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The Driving Age For Teens And Seniors!


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#1 cowsgonemadd3

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Posted 05 July 2007 - 10:09 PM

I think this would make a good topic.

The driving age. It has been shown that as teens get older accident rates fall. We let kids drive at 15 now days and with drivers ed they can drive without a adult during daylight hours just 180 days after they turn 15!

Even though I had experience driving more than most kids my age at 15(farm driving trucks and a four wheeler a lot) I was not prepared at 15 to drive. Infact I almost ran into a tree my first time and got so scared I did not drive again until almost 17.

A lot of this fear came from the fact it hit home that my friend died in a car accident and when I almost wrecked right after she died it scared me as it could happen to me.

Now some MAY be mature enough to drive WITH a adult at 15 most are not.

Should the driving age be raised? I am now 18 and might get my liscense soon. Problem is the insurance goes up 80 bucks a month as soon as I get it....Parents nor me wants to pay this so I dont have it.

Say 16 for permit and 18 for liscense?

And then the Seniors....
A lot of accidents are caused by them. Should after you turn 65 you then be forced to take a driving test every year or 2 years or???I know this first hand. My dads dad who is now 71? 72? has had some family members fall right off the atv before and he not even know it. He has drove a big tractor down the road and came home with a mailbox on the teeth of the plow.

Now he drives fine and these are rare but some people his age do these things all the time and are lucky nobody has died yet.

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#2 solaris32

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Posted 05 July 2007 - 10:52 PM

With kids these days, getting actual jobs younger and younger, they kinda need to drive. I agree many of them are irresponsible, but what else is there to do? And not every city has public transportation.

And seniers after the age of 60, and possibly younger, should be required to retake the driving test every year.

Edited by solaris32, 05 July 2007 - 10:53 PM.

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#3 MaraM

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 12:31 AM

Don't have the answer but certainly do agree that seniors should take a test, especially in regard to reflexes and vision.

I sympathise CGM because your dear Grandpa shouldn't be driving. Period. The problem may be far spread when it comes to some seniors no longer being capable of driving safely - yet, in turn, to stop most from doing something they've always done - eep. Their family members cringe (and quite rightly) at the thought of demanding they stop. Now. Must confess I dithered like crazy when it came time for me to say, "Stop!" - and I took the easier way out. Simply mentioned my concerns to the family doctor and let him call my loved one in for an exam and during it, discovered all sorts of reasons to notify the Motor Vehcile Branch to send out a 'Notice for Re-Exam of Licence'. Cowardly perhaps, but it's hard enough to grow old I suspect without one's kids themselves starting to treat them like kids. Gentle sigh.

Re teenagers driving. Lots a great drivers. But more deaths happen on our roads from teenagers killing than any other cause. Perhaps if we all take one step back - and realize that the car can be - and often is - simply a deadly weapon. Ergo, young drivers want to drive, that fine - but in return they should legally be held responsible as an adult for any injury caused while behind the wheel.

- - -
PM to CGM ... Ever so sorry about your friend dying in a car accident. Gentle hug!
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#4 rowal5555

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 12:58 AM

My licence expired in March last year @ 64, and I was required to take a medical. Failed the eye test and had to get new specs but that was it, no actual driving test. This one lasts for ten years, but next time I will be required to take an actual test. I have been driving for 50 years and had a lot of prangs back when I was a teenager. This is simply because younger ones take it for granted that they are invincible, and it is only experience that teaches them otherwise.

To raise the age limit is kind of self-defeating, as that only raises the age when experience starts.

If ALL DRIVERS would only realise that any motor vehicle is a lethal weapon, and treat it as such, there would be a lot less carnage on our roads.
I reckon it would be a great idea to require drivers to undergo a DEFENSIVE DRIVING course before gaining their full licence - in that way any bad habits taught by friends, parents, etc could be picked up and rectified, and good driving habits could be hammered home, before you receive your final licence.

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#5 DSTM

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 02:22 AM

Here,due to the high number of teenage Driver deaths on our roads,our Government has taken steps to try and reduce these road deaths.At 16yrs and 10 months,you get a learner Driver permit.The learner driver must now complete 120 hrs of driving while having a teacher with them at all times.This must be logged as to times,distances covered,and must be accident free.What Parent can leave the house for this amount of time,really?
Then after tests you get a Provisional Licence for one year.This is speed limited,zero Alcohol and no accidents.And only 1 passenger allowed in the vehicle at any one time.Any infringement and you lose your Provisional Licence and after a certain period you have to start all over again.
The courts are forcing Provisional drivers who have serious accidents to visit Morgues to view first hand what being an idiot on the road can cause.Also they are forced to look at Graphic pictures of badly mutilated road accident victims,much to their horror.Whether this has any effect on their behavior,only time will tell.
As for the Older Drivers,many are quite good Drivers,and some are horrors and cause many accidents here anyway.
Here there are no checks on a Drivers ability till they reach 85 yrs of age.Then a medical and a Driving Test every year there after.This in my opinion is far too late in life.I believe from 65yrs is more sensible.Many by 65yrs have severe medical conditions and swear they have a right to drive based on their previous Driving record.They are only endangering other drivers,being on the road with these conditions.My Father at 85 yrs is so stubborn and won't let me discuss his Driving habits.
Their reaction times at this age are nearly non existent.I worry he may get into an accident and kill my Mother.You can't tell 'em.















#6 cowsgonemadd3

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 09:07 AM

but in return they should legally be held responsible as an adult for any injury caused while behind the wheel.


Now thats not fair....Accidents are just that accidents.

To raise the age limit is kind of self-defeating, as that only raises the age when experience starts.


Its not just experience thats whats needed it maturity and your brain grows as it gets older and does not stop until like 25?
They dont have the MENTAL ability its not physical for a teen as we have plenty of reaction.

Problem is kids can study a book,take a test and then drive is not a safe way to do it. They should be MADE to take drivers ed BEFORE getting the permit.Some parents are not good drivers either.

#7 jwinathome

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 09:19 AM

Interesting stuff CGM. I actually don't think raising the limit would solve the issue. I personally started working at 15, and needed a vehicle, because both of my parents worked long hours.

When I drive around down here, there are countless wreaths and crosses on display at various intersections and points along roads and highways. The majority are indeed teenagers that were incapable of controlling the car at high speeds. Many times, alcohol was involved. At certain high schools, driver courses are mandatory, and they are not mediocre courses. They actually teach how to make corrections when the car loses control, etc. At one high school, they show videos and pictures of the aftermath of drunk driving/impaired driving. Teen accidents in that particular school zone are much lower than other places without these methods. So it may seem as usual, that education is the key to solving the problem.

I do agree with you though CGM, that it does take a certain maturity to be respectful while driving.

#8 MaraM

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 01:22 PM

Wow, 10 full years before having to have a licence renewed - that in itself is surprising, rowal5555. (Glad you passed yours with only needing new specs - yipee!!).

Here we have something similar to what DSTM mentioned they have in Australia - getting one's licence in stages - and it's a great idea. What we don't have is strong enough penalties when disaster happens.

As I mentioned before, I feel everyone behind the wheel of a car should be held responsible - legally an an adult - for any injury they cause while driving. And I'm sorry, CGM, I don't agree with "Now thats not fair....Accidents are just that accidents".

The car is literally a potental lethal weapon. If one feels he or she is old enough to drive one, they should be willing to stand up for the consequences of what happens when they do. And along with our 'get your licence in stages', I wish we too forced all potential drivers (of any age) to witness first hand what can and does happen every day on our roads, just as DSTM mentioned.

It is not an 'accident' when kids are screaming down city streets at over 100mph, racing each other and slam into a child on a bike. That is not an accident - and I don't honestly care if the kids driving are only 16.

I've had the horrible experience of watching a young woman screaming her lungs out and clawing at the inside windows of her car. She had good reason. She was literally burning alive. The two street racers walked away with a fine and less than a month in jail - why, because they were kids.

Many kids are great drivers. Many drive their cars like a weapon. Accidents are not 'just accidents'. An accident is when one is driving as responsibly as possible and something happens. Nope, 'accidents are just that accidents' does not apply to all of the carnage that happens on our streets. And 'fair' - unless it has rides and cotton candy, it's not a fair. :thumbsup:
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#9 jwinathome

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 01:27 PM

But do you acknowledge when it is indeed a total accident, there should be no penalty? Or are you saying that no matter what the case, it should have a penalty?

#10 MaraM

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 01:47 PM

Okay, now I'm not only laughing but once again darn near had my coffee shoot up my poor nose! :thumbsup:

" But do you acknowledge when it is indeed a total accident, there should be no penalty? Or are you saying that no matter what the case, it should have a penalty?


Here in Canada, at least, we do have 'no penalty' for a 'total accident' in many cases. For instance, if a driver is creeping along during an ice storm and slithers off the road into a tree or into another car - other than having to pay for the physical damage causes (or in reality, one's insurance pays it), there would be nor should be an additional other penalty.

Why? The driver was driving as responsibly as he or she could with the circumstances in existance at the time.

However, if a driver of any age decides to drive like an idiot during the same circumstances and he hits someone and causes damage, that is his fault and not something I could consider a non-culpable accident.
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#11 jwinathome

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 01:52 PM

Thank you for clarifying. I wasn't sure how you felt based upon these random thoughts....

Many kids are great drivers. Many drive their cars like a weapon. Accidents are not 'just accidents'. An accident is when one is driving as responsibly as possible and something happens. Nope, 'accidents are just that accidents' does not apply to all of the carnage that happens on our streets. And 'fair' - unless it has rides and cotton candy, it's not a fair.



#12 cowsgonemadd3

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 03:50 PM

The car is literally a potental lethal weapon.


I can kill someone with about anything if done right. If its a accident its just that....

It is not an 'accident' when kids are screaming down city streets at over 100mph, racing each other and slam into a child on a bike. That is not an accident - and I don't honestly care if the kids driving are only 16.


Of course its a accident! They didnt do it on purpose!

Its just irresposibility for sure but not done purposely.

#13 BlackSpyder

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 04:52 PM

I've been driving since i was13 (believe it or not Ive been driving class 7 trucks since i was 15) and there wasnt much of a difference between me and many of my peers who had only started driving at 15 (when you could get a learners permit back then). I wreaked a good many times but my trucks were built very solid (this is the true cause of most teenage deaths in auto accidents nowadays... i'll rant on this later). Now that i have a CDL (Commercial Drivers License) I am required to have a full physical and Drug Screen every year and have to retake the test every 5 years i think (theyll send me a letter when I have to. They always do) It really doesnt bother me. Seniors are a problem that needs to be dealt with. One of the guys that I work with recently had his license suspended and his CDL revoked for a Nervous System problem. He should have had both revoked because according to the hack company doctor the issue can reappear at any time (which is also true of high risk people for Heart Attacks and Strokes).

Now to rant on the TRUE killer of teen drivers.

Auto Manufacturers today live by the code of "Lighter, Stronger, Faster, more Efficient". Take for example my 1971 pickup which weighs in at a whopping 2 tons (American/4000 lbs) where as my newer (1994) truck tips the scales at 1.5 Tons (3000 lbs) 1000 lbs lighter then the old one. Why?
1) Thinner Frame Rails used to make "Crumple Zones" (more like crush your legs Zones),
2) Fiberglass Body parts (Fenders, bumpers, hoods, etc ) This stuff cracks and breaks when you lean on it wrong. Steel bends and takes some of the force away from a crash)
3) Lighter Sheet metal parts and reinforcings (Doors, door reinforcements,Roofline, A/B/C pillars, ect) . All the pieces that are made now are of lighter gauges of steel that crush at lighter pressures (Remember being able to lean on your car door and it wouldnt dent) Also the reinforcments to the doors are made of "I" beams which are very strong when struck head on but fold over on themselves when hit at an angle.
4) Finally Aluminum engine parts. You used to have to sacrifice 200lbs to put a Big Block Chevy where a Small bock once resided (Big Blocks weigh approx 700 lbs Small Blocks 500 lbs) now that is not the case both are about the same weight wise and now produce more horsepower then ever before.
5) The Unibody Frame. Consists of 3 frame sections 1)Front Clip, 2) Rear Clip, and 3) Center Section (aka the floor board of your car) Both Clips are built very similar to older cars solid frames. the Center section is a reinforced section of floorboard where the other 2 sections are bolted to. Guess where they break. ( Mid 80's Mustang Convertibles were bad about bowing down in that section) drops alot of weight off of a car not having 6 feet of thick wall Channel iron.


When you reduce the weight of a car you create more speed and efficacy and require less horsepower to do so. But when you start to take away structural integrity to do so you start killing people.

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#14 athelos

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 06:16 PM

I've only skimmed through this as im about to go to bed, but has anyone mentioned motorbikes? Just found it strange how different coutries have different laws. Over here we can start driving at 17 (over here being England).

That said motorbikes are completely different. at 16 you can take a test to ride a 50cc bike, which at a push may be able to do 50mph. Then at 17 you can take another test which allows you to ride anything that is restricted down to around 30bhp. While taking that test however your not allowed anything higher than a 125cc engine. Its only 2 years after you have held that licence that your able to take yet another test which allows you to ride any bike. Or if your 21 you can take a Direct Access course which allows you to skip right to the last tests.

Was speaking to my kickboxing instructor however. Bought the subject up of CBT (compulsory Basic Training), which is what you have to complete before you take ANY of these tests. Apparently, "back in his day" they didnt have that. He said the person who took normal car lessons done the motorbike tests too. And s/he didnt follow behind you on another bike either. They set the course out for you and left you too it. Meanwhile s/he would cut through various alleys and meet you at certain points on the way and do things like emergancy brake tests, etc. This was done on a bike up to 100cc. After you had completed your test you could jump onto almost ANY sized engine bike you wanted!!! My intructor told me his friend done the test and went staight to a 400cc bike he already had waiting!!

Whats it like in other countries? Or is it mostly the same?
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#15 BlackSpyder

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Posted 06 July 2007 - 06:34 PM

In Virginia (in the US every state is a little different) you go to the Department of Motor Vehicles take the written test and pick up your Motorcycle Learners Permit at the age of 18. Six months later you go back and take the riding exam on your own bike (any legal size 51-90 cc bikes are illegal here) and pick up your Motorcycle drivers license.

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