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Vista Networking


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#1 usasma

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Posted 22 February 2007 - 05:16 PM

One of the local cable companies is having issues with Vista connecting to home networks. What I know is....

One customer had problems with firewall rules and also had failed a security audit about the time of the attempted connection.

The cable tech relates that they can connect easily when connecting to a router - but they cannot connect when it's a straight shot to the modem. The tech says they'd been using Motorola Surfboard modems - but that he'd also tried an RCA modem to rule out the problems.

Any ideas? I'm trying to get a chance to see the actual installation - but his company and my company aren't too eager to let us consult with each other.

TIA! :huh:
My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

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#2 RandomUser

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 12:29 AM

Usasma,

When you say a problem with Vista connecting to home networks, What exactly do you mean?
Are you simply attempting to use Vista on your local (home network) and connect to XP Machines?

If that's the Case, you'll need the LLTD (Link Layer Topology Discovery) Service installed on your XP machines.

If the problem is something other than this, please be Specific so Users may better assist you in this matter.

#3 usasma

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 06:19 AM

Well, I apologize for the lack of information - but that's all that I've got at this time. Perhaps I should make something up for you?

As may it may not be obvious from my initial post, I'm actually the 3rd layer of tech support on this one - trying to help a customer who cannot connect to their modem (but can connect if using a borrowed router).

Connecting straight to the modem means that there is only one system (although I assume that one could make a splitter). Also, as this is a Vista forum, and it's stated in my post that this is a Vista problem - so I presume that an XP solution may not be appropriate (but I will try checking the LLTP on the Vista system)..

I believe that the solution to this problem lies in the fact that the system can connect when a router is in the loop - but cannot connect when connected straight to the modem without a router. But I'm unsure of any differences between the 2.

Finally, I am an MVP for Windows - Networking, have a bit of experience with networking Vista (and have worked with Microsoft on network bugs in Vista during beta testing). Also, I am headed off to Microsoft to do some work for them next week (as a contractor) and I will ask the appropriate people there for suggestions - but I'd really like to help these people (the customers) out before then.

Edited by usasma, 23 February 2007 - 06:26 AM.

My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

#4 RandomUser

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 11:51 AM

OK that's a start.

What's the model of the router and the modem? This may help in determining what services are set up, or available on the router, and to check if there are firmware updates for the modem that fix the issue.

#5 usasma

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Posted 23 February 2007 - 07:20 PM

The modems are Surfboards (5120's I think) and they've tried RCA modems also. The routers are whatever they have installed (with no make specified).

I did receive a call from a customer today with this problem - and he attached his old LinkSys router. Prior to this he was getting an "unidentified network" error (he couldn't tell me where it came from).

Once the router was hooked up, the network was identified - but he wasn't able to connect to anything. I was unable to talk him through "pinging" the server, he wasn't able to navigate to the connection properties to check the LLTDand I referred him to the cable company to get his MAC address reregistered.

The difficulty here is that I'm only able to obtain a little info at a time - and it all relies on the customers cooperating. This is the 3rd customer that I spoke with about this cable company. We gave the first one a new laptop, the next one came to the store and I got the errors (audit failure and firewall errors), and today I got the person with the router. None have come back to report success or failure.

I'm leaving for Seattle tomorrow - so I won't get anymore feedback from the customers. I'm really interested in any and all ideas at this point. I can feed them to the techs at the cable company - and can call them back to see if we've fixed it.
My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

#6 RandomUser

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 04:34 AM

OK well it helps to know that you're only getting Bits and pieces at a time.

I don't believe that LLTD is the problem or solution here. My only thought is an Educated Guess.

And the guess may have something to do with IPv6 which is the default protocol for networking in Vista.
You'll have to use your expertise to discern the problem at this point, b/c as you said, there is not enough
info for me to go on here.


Good Luck

#7 usasma

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 06:51 AM

Thanks for the help. At least your guesses will lessen the work that's required to fix this. I hadn't thought of IPv6 at all - so that's worth a shot. I'll see if disabling it helps.

Any idea about what sort of event would cause the security audits to start failing?
My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

#8 RandomUser

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Posted 24 February 2007 - 03:07 PM

That's a weathered question regarding the Security audits.

You may want to customize your Security logs. As you know, there are a thousand things that can cause a Failed Audit.

Generally speaking, you will recieve a Failed Audit in your logs, it is due to lsass.exe (local Security Authority) which denies a user or a network service from gaining access to a computer. This could be the result of a Trojan on the modem or router, A hacker, or a worm attempting to gain access.

Also, you will recieve the Failed audits for Normal programs and services that are blocked by default in Windows firewall. The latter is only true if windows firewall is turned on.

What I would do at this point, is download the Current Firmware for all devices. Modem, Router, and Driver for the Network card on the PC.

Contact the Cable company to make certain all settings are correct, IE Mac Address if one is required, Disable all Firewalls, Turn IPv6 Off and then attempt to connect with just the modem, and then Just the router.

If these measures do not solve the issue, there is something more going on here and would require a support call to microsoft, or the device manufacturer. IE Motorolla, Lynksys, etc.

Also, Make certain to resest all devices via their reset button, and reboot them, as often times this can remove unwanted software. I've used several combinations of modem and router, w/o issue regarding Vista, and have had no issue.

I've exhausted my diagnostics steps regarding the little info available. wish I could be of more assistance.

I'm sure you'll figure it out though. good luck.

#9 usasma

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 06:55 AM

Thanks for the help RandomUser! I wasn't aware of the Security Audits failing because of firewall blocking - and that has been an issue in the one system that I got to look at. I setup rules in that system to allow traffic that was blocked and haven't heard back about it.

FWIW - in the past I've found that this sort of problem is usually caused by the user (or the cable company in this case) doing something that they thought wouldn't matter - so they don't inform us of it. When it finally comes to light, the problem is easily fixed.

I seem to remember the tech telling me that he had tried disabling IPv6, but don't recall him mentioning the firewall settings.

Another suspicion is that these are either computers with McAfee or Norton firewalls - or they are ones that we removed the Norton or McAfee firewalls from. If I'm able to find out which one's they are we may be able to configure the default Windows firewall settings.

So, to sum up... Disabling IPv6, disabling any add-on firewalls, and resetting the Windows firewall to default will likely fix this issue. I've reached this conclusion (thanks to your help) because of the issues with IPv6 and the failed security audits that may relate to blocked access.
My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

#10 RandomUser

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Posted 25 February 2007 - 09:55 PM

NP

Just because it sounds good, doesn't mean I'm right tho.

I hope you figure it out.

good luck

#11 cool_Lee

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Posted 03 March 2007 - 03:56 PM

I am curious as to the way you fixed this problem.

cl

#12 usasma

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Posted 15 March 2007 - 12:43 PM

An update that may be of interest to y'all.

First, the test for disabling IPv6 was a failure - but it wasn't discovered until the customer brought the computer in and I found that it had a proxy server still installed (from my shop, no less!).

I've talked with several of the folks here at Microsoft about this and described the efforts that were made.

They all agree that the first thing to check is to see if the DHCP Broadcast bit is set/enabled. In XP it was not enabled, but it is enabled in Vista. They seem to recall that there was a KB article on it (which I'll search for and post the link if I can find it).
My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

#13 usasma

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Posted 15 March 2007 - 12:49 PM

Found it easy enough...
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx/kb/928233

BTW - the networking guys suggest that using netmon will be able to identify this issue.

Edited by usasma, 15 March 2007 - 12:55 PM.

My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.




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