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Build A New Gaming Pc Or Dell Xps 710 H2c


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#1 Redonmyhead

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Posted 24 January 2007 - 04:56 PM

My old computer is just old. I done revamping it. Time for a new one. My question is this. I'm a computer noob. I don't know much but I know a little. I put in a new power source and graphics card in my old one. I don't know how much knowledge it takes to build a whole new computer with all new parts compare to a power source and graphics card. In the past I've read how to build computers. I feel okay building on my own. What would be a wiser way to go? Build my own or buy a Dell XPS 710 H2C? Money does not matter. I want an ultimate gaming rig. Would it be hard to build on my own with the limited knowledge that I have?

These are the computer parts that i have in mind if I build my own. Feel free to remodify my list if you think I can build my own computer on my own.

IntelŽ CoreTM 2 Extreme QX6700 quad-core processor
EVGa 122-CK-NF68-AR Motherboard or Striker Extreme Motherboard
What would u recommend for RAM 2 or 4GB, and what kind of ram and who?
Sound BlasterŽ X-FiTM XtremeMusic
dual NVIDIAŽ GeForceŽ 8800 GTX graphics cards.
Western Digital Raptor WD1500ADFD 150GB 10,000 RPM Serial ATA150 Hard Drive - OEM x2 for Raid 0
Data drive maybe 100 to 250 GB (what do u recommend)
PLEXTOR Black 16X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 6X DVD+R DL 16X DVD-R 4X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 8M Cache IDE Slot Load DVD Burner
Vista Premium
Monitor wise, I don't know what to get? i want something between 200 to 400 dollar range.
Case-Thermaltake Kandalf VA9000SWA Silver Chassis: 1.0mm Aluminum, Front Bezel: Aluminum ATX Full Tower Computer Case
1kw power source of something


am I missing anything else? Do I need cables for this? Should I water cool this or not? I don't know how to overclock and probably won't. So would it be wise to stick with fans to cool this off or use a water cooling system?

Any other suggestions or stick with the Dell XPS 710 H2C.
Any good websites out there to build computers?

Thanks,
Red

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#2 dogslikeus

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 12:28 AM

that sounds quite impressive :thumbsup: just a few ideas:

i don't think you need the quad core processor. very few games are optimized for dual core, let alone quad core. i'd suggest going for the core 2 duo e4300 which should be coming out here in a few weeks. it will retail for around $180 and is highly overclockable, up to 3.7GHz with the standard cooling and everything. in benchmarks and other tests, the overclocked e4300 is beating out the core 2 extreme processors which cost a great deal more. cheap doesn't necessarily mean bad, here. i'd recommend going with that for now and then, when games become more accustomed to dual/quad core processors, upgrade.

2gb of RAM should be enough. apparently the 32-bit version of windows cannot utilize more than 3.25gb of RAM anyway. i don't know how the 64-bit version fairs with it, but 2gb is plenty for current games. corsair value select is a decent brand of RAM, but if you're really concerned you could go with kingston or OCZ. i don't know much about them, but OCZ makes watercooled RAM, if that tells you anything.

ditch the soundcard. unless you're an audiophile, onboard sound is quite good these days. granted it does give the CPU slightly more work to do, but it's not really an issue anymore.

wait on the dx10 cards. ATI is about to release their dx10 cards (the R600) series and it looks like they're going to walk all over nvidia (but who knows). so i'd wait a few months on that and see how it shapes up.

do not skimp on the PSU. go with well known manufacturers like antec, enermax or thermaltake and make sure that it has (in your case) 4 12V rails with at least 18A on each.



that said, it's all up to you on building a computer. it's not as hard as it used to be and there are a multitude of guides on the internet if you get stuck. there's really only one way everything can fit together, so it shouldn't be too bad :huh:

if you do decide to go with prefab, i am partial to the site www.ibuypower.com they built my current PC and it's quite wonderful. relatively cheap, too.

Edited by dogslikeus, 25 January 2007 - 12:28 AM.


#3 Mr Alpha

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 06:01 AM

Going from dual- to quad-core isn't nearly as big a step at from single- to dual-core. There are many game-engines coming out that will support dozens of cores. UT Engine 3.0 16 cores, Valves new source theoretically an unlimited number of cores, Supreme Commander sees a big difference between dual- and quad-core. Crysis and Alan Wake can use lots of cores. The only dual-core supporting games that can't use quad-core are those with a simple server/client split, like Quake 4. Ant proplerly written multi-threaded engine will support quad-core. If you are going to put a lot of money on a processor, defiantly get a quad core.

If you go with integrated sound stay away from RealTek. There is something wrong with their EAX implementation and it sounds horrible.

How many rails the PSU has isn't interesting, rather their combined output. You should look at a quality 750W+ power supply.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
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#4 dogslikeus

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 08:28 AM

i was pointing out that if he really does intend on having an 8800GTX SLI setup, he will need a PSU that has four 12V rails as each GTX requires two 12V attachments. it would suck to buy a PSU that won't power his machine.

Edited by dogslikeus, 25 January 2007 - 08:29 AM.


#5 Mr Alpha

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 09:33 AM

The GTX uses two PCIe power connectors, the rails don't matter. You can have all connectors connected to the same rail as long as you have enough amps.
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#6 usasma

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 09:38 AM

Vista and XP (32 bit versions) will only recognize a total of 4 gB of addressable memory - and in practical terms this works out to about 3.25 gB (this is the case with my system with 4 gB of DDR2)

The 64 bit versions of the OS will recognize much more - but since there's limited driver support for these versions I've stayed away from them (but may try it in my newest build).
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#7 dogslikeus

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 01:17 PM

The GTX uses two PCIe power connectors, the rails don't matter. You can have all connectors connected to the same rail as long as you have enough amps.


ah. good to know :thumbsup:

i always hear people talking about the 12V rail rating. why is that if it doesn't matter?

#8 Peaches*

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 04:45 PM

K, first of all....wow you must have a butt-load of money. Second off, don't go for Dell. Especially XPS. They really rip you off. I suggest waiting for ATI's new R600 thats on the way because it's gunna smoke the 8800GTX. If some of the specs off wikipedia are true, one R600 will be better than Dual 8800GTX! Also I suggest going Dual core. If you spend a little less when you build it now, you can save that other money for future upgrades. New products will always be coming out. Anyway...lol....it sounds like money isn't a problem for you...so do whatever you want because you can always upgrade later.


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#9 Mr Alpha

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 06:04 PM

Time for Mr Alpha's short guide to the 12V rail.

First of all the 12V rail isn't a physical thing you can pick up and throw out the window. The 12V rail is the 12V power supplied by the power supply. Inside the power supply there is a transformer with a tap wich spits out 12V:ish power which is the regulated to 12V. It is this transformer which determines how many amps you can get on the 12V rail.

So what about the multiple 12V rails? I'm glad you asked. There is this mandate that says you shouldn't have more than 240VA running in a wire a consumer might play around with. Intel took this in account when upgrading their ATX spec, limiting the power supply makers to 18A in any 12V wire. What do power supply makers do then? They take the 12V power an split it in two, with current limiters limiting it to 18A. It is still the same power from the same tap on the transformer, but split to two different wires. As power requirements continued to grow the dual 18A wasn't enough (thanks ATI & nVIDIA!), and the 240VA limit was unofficially dropped.

What did power supply maker do? Well, we still se multiple 12V rail advertised. Why? Three reasons: One, they get the cool compliance sticker if they stick to 18A per 12V wire. Two, a power supply with lots of 12V rails sounds cool and gives you something to brag about. Three, they can fool the consumer. With 4 12V rails, all limited to 18A, make it sound like the power supply can do 64A of 12V power. In reality it is the transformer which limits how much power you get from the 12V tap, which might be only 50A. This is why you want to know the actual combined output of the 12V rails.

Is multiple 12V rail a good idea? No really, if you have two 12V rails with 18A each and you need 20A from one and only 5A from the other your screwed. This is why some power supply manufacturers don't actually have any power limiters on the separate 12V rails. And also why some manufacturers, like usasma's favored PC Power & Cooling, have gone back to using a single 12V rail in some models.

To sum it up: When people talk about the 12V rail they might be referring to either the different wires with 12V power, or to the 12V power tap on the transformer. When you are figuring out the power on the 12V rail it is the tap on the transformer which counts.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
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#10 Detox

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Posted 25 January 2007 - 07:45 PM

that sounds quite impressive :thumbsup: just a few ideas:

i don't think you need the quad core processor. very few games are optimized for dual core, let alone quad core. i'd suggest going for the core 2 duo e4300 which should be coming out here in a few weeks. it will retail for around $180 and is highly overclockable, up to 3.7GHz with the standard cooling and everything. in benchmarks and other tests, the overclocked e4300 is beating out the core 2 extreme processors which cost a great deal more. cheap doesn't necessarily mean bad, here. i'd recommend going with that for now and then, when games become more accustomed to dual/quad core processors, upgrade.

2gb of RAM should be enough. apparently the 32-bit version of windows cannot utilize more than 3.25gb of RAM anyway. i don't know how the 64-bit version fairs with it, but 2gb is plenty for current games. corsair value select is a decent brand of RAM, but if you're really concerned you could go with kingston or OCZ. i don't know much about them, but OCZ makes watercooled RAM, if that tells you anything.

ditch the soundcard. unless you're an audiophile, onboard sound is quite good these days. granted it does give the CPU slightly more work to do, but it's not really an issue anymore.

wait on the dx10 cards. ATI is about to release their dx10 cards (the R600) series and it looks like they're going to walk all over nvidia (but who knows). so i'd wait a few months on that and see how it shapes up.

do not skimp on the PSU. go with well known manufacturers like antec, enermax or thermaltake and make sure that it has (in your case) 4 12V rails with at least 18A on each.



that said, it's all up to you on building a computer. it's not as hard as it used to be and there are a multitude of guides on the internet if you get stuck. there's really only one way everything can fit together, so it shouldn't be too bad :huh:

if you do decide to go with prefab, i am partial to the site www.ibuypower.com they built my current PC and it's quite wonderful. relatively cheap, too.


He wants an ultimate gaming PC, not a budget PC.

I would suggest that an E6600 would more than enough meet your needs. And you can either wait for the R600 or just get the 8800. For Ram, I'd go with Corsair's Dominator ram, their fastest memory on the market. For data drive, get the Seagate 320GB HD, it's fast and it's well priced. I don't know that much about Audio, but if you have the money, then pick whichever is the best. Get a good PSU, OCZ makes great gaming PSUs. And there's no Vista Premium, there's Vista Ultimate. For a monitor, I'd suggest a 22' LCD, I personally prefer Samsung monitors, but you can search for better ones on the web. And for the speakers, go with Logitech 5.1 or 7.1 speakers.

#11 dogslikeus

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Posted 26 January 2007 - 12:17 AM

He wants an ultimate gaming PC, not a budget PC.


true, but i'm of the opinion that just because money is no option does not mean that money should be spent frivolously on frivolous things. i was only giving my opinion on what would still be considered ultimate. sorry it conflicts with your ideas.

#12 dogslikeus

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Posted 26 January 2007 - 12:22 AM

Time for Mr Alpha's short guide to the 12V rail.

First of all the 12V rail isn't a physical thing you can pick up and throw out the window. The 12V rail is the 12V power supplied by the power supply. Inside the power supply there is a transformer with a tap wich spits out 12V:ish power which is the regulated to 12V. It is this transformer which determines how many amps you can get on the 12V rail.

So what about the multiple 12V rails? I'm glad you asked. There is this mandate that says you shouldn't have more than 240VA running in a wire a consumer might play around with. Intel took this in account when upgrading their ATX spec, limiting the power supply makers to 18A in any 12V wire. What do power supply makers do then? They take the 12V power an split it in two, with current limiters limiting it to 18A. It is still the same power from the same tap on the transformer, but split to two different wires. As power requirements continued to grow the dual 18A wasn't enough (thanks ATI & nVIDIA!), and the 240VA limit was unofficially dropped.

What did power supply maker do? Well, we still se multiple 12V rail advertised. Why? Three reasons: One, they get the cool compliance sticker if they stick to 18A per 12V wire. Two, a power supply with lots of 12V rails sounds cool and gives you something to brag about. Three, they can fool the consumer. With 4 12V rails, all limited to 18A, make it sound like the power supply can do 64A of 12V power. In reality it is the transformer which limits how much power you get from the 12V tap, which might be only 50A. This is why you want to know the actual combined output of the 12V rails.

Is multiple 12V rail a good idea? No really, if you have two 12V rails with 18A each and you need 20A from one and only 5A from the other your screwed. This is why some power supply manufacturers don't actually have any power limiters on the separate 12V rails. And also why some manufacturers, like usasma's favored PC Power & Cooling, have gone back to using a single 12V rail in some models.

To sum it up: When people talk about the 12V rail they might be referring to either the different wires with 12V power, or to the 12V power tap on the transformer. When you are figuring out the power on the 12V rail it is the tap on the transformer which counts.


that was enlightening. thank you :thumbsup: just goes to show that no matter how much you think you know, you can always learn more. i think my confusion on the 12V rail was that i had mistakenly assumed that the 6-pin PCIe plug was the 12V rail. i didn't realize that it was just a plug for PCIe and contained a 12V rail but was not, itself, a 12V rail.

Edited by dogslikeus, 26 January 2007 - 12:56 AM.


#13 Mr Alpha

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Posted 26 January 2007 - 06:25 AM

i think my confusion on the 12V rail was that i had mistakenly assumed that the 6-pin PCIe plug was the 12V rail. i didn't realize that it was just a plug for PCIe and contained a 12V rail but was not, itself, a 12V rail.

This confusion might have risen from the fact that many power supplies with 4+ 12V rails often have 12V rails with only a PCIe connector connected to it. But you don't know if it is so by just reading the label of the power supply, you have to open it up and look at the wiring.
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#14 Peaches*

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Posted 26 January 2007 - 09:31 AM

k. Dont go for a seagate 320....they run at 7200 rpm. If you want a PC for gaming, get a Western Digital Raptor. For ultimate preformance get 2 in raid 0 config. Get the 150 GB. It's slighgtly faster than the 74 GB and twice the size and only 100$ more.
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#15 Peaches*

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Posted 26 January 2007 - 09:33 AM

For data drive, get the Seagate 320GB HD, it's fast and it's well priced.


WD 150 GB Raptor..
What else is in the Teaches of Peaches*? Like SEX on the Beaches...




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