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CPU & GPU Weird Thermal Throttling


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#1 febkosq8

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Posted 06 June 2018 - 11:05 PM

Product Name: HP 15-bs028ne
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 10 (64-bit) V.1803

Hi All ,

 

I have a HP 15-bs028ne (Intel i7 7th Gen,8 GB DDR4 RAM ,1TB SSHD ,120GB SSD,2GB AMD Radeon 530 Graphics).

This might not be the best one out thier for gaming ,but it used to do its work correctly .

 

Until recently (5 Weeks ago) my laptop started to Throttle itself while gaming .

I use HW Monitor to keep a tab on my temps .

At exactly when my laptop CPU (i7 7th Gen) reaches 95 Degress Celsius ,both my CPU and GPU will stop working for a short period of time like (2 Seconds) i can see the graph drop and rise in Task Manager .

 

 

 

I play Rainbow 6 Siege and my laptop has the recommended configrations ,also (i upgraded to an SSD & SSHD ).

While playng continuously for like 30 mins and the temps go to 95 degree,the game will freeze for some time and the then revert back to original state .

 

I noticed this problem after the last 2 BIOS updates ( Maybe connected ,Just assuming).

I already tried HP's  Solution for overheating https://support.hp.com/in-en/document/c01657439

I cleaned the fans and everything ,but still no use .16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif

Installed HP CoolSense and figured out it does nothing 16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif .

I did a Extensive Harware HP System Diagnostics Test ,all PASSED without any problems .16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif

Fans seems to be running normally .

Have a doubt on the Thermal Paste side .

 

Tried reinstalling Windows  ,changing HDD to SSD/SSHD ,plugged in adapter ,changed graphics settings .All availed no use .16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif

 

Temp : Normal Use (Browsing,etc) : 65 Degree

               Cold Boot :55 Degree

 

 

Note : I am stuck with HP poor driver support for my Laptop .

The drivers are so outdated that even while launching game ,Ubisoft also tells me to update it . 

All latest updates are installed .My AMD drivers  are made on 17/05/17 .

Tried installing Official drivers from AMD website but turned out to be a disaster .Had to revert back to official HP drivers .HP really needs to update thier drivers regularly .16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif16x16_smiley-frustrated.gif

 

Note : I did a CPU + GPU stress test at the same time , which also resulted in the graph to fall (at 95 Degree). Same main issue that i have .Only CPU throttles itself down .

Running CPU only / GPU only was fine .

 

Can anyone help me in solving this misery ? I cant game with this problem as each second is crusial while gaming .

 

 

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#2 mightywiz

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Posted 07 June 2018 - 04:49 PM

i have the simular model, i had to redo the thermal paste after it slid off my lap and onto the floor from the couch.

 

i don't know if it's just not built well or what,  but my heat problems went away after that.



#3 Chris Cosgrove

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Posted 07 June 2018 - 04:50 PM

 

Have a doubt on the Thermal Paste side.

 

From your description of what you have done to this laptop this sounds like the only candidate left. If you have been in and cleaned the fan and everything then you probably have a good idea on how to remove the heat pipe, if not, this video claims to be for all HP 15 series laptops -

 

 

Removing the heat pipe starts at about 4minutes 30. You need to thoroughly clean all the old paste away from the underside of the heat pipe and the tops of the processor chips. Then apply a thin coat of new paste to one surface, and only one unless there is a thermal gasket or spacer in between the two surfaces.

 

If there is a thermal gasket, these can be re-used if removed and cleaned carefully. The counsel of perfection is of course to replace any such gasket material with new material but sourcing new material can be difficult. So be careful !  If there is such a gasket then you apply a thin layer of paste to both metal surfaces, put the gasket back carefully and smoothly - no wrinkles, and screw the heatpipe back in place.

 

Thermal paste - or heat sink compound - is fairly readily available. The brand you use is not critical, it is far more important that it is properly applied in a thin smooth layer.

 

Chris Cosgrove



#4 febkosq8

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Posted 08 June 2018 - 12:46 AM

 

 

I know how to remove the thermal heat sink ,and already done it once .Thanks to HP Service PDF ,it was quite easy to figure out how to do it .

Unfortunately ,thier is no thermal paste available for buying in my region currently .Still searching for one .

 

 

My doubt is that many people are telling that performance can drop if bad thermal paste is applied .How is a thermal paste bad ?

Basically they all are paste .

 

I think that this question does not make any sense ,but still i hope to figure it out .

 

i have the simular model, i had to redo the thermal paste after it slid off my lap and onto the floor from the couch.

 

i don't know if it's just not built well or what,  but my heat problems went away after that.

 

Oh ..Thanks for the info .Will try that !

 

 

------------------------------

Note : Found out some info ,i know it might sound ridiculous but it works .

Removing the back case (Protection Plastic Case Underneath ) and keeping the down part on a flat table and then running all games and stress test resulted in no problems . I now think that lack of air flow might be the cause .

 

I am no expert ,so your opinions are valuable .

 

Edit : I got a generic thermal paste (HY510 HALNZIYE) after much effort's .Replaced the old one ,saw some guide on how to do it .No use .

The issue still persist's .I am hopeless on that area now .

 

Still the workaround by removing the back cover and using is working ,so i have some kind of hope in getting a solution .

 

Thanks for spending your valuable time for me.


Edited by hamluis, 11 June 2018 - 06:48 AM.


#5 Chris Cosgrove

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Posted 08 June 2018 - 05:09 PM

The secret with thermal paste - or heat sink compound, whatever you call it - is not the brand but in the application. I had a tube of some generic brand in my toolbox for several years until it ran out and it worked on everything from computers to audio systems to power control boards.

 

The secret is in cleaning the surfaces and getting a thin and even coating between the two surfaces. There are those who prefer to put a small blob in the middle of the surfaces to be joined and rely on the pressure of the clamping together to spread it; my own preference is to spread it evenly across one of the surfaces and then clamp them together. Your choice.

 

You should not need to take the base cover off a laptop to get adequate airflow through the system. Having to do this suggests either that the intake route is itself blocked or you are using it on a soft surface. If, for example, you are in the habit of using it in bed I would suggest the use of a hard flat tray to sit it on. This would permit the designed airflow to take place. I mention bed because my wife watches on-line sport from time to time in bed and you can hear the fan whirring away trying to keep up !

 

Chris Cosgrove



#6 febkosq8

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Posted 09 June 2018 - 12:45 AM

Thanks again for your efforts .

 

No i am not using it in a soft surface .Its being used in a flat surface always ,with plenty of space around .I even tried keeping the laptop at some height to reduce the heat .But all of it availed no use .

I properly checked all the intake routes for the air to go ,and their exist only 1 route ,i.e. below the case a bunch of holes arranged in a consistent rectangular manner which are pretty clear for airflow to my eyes .

 

Still waiting for a proper solution to appear .


Edited by hamluis, 11 June 2018 - 06:46 AM.


#7 Platypus

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Posted 09 June 2018 - 01:56 AM

It's been my observation that cooling may be marginal anyway in HP laptops, but from your symptoms I'd be suspecting the efficiency of the heatpipe has diminished. Perhaps a pinhole has allowed loss of some of the working fluid, or atmospheric contamination. If the heat exchanger at the condenser (outlet) end isn't getting as hot as normal (best judged using an infra-red thermometer), that would be a confirmation.

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#8 febkosq8

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Posted 09 June 2018 - 12:43 PM

 If the heat exchanger at the condenser (outlet) end isn't getting as hot as normal (best judged using an infra-red thermometer), that would be a confirmation.

By heat exchange do u mean the part of the heat sink near the fan where the fan blows out ?

My observation's are that the heat is greater on the  CPU > GPU > Fan side part of the heat sink .(I have a single piece of heat sink which has 3 parts for fan ,cpu & gpu) .

Is their any fixes or diagnostics that i can do to troubleshoot this ?

 

Thanks for your reply .



#9 Platypus

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Posted 09 June 2018 - 01:29 PM

Yes, the finned section that the fan blows through. When the laptop is being run without the bottom casing, if the heatpipe is operating correctly, the finned section should be quite warm and so should the exhaust air. It would be difficult to do an accurate diagnostic without being able to have previously measured comparative temperatures with the system working normally. But if the CPU and GPU are much hotter than the heat exchanger fins, then that suggests the heatpipe is not transferring the heat as it should. If that's the situation, replacing the heatpipe assembly is the only solution.

Wikipedia notes:

"non-condensable gases that diffuse through the pipe's walls, resulting from breakdown of the working fluid or as impurities extant in the material, may eventually reduce the pipe's effectiveness at transferring heat."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_pipe

Edited by Platypus, 09 June 2018 - 01:36 PM.

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#10 febkosq8

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 05:07 AM

Well i dont think any of my coolant inside the heat pipe is leaked or the heat sink is not working .

The air coming out is surely very hot ,but the force it is coming out is less when compared without the case .

When i  checked it the temp seems to be transferring from the CPU to the finned part as i would expect . 

 

The problem i found out is that ,when the case is on ,it is the case that gets heated up .I think the heat pipes are touching the metallic surface of the enclosure and hence the heat is stuck inside of the case .

I have attached a photo of the heat sink for reference . https://imgur.com/a/FRNxxZj

 

Thanks again for your valuable time !


Edited by hamluis, 11 June 2018 - 06:45 AM.
Removed unnecessary quotebox - Hamluis.


#11 Platypus

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 07:31 AM

If the exhaust air is hot, then that would suggest heat is being carried away by the heatpipe, although to be certain it is operating at original efficiency, it really would be necessary to know the ex-factory temperatures and be able to accurately measure locations with an infra-red spot thermometer. But a hot exhaust should mean the heatpipe is working.

Re-reading your initial post has caused me to wonder about one of your temperature quotes:

Cold Boot :55 Degree

If this is a reading taken as soon as possible after a genuine cold boot (e.g. first time startup in the morning) there seems to be something odd there. What would the ambient (room) temperature be?

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#12 febkosq8

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 07:50 AM

If the exhaust air is hot, then that would suggest heat is being carried away by the heatpipe, although to be certain it is operating at original efficiency, it really would be necessary to know the ex-factory temperatures and be able to accurately measure locations with an infra-red spot thermometer. But a hot exhaust should mean the heatpipe is working.

Re-reading your initial post has caused me to wonder about one of your temperature quotes:

Cold Boot :55 Degree

If this is a reading taken as soon as possible after a genuine cold boot (e.g. first time startup in the morning) there seems to be something odd there. What would the ambient (room) temperature be?

 

Hi thier ,

 

Thanks for spending your valuable time for me .

 

As far as my knowledge ,i dont know my ex-factory / earlier temperature's as i never had to measure it / monitor it .

I only started looking in the temps stats after the games started to stop working suddenly at a point of time .

 

 

By cold boot (55 Degree ) i meant that morning in case if i turn on laptop,after taking HW Monitor soon after Windows Loads up (which should be under 2 mins) ,the CPU package temps will be around (50 - 55 Degree) .

 

The room temperature would be around 25-35 degrees depending upon the time of the day . Mostly i dont think the external factors such as sunlight could be causing this problems .

 

I am now trying/experimenting with ideas that can possibly solve the issue .Once i reach somewhere i will surely update here .Till then i am open to all suggestion's / advice .

 

As far as replacing or getting warranty services topic goes ,i dont have any hope for it as this laptop was purchased from Kuwait and the parts are only available their (CONFIRMED) ,India HP Service Center refused to even open and see the laptop last time i went to get my failing HDD replaced .( I had to buy a new HDD as thier was no other way ) .

 

I have 2 possible reason's in my mind for this problem :

 1) Not enough air for the fan .Maybe the breathing holes below the case is not enough for the fan to blow out this amount of heat in time .

 2) Instead of disposing the heat to the outside ,thier is a design fault in my laptop which leads the case to gather all the heat produced during that situation  .

 

Feel free to give your opinion's .



#13 Platypus

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 08:27 AM

If I understand your initial post correctly, this started happening about 5 weeks ago, around the time BIOS updates were done?

In that situation, there would be no reason for insufficient ventilation or a design fault to be the cause.

Or have I misunderstood what you posted?

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#14 Platypus

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 08:35 AM

Mostly i dont think the external factors such as sunlight could be causing this problems .


The ambient temperature will very directly affect the operating temperature of the unit. Once the cooling fan is running at its full speed (i.e. the laptop can't be cooled any better), if the room temperature goes up 10°, the CPU temperature will go up 10°

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#15 febkosq8

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Posted 11 June 2018 - 10:16 AM

If I understand your initial post correctly, this started happening about 5 weeks ago, around the time BIOS updates were done?

In that situation, there would be no reason for insufficient ventilation or a design fault to be the cause.

Or have I misunderstood what you posted?

 

Yes  ,i used to play Rainbow 6 Siege (R6S) the very 1st version before .

Until recently (the above mention 5 weeks before ),i got the latest version of R6S for myself ,and hence the problem started .

So i dont know whether this was thier earlier or not ,as the latest version is a lot different from the 1st one and needs a ton of resources when compared to the old ones .

 

I never did a stress test also at the starting (When i got the laptop ) to find out if this problem exist  .

I am extremely sorry for forgetting to mention this point .

 

Let me tell something background for my laptop :

 1) Had to replace the motherboard as the BIOS crashed during an BIOS update .That time i was at Kuwait ,so got it replaced .

 2) Then recently (below 2 months) my HDD started giving out problems (Reallocated Sector Count ) For more details on that use the below link 

https://h30434.www3.hp.com/t5/Notebook-Hardware-and-Upgrade-Questions/Will-i-get-a-Hard-Drive-replacement-for-Reallocated-Sector/td-p/6651944

 

 

The ambient temperature will very directly affect the operating temperature of the unit. Once the cooling fan is running at its full speed (i.e. the laptop can't be cooled any better), if the room temperature goes up 10°, the CPU temperature will go up 10°

 

 

Well then the temp must have changed during the times i dont game . I use this laptop as my daily-driver too .

I believe that  the fan supposed to try- maintain a specific safe temperature .

Currently while typing this ,the temps are about (49-58 Degree ) ,the outside temperature is quite cool (it's night time with a lot of rain ).

 

Correct ,me if i am wrong .

 

Is their anyway to tell whether my fan is running at its full speed ? 

 

Also let me clarify one thing ,

I found a setting related to system fan in BIOS (Insydeh20) today . 

It stated that Fan always ON (Set to ON/True ) ,i wonder if that can affect the issue ,even though it is at ON rather than OFF .Any idea if its the correct setting ?

 

Thanks again for spending your time .


Edited by febkosq8, 11 June 2018 - 10:17 AM.





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