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What is the best Gear & Way to Route Internet through the Home Power Lines?


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#1 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 02:30 PM

I'm trying to get internet from a downstairs router to the upstairs in the house, and it can't be with the wifi.  It has to be a hardline of some kind.  

 

I have seen the videos suggesting that in my situation I would use the house's electric power lines as a medium to connect to the internet.  The videos I have seen seem somewhat out of date, so perhaps the technology exhibited in the videos is not up to date with the latest greatest thing.

 

I'm just looking for a clearer picture on what I possibly can do which I'm not already thinking of, and what would be the best gear to do it with as well as what should I never do?  I have seen some videos say you have to use the wall outlet not a powerstrip of some kind while I've seen some videos say that you can use a powerstrip instead of the wall outlet.  

 

I haven't tested any systems yet.

 

 

Thanks for your input ahead of time.  



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#2 mikey11

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 03:23 PM

you are talking about powerline adapters.....and they give horrible wifi signals and drop connections constantly.....i have never heard one good review of them, save your money

 

find a way to run a cat 5 or cat 6 cable from your router to wherever you want the connection upstairs



#3 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 03:56 PM

Not wifi



#4 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 04:28 PM

I'm looking at the reviews around these products, and the only complaint there is is when they do not get the same Mbps with the powerline adapters as they do across the Wifi and definitely not the ethernet cable.  

 

So tell me what is important here.  The speed between the router and my computer or the speed between the servers online through my ISP to my computer?

 

The way I understand it is that these speed tests that the consumers and many of the video demonstration guys are using is measuring the router to computer speeds not the server online to the computer speeds.  The ISP doesn't even provide them the speeds of the Wifi from the router to the computer rate, so they are blinded by the contrasts.  

 

Maybe I am blinded by bias, and I do not know what I am talking about.  That could be a factor, but the reviews say a lot.  They are mostly full flung ecstatic about the results of these powerline ethernet adapters, and the confusion about speed loss is rare.  

 

 

Tell me if I am wrong about how routers and internet works in general, and what are your experiences with the powerline ethernet devices.



#5 mikey11

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 04:35 PM

All an ISP cares about, or guarantees, is how fast their signal gets to the router in you home....that's it

 

anything beyond that is the customers problem, an ISP will never guarantee the speed of a WIFI signal.....that's the customers problem



#6 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 04:46 PM

Again, I don't use wifi.  



#7 mikey11

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 04:48 PM

Again, I don't use wifi.  

 

it might help if you explain in better detail what it is your trying to accomplish.....

 

here is my take.....

 

your router is located somewhere downstairs, and you have a computer upstairs that you want to hookup without using WIFI....correct?

 

if that is correct i have already provided you with a solution to run a cat 6 cable,



#8 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 05:25 PM

2 out of 3 is okay with me.  As long as we understand I can't use wifi.  Thanks for your time and input.   :)



#9 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 05:26 PM

I don't mean to be a brick or anything.  I'm mostly interested what others' experiences are with the powerline ethernet adapters are.  Hehe



#10 mikey11

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 05:37 PM

 I'm mostly interested what others' experiences are with the powerline ethernet adapters are.  Hehe

 

okay....i have already given my opinion on that....so looks like im done here



#11 Vicin

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 08:06 PM

I used to work as ISP tech support. If you'd call your ISP and ask for assistance they'd tell you that there's no way in hell they'd troubleshoot while you're connected trough homeplugs (internet trough the powergrid).

 

All though, I've heard ppl say they work  fine. But only for those that use them for basic stuff, such as youtube and news.

 

Also, if your cables in the walls are older then 10 years, it's never gonna work well.

 

Personally I used to share internet with my neighbor, the way we sorted it out was to have 2x 5.1 ghz repeaters that were wifi bridges designed to send TV. One was connected with an ethernet cable to the router and transmitted to the other one down in my apartment (2 floors down with one of the floors  being concrete).

 

This meant it didn't get disturbed by anyone using the routers wifi and the signal had only one device to send info to. A wifi will swap between sending to different devices otherwise and usually cause some issues while ex. gaming. On top of that I had a router in bridged mode connected to the repeater in my apartment so I could get my own wifi for phones and such + the extra ethernet ports for computers.

 

As for your question about what speed that matters, it's all about where the bottleneck is. Your speed will always be equal to the lowest speed on your way to the server, be it your ISPs throttle, your wifi speed or whatever. So if you have 500 mbit/sec to the router but your homeplug can only handle 50 mbit/sec you're limited to 50.

 

From the problems I've seen using homeplugs, the biggest issue seems to be latency (delay) and/or packet loss due to less then good quality powerlines. But as Iong as your wiring in your house is new, they SHOULD work pretty fine, expect extra delay though compared to wifi/ethernet cable.


Edited by Vicin, 09 March 2018 - 08:28 PM.


#12 F-1DeskLamp

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 09:19 PM

"So if you have 500 mbit/sec to the router but your homeplug can only handle 50 mbit/sec you're limited to 50."

 

 

Yeah, but if your ISP doesn't even do over 50Mbps, then where's the harm at?  The ISP, right?  Or am I missing something there.

 

And not to say I know more than you, but I've seen many reviews about these powerline ethernet adapters that say even though the house as 100 years old or less depending on which case it was, they were thrilled with the level of productivity they could carry out on the electrical wiring in the walls.  

 

 

But if I know anything, it's that as soon as I buy one of these, I am going to regret it.  LOL



#13 Vicin

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Posted 09 March 2018 - 09:26 PM

Yes, as long as your homeplugs can handle a higher speed then your ISP delivers they will not become a bottleneck and shouldn't affect your speed.

 

Of course they can work well even with older wiring but the older the wires are, the higher the chances are that you'll experience issues.

 

The biggest reason I don't like homeplugs is that it's hard to know if they will work well with the wiring you have. Maybe you could ask the salesperson for a guarantee that you can return them after trying them out if they do not work as intended. Testing if they work properly isn't hard. Just use some software such as pingplotter and set it to ping your router. If you experience packet loss and high delays you know it's not a good solution for you.

 

What's the reason you can't use wifi?



#14 Orecomm

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Posted 10 March 2018 - 10:59 AM

I have several clients using power line devices with various levels of success. Frankly, the only way you are going to know how it works in your case is to try it. Costco or Amazon or someone else that takes returns would be your friend. I keep a spare pair in my kit just for testing at client sites. In general, if both outlets are on the same circuit breaker you are generally golden. If they are on the same phase but different breakers you are generally good. (if you breaker box is typical, you will generally see that every even number breaker is on one phase, every odd is on the other). If you are across phases it gets a bit iffy.  If you are across breaker boxes or different power line drops you are most likely not going to have a good day. Plug strips, particularly of they have filters or surge suppression, are a no-no. Even in the best cases, some devices may kill your link when they power on and spew noise onto the power line. These are generally high power devices like microwave ovens (particularly old ones), air conditioners, compressors and shop equipment. Most electric heaters may give you a glitch when the turn on or off but usually so short as to be unnoticeable.

 

The other big gotcha with power line is that most power line devices handle only a single MAC address per "remote" end. This means you need a router to be the first device it hits if you need to connect more than one device on the remote end (many power line providers have units with 4 ports on the remote end, and special internal circuitry to solve this problem). Using a switch will result in really odd symptoms (one device at a time will work just fine while the others fail in weird and unusual ways, and which device is working at any given time (and which fails) is undefined. This same situation occurs if you try to link multiple devices across a WiFi link not designed for bridging.)

 

As with WiFi, the speeds advertised are generally unobtainable in the real world. That said, I have users successfully "twitch" gaming over the links.

 

Powerline will never match a dedicated wire. If you can get a Cat5 or better from point to point that would be your best solution.

 

Sometimes phone wire in the walls (yeah, once upon a time phones used wire to connect) can also be an alternative, but you may have to work on locating and disconnecting unused links. This is low Cat wire and you probably want to use specialized modems to use it, which can be pricey but reliable. For all practical purposes you are building a DSL network in your house. These aren't very common, it will take some searching to find them. Generally a search for Ethernet Extender Phone Line will get you started.

 

Likewise, it's possible to use old TV Coax for a network link, functionally your own Cable Internet.  Look for MOCA devices.

 

Good Luck!






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