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Win 10 crash, formerly on boot up, after win update, more general


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7 replies to this topic

#1 cd27idw

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Posted 21 January 2018 - 07:55 AM

http://speccy.piriform.com/results/Xh0Akav2jUW4EMGduevS01b

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#2 HyperHenry

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Posted 21 January 2018 - 10:44 AM

We really need more info to help you. There were no minidumps, you gave no explanation at all what's happening. The only thing I noticed on the Speccy is that you have Norton for an AV, Norton and Windows 10 are incompatible on many machines.



#3 pcpunk

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Posted 21 January 2018 - 03:28 PM

This probably has something to do with it:

"Installation Date: 19-Jan-18 2:25:18 PM"

 
A little history would be good.  One thing would be important, is this an Upgrade, or a Clean Install?
 
Many things can go wrong with the Upgrades from an older OS, and not just the first time, it can be the second or third Windows 10 Upgrade.  I'll just leave you with this link to help explain some of your options.  Fixing is always intriguing, but a Clean Install will be best if this is an older Upgrade.
JUST MAKE SURE TO BACKUP ALL YOUR FILES BEFORE ATTEMPTING A REPAIR
 
I find a clean install fixes many little issues and runs much smoother.  Sometimes will fix Long Startup times etc.

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#4 cd27idw

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Posted 21 January 2018 - 04:35 PM

Ok, thanks both of you for taking the time here.

 

Further Googling suggested turning off "Fast Computer Startup", and so far this appears to have sorted the issue, which has been ongoing for sometime, but became worse after a recent Windows update. The intermittent, and random, fail seems to have been resolved by turning off the computer hibernation/sleep feature.

 

As regards the suggestions above, the installation date would be the date of the windows update I mentioned, which appeared to be quite significant (might have switched on the hibernation option). The installation is an upgrade from Windows 7, and was done more than a year ago.  The hardware is also a number of years old (i'm not interested in upgrading any more), and it's possible that the power supply is exacerbating these issues.

 

As I say so far so good, I'll keep my fingers crossed that the issue is resolved.

 

Again, thank you for your inputs.

 

Ian Warren (cd27idw)



#5 pcpunk

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Posted 21 January 2018 - 07:40 PM

 

the installation date would be the date of the windows update I mentioned, which appeared to be quite significant

Yes, that would be a Major Update as "they" call it, but I call it an Upgrade.  If you are curious open CMD and type in "winver" and hit Enter, and it will tell you what version you are on now.  It's always interesting to see what Version computers are on at this time.

 

Good luck


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#6 usasma

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Posted 22 January 2018 - 04:21 PM

Your UEFI/BIOS (version F4) dates from 2012.  Please check at the manufacturer's website to see if there are any UEFI/BIOS updates available for your system.  If you are able to install the update through Windows (without booting from an external drive), then go ahead and update it.  WARNING - if the computer might shut down during this procedure, please don't do it, as this may physically damage the computer and prevent it from booting.
FYI - W8 and W10 communicate more with the UEFI/BIOS than previous versions of Windows, so it's important to ensure that the UEFI/BIOS is kept up to date (and the outdated UEFI/BIOS' may be the cause of some compatibility issues).

I am very concerned about the compatibility of this BIOS version with later versions of Windows (W8/10).   Unfortunately, the only way to test this is to install the original version of Windows that this system was originally designed for.  On a positive note, if the system manufacturer offers W10 support for this device - then compatibility issues become less of a concern.  If they don't offer W10 support, then the concern about compatibility remains high.

There's a bunch of BSOD's related to atapi.sys - which is related to the hard drive controller (which may be why the dump files weren't collected).
I have to wonder about the compatibility of this system with W10.  While it may have worked initially, the cumulative Windows Updates may have finally exposed an incompatibility that hasn't been fixed.
As I stated earlier, unfortunately the only sure way to test for this is to revert to the original OS and see if the problem goes away.

 

Beyond that, there's no firm indications of the problem in the uploaded reports.  Most often this is a symptom of a hardware or compatibility issue.

You can start to rule out hardware with these free diagnostics:Please run these free hardware diagnostics:  http://www.carrona.org/hwdiag.html
Please run ALL of the tests and let us know the results.
FYI - These are the tests and what we usually see for the reports:

1 - Antivirus/antimalware scans:  In short, if there are Trojans or other serious malware - start over in the Am I Infected forums
2 - Memory diagnostics:  Run MemTest86+ for at least 3 passes.  If booting from UEFI, run MemTest86 instead.  Let us know if there were any errors reported
3 - Hard Drive diagnostics:  Don't sweat the details here.  In short, run the Seagate Seatools Long/Extended test from a bootable disk.  If unable to run it from a bootable disk (UEFI and some others), then run the Seagate Seatools for Windows from within Windows.  There are no diagnostics for SSD's, just run the Crystal Mark tests and let us know if there were any failures
4 - Furmark:  run the test until the temperature stabilizes.  Don't let it get much over 90ºC.  Let us know the temp it stabilizes at and if there were any problems running the test (other than slowness).
5 - Prime95:  run the Blend test for 24 hours (this may not be possible, but run it as long as you can.  Look for errors in the output, or for problems running the test (freezes/crashes)
6 - Video 2 (other video tests):  there's several tests here.  Run all of them.  I'm especially interested in the Video Memory Test.  Let us know the results of the test(s)
  - A - simtek.org memtest
  - B - Video memory stress test
  - C - Artifact Locator
  - D - OCCT - 4 built in tests for CPU, GPU, PSU
  - E - Video Memory Stress Test
7 - CPU tests:  run at least one test on your CPU and let us know the result.


And, if the system passes all of those tests, then the next step would be this procedure:  http://www.carrona.org/strpdown.html

 

Good luck!


My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.

#7 cd27idw

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Posted 22 January 2018 - 04:49 PM

Thanks for your time. The issue has effectively been resolved by switching of the fast computer startup, as detailed above.

 

As regards the BIOS, yes it's very old, but it's the latest for the motherboard; the whole computer is now a few years old, and was assembled by myself with a Windows 98 operating system. I was once very keen on upgrading, but latterly have better things to spend my money on.  I don't know how many more Windows (currently Windows 10 ver 1709) revisions it will take, from this episode, I guess it's already being challenged by the new techniques. Downhill from here on I suppose. I'm not usually by this desktop so much, usually use my laptop when I'm on the road.

 

Many thanks for your input, but I'm confident now that the issues are resolved, especially the startup.



#8 usasma

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Posted 24 January 2018 - 01:13 PM

Not a problem - I'm just glad that you got it working.

 

Unfortunately, compatibility issues start like this - but after you spend weeks and weeks troubleshooting them, they're still not fixed.

 

A short story......

 

Back when Vista first came out I purchased a new, top of the line Lenovo t60p laptop.  It had everything on it and I was the envy of all the other geeks.
It upgraded to Windows 7 seamlessly and worked OK for several years.
Then Windows 8 came out and I upgraded to that without any problems.

But after a while strange, unfixable errors started to crop up.  Nothing real serious, but enough so that I had to take pains to save my work every couple of minutes so that I didn't lose it.

Being a troubleshooter at heart, I started looking for causes - and found none.

Even tried reinstalling Windows 8 - without any luck.

I enlisted the help of all my friends on the forums - without any luck.

Then I took it to the Microsoft MVP Summit at Microsoft - where I had other MVP's look at it, and even had some Microsoft Windows people look at it.

And in the end we all came to the same conclusion - it just wasn't compatible w/Windows 8.

 

Shortly after that one of our friends needed a new computer for their daughter - so I installed Windows 7 on it and let them have it (explained the issues that it had w/W8 and that we hoped there wouldn't be problems w/W7).

That was about 5 years ago and that system is still running without problems.


My browser caused a flood of traffic, sio my IP address was banned. Hope to fix it soon. Will get back to posting as soon as Im able.

- John  (my website: http://www.carrona.org/ )**If you need a more detailed explanation, please ask for it. I have the Knack. **  If I haven't replied in 48 hours, please send me a message. My eye problems have recently increased and I'm having difficult reading posts. (23 Nov 2017)FYI - I am completely blind in the right eye and ~30% blind in the left eye.<p>If the eye problems get worse suddenly, I may not be able to respond.If that's the case and help is needed, please PM a staff member for assistance.




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