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Install sequence - dual booting ?


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#1 Chris Cosgrove

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 07:37 PM

Long story, short story. I have a Sony Vaio laptop, model SVF 1421S1E, which I use mainly for teaching purposes. Since I need both Windows and Linux I intended re-partitioning the 750GB drive to allow me to install Mint 18.2 alongside Win 8.1. Trying to generate a clone before i did the re-partitioning failed due to 'read errors'. SFC showed unfixable errors, it then failed the long Seagate generic test, so Chkdsk /r and another long test - failed.

 

This laptop now has a brand new 1TB drive in it, considering its expected use a ridiculous capacity. I installed 8.1 on it then reduced the size of the partition to give me ~300GB of space for Linux and installed Mint 18.2 from a USB stick into this partition. The installation has failed twice with the message that the Grub package did not install.

 

I am thinking of basically blanking this hard drive and returning it to one empty partition and starting again. But should I install Mint first or Windows ?  Or is there a better way of going about this than starting all over again. Win 8.1 is working but I have no choice to get into Mint.

 

Chris Cosgrove

 

 



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#2 buddy215

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 08:09 PM

Install Windows first. Seems I recall others having difficulty with Sony Vaio.

 

Check out info on one or more of the search results.

dual boot windows and linux on Sony Vaio laptop - Google Search


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#3 NickAu

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 08:17 PM

 

But should I install Mint first or Windows ?

Windows.

 

Did you install Mint in UEFI or Legacy mode?

 

How To Install Linux Mint Alongside Windows 10 (UEFI)

http://www.everydaylinuxuser.com/2016/04/how-to-install-linux-mint-alongside.html

 

How To Install Ubuntu Linux Alongside Windows 10 (Standard BIOS, non-UEFI)

http://www.everydaylinuxuser.com/2015/11/how-to-install-ubuntu-linux-alongside_8.html


Edited by NickAu, 10 November 2017 - 08:17 PM.


#4 pcpunk

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Posted 10 November 2017 - 11:41 PM

Some have had success making sure the "Device for Boot-Loader" was the Windows EFI System Partition. 

 

Some are also saying to Turn Off Fast Boot in Windows 8.

 

Here is a good resource for the basics, but does not mention the above and is a little dated.


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#5 paul88ks

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 12:35 AM

If your hard drive is failing tests- then it IS possible that you got bad drive OOTB- 

What program did you use to test it?

Is it possible to remove the drive and test it on another machine?

 

I always install Windows first on a dual -boot machine. Then Linux. If it isn't showing up in the boot loader after install, download Easy BCD and use it to dual boot initially, then you can update grub from Linux,and you will be good to go-

I had a similar incident with a brand new hard drive once- Paul



#6 Gary R

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 01:20 AM

You should always install Windows first, and then Linux.

 

Whereas the Linux bootloader can deal with the fact that Windows is already present, and can usually accommodate it into a dual boot setup without problems, the same cannot be said for the Windows bootloader, which generally mucks things up if Linux is already installed.



#7 paul88ks

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 02:46 AM

You should always install Windows first, and then Linux.

 

Whereas the Linux bootloader can deal with the fact that Windows is already present, and can usually accommodate it into a dual boot setup without problems, the same cannot be said for the Windows bootloader, which generally mucks things up if Linux is already installed.

Amen to that! Although i recently did a dual boot machine with UEFI and placed the bootloader for Linux in the Windows Boot Manager. I was hesitant at first because I had not attempted it before, but it booted right up with both OS's showing. But I still still think it is good practice to install Windows first. Maybe I will try it the other way around on a spare machine I have,and see what happens?



#8 Chris Cosgrove

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 11:09 AM

Thanks guys.

 

I installed in UEFI mode.

 

I think I'll have a look at EasyBCD first as that sounds a quicker way of getting into the Mint install. If I can get into it it is probably fixable. Failing that, Nick's first link shows promise. I hadn't thought of booting from the 'Assist' button.

 

I really would like to get this up on the Vaio, it's quite a nice laptop even if the screen is a bit smaller than I like but it has battery life which is longer than I need between charging opportunities. My other laptop is marginal on battery power for one of my teaching sessions. But running Win 7 and 18.2 I resized the Windows partition and installed Mint without any problems at all and Grub works as it is supposed to !

 

Chirs Cosgrove



#9 pcpunk

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 03:51 PM

Thanks guys.

 

I installed in UEFI mode.

Windows 8 and Mint?

 

I think I'll have a look at EasyBCD first as that sounds a quicker way of getting into the Mint install.

Yes, that sounds like a good idea.  It may take a few try's to point the device to the partition you installed Grub too.


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#10 Chris Cosgrove

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 05:44 PM

I am getting frustrated !  What idiot developed UEFI ?  More accurately, I have nothing against developments in security and I can understand MS taking the point of view that if you have one of their OS, especially 8.1 or later, then - of course - you don't need another. But why did, as I understand it, the mobo makers go along with this exclusive point of view ? Again, I can understand MS leaning on the OEM builders to install their OS, whisper it, possibly even offering incentives, but why does this affect downstream component suppliers ?

 

Thanks to Mike Walsh, Puppy and the fact that Linux pays very little attention to MS restrictions I have restored this HD to the condition it was in when I brought it home yesterday - blank, formatted NTFS. But if I set the BIOS/UEFI to 'Legacy' it won't boot into Windows, and if it is set to 'UEFI' it gives one a seriously hard time trying to get it to dual boot. Grrrr ! ! !

 

I'm done for today, but the struggle continues !

 

Chris Cosgrove



#11 buddy215

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 05:53 PM

See post #2


“Every atom in your body came from a star that exploded and the atoms in your left hand probably came from a different star than your right hand. It really is the most poetic thing I know about physics...you are all stardust.”Lawrence M. Krauss

A 1792 U.S. penny, designed in part by Thomas Jefferson and George Washington, reads “Liberty Parent of Science & Industry.”


#12 philbo

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 06:25 PM

Chris, sorry to see you're having trouble with UEFI.

I've found I prefer it to legacy, mainly because bootloaders for different OSs can live side by side in an EFI partition instead of overwriting each other as with MBR.

I usually manage the EFI partition by booting a live usb of Ubuntu or Mint, mounting the EFI partition with the "Disks" utility, and viewing the contents with the file manager. It's a good way to see which bootloader files should and shouldn't be present.



#13 MadmanRB

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 06:32 PM

Yeah always reinstall windows first as it will screw up the bootloader


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#14 pcpunk

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 09:24 PM

I am getting frustrated !  What idiot developed UEFI ?  

I feel you pain Chris, I'm just learning UEFI and not even dual booting, just trying to get Windows to install sometimes, or booting a Linux Live Session can be a pain.  It is...for sure...a PITA! 

 

Some of those links explain that you can install windows in Legacy by accident, then when you try to install Linux in UEFI it don't work, or won't boot after because the first OS was in Legacy.  I've done many Dual Boots in MBR Style, super easy as you know.  Sometimes it's the Boot Order that says USB-UEFI, DVD-UEFI etc.  and other variables, Arrrggggg.  Sometimes the proper UEFI Boot Devices don't even show up, sometimes it takes multiple boots to get it right.  I've had the most headaches on W8 computers...I need more practice for sure. 


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#15 philbo

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Posted 11 November 2017 - 11:31 PM

UEFI dual boots seem to go pretty smoothly for me these days, but there are a few things to look out for while attempting them...

1) Always install Windows first.

2) Turn off Fast Startup in Windows power button settings.

3) Some distros require Secure Boot to be disabled.

4) Check you are definitely booting in UEFI. Some computers include legacy boot options along with those for UEFI boot. My Dell laptop separates them clearly, but they're still there.

5) Ubuntu's Ubiquity installer (also used by Mint) won't allow you to select an EFI partition. It always installs the bootloader in the Windows EFI.

6) The LMDE installer (also used by Netrunner) will sometimes label the hard drive as sdb, instead of sda. The installation will go along as normal, but the bootloader will then fail to install.

7) Unlike Ubiquity, the Anaconda and Calamares installers will let you install the bootloader on a separate EFI partition.

8) After uninstalling a Linux distro, the boot files remain in the EFI partition. They take up very little space, and you can delete them later anyway.
 






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