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CPU getting too hot


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#16 Just_One_Question

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:23 AM

Yes, you are correct, Louis. I excluded all other parts (forgot about the sensors, though, good thinking!) based on the fact that absolutely everything else in his computer works fine, so it would make sense that wherever the problem is located, it is the culprit.:)



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#17 britechguy

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:40 AM

I also don't get, at all, what the big deal is when there is no evidence, none, of misbehavior on the part of the computer.

 

If the thing is actually 90 degrees C and running fine then it's 90 degrees C and running fine.   There is not a single modern processor that won't throttle itself and shut down if necessary when it detects it's getting anywhere near to its Tcritical temperature.

 

There are lots of modern CPUs/APUs designed to tolerate in excess of 90 degrees C as within their normal operating range.  The i7-2600K isn't one of those according to its specs, but whatever this CPU is running at, temperature-wise, is not something it thinks is critically high.   If it were there would be associated behavior changes.


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#18 Just_One_Question

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:55 AM

True, but what if the sensors are not working as Louis suggested and OP is in the beginning of seeing the CPU just slowly frying itself until system instabilities do start to occur?:)



#19 Platypus

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 09:57 AM

I find statements that the throttling threshold for that CPU is 95C, with maximum (presumably total throttling) of 98C.

Note that these are core junction temperatures, which are reported by digital data - the case temperature Tc is read from a sensor on the casing and recommended maximum is 72.6C

If it is only the maximum reported figure that reaches 90C rather than a continuous steady temperature, that may well not be abnormal. A core could attain 90C for a few seconds during turbo boost, then drop back to what I read seems to be common gaming range 74 - 79C.

Edited by Platypus, 13 September 2017 - 10:17 AM.

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#20 jonuk76

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:09 AM

I also don't get, at all, what the big deal is when there is no evidence, none, of misbehavior on the part of the computer.

 

If the thing is actually 90 degrees C and running fine then it's 90 degrees C and running fine.   There is not a single modern processor that won't throttle itself and shut down if necessary when it detects it's getting anywhere near to its Tcritical temperature.

 

There are lots of modern CPUs/APUs designed to tolerate in excess of 90 degrees C as within their normal operating range.  The i7-2600K isn't one of those according to its specs, but whatever this CPU is running at, temperature-wise, is not something it thinks is critically high.   If it were there would be associated behavior changes.

 

My thinking/personal opinion, is that if it's hitting core temperatures of 90 degrees when running a game, then there could be other more stressful uses which will push it over the edge of throttling.  Games typically do not stress quad core+ processors 100%.  They use a mixture of GPU and CPU depending on what's going on at the time, but are normally more GPU intensive.  Linpack or things like Prime95, used for stress testing or for legitimate scientific purposes for a few people, is one way of thrashing the processor 100% deliberately.  Other things like video encoding can be extremely processor intensive.  For this reason I want any system I've built to withstand running Prime95 stably (a worst case scenario as far as processor heat is concerned) for several hours, with a good degree of thermal headroom.  

 

Most laptops and ultra small form factor computers are compromised, in that they WILL throttle under high loads, get hot to touch, have fans spinning at high rpm etc. and that is a result of them being designed to be small and portable.  There's not a lot that can be done about it, but most sensible people will not use their laptops to run Folding @ Home, BOINC, Prime 95 etc long periods..  There is no need for a desktop to be compromised in the same way, where you have the room to use an adequate cooling system.


Edited by jonuk76, 13 September 2017 - 10:10 AM.


#21 MadmanRB

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:37 AM

Well my question is what about airflow?

You didnt specify your case.

Nor did you specify your cooler.

Do you live in a warm client?


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#22 britechguy

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 10:51 AM

True, but what if the sensors are not working as Louis suggested and OP is in the beginning of seeing the CPU just slowly frying itself until system instabilities do start to occur? :)

 

Not that this cannot happen, but it is relatively rare.

 

What it comes down to is that, unless you're willing to pull the thing apart, replace thermal paste, etc., and put it back together you're not going to see any change (unless something's clogged/dirty, and I presume whatever cleaning that can be done has been done).   You may not see any change afterward, either.

 

I have yet to see a CPU not give scads of warning signs when failure is in the cards, whether that failure is imminent or a bit further off.   If I've got a system that's behaving normally with temperature spikes secondary to heavy-duty processing - and in my experience modern games involve some very heavy duty processing on a cyclic basis - I don't worry about it.

 

Some of that comes, I guess, from having my very earliest laptops using processors that were known to "run hot" (and on my now ancient Acer that was an understatement) straight out of the box.  It's still running (but I'm not using it practically at all these days - it's an XP era box) many, many years later.

 

I really wish that manufacturers would routinely include a normal "idle temperature range" along with a "normal stressed temperature range," and always report what the Tcritical temperature is for a given CPU/APU/GPU.   I have been astounded on several occasions at just how big a spread there is between what is reported as maximum normal operating temperature and Tcritical, where the machine will shut itself down to prevent destruction.   There's usually a generous amount of breathing room for transient spikes, but sometimes the breathing room is so great that I find the "maximum normal" temperature to be a joke.


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     A job that routinely requires 60 to 80 hours per week is mismanaged, understaffed, or staffed with the wrong person.  A badly managed firm isn't a good place for men or women, parents or not."  ~ Sophie M. Korczyk

 


#23 TheFrancisco

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 04:27 PM

I'm at lost here, what are you all suggesting, that I should abandon the issue as long as the pc works and doesn't shut down? and if that's the case could I object and state that I should be doing something BEFORE it shuts down?



#24 The-Toolman

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 04:29 PM

Remove the side cover and then while running the games that you are experiencing the high temperatures reach inside the case and grab hold of the processor heat sink.

 

If the processor heat sink is only warm to hot by touching I wouldn't really be to concerned.

If the processor heat sink is to hot to touch then I would be concerned as that would indicate a problem.

Yes I know my method is old school but effective.

 

If your computer is not locking up or shutting down randomly then I wouldn't be real concerned.

 

Just my 2 cents.


Edited by The-Toolman, 13 September 2017 - 04:30 PM.

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#25 britechguy

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 05:20 PM

I'm at lost here, what are you all suggesting, that I should abandon the issue as long as the pc works and doesn't shut down? and if that's the case could I object and state that I should be doing something BEFORE it shuts down?

 

Yes, that is what I'm suggesting.   You can object if you please, but if you've got a bad sensor that's not going to change unless you replace the CPU, at which point you'd might as well replace the computer unless it was a custom build.  The next thing would be redoing the thermal paste, which you seem to be wanting to avoid, and there's no guarantee that would work.

 

It is extremely unusual for any CPU/APU/GPU that is overheating beyond its design tolerances to continue chugging along like nothing's gone wrong.  I suspect a bad sensor, myself.  I also suspect things will chug along for years with these readings still being produced.  I suspect there's actually nothing wrong other than getting a bad temperature reading.

 

If you've already done the easy things (checking that you don't have dust bunnies, have clear inlets/outlets for air cooling, have functional fans), and don't wish to do the intermediate and messy, I have no idea what anyone could suggest that has not been suggested.  If it is a bad sensor then there's nothing short of replacing the CPU that is going to change anything, but you can't know that until all of "the usual steps" including replacing the thermal paste have been done.


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     A job that routinely requires 60 to 80 hours per week is mismanaged, understaffed, or staffed with the wrong person.  A badly managed firm isn't a good place for men or women, parents or not."  ~ Sophie M. Korczyk

 


#26 britechguy

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 05:25 PM

If your computer is not locking up or shutting down randomly then I wouldn't be real concerned.

 

Which is the succinct version of what I've been trying to express.  CPUs that are actually overheating have always, in my experience, exhibited clear symptoms in terms of what the end user with absolutely no knowledge of what might be wrong would immediately notice.

 

If it's not objecting then there's likely nothing to object to.  I see more hand wringing (and that's not aimed at the original poster, at least not directly) over CPU temperatures and unnecessary stress about it than I care to.  These things are not "shrinking violets" and generally not subtle about something being wrong.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it.


Brian  AKA  Bri the Tech Guy (website address in my profile) Windows 10 Home, 64-bit, Version 1703, Build 15063

       

". . . American business has yet to learn how to measure the productivity and effectiveness of professional and technical employees.  As a result, employees who get little done, but spend a lot of time doing it, are often rewarded more than those who fulfill or exceed job requirements while keeping reasonable hours.
     A job that routinely requires 60 to 80 hours per week is mismanaged, understaffed, or staffed with the wrong person.  A badly managed firm isn't a good place for men or women, parents or not."  ~ Sophie M. Korczyk

 


#27 The-Toolman

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Posted 13 September 2017 - 06:26 PM

 

If your computer is not locking up or shutting down randomly then I wouldn't be real concerned.

 

Which is the succinct version of what I've been trying to express.  CPUs that are actually overheating have always, in my experience, exhibited clear symptoms in terms of what the end user with absolutely no knowledge of what might be wrong would immediately notice.

 

If it's not objecting then there's likely nothing to object to.  I see more hand wringing (and that's not aimed at the original poster, at least not directly) over CPU temperatures and unnecessary stress about it than I care to.  These things are not "shrinking violets" and generally not subtle about something being wrong.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

:thumbup2:


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#28 TheFrancisco

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 09:04 AM

Remove the side cover and then while running the games that you are experiencing the high temperatures reach inside the case and grab hold of the processor heat sink.

 

If the processor heat sink is only warm to hot by touching I wouldn't really be to concerned.

If the processor heat sink is to hot to touch then I would be concerned as that would indicate a problem.

Yes I know my method is old school but effective.

 

If your computer is not locking up or shutting down randomly then I wouldn't be real concerned.

 

Just my 2 cents.

Believe me on this: I will end up, sooner or later, following your suggestion; it may be old school but it's sure to be efficient, thank you.



#29 TheFrancisco

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 09:08 AM

 

If your computer is not locking up or shutting down randomly then I wouldn't be real concerned.

 

Which is the succinct version of what I've been trying to express.  CPUs that are actually overheating have always, in my experience, exhibited clear symptoms in terms of what the end user with absolutely no knowledge of what might be wrong would immediately notice.

 

If it's not objecting then there's likely nothing to object to.  I see more hand wringing (and that's not aimed at the original poster, at least not directly) over CPU temperatures and unnecessary stress about it than I care to.  These things are not "shrinking violets" and generally not subtle about something being wrong.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

I recognise the wisdom in your words and I'll just follow your advice BUT if something happens I'll come back to annoy you if that's ok with you :thumbsup2:

Oh and thanks by the way.



#30 britechguy

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Posted 14 September 2017 - 09:32 AM

You're welcome.  And you can always come back to annoy us!!

 

In this particular case, though, the gamut has pretty much been run.


Brian  AKA  Bri the Tech Guy (website address in my profile) Windows 10 Home, 64-bit, Version 1703, Build 15063

       

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     A job that routinely requires 60 to 80 hours per week is mismanaged, understaffed, or staffed with the wrong person.  A badly managed firm isn't a good place for men or women, parents or not."  ~ Sophie M. Korczyk

 





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