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AMD vs Intel: MDD1963 vs Drillingmachine


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#106 MDD1963

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Posted 07 October 2017 - 08:00 AM

Did you see the thread about leaked forthcoming socket 1161 and socket 2076, presumably for 2018/2019, repsectively? :)

 

(Not that a potential 8700K buyer would likely need a CPU upgrade soon after anyway, but, for sure socket 1151 already dead end....no more releases on 1151v2,at least none forecasted currently, but, you could never rule out them slipping in a '8750K' with 100 MHz higher base clock) :)


Asus Z270A Prime/7700K/32 GB DDR4-3200/GTX1060


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#107 cat1092

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Posted 08 October 2017 - 05:54 AM

Did you see the thread about leaked forthcoming socket 1161 and socket 2076, presumably for 2018/2019, repsectively? :)

 

(Not that a potential 8700K buyer would likely need a CPU upgrade soon after anyway, but, for sure socket 1151 already dead end....no more releases on 1151v2,at least none forecasted currently, but, you could never rule out them slipping in a '8750K' with 100 MHz higher base clock) :)

 

Yes, I could see Intel release yet another 1151v2 chip, maybe a model from tweaking of existing overstock (like the meaningless i7-4771), which by chance was exactly 100 MHz more over the (then) highly popular i7-4770.......just to gain some extra R&D cash for their upcoming projects! :)

 

Speaking of which, the two 'Devil's Canyon' CPU's was a sweet final release of Intel's most successful (in sales & longevity) of the Haswell (1150) line, had a great 3.5 year run, by far the longest of the post 'i' series gen to this day. A run that may never be broken, given the fast paced releases since. Many considers Devil's Canyon to be a parting gift from Intel to all of the ones who made Haswell the success it was, to be able to get two last fast CPU's, and I'm happy to have been a part of it. Both should last me a total of a decade, or until these become third string PC's! :P

 

Here's how my latest project has turned out...so far. Still have some work to do, would like to make it run 32GB RAM, as the FX-8350 did before. Just found out also that my 8GB GSkill Aegis RAM modules are overclockable, had to, by default ran at near half of it's rated 800 MHz each (1600 MHz as a kit). Instead, are now running at some odd spec, I believe 1732 MHz, dual channel. Also, I need to learn the difference between 'ganged' & 'unganged', my experience has always been that everything falls into place once the PC is fired up. Am not sure is the terms are related to dual channel, which I'm running, may have to create my own Topic in regards to this. May be the reason why Windows won't boot with 32GB installed, although can use the other two modules elsewhere. :)

 

http://speccy.piriform.com/results/8z63DC2vYE8UQxsuCYxUrRY

 

Can't get it to run below 39C yet, may be it's best, although Prime95 doesn't push it any warmer than a manual MBAM Threat scan. Yet the feel of the PC with the Phenom x4 965 is more responsive than the FX-6300 for certain & close to 8530 levels, using half the quantity of RAM. :thumbsup:

 

Looking forward to Intel's new sockets again & how AMD will respond, although I don't see them moving away from the AM4 socket for a while. Historically, they've tended to get the most out of existing ones, just a couple of versions back were the long running & successful (in sales) AM3+ sockets, of which would also run AM3. 

 

Oh, and while here, I also had to move the NH-D15 fan on my main rig, until I purchased the TridentX modules with removable heat spreaders & it's still a tad higher, here's the original pics. :)

 

4r3TmQV.jpg

 

6LPOApC.jpg

 

Have learned from both between you & Drillingmachine, as well as many others here over the past decade, was a follower of the site 7 years before joining. :)

 

As to 'AMD vs Intel', I'm no fanboy of either & never have been when it comes to CPU's, only the one that meets my need/desire at time of purchase. Had AMD not dragged around so long over the Ryzen release, wouldn't had purchased the MB's I'm now running nor the FX-8350, I simply wanted the best AMD build I could find. Although hindered myself a bit be not looking closer at FM2+, because these has PCIe 3.0 x16 lanes, while not as powerful as the FX-8350, there's one or two fairly potent Athlon chips w/out onboard graphics & the speed of a PCIe x4 NVMe SSD would had more than made up for any power loss. Have a spare of these in my safe, still in sealed package, just nowhere to install for now.

 

The reason from the beginning, going back to my ASRock 970M Pro3/FX-6300 purchase a couple of years back, I simply wasn't aware of the FM2/FM2+ differences, other than many offered onboard graphics. Guess it called living & learning, no need to second guess myself now, only to research unfamiliar brands more before pulling the trigger. :P

 

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ASUS Z97-PRO Gamer PC. EVGA GTX 1070 FTW + ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5 GPU! 4K!  http://speccy.piriform.com/results/w3mBsNE6cJXW7on5sbNTFDc  (Updated 10/07/2017)

ASRock Z97 Extreme6, EVGA GTX 1060 FTW + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/tbdS4YKHBvWROeKETAMBRKk  (Updated 04/12/2017))                                                                       

Dell XPS 8700, Revived from the Dead, EVGA GTX 1060 SSC + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/KrNXc5IZ6HmJvrrLVSZbGzi  (Updated 05/17/2017)

ASUS 970 PRO Gaming AURA, with a cool running AMD Phenom x4 965 CPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/c0aVnEnmxFmqX5Pf1nOhCKf   (Updated 10/10/2017)

Dell Dimension 2400 Rebuild, Done the Right Way! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/MLv5xbYuI2vsLqvtS4PaDGB  (Updated 10/20/2017)


#108 MDD1963

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Posted 09 October 2017 - 08:28 PM

The ever so elegant tan and dark brown, matching any color scheme world wide! :) (Darn good cooler, though!)


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#109 cat1092

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 05:40 AM

Yes, for the money, as long as it fits in the case, the Noctua NH-D15 can't be beat. :)

 

That flimsy copper core cooler that used to be shipped with unlocked Intel CPU's performs worse than the stock XPS 8700 one. Which by chance was all aluminum, yet 3x heavier & also that much taller. I believe that the copper core is rather hollow, cannot be compared to one with copper tubing. Eventually found a compatible 3rd party cooler, yet still had to purchase a 92mm NF-A9 due to fan rattle, and use SpeedFan to tune speed of all fans (was running at a max of 808 rpm), The plus was that I was able to reuse the stock fan as an intake via the PWM splitter & now all fans are running nearly wide open, providing great flow from front to rear.

 

Purging any computer of hot air should lower temps of most any installed CPU, plus keep other components cooler as well. The PC I'm on now was designed with great airflow in mind, two intake fans lit in blue, one exhaust & the top is open with a magnetized dust filter for extra passive cooling. Great addition to the Rosewill Stryker M because heat rises, for the cash, a nice case. I paid $20 less than the below price with free shipping. 

 

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811147244

 

Also has a windowed door for those who wants to show their stuff, am not into it myself, so disabled the lighting effects of the MB, which were nice, yet no good because of the way I have to set it. No room to turn one PC to the side when there's 6 mid towers on a shelf, not counting my main rig under the desk & a couple of SFF PC's that's stacked with wood blocks between each on top of the PC desk hutch. Plus I may consider another Z97 build when I get the ASRock Z97 Extreme6 MB repaired under warranty (bent pins). I sent in the UPC for a rebate before attempting a build, come to find out the socket needs replacement. Will cost $50 plus shipping & then warranty becomes reduced to 90 days. Or may save for 'just in case' one of my others goes bad. I prefer the MB over the ASUS Z97 PRO Gamer because it's easier to OC, that's why I can push the crap out of the i5-4690K w/out BSOD, so may swap & save the ASUS as a spare. I really don't need any more PC's at the moment, just maintain the ones here (9 total, plus three notebooks). :)

 

One thing for sure, I'm going to mark the MB in several places before shipping to ensure I get my original back & take lots of pics, plus let them know ahead of time that I don't want a swapped one & will have the proof. It's new & can be smelled as such, someone must have hit the pins hard. Will pay with credit card so that my rights will be enforced. 

 

When it comes to new build time, will sell a couple of these, at one time had 15-16 MT PC's, gave one to a friend, another newer than any I own to a neighbor along with a notebook to her daughter & donated the rest to the local Hospice store. That notebook, a Dell Inspirion, had a 4th gen i7, although weak (sub-20W) model, my 1st gen MSI's i7 dusted it in performance benchmarks. I'm more into power over elegance. :thumbsup:

 

Cat


ASUS Z97-PRO Gamer PC. EVGA GTX 1070 FTW + ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5 GPU! 4K!  http://speccy.piriform.com/results/w3mBsNE6cJXW7on5sbNTFDc  (Updated 10/07/2017)

ASRock Z97 Extreme6, EVGA GTX 1060 FTW + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/tbdS4YKHBvWROeKETAMBRKk  (Updated 04/12/2017))                                                                       

Dell XPS 8700, Revived from the Dead, EVGA GTX 1060 SSC + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/KrNXc5IZ6HmJvrrLVSZbGzi  (Updated 05/17/2017)

ASUS 970 PRO Gaming AURA, with a cool running AMD Phenom x4 965 CPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/c0aVnEnmxFmqX5Pf1nOhCKf   (Updated 10/10/2017)

Dell Dimension 2400 Rebuild, Done the Right Way! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/MLv5xbYuI2vsLqvtS4PaDGB  (Updated 10/20/2017)


#110 jonuk76

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Posted 11 October 2017 - 07:20 AM

Yes, for the money, as long as it fits in the case, the Noctua NH-D15 can't be beat. :)

 

That flimsy copper core cooler that used to be shipped with unlocked Intel CPU's performs worse than the stock XPS 8700 one. Which by chance was all aluminum, yet 3x heavier & also that much taller. I believe that the copper core is rather hollow, cannot be compared to one with copper tubing. Eventually found a compatible 3rd party cooler, yet still had to purchase a 92mm NF-A9 due to fan rattle, and use SpeedFan to tune speed of all fans (was running at a max of 808 rpm), The plus was that I was able to reuse the stock fan as an intake via the PWM splitter & now all fans are running nearly wide open, providing great flow from front to rear.

 

 

Their coolers have got lighter in later variants, so probably the copper slug has been shrinking yes.  Copper is expensive... I actually looked into it at some point (what a life eh?) and noted a box cooler I have that came with a Socket 1156 (1st gen) i5 was notably heavier, than one that came with a 4770K, and also had a much more powerful fan...  The box coolers they supplied by the Haswell generation were frankly insufficient for the top end, hot running models, to the point they could thermally throttle at stock speeds.  Who in their right mind spends the money on a high spec "K" CPU and uses a box cooler anyway?  Probably why they no longer include them.  However they work well as an "upgrade" cooler on lower end CPU's like the Pentium's, which come with alu only coolers.

 

I used the old 1st gen i5 cooler on my Pentium G4560 mini PC build, and it does quite nicely.  I don't normally hear it and even when being thrashed barely registers over 50 degrees at the cores.



#111 cat1092

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Posted 12 October 2017 - 05:08 AM

jounk76, that's exactly why many of those coolers can be found new & unused, still with OEM thermal paste applied, for as little as $10 (the copper core version). Most who pays $300+ USD for a CPU will likely upgrade the cooling, most all mid tower cases, as well as mini-towers, can accommodate some type of 3rd party tower cooler, although if one has a Pentium or i3 & needs a basic one, the Intel copper model will do the job. :)

 

Yes, the 1st gen, as well as some Socket 775 CPU's were much better, am awaiting a Dell Optiplex 780 MT OEM optional cooler to upgrade the smaller, all aluminum one. This will allow me to install a Q9550/9650 once the warranty expires in a year, by then pricing will also fall, some of the Q9550's are already at the $30 mark, I expect the Q9650 to be at that point or less come another year. Once the upgraded cooler comes in Friday, will upgrade the E8400 CPU (3.0GHz) to a E8600 (3.33GHz) that I have in a semi-bricked HP dc5800 (a W10 upgrade is what caused the brick). BTW, the stock cooler in that SFF PC also has a copper tube heatsink, maybe because some ordered with Core2Quad CPU's, although the Q9xxx lineup isn't compatible with the model, has to be select Q8xxx series or lower, many used the (then) very popular Q6600, although a microcode upgrade is required for certain models (to include the E8600). The Q6600 is a CPU that continues to live on through this day on legacy systems & today's Linux will run fine on the chip. :)

 

Don't understand why W10 messed up the dc5800, as I ran the Previews before release fine & even the first release after GA for everyone. It was the Anniversary Update that caused the brick, have tried many times to revive by reflashing the BIOS & got only one response, the screen flashed once & then went back out just as fast as it appeared. After a total of no less than 50 attempts to revive over the course of a week, threw in the towel, although a lesson was learned, not to upgrade to W10 on legacy (decade old) computers, the chance of a semi or permanent bricking is there. 

 

There are many high powered legacy Intel & AMD CPU's out there, still packed with performance on the right MB. Many may not be aware of the issue, while the Phenom series supports XP, Vista & Windows 7 fine (& included virtualization or AMD-V & AMD64 instruction sets), with FX systems, while totally compatible with W 8.1 & newer, a special update (by request) that may or may not show in the Optional list is required for Windows 7 for best performance. Not available for Vista or older, although Process Lasso can deal with the issue. 

 

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/2645594/an-update-is-available-for-computers-that-have-an-amd-fx--amd-opteron

 

Of course, since I use Process Lasso Pro to handle core parking & tame processes to improve performance/responsiveness, may not be that beneficial, still worth the update if performance is less than expected. :)

 

When one thinks of AMD vs Intel, it's hard not to remember or include the CPU's of the past, which placed both corporations on the map. Then one can look at that timeframe & see mistakes, as well as positive advances that both teams made. Both has has their ups & downs over the last 15 years, history cannot be rewritten to deny misfires. On the other hand, both sides can learn & move forward, yet sooner or later, one or both will make yet another mistake or costly backfire, history always tends to repeat itself. 

 

Cat


ASUS Z97-PRO Gamer PC. EVGA GTX 1070 FTW + ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5 GPU! 4K!  http://speccy.piriform.com/results/w3mBsNE6cJXW7on5sbNTFDc  (Updated 10/07/2017)

ASRock Z97 Extreme6, EVGA GTX 1060 FTW + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/tbdS4YKHBvWROeKETAMBRKk  (Updated 04/12/2017))                                                                       

Dell XPS 8700, Revived from the Dead, EVGA GTX 1060 SSC + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/KrNXc5IZ6HmJvrrLVSZbGzi  (Updated 05/17/2017)

ASUS 970 PRO Gaming AURA, with a cool running AMD Phenom x4 965 CPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/c0aVnEnmxFmqX5Pf1nOhCKf   (Updated 10/10/2017)

Dell Dimension 2400 Rebuild, Done the Right Way! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/MLv5xbYuI2vsLqvtS4PaDGB  (Updated 10/20/2017)


#112 MDD1963

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 03:59 AM

Not sure who to point fingers at, MB manufacturers and/or Foxconn, but, a handful of TR4 boards using Foxcon CPU sockets/retention mechanisms are having issues getting cpu locked down, resulting in damaged boards and/or cpus, which would be a bummer on $450 mainboard and a $1000 TR1950X, to be certain....

 

(THe motherboards using CPU sockets marked "Loce" have thus far been problem free....)

 


Asus Z270A Prime/7700K/32 GB DDR4-3200/GTX1060


#113 cat1092

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 05:17 AM

No way would I consider a Foxconn MB, unless it's an exact replacement needed for a branded OEM PC. :)

 

Any Pegatron remanufactured (or recertified) components, not only the MB, are generally junk. :thumbdown:

 

This is why some Foxconn & many Petragon MB's & GPU are sold at unreal low prices on eBay, most will make it past the 60 day return window, then withing a year or so, will be a paperweight. Worse for Apple, which also partners with Petragon & Foxconn, the former won't be able to keep up demand, while the latter mistreats workers & probable human rights violations. Sure, these facilites gets 'inspected', yet w/out giving notice, not even Tim Cook has the right to fly in & walk into their facilities on no-notice demand. More info below.

 

http://appleinsider.com/articles/17/01/16/apple-partner-pegatron-could-boost-us-manufacturing-capacity-by-3-5x-if-pressed

 

http://www.zdnet.com/article/pegatron-is-exploiting-workers-making-apple-iphone-7s-in-china-report/

 

Articles from last year (& 2012) covering human rights violations at Foxconn, which no outside OEM of any type can just walk into.

 

https://www.chinadialogue.net/article/show/single/en/8826-Dying-for-an-iPhone-the-lives-of-Chinese-workers

 

http://mashable.com/2012/02/22/foxconn/#nwEYPOWjdmqC

 

So those who especially purchases any Apple product are supporting slavery, and by now, many knows it. No way can these types of incidents can be covered up, way too many are simply looking the other way, while at the same time, iPhone ownership continues to move upwards, for that matter, so is the gaining in popularity Android phones, Which hopefully aren't manufactured in the same facilities. This is simply corporate greed at it's worst. :(

 

Cat


ASUS Z97-PRO Gamer PC. EVGA GTX 1070 FTW + ACX 3.0 8GB GDDR5 GPU! 4K!  http://speccy.piriform.com/results/w3mBsNE6cJXW7on5sbNTFDc  (Updated 10/07/2017)

ASRock Z97 Extreme6, EVGA GTX 1060 FTW + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/tbdS4YKHBvWROeKETAMBRKk  (Updated 04/12/2017))                                                                       

Dell XPS 8700, Revived from the Dead, EVGA GTX 1060 SSC + ACX 3.0 6GB GDDR5 GPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/KrNXc5IZ6HmJvrrLVSZbGzi  (Updated 05/17/2017)

ASUS 970 PRO Gaming AURA, with a cool running AMD Phenom x4 965 CPU! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/c0aVnEnmxFmqX5Pf1nOhCKf   (Updated 10/10/2017)

Dell Dimension 2400 Rebuild, Done the Right Way! http://speccy.piriform.com/results/MLv5xbYuI2vsLqvtS4PaDGB  (Updated 10/20/2017)


#114 jonuk76

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 05:55 AM

Not sure who to point fingers at, MB manufacturers and/or Foxconn, but, a handful of TR4 boards using Foxcon CPU sockets/retention mechanisms are having issues getting cpu locked down, resulting in damaged boards and/or cpus, which would be a bummer on $450 mainboard and a $1000 TR1950X, to be certain....

 

(THe motherboards using CPU sockets marked "Loce" have thus far been problem free....)

 

 

I'm not certain on this but I have a feeling there was also a problem in the early days of LGA 1156, and it was also with Foxconn sockets, resulting in damaged CPU's (burnt contact pads). The Lotes sockets (could that be the same as "Loce"?) were said to be of a higher quality and were generally problem free.



#115 Drillingmachine

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 09:41 AM

Not sure who to point fingers at, MB manufacturers and/or Foxconn, but, a handful of TR4 boards using Foxcon CPU sockets/retention mechanisms are having issues getting cpu locked down, resulting in damaged boards and/or cpus, which would be a bummer on $450 mainboard and a $1000 TR1950X, to be certain....

 

(THe motherboards using CPU sockets marked "Loce" have thus far been problem free....)

 

 

User error. Screw 1 should be screwed lightly, then screw 2 lightly and screw 3 lightly. Then screw 1 hard and so on. That dude screwed first screw hard , probably his first time holding screwdriver.






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