Jump to content


 


Register a free account to unlock additional features at BleepingComputer.com
Welcome to BleepingComputer, a free community where people like yourself come together to discuss and learn how to use their computers. Using the site is easy and fun. As a guest, you can browse and view the various discussions in the forums, but can not create a new topic or reply to an existing one unless you are logged in. Other benefits of registering an account are subscribing to topics and forums, creating a blog, and having no ads shown anywhere on the site.


Click here to Register a free account now! or read our Welcome Guide to learn how to use this site.

Photo

Where do I place the bootloader of Linux Mint in UEFI dual boot PC?


  • Please log in to reply
24 replies to this topic

#16 paul88ks

paul88ks

  • Members
  • 1,304 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Dallas,Texas
  • Local time:11:26 PM

Posted 23 July 2017 - 01:53 AM

Nick - this article only shows booting from a USB stick- I assume you can do the same with an .iso on a DVD as well? or have I lost my mind? That's the only way I have ever done it---



BC AdBot (Login to Remove)

 


#17 cat1092

cat1092

    Bleeping Cat

  • Topic Starter

  • BC Advisor
  • 7,013 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Carolina, USA
  • Local time:12:26 AM

Posted 23 July 2017 - 05:22 AM

Cat- what is the G: Online partition for listed on the Partition tool ? i've never seen that before--

 

Paul, that's my Online Storage (OneDrive, Google Drive & Dropbox) partition, had you clicked onto the image & read the lower description, you'd have seen, there's also one where I store some Backups (usually prior to Patch Tuesday) using Macrium Reflect's bootloader (note, the Macrium Reflect WinPE bootloader MUST be installed before installing a Linux distro, or will fail to succeed afterwards. I always keep these separate on a Windows install, rather than include in Data, as well as one for VM's. That's the cool thing with GPT partitioning, one can create up to 128 of these for many purposes, and all Primaries, in essence making Logical/Extended partitioning obsolete in the future, as BIOS/MBR based PC's dies off, still a decade away. :)

 

Also, even on a non-UEFI MB with a 64 bit OS (going back to the days of XP 64 bit/Windows Server 2003), one can have a GPT drive for Data & other partitions, just can't boot from these. For Linux, still OK to place the /home partition there. What I'd like to do, although seldom mentioned, is figure out how to have multi-/home partitions (or use other options from the drop down list, if serves the same purpose). 

 

John, your highlighted partition is where you want to install Windows, although if you're going to dual boot with Linux & assuming you have a 2nd drive of some type for /home, you'll have to make that OS partition that's highlighted no more than 80GiB, otherwise won't have room for Linux Swap (if used) & root partitions (that'll be plenty for both). That's correct that Windows 10 (although not 8.1) uses a 16MiB MSR partition that like Linux Swap, is unformatted. However, if one has a drive large enough to dual boot Windows 8.1 & 10, unlike the way we have to do this for Windows 7 to have recommended GPT formatting as shown in your above snapshot. Although if 8.1 is installed & one wants to keep it, it's OK, W10 won't overwrite or shrink the MSR partition. It's still ideal, if one plans to install both at the same time, to boot into the UEFI W10 media to have the 16MiB partition, create all while there, back out & then install 8.1 first, although it's not required to install 8.1 or even 7 prior (and may actually help with removal at EOL of either, the W10 media will repair the bootloader). Just looks better if in proper order, would bug me like mad if not. :)

 

Speaking of all of this, and this is another difference of GPT versus MBR, are that all partitions as created has a unique serial. Meaning that if that is altered by moving/cloning (example, if one purchases a PC with a 2TiB HDD & wants to install a 500-512GiB SSD, and the system is under warranty, once cloned with Macrium or EaseUS Todo to fit that smaller drive, then the GPT serials (partition ID's) will no longer be unique (store your original HDD untouched as long as under warranty). Unlike BIOS/MBR, one cannot make the Recovery partition at the far end (usual position) Active with partition software to force Recovery to load, one must have created a Recovery drive (with the Recovery partition copied) onto a USB Flash drive prior to any drive alterations, as well as create a recovery disc set on DVD - or + media, which can recreate unique serials on a drive of the same size or larger, although this set won't work on a smaller drive (the Recovery drive will work on smaller drives). The same applies to sector to sector backup images, which some Linux backup software uses, these are no longer unique & will likely require rescue media to regenerate GRUB, plus Swap will likely need to be re-created. Everything is thrown out of whack. although if backup software that compresses the image are used, then can be restore to perfect condition, provided the same drive is used for restore.

 

While this may not seem 'good', it's actually further inbuilt security of the drive, plus unlike MBR, the boot records are stored on various places of the drive, not just that hidden area that drive wiping tools (to include DBAN) cannot wipe, although can be reset & should be if clean installing Windows (if MBR), otherwise, if the proper key isn't hit in time, doesn't matter if a Guttman wipe (35x pass) was used, one will see the 'grub 'rescue' popup. This prevents others from tampering with the boot records, or in the case one sells a 'genuine' Windows computer, yet Recovery doesn't work (should be tested ASAP), a legit case for a refund from Seller, (s)he has physically tampered with the drive & therefore may not be secure. In a corporate environment, w/out approval from the IT director, this is a terminal (as in being fired) offense & usually is, employees aren't allowed to repair issues themselves on most jobs anymore, this is why the IT department or contractor is hired/retained. Serials are kept of everything, down to the wireless/BT card (if not removed by IT prior to issuance). 

 

In regards to this PC, I have to make a decision, either run the Windows Insider Previews on a PC w/out Linux Mint, or face having to repair Mint after every upgrade, as the bootloader is overwritten with these upgrades, which ships about every couple of weeks, as I'm in the 'fast' lane. May consider another PC which has only W10 installed on a 128GiB SSD, and install a small (160GiB) HDD, although plenty large enough to hold Data & Online Storage partitions. This would also test how far the Intel Core 2 Quad 9650 can go as far as upgrades goes, as sooner or later, regardless of how powerful the CPU may be, will fall out of support over a minor instruction set within the chip, yet still plenty powerful enough to run W10 in it's current form, when W7 was installed, even on a SATA-2 MB, came up just one point shy of the 7.9 max (7.8). Only the graphics fell below 7.0 & that was 6.9, the same card that shipped with the PC I'm typing this post on, the XPS 8700 in my sig below.

 

My apologies for the long post, although this is a lot of information to post in a two-liner. :)

 

Cat


Performing full disc images weekly and keeping important data off of the 'C' drive as generated can be the best defence against Malware/Ransomware attacks, as well as a wide range of other issues. 


#18 NickAu

NickAu

    Bleepin' Fish Doctor


  • Moderator
  • 13,100 posts
  • ONLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:127.0.0.1 Australia
  • Local time:02:26 PM

Posted 23 July 2017 - 05:28 AM

 

Nick - this article only shows booting from a USB stick- I assume you can do the same with an .iso on a DVD as well?

Yes, Install Linux along side just like in that tut, then if you install other distros on other partitions just update grub.


Arch Linux .
 
 Come join the fun, chat to Bleeping computer members and staff in real time on Discord.
 
The BleepingComputer Official Discord Chat Server!


#19 malwaredpc

malwaredpc

  • Members
  • 141 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:02:26 PM

Posted 23 July 2017 - 03:45 PM

Grab a USB stick. either 2.0 or 3.0 and select it to have the bootloader. Windows won't mess it up.



#20 paul88ks

paul88ks

  • Members
  • 1,304 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Dallas,Texas
  • Local time:11:26 PM

Posted 25 July 2017 - 02:28 AM

I should have just stuck to the how-to tutorial. After numerous attempts at installing Linux Mint off of a DVD,all to no avail, my mobo was having no part of it-Secure Boot on or off,CD/DVD or EUFI CD/DVD.I tried every trick I knew,and have have done a lot of dual-tripleboot machines since being on this website.Granted,they were all MBR/BIOS. SO - I burned the .ISO on to a USB Stick,set it as first boot in the BIOS,and BANG!! loaded straightaway. Installed the bootloader into the Windows Boot Manager and it was all clear sailing after that. 

 

I still cannot figure out why it would not let me boot from a DVD? It's a MSI 970A Gaming Pro Carbon Edition. More stuff in the BIOS that XMAS tree lights on a tree. Anyway - I got it done. Will post the specs of my new AMD machine soon!



#21 paul88ks

paul88ks

  • Members
  • 1,304 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Dallas,Texas
  • Local time:11:26 PM

Posted 25 July 2017 - 02:57 AM

 

Cat- what is the G: Online partition for listed on the Partition tool ? i've never seen that before--

 

Paul, that's my Online Storage (OneDrive, Google Drive & Dropbox) partition, had you clicked onto the image & read the lower description, you'd have seen, there's also one where I store some Backups (usually prior to Patch Tuesday) using Macrium Reflect's bootloader (note, the Macrium Reflect WinPE bootloader MUST be installed before installing a Linux distro, or will fail to succeed afterwards. I always keep these separate on a Windows install, rather than include in Data, as well as one for VM's. That's the cool thing with GPT partitioning, one can create up to 128 of these for many purposes, and all Primaries, in essence making Logical/Extended partitioning obsolete in the future, as BIOS/MBR based PC's dies off, still a decade away. :)

 

Also, even on a non-UEFI MB with a 64 bit OS (going back to the days of XP 64 bit/Windows Server 2003), one can have a GPT drive for Data & other partitions, just can't boot from these. For Linux, still OK to place the /home partition there. What I'd like to do, although seldom mentioned, is figure out how to have multi-/home partitions (or use other options from the drop down list, if serves the same purpose). 

 

John, your highlighted partition is where you want to install Windows, although if you're going to dual boot with Linux & assuming you have a 2nd drive of some type for /home, you'll have to make that OS partition that's highlighted no more than 80GiB, otherwise won't have room for Linux Swap (if used) & root partitions (that'll be plenty for both). That's correct that Windows 10 (although not 8.1) uses a 16MiB MSR partition that like Linux Swap, is unformatted. However, if one has a drive large enough to dual boot Windows 8.1 & 10, unlike the way we have to do this for Windows 7 to have recommended GPT formatting as shown in your above snapshot. Although if 8.1 is installed & one wants to keep it, it's OK, W10 won't overwrite or shrink the MSR partition. It's still ideal, if one plans to install both at the same time, to boot into the UEFI W10 media to have the 16MiB partition, create all while there, back out & then install 8.1 first, although it's not required to install 8.1 or even 7 prior (and may actually help with removal at EOL of either, the W10 media will repair the bootloader). Just looks better if in proper order, would bug me like mad if not. :)

 

Speaking of all of this, and this is another difference of GPT versus MBR, are that all partitions as created has a unique serial. Meaning that if that is altered by moving/cloning (example, if one purchases a PC with a 2TiB HDD & wants to install a 500-512GiB SSD, and the system is under warranty, once cloned with Macrium or EaseUS Todo to fit that smaller drive, then the GPT serials (partition ID's) will no longer be unique (store your original HDD untouched as long as under warranty). Unlike BIOS/MBR, one cannot make the Recovery partition at the far end (usual position) Active with partition software to force Recovery to load, one must have created a Recovery drive (with the Recovery partition copied) onto a USB Flash drive prior to any drive alterations, as well as create a recovery disc set on DVD - or + media, which can recreate unique serials on a drive of the same size or larger, although this set won't work on a smaller drive (the Recovery drive will work on smaller drives). The same applies to sector to sector backup images, which some Linux backup software uses, these are no longer unique & will likely require rescue media to regenerate GRUB, plus Swap will likely need to be re-created. Everything is thrown out of whack. although if backup software that compresses the image are used, then can be restore to perfect condition, provided the same drive is used for restore.

 

While this may not seem 'good', it's actually further inbuilt security of the drive, plus unlike MBR, the boot records are stored on various places of the drive, not just that hidden area that drive wiping tools (to include DBAN) cannot wipe, although can be reset & should be if clean installing Windows (if MBR), otherwise, if the proper key isn't hit in time, doesn't matter if a Guttman wipe (35x pass) was used, one will see the 'grub 'rescue' popup. This prevents others from tampering with the boot records, or in the case one sells a 'genuine' Windows computer, yet Recovery doesn't work (should be tested ASAP), a legit case for a refund from Seller, (s)he has physically tampered with the drive & therefore may not be secure. In a corporate environment, w/out approval from the IT director, this is a terminal (as in being fired) offense & usually is, employees aren't allowed to repair issues themselves on most jobs anymore, this is why the IT department or contractor is hired/retained. Serials are kept of everything, down to the wireless/BT card (if not removed by IT prior to issuance). 

 

In regards to this PC, I have to make a decision, either run the Windows Insider Previews on a PC w/out Linux Mint, or face having to repair Mint after every upgrade, as the bootloader is overwritten with these upgrades, which ships about every couple of weeks, as I'm in the 'fast' lane. May consider another PC which has only W10 installed on a 128GiB SSD, and install a small (160GiB) HDD, although plenty large enough to hold Data & Online Storage partitions. This would also test how far the Intel Core 2 Quad 9650 can go as far as upgrades goes, as sooner or later, regardless of how powerful the CPU may be, will fall out of support over a minor instruction set within the chip, yet still plenty powerful enough to run W10 in it's current form, when W7 was installed, even on a SATA-2 MB, came up just one point shy of the 7.9 max (7.8). Only the graphics fell below 7.0 & that was 6.9, the same card that shipped with the PC I'm typing this post on, the XPS 8700 in my sig below.

 

My apologies for the long post, although this is a lot of information to post in a two-liner. :)

 

Cat

 

Cat ,my friend,sometimes I have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. HAHA! So,I'll just keep asking questions and reading until I'm as smart as you! Cheers!



#22 NickAu

NickAu

    Bleepin' Fish Doctor


  • Moderator
  • 13,100 posts
  • ONLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:127.0.0.1 Australia
  • Local time:02:26 PM

Posted 25 July 2017 - 03:10 AM

 

It's a MSI 970A Gaming Pro Carbon Edition. More stuff in the BIOS that XMAS tree lights on a tree

Tell me about it I have a MSI H81M -P33.


Arch Linux .
 
 Come join the fun, chat to Bleeping computer members and staff in real time on Discord.
 
The BleepingComputer Official Discord Chat Server!


#23 cat1092

cat1092

    Bleeping Cat

  • Topic Starter

  • BC Advisor
  • 7,013 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North Carolina, USA
  • Local time:12:26 AM

Posted 25 July 2017 - 04:08 AM

MSI (at one time) produced great notebooks, I still have the FX603-064US purchased in early 2011 at Newegg, many who has seen it thinks it's like new. :)

 

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834152251

 

The few upgrades I made were first the RAM to max 8GB for $29.99 on that year's Black Friday sale, the wireless card from a Intel 1000 to an upgraded 6235, to not only have dual band, also Bluetooth 4.0 for when needed & much faster wireless speeds. and the CPU from a i5-480M to i7-640M, sweet difference in power, dual boots W10 & Linux Mint 18.2 MATE like a charm. I did remove the optical drive & installed a 2nd drive bay, which allowed for two SSD's, one for the native OS install, the other for Linux MInt & Windows Data. Originally had the OEM HDD in the bay as a Data drive while running W7 Pro only on my first SSD, a 128GB Crucial SSD, still in use today & where Linux Mint is installed on 40 GiB of it, the rest is used for the W10 Data partition. Am considering reinstalling W7 clean on it, as it ran faster than W10 now is. 

 

Only thing is that the notebook has a 1st gen 'i' series (almost fresh off the assembly line when I received it), and BIOS rather than UEFI, although one thing I won't have to worry about, is the thermal paste within the CPU drying out & causing failure in the future, as 1st & 2nd gen Intel 'i' CPU's has the IHS soldered onto the CPU chip. 3rd gen & newer are held together with low grade thermal paste (Dow Corning 1998 spec) & glue, what a way to manufacture CPU's. :lol:

 

Fortunately, AMD stayed with proven technology & still solders the IHS (where we apply thermal paste on top) to the chip beneath. Check out some delid videos on YouTube & you'll understand what I'm speaking of. Therefore, if one has a 1st & especially 2nd gen Intel 'i' series CPU, there's no reason to upgrade, these can still be purchased brand new. That's one thing I like about my two AMD 'FX' builds, while not the fastest today, are still very reliable, as long as kept cleaned & properly cooled. :)

 

Good Luck with your MSI 970A Gaming Pro Carbon Edition, looks to be a good MB, mine's the ASUS 970 Pro Gaming Aura, running a FX-8350 very well, rarely reaches 30C and the UEFI of that one has tons of options also.

 

The only negative is that one can run only two RAM modules at 1866 or above (this is an AMD limitation on the FX series, not ASUS or MSI), although can run four 1600MHz modules w/out issue. In this respect, more RAM is better than faster & mine's stuffed with 32GB. :thumbsup: 

 

http://speccy.piriform.com/results/GUHywCAGd5NEjBvRp8KWMoW

 

Cat


Performing full disc images weekly and keeping important data off of the 'C' drive as generated can be the best defence against Malware/Ransomware attacks, as well as a wide range of other issues. 


#24 Guest_philbo_*

Guest_philbo_*

  • Guests
  • OFFLINE
  •  

Posted 01 August 2017 - 07:57 AM

I finally got around to trying MadmanRB’s suggestion of a separate EFI partition.

 

I installed Fedora 26 in a dual-boot with Windows, and it worked well. Anaconda had no problems, and my laptop recognizes both systems.

 

Thanks, Madman. Now I no longer have to risk the Windows bootloader when I install a new distro.



#25 Guest_philbo_*

Guest_philbo_*

  • Guests
  • OFFLINE
  •  

Posted 04 August 2017 - 06:11 PM

While Anaconda found the second EFI partition easily, Ubiquity seemed to ignore it.

 

I installed Ubuntu 16.04, and selected /dev/sda5 (flagged as EFI) for the bootloader. During the installation it said it was placing GRUB there, but afterwards I found it had used /dev/sda2 (Windows EFI) instead.

 

Calamares looks to be more flexible with EFI partitions, so I’d expect it to work.

 

I’m not sure about the LMDE installer. I’ve noticed it will sometimes identify the live media as /dev/sda and the hard drive as /dev/sdb, which can cause a little confusion.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users