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Acer3000 Graphics


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#1 pcpunk

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Posted 17 December 2015 - 04:20 PM

Disclaimer:  This is my Test Machine so there is no urgency to fix this.  Speccy is in my Signature but does not include that this is now a Dual Boot XP and Mint13-Xfce, and soon maybe Puppy.

 

Have always had issues with Graphics on this machine, and, have always thought there is a way to fix it but surely can't do it myself.  Some distro's ran better than others.  Had good luck with LXLE except for some file transfer issues that I could not live with.  Settled on Mint-13-32bit Xfce Maya after running MANY distro's so no suggestions needed, as it ran the best on graphics and the lowest on resources, lower than all other Mint 13's and newer Xfce from Mint.

 

Recently I booted up Precise Retro Puppy, and the graphics are perfect! but don't know why.  And...having lots of issues that may or may not be related to this like:  Warning today on Sevenfourms: "Shockwave Flash is not responding" and horrible scrolling issues there and internally like Libre Word.

And: Sometimes when scrolling, there seems to be a Big Lag and then the scrolling will happen, sometimes it will save every scroll I have done, then execute them ALL afterwords.  This is an Intermittent problem though as most of the time it works pretty well albeit choppy.  Tried Xubuntu recently also, and it had really bad Screen Tearing.  Don't want to use Puppy for my main OS so that's out also, but will work with it in some capacity.

 

Here is the output from Mint:

Graphics: Card: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] 661/741/760 PCI/AGP or 662/761Gx PCIE VGA

 

Display Adapter bus-ID: 01:00.0

X.Org: 1.11.3 driver: vesa Resolution: 1024x768@61.0hz

GLX Renderer: Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe (LLVM 0x300) GLX Version: 2.1 Mesa 8.0.2 Direct Rendering: Yes

 

Did not know how to get the output in puppy but here is the Driver that is being used there as it states in X server chooser Wizard, it is the same:

Version Xorg 1.11.3

Resolution and all other factors that I can see are the same.

 

I tried to use the Windows XP Driver but could not figure that out.  There is an option to do this as most of you know, but don't know if anyone actually uses it?

 

Also to Note: Mint is using "Mint-flashPlugin"

 

If I can get this fixed maybe I could install a newer version of Mint like Xfce-17.2 and use this info.

 

Thanks pcpunk out!


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#2 pcpunk

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Posted 19 December 2015 - 12:19 PM

Okay this Thread is done because of no interest.  I have posted elsewhere.  I did find an answer I think...in Mint Xfce1-17.2 booting in Compatibility Mode.  Couldn't get it at first because I was holding the TAB button just a tad to long and it would bypass the boot options.  LXLE graphics still work the best (and includes the b43firmware needed for wireless) but love this new Xfce so still up in the air about new install.


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#3 pcpunk

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 05:56 PM

 

My quote: Acer Aspirre LXLE 32bit 12.04 as that is the only version of linux to work with poor graphics card.  Even Lubuntu 14.04 would not work for graphics.

 

NickAu1 quote: That is incorrect, Just because you couldnt get it to run.

If this can be fixed I am ready.  I have researched this many hours, but don't have the info about drivers anymore as I thought it was done.  The output above is wrong, Mint 17xx will use the Xorg 1.15.something.  I've been told that the 1.11.3 cannot be used with new Kernel in MInt 17xx/14.04, but 1.11.3 is the only one that will work with this lappy.  I assumed there was a work around involving Xorg but I would not know how to rewrite that.

 

This is not high priority guys, but it was brought up so here we go.  I really like this pc, and will keep using it as it is like brand new.  If I could run 14.04!  It will be installed before 12.04 ends for sure, if not very soon.  And! will go to Mint or Xubuntu etc. instead of LXLE, as LXLE is not my preferred distro.

 

Thanks all for trying to revive old pc's


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#4 lti

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Posted 01 February 2016 - 08:49 PM

I actually have the same problem with an old computer, but I never made a topic about it.

This is what I found:

http://www.mesa3d.org/relnotes/8.0.html

 

Removed all DRI drivers that did not support DRI2. Specifically, i810, mach64, mga, r128, savage, sis, tdfx, and unichrome were removed.

Ubuntu-based distros seem to use direct rendering heavily, and your computer has unsupported graphics hardware (all SiS graphics hardware uses the sis driver). There is a PPA for 12.04 that adds legacy direct rendering drivers, but I'm not aware of anything for newer distros.


Edited by lti, 01 February 2016 - 08:50 PM.


#5 pcpunk

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 12:18 PM

Thanks for the reply.  This is confusing to me, but have researched extensively and found no answers except that there is no support.  You say: "(all SiS graphics hardware uses the sis driver)."  Then why does this say "vesa" here: X.Org: 1.11.3 driver: vesa  


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#6 lti

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 07:44 PM

You say: "(all SiS graphics hardware uses the sis driver)."  Then why does this say "vesa" here: X.Org: 1.11.3 driver: vesa  

That is a generic driver that works with most graphics hardware, but doesn't support all hardware acceleration features. Linux Mint might not have the SiS driver installed normally. I haven't used it.

 

I noticed that you were talking about Linux Mint 13. What driver is being used in Mint 17?


Edited by lti, 02 February 2016 - 08:00 PM.


#7 pcpunk

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Posted 02 February 2016 - 09:06 PM

17.xx uses 1.15.something, I think .1  It might even be the SiS Driver.  Sorry I deleted all my research on that because I gave up on it.  I can run some specs again, but been told by some with good knowledge that it won't work.  Would look into it further but don't understand all the technicals, Xorg etc.  The 1.11.3 works, that's all I know.  Don't care about hardware acceleration, would just be happy to get the mentioned driver to work on 17xx's.

 

Found some info from another post, not on main pc now.  I think we can forget this but appreciate the help.  Don't have all the links here...but it's futile as I remember.

17.1 is using X.Org: 1.15.1 drivers: sis (unloaded: fbdev,vesa) Resolution: 1280x800@60.0hz ,
Xfce-13 and puppy are using X.Org: 1.11.3 driver: vesa as are the Ubuntu's 12.04's

 

Thanks, let's put this to rest.  I only re-opened this because NickAu1 suggested in another post there was a way.


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#8 cat1092

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 05:22 AM

 

 

Then why does this say "vesa" here: X.Org: 1.11.3 driver: vesa  

 

pcpunk, VESA is simply a international standards body for computer graphics, formed in 1998 by NEC Home Electronics, they're also over the Displayport Standard, which is not by any means new to business users, yet now the consumer market for the standard is really growing, as Displayport 1.2 can power 4K UHD monitors. Most all modern PC graphics cards has between 1 & 3 of these ports to connect multiple monitors, plus HDMI 2.0 & (sometimes) DVD-D or DVD-I. 

 

Here's a little of the history of VESA. 

 

http://www.abbreviations.com/VESA

 

Hope that this at least explains what VESA stands for, many of us has seen it on our computers & in home entertainment systems. :)

 

Now, about the VIA graphics, I know for a fact I've seen the update in some of the Level 4 updates for my PC, though hid it, have no idea why it was offered, maybe that's why Level 4 & 5 Updates are hidden. Because these doesn't apply to everyone. Yet did want to let you know I seen the update on Linux Mint 17 & 17.1, though mine's the 64 bit version. Shouldn't make any difference though, as far as updates being offered. 

 

In your case, it's a matter of getting the OS installed to apply the updates. Maybe choosing Compatibility Mode during the countdown to automatic boot will help. There has to be an answer to address your situation. 

 

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#9 pcpunk

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Posted 03 February 2016 - 08:06 PM

I think I found what I need but will take a lot of work for me to understand how to configure all this stuff, if ever?  Seems as though I will need a new Xorg.config file etc. to make it work, looks like I got another project on my hands.

http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/trusty/man4/sis.4.html


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#10 cat1092

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Posted 04 February 2016 - 04:50 AM

Seems to be a lot of work involved there, the OS should have this stuff built in, or allow to install & update to the right drivers. 

 

I have to admit, am by no means an expert of GPU configurations, Al & Nick helped me through my GTX 960 install, and have it bookmarked for future reference. Other than any updates offered, the VIA graphics are way over my head, you're the first & only person I know who has this. 

 

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#11 pcpunk

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Posted 04 February 2016 - 11:22 AM

I think it is a dead end cat, but my next move will be to use the 12.04 Xorg.config and SiS Driver that it works with to see if I have any luck.  The page I provided there was actually the 14.04, but the link to 12.04 is right there also.

 

Don't know weather to try this in normal running OS or a live session, or anything else about it lol.  But I will have a go with it.


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#12 raymac46

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Posted 04 February 2016 - 04:51 PM

You might want to try Bodhi Linux 3.X on a USB stick and see how it goes. That is still based on Ubuntu 14.04 which may work.

You have my sympathies with SiS. I usually encountered this on old desktops so I had a cheap Nvidia card ready to install.



#13 cat1092

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Posted 05 February 2016 - 02:48 AM

You might want to try Bodhi Linux 3.X on a USB stick and see how it goes. That is still based on Ubuntu 14.04 which may work.

You have my sympathies with SiS. I usually encountered this on old desktops so I had a cheap Nvidia card ready to install.

 

That's the cool thing about a PC versus a notebook, while I like a notebook for room to room or on the go, there's nothing like a PC. Doesn't matter if it's a tower (mid or large) or desktop PC which takes only low profile cards, these are expandable & cards are at all time lows in pricing, and uses less power than ever. Surprisingly, am running the GPU that shipped with my XPS 8700 on this Optiplex 780, though had to install a low profile bracket to use the HDMI port, also has a DVI-D port. Even my HP dc5800 of less specs runs a Radeon 3400 series GPU with twin DVD-D ports (via a DMS-59 adapter, required), that I'd like to upgrade to at least a Radeon 4xxx or 5xxx series for better performance. Or find another of the AMD Radeon 7570 (Dell OEM) that was pulled from it to install in the Optiplex 780. 

 

Here's what the DMS-59 connection coming out of the PC looks like, allows for the install of an adapter (VGA or DVI-D) to drive two monitors, though honestly, it's hard for me to expect a quality experience across twin monitors with a Radeon 3400 series GPU, maybe better with the 4xxx series. Don't know if the Radeon 5xxx series uses these, that's kind of old school stuff, yet lucked up on the DMS-59 DVI-D adapter for $5 shipped, brand new. Though it looks nice on the 20" 1600x900 monitor it's connected to. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DMS-59#/media/File:DMS-59.jpg 

 

One doesn't need an expensive computer to do these things, and I could had easily chosen a tower with a slightly less C2Q (Q9550), and would had, the seller has discrepancies (unintentional) in the listing, at the heading, stated it was a Q9550, on down in the description, stated Q9500, by the time he got up with me to clear the matter up (New Year weekend), it was too late, has purchased the one I got while available. At any rate, the GPU I was going to install in the mid tower wouldn't had fitted anyway, the slot for the GPU was a single one, mine's a dual, and even if it were a single, would had bumped the CPU heatsink. 

 

Poor design on the part of Dell for placing the graphics slot there, most high performance cards requires two slots for install, for clearance. Plus would need either a 6 pin GPU power plug, or would have to purchase a twin SATA to 6 pin GPU adapter plug, just one SATA power plug isn't enough power. Though some cards ships with this adapter, I believe the one in question did. In some cases, this may mean choosing to go w/out an optical drive to have the 2nd SATA power adapter, if used for this purpose, cannot be daisy chained to provide power for other sources. A floppy power connector can also be used, yet will require a Molex to SATA power connector to work, that's better than giving up the optical drive. 

 

Normally, I always find a way to accomplish what I wish to do, as long as there's room to work & power cables to work with, as well as a large enough PSU (350W or higher for the MSI AMD Radeon HD 7770 GHz edition). The spec sheet says 400-450W, many has installed on 305-350W units. 

 

Low cost nVidia cards are plentiful also, just purchase according to need, it's actually my favorite brand. :)

 

I was just at the time that I purchased the MSI Radeon 7770, there were no new nVidia cards that featured Displayport, though some arrived on the scene a few months later, and pulled the trigger on the GTX 960, though just a couple of weeks too soon. As EVGA introduced a 4GB OC version of the same card, though with only 128 bit, that's by no means double the performance, though still OC'd out of the box (as the MSI R7770), would had seen & felt some difference under the hood. 

 

These are the kind of things that separates notebook from desktop users, and why it's best to have at least one of each around. Many will give an older, yet still useful, PC away just to get rid of it. I know this from first hand experience, at one time, had so many, had to donate all of the 32 bit ones that I had, the room was piled with these everywhere. Today, I'd recommend a 64 bit PC, even if older, chances are that for less than $20, the CPU can be upgraded for much better performance, and if lucky, may get one that's already been upgraded that an enthusiast has long given up on, moving to newer ground. 

 

With notebooks, you have what you have, other than RAM & SSD upgrades, unless one wants to spend upwards of $800, finding one with a 1GB GDDR5 discrete card is hard to find. On a notebook, since it can't be changed, wouldn't think of purchasing one new with a GDDR3 chip, the onboard may be better. :)

 

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#14 raw

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Posted 05 February 2016 - 04:11 AM

 

That's the cool thing about a PC versus a notebook,

 

Not relevant to OP's topic

 

 

so I had a cheap Nvidia card ready to install.

 

 

Low cost nVidia cards are plentiful also, just purchase according to need, it's actually my favorite brand. :)

 

+1 came in to say the same thing.


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#15 raymac46

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Posted 05 February 2016 - 08:38 AM

@Cat I hear you about notebooks. I have a few old netbooks around here that run Linux. In fact a couple were sold that way. One of them - Dell Mini 12 - is one of the worst examples of preinstalled Linux hardware I've ever seen. It has a Linux unfriendly wifi - Broadcom - and the Intel GMA500 graphics has never worked in 3D for Linux. It's only the last couple of years that a decent 2D driver found its way into the kernel.

Recently I got an older Toshiba netbook for free. This one is very Linux friendly, has a 2nd generation 64 bit Atom processor and 2 GB of RAM. Even has Atheros wifi. The netbook was running Windows 7 Starter like a dog. Now it's re-energized with Linux Mnt 17 Xfce.


Edited by raymac46, 05 February 2016 - 08:49 AM.





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