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Ubuntu 16.04 LTS with Unity 7 to Support Snappy Packages


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#1 Dazzzler

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Posted 06 November 2015 - 12:13 PM

The upcoming Ubuntu 16.04 LTS will continue to use Unity 7 as the default desktop environment, and that’s been known for quite a while. Canonical also aims to offer the Unity 8 desktop as an alternative until it becomes stable enough to take the place of the old one.

Canonical wants to adopt the Snappy packages for the regular Ubuntu distro, not just the phone. They used to be called click packages, but that terminology is no longer used. They are now called Snappy Personal, Snappy, or just snaps. Their name is less important than the fact that they bring a new type of package management.

 

These new packages have some improvements over the older debs, but it will take a while until they get some traction. It will help if Snappy package will also be available for the vast majority of Ubuntu users, who are not moving away from Unity 7 anytime soon.

 

Mod edit. The full article can be found here :-

 

http://news.softpedia.com/news/ubuntu-16-04-lts-with-unity-7-to-support-snappy-packages-495769.shtml


Edited by Chris Cosgrove, 06 November 2015 - 12:32 PM.
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#2 NickAu

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Posted 06 November 2015 - 04:51 PM

As long as it uses Unity its all good, I must be one of the few who loves unity and dash.


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#3 DeimosChaos

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Posted 06 November 2015 - 11:03 PM

I'm with ya Nick, it grew on me after using it. I don't mind it at all. The one thing I like about unity is the out of the box keyboard shortcuts. I haven't seen any other distribution with that many.

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#4 Guest_hollowface_*

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Posted 07 November 2015 - 09:26 PM

I have done some reading on snappy packages, and I am have been considering downloading Ubuntu Snappy Core to give them a try, but have been to busy lately. I'm not sure if I'll prefer snappy packages to deb or not.



#5 cat1092

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Posted 08 November 2015 - 07:38 AM

As long as it uses Unity its all good, I must be one of the few who loves unity and dash.

 

I believe you're right, Unity reminds too many folks of Windows 8, and really they share a lot of similarities. 

 

But it was long before Windows 8 was known of when Unity placed Ubuntu in a bad position. There's a way to make 12.04 into a traditional Ubuntu desktop with a couple of Terminal lines, not sure if this works in 14.04. 

 

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#6 MadmanRB

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 01:11 AM

Yes but it does seem like they are dumping the .deb format and thats a bad thing.

You will have to compile I guess.


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#7 cat1092

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 02:42 AM

Yes but it does seem like they are dumping the .deb format and thats a bad thing.

You will have to compile I guess.

 

That indeed is a bad thing & while may make the OS more secure, at the same time, drive newcomers to Linux away. Really it's doesn't make the OS more secure because one has to enter their password to execute a .deb file. I just don't understand the reasoning behind this, it may, like Unity in 2010-11, come back to bite Canonical in the seat of their pants. If we have to compile code, there's lots of other choices that works much the same way. This won't help Ubuntu's popularity in the least. 

 

It's my hope that Linux Mint doesn't follow the same rules, there's enough of a user base to keep the .deb files coming. Yet I also know that Mint 17 is supported until April 2019, so that'll give me plenty of time to keep it as my main OS while learning the new way (or a new OS). In fact, can run it a little longer, if I wish to. If Mint goes in the same direction, it may be time to rethink CentOS, it's simply a free Red Hat with some decent extras that doesn't make the final cut. I was once deep into learning it, until being invited to becoming a Moderator on a Windows 8 forum, that effectively ended my training. 

 

Yet I'm resilient enough to go in any direction I desire, there's also PCLinuxOS, which at the time I was picking up on, just didn't have a 'real' ISP, rather a cell based USB device that didn't play well with the OS. Plus they have among the best of dedicated Linux OS forums, the people there were great to me & knew what was going on. 

 

Like I said, there's plenty of time left in Mint 17 to ride things out, maybe enough for someone to realize this is a huge mistake in the wrong direction. As I've stated many times, it's often the distros, through their forums or the distros themselves, that's keeping consumer based Linux usershare below 2%, either by belittling new Linux users by having a dual boot while learning, or the OS's are too complex to learn. The business share is thriving quite well, and if it weren't for Linux, we'd live in a much unsafer world than we do. 

 

This is the equivalent of making a 8 yard pass & then turning around & getting sacked deep in the backfield for a net loss of 20 yards. Rather than being 3rd & 2, now in deep trouble at 3rd & 22. 

 

Canonical can never win over consumers like this. Prior to Unity, Ubuntu had a commanding #1 position, at one point had lost it to Debian, then a KDE release (I forget the name of distro), and finally late in 2011 to Mint. This will also harm all of the progress that Ubuntu MATE has made (unless MATE sticks to their roots, and hopefully Mint's version also), as well as other 'buntu' releases. 

 

One thing is likely for sure, many Linux users will stand their ground against Snappy releases, running the older versions as long as possible & then some. 

 

Cat


Edited by cat1092, 11 November 2015 - 02:42 AM.

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#8 MadmanRB

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 02:45 AM

Ever try Manjaro?

Its become rock solid as of 15.09


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#9 cat1092

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 04:56 AM

No, but I've heard of it, there was once a member here not long back, who've I've not seen as of late who often spoke of the OS. 

 

I'd be open to anything if MInt were to go downhill, yet I'd want a stable OS, one what's been around for awhile. The reason why I was once learning Cent OS, is because of it's association with Red Hat, if one can run Cent, then Red Hat is within reach. It happens to be one of the OS's used by a lot of accountants & tax preparers, which may be of interest to me. I know how to prepare taxes if the software is available, could be a nice seasonal hobby to stash some serious cash for my upcoming PC build, which will cost as much as the PC I have, plus all of the upgrades & then some. The PCIe SSD that I want starts at $400 & that's for the slower version that reads at 2000MB/sec & writes at 800MB/sec. Writes concerns me here, so will have to shell out a little more for a 1.2TiB PCIe SSD (runs on a x4 slot, as does the slower one). By then, pricing will drop & other OEM's will hop on the bandwagon. Samsung won't be left out of this market. 

 

When I was purchasing the two 32GB RAM kits that I have, they weren't $75, more like $135, and have been through two GPU upgrades & several SSD's, plus a 1TiB HDD, split in half between Linux Mint /home & Windows Data, with a 4GB Swap partition at the end of the drive. And still one last SSD to go in a 500GiB Samsung 850 Pro. Will remove the two small SSD's & place them elsewhere. 

 

After that, all of my extra cash will be put aside for components for my next (& first) PC build, want at least a decent 6 core Intel CPU, but more than the one $50 more than the popular i7-4790K. The 8 cores are too costly, yet a 6 core would be affordable. Intel was doing good with their dual & quad core lineup until they let the MB OEM's place the graphics on their back, potentially taking away CPU cycles in the process. That extra power for the crappy Intel HD graphics that won't even hit a 7.0 on the WEI is a waste of good resources, that could give the CPU's another 1GHz or more power, or add more Turbo Boost (either is better than none). 

 

And of course, there will be a Linux OS on this PC build, and not a Windows one, if so, would only be in a virtual machine to assist others. Windows no longer offers me anything but a pain in the rear, having to research every non-security update before installing, to ensure there's no telemetry junk installed, which 'phones home'. It was recently that there was a script for download for anyone who didn't want 10, and it removed a lot of stuff going back to just after SP1 was released. 

 

That's the cool thing about Linux, we don't have to worry about Linux Torvalds or Richard Stallman selling us out, and they'd keep large Linux corporations like Canonical in line with this. Well, Linus would anyway, while he did bend & allowed the Microsoft signing keys for Secure Boot (after a huge tirade for doing it behind his back), he'd never approve of 'phoning home' updates to the OS's & neither would join forces with PRISM, under any circumstances. Furthermore, he rounded up all of the leaders of the major distros & laid down the law, no more backstabbing. 

 

In fact, the signing keys weren't even needed, all one has to do is disable Secure Boot & the OS runs as intended. I've performed a few Linux Mint installs on former Windows 8 computers & I just disabled Secure Boot, as a favor to the user, if they're not needed, no point in using these. Hopefully this will still be possible for the long haul. I also disable this option as a favor to anyone that has it, if I'm working on their computers for another reason. 

 

I'll have to check out Manjaro, have read many good things about it.  :thumbup2:

 

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#10 MadmanRB

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 07:07 AM

Actually I say dont get a hex core CPU, not a lot of apps are optimized for that kind of load.
Quad core will do even for a linux gaming rig, I understand wanting the biggest PC powerhouse but with Linux picking your parts doesnt mean picking out top shelf hardware.
If this were a server then yes but if just a plain desktop any setup will do under linux, heck even a Pentium G3258 would run great under linux.
Workstation PC Maybe I can see where you may want more vroom vroom but the advantage of linux is it can run on low end hardware no prob.
Also I wouldnt diss the integrated Intel GPU's, my integrated intel HD 4600 is actually quite amazing.
Sure its no Nvidia but for a built in GPU its utterly stunned me on how well it handles things like games.
In a year from now I will get a more proper GPU yes but for now I will settle for my intel as it works surprisingly well under most of what i throw at it.
It kicks ass at playing Tomb Raider 2013, Alien Isolation and Batman Arkham Origins (probably the only arkham game I will own on PC)

Edited by MadmanRB, 11 November 2015 - 07:12 AM.

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#11 myrti

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 11:13 AM

Is Ubuntu moving away from the deb packages:
http://www.itworld.com/article/2914850/linux/is-ubuntu-moving-away-from-deb-packages-here-is-the-complete-story.html

The short answer is no, they can't. Ubuntu is still Debian based and as long as that remains they will be using deb packages. However they are moving their own packages to snappy packages which improve the isolation of individiual apps. This doesn't mean you won't be able to install .debs from then on.

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If you're moving away from Ubuntu because it no longer uses deb as primary packages, going to Red Hat is a bit of an odd choice, since they also don't use the deb & apt-get packaging.

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#12 pcpunk

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 01:28 PM

Thanks guys good read!


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#13 MadmanRB

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Posted 11 November 2015 - 05:36 PM

Is Ubuntu moving away from the deb packages:
http://www.itworld.com/article/2914850/linux/is-ubuntu-moving-away-from-deb-packages-here-is-the-complete-story.html

The short answer is no, they can't. Ubuntu is still Debian based and as long as that remains they will be using deb packages. However they are moving their own packages to snappy packages which improve the isolation of individiual apps. This doesn't mean you won't be able to install .debs from then on.

@cat
If you're moving away from Ubuntu because it no longer uses deb as primary packages, going to Red Hat is a bit of an odd choice, since they also don't use the deb & apt-get packaging.

regards
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Its compatibility is my concern, its not what they are using its them seemingly abandoning the Debian base altogether.
Its different then jumping ship to redhat or centOS as they still have packages one can install from the web, but will Ubuntu do that in the future? Seems maybe not, there is just so much double talk makes you think Canonical is Microsofts hick cousin


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#14 cat1092

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 02:14 AM

Is Ubuntu moving away from the deb packages:
http://www.itworld.com/article/2914850/linux/is-ubuntu-moving-away-from-deb-packages-here-is-the-complete-story.html

The short answer is no, they can't. Ubuntu is still Debian based and as long as that remains they will be using deb packages. However they are moving their own packages to snappy packages which improve the isolation of individiual apps. This doesn't mean you won't be able to install .debs from then on.

@cat
If you're moving away from Ubuntu because it no longer uses deb as primary packages, going to Red Hat is a bit of an odd choice, since they also don't use the deb & apt-get packaging.

regards
myrti

 

myrti, Thanks for the link, it squashes many concerns & rumors spread, keeps the record straight. :)

 

No, I don't want to move away from Linux Mint, but if I had to, would prefer to learn over again under a totally different roof, why would I allow Canonical to burn me twice? I did it when the initial leap to Linux MInt was made 6.5 years ago (after bouncing around 3-4 months until I could find the one for me) & can again if I have to. Actually, as stated above, was already beginning to learn Cent OS some (yes, it's indeed tougher), after a couple of months, beginning to enjoy the experience. Had I turned down my friend's offer, would be fluent in two Linux distros long ago, Windows 8 turned out to be a bust & many wasted hours of my time, not to mention the members I had to deal with in the role that I accepted before even making my first post on the forum. It's since been hacked & am not surprised. 

 

 

 

Seems maybe not, there is just so much double talk makes you think Canonical is Microsofts hick cousin

 

In a sense, you're right, about 30% or more of Microsoft Azure clients are running Linux servers (many modified Ubuntu ones). There are already two major versions of Ubuntu, the free one that we can use mostly w/out EULA's, and there's also their cash cow professional subscription based versions (that keeps ours free), custom tailored for most any need. That's why Canonical has sales & support offices all over the world, my main medical provider now uses a custom Ubuntu build, she liked the OS so good, that it's all that's in her home now. Told me that it was saving her over $150 yearly in security software alone, not to mention all of the other needed maintenance that Windows requires to run smooth. If a Windows user, unless one has as much set on auto pilot as possible (I do), there's still work involved. Anyone that says different is not taking care of their OS. 

 

While there also is some with Linux Mint or Ubuntu, that amount is sliced by 80%. Keeping the OS & software updated & imaged weekly are the main two things to do. As far using the OS, well it's just like any other in that respect, which makes it hard for me to believe Home usershare hasn't grown, while business usage has grown tremendously. Yet I'll be the first to tell anyone who says 'I don't use Linux', that they're very wrong. Be it placing orders online, having access to basic utilities like power, phone, cable & even water, many are using Linux, whether or not they like it. If their water system is on Linux & it's cut off for a day or two, that person will fall in love with Linux & if their ISP is, even more so. At a minimum, they'll stop trashing it. 

 

Canonical & other huge players in the Linux world needs to be actively seeking contracts with major retailers, North America is a huge market in itself, with as many Walmart stores as there are, Ubuntu is still (behind the scenes) hoping that Dell is their winner & this makes their 2nd attempt. One has to dig deep into the Dell website to find notebooks & ultrabooks loaded with Ubuntu. There are many $288-348 notebooks & PC's in Walmart stores, shave $25 off the price for the Windows license & with a little negotiating, can begin a major market. This applies to Linux Mint also. These backwood online retailers few except enthusiasts hears of, like System76 & others, are charging more than Apple for equivalent hardware & killing any hope at a real Linux market. 

 

Chromebooks are selling, so don't see why Ubuntu based distros can't either. While Google has the advantage of being a household name, this wasn't always the case, in fact Debian (which Ubuntu was built on) was here years before Google was a thought in the minds of Larry Page & Sergie Brin. And back in the mid 80's when Bill Gates was struggling to keep Microsoft's first users, he'd been totally delighted to have had today's Linux usershare. So obviously, it's the Linux distro leaders shooting themselves in the feet at developing a decent market share. 

 

And it's those who stirs up these rumors that Ubuntu is going to totally change that makes matters worse. My retention rate at keeping Linux users is 100% (in about 35-40 users) & if weren't disabled & could get out more, could bring in a lot more. It's all in how one presents their product to the individual that wants a different way for their needs. Most of mine were sick & tired of their computers being the same way via infections & some had 'premium' software to catch Malware. Linux Mint solved that. Bring me someone who gets 3-4 infections per week, I'll have that person on Linux Mint (or Ubuntu if the Modern UI is their cup of tea) inside of 2 hours. And I won't have to twist arms, be untruthful or use underhanded sales tactics, because I'm selling nothing, only giving away freedom. 

 

 

 

Workstation PC Maybe I can see where you may want more vroom vroom but the advantage of linux is it can run on low end hardware no prob.

 

MadmanRB, you're correct, I've loaded Linux MInt MATE & Xfce on many low power Windows 7 computers that were sold in the untold millions. My purpose for a well loaded PC is to run VM's, sometimes 2 or 3 at a time. One needs hardware to accomplish that, and the VM's runs as fast, if not faster, than a native install. Once I perform a new build, will use my current PC as a home entertainment one, and it has the power to do just that. 

 

The Intel 4600 HD graphics aren't bad for a single install of Linux, actually quite good, yet if pushed to a certain point (like running the host OS plus a couple of VM's), it begins to fold. Sometimes my GTX 960 will if I don't OC it a bit. If only Dell had announced they were testing the GTX 970, which has twice the power & later approved a couple of EVGA models, I'd have waited. At the current time though, cannot justify the cost of 3rd GPU upgrade in a PC just barely over 2 years old, 4 if the included AMD Dell OEM 7570 (1GB GDDR5) is in the mix, though with a low profile bracket, have installed it in a SFF PC. 

 

I've never really used the Intel HD 4600 graphics, other than to clean install a new card (or Linux Mint), by default it's disabled if one is in the slot for it. 

 

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#15 NickAu

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Posted 12 November 2015 - 03:58 AM


 

 Unity reminds too many folks of Windows 8, and really they share a lot of similarities.

 

Cat, You will stay after school and write Unity good, Windows 8 bad, they do not share similarities, I am a bad Cat for even thinking that, Ubuntu 1 distro to rule them all. 10000000 times.


Edited by NickAu, 12 November 2015 - 03:59 AM.

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