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#1 rozzer

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 09:02 AM

 Thought this might be of interest

 

 

http://mygaming.co.za/news/news/82622-windows-10-to-implement-advertising.html

 

 



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#2 gigawert

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 09:23 AM

Ah, MSFT is always looking to make some more money as if they don't have enough already.


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#3 dannyboy950

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 09:47 AM

I saw this coming a long time ago and I am a dunce.
Advertiseing/marketing has become a multi million dollar industry on it's own. You think they are really gonna give up that revenue source?

Microsoft has probably decided why fight them when we can join the rest of them and increase the bottom line as well Win Win except for the user who really does not count anymore. I mean really who would actually have the financial resources to fight them.

As much money as Microsoft has it pales in comparison with a lot of Mega companies today.

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#4 jargos

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 08:10 PM

Well, I have no issue with the profit motive or advertising, I'm a capitalist, after all.

 

BUT, from the article linked in the OP,

 

Annoyingly, Microsoft is harvesting your OS and PC for data, so expect to be target by personalised ads fairly frequently.

 

THIS is what makes me rail strongly against MSFT and such practices. After all, where does it stop ? Who polices it ?

 

I sent (had to) some emails through my Win 7 lappie just now., to bussiness associates. The were of a highly confidential, market sensitive nature.

 

Just how much of them would W10 have harvested .. who knows ???


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#5 NickAu

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 08:37 PM

 

Ah, MSFT is always looking to make some more money as if they don't have enough already.

They are making truck loads of money.

 

 

REDMOND, Wash. — October 22, 2015 — Microsoft Corp. today announced the following results for the quarter ended September 30, 2015:

  • Revenue was $20.4 billion GAAP, and $21.7 billion non-GAAP
  • Operating income was $5.8 billion GAAP, and $7.1 billion non-GAAP
  • Net income was $4.6 billion GAAP, and $5.4 billion non-GAAP
  • Earnings per share was $0.57 GAAP, and $0.67 non-GAAP

Non-GAAP financial results exclude the deferral and recognition of revenue primarily related to Windows 10.

During the quarter, Microsoft announced a 16% increase in its quarterly dividend to $0.36 and returned $6.9 billion to shareholders in the form of share repurchases and dividends.

"We are making strong progress across each of our three ambitions by delivering innovation people love," said Satya Nadella, chief executive officer at Microsoft. “Customer excitement for new devices, Windows 10, Office 365 and Azure is increasing as we bring together the best Microsoft experiences to empower people to achieve more."

The following table reconciles these financial results reported in accordance with generally accepted accounting principles (“GAAP”) to non-GAAP financial results. Microsoft has provided this non-GAAP financial information to aid investors in better understanding the company’s performance. All growth comparisons relate to the corresponding period in the last fiscal year.

http://www.microsoft.com/investor/EarningsAndFinancials/Earnings/PressReleaseAndWebcast/FY16/Q1/default.aspx



#6 leithanne

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 09:24 PM

The current advertising is very unobtrusive. I wonder just how far they'll push it.



#7 britechguy

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 10:21 PM

From the Microsoft Services Agreement, Section 2, Your Content (bolding mine):

 

2. Your Content. Many of our Services allow you to store or share Your Content or receive material from others. We don’t claim ownership of Your Content. Your Content remains Your Content and you are responsible for it.

  • a. When you share Your Content with other people, you understand that they may be able to, on a worldwide basis, use, save, record, reproduce, transmit, display (and on HealthVault delete) Your Content without compensating you. If you do not want others to have that ability, do not use the Services to share Your Content. You represent and warrant that for the duration of these Terms, you have (and will have) all the rights necessary for Your Content that is uploaded, stored or shared on or through the Services and that the collection, use, and retention of Your Content will not violate any law or rights of others. Microsoft cannot be held responsible for Your Content or the material others upload, store or share using the Services.
  • b. To the extent necessary to provide the Services to you and others, to protect you and the Services, and to improve Microsoft products and services, you grant to Microsoft a worldwide and royalty-free intellectual property license to use Your Content, for example, to make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat, display, and distribute via communication tools Your Content on the Services. If you publish Your Content in areas of the Service where it is available broadly online without restrictions, Your Content may appear in demonstrations or materials that promote the Service. Controls for how Microsoft personalizes advertising are available on the Security & privacy page of the Microsoft account management website. We do not use what you say in email, chat, video calls or voice mail, or your documents, photos or other personal files to target advertising to you. Our advertising policies are covered in detail in the Privacy Statements.

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#8 gigawert

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Posted 22 October 2015 - 10:55 PM

 

 

Ah, MSFT is always looking to make some more money as if they don't have enough already.

They are making truck loads of money.

 

 

REDMOND, Wash. — October 22, 2015 — Microsoft Corp. today announced the following results for the quarter ended September 30, 2015:

  • Revenue was $20.4 billion GAAP, and $21.7 billion non-GAAP
  • Operating income was $5.8 billion GAAP, and $7.1 billion non-GAAP
  • Net income was $4.6 billion GAAP, and $5.4 billion non-GAAP
  • Earnings per share was $0.57 GAAP, and $0.67 non-GAAP

Non-GAAP financial results exclude the deferral and recognition of revenue primarily related to Windows 10.

During the quarter, Microsoft announced a 16% increase in its quarterly dividend to $0.36 and returned $6.9 billion to shareholders in the form of share repurchases and dividends.

"We are making strong progress across each of our three ambitions by delivering innovation people love," said Satya Nadella, chief executive officer at Microsoft. “Customer excitement for new devices, Windows 10, Office 365 and Azure is increasing as we bring together the best Microsoft experiences to empower people to achieve more."

The following table reconciles these financial results reported in accordance with generally accepted accounting principles (“GAAP”) to non-GAAP financial results. Microsoft has provided this non-GAAP financial information to aid investors in better understanding the company’s performance. All growth comparisons relate to the corresponding period in the last fiscal year.

http://www.microsoft.com/investor/EarningsAndFinancials/Earnings/PressReleaseAndWebcast/FY16/Q1/default.aspx

 

Truck loads indeed...  :blink:


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#9 jargos

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 09:12 AM

 

From the Microsoft Services Agreement, Section 2, Your Content (bolding mine):

 

2. Your Content. Many of our Services allow you to store or share Your Content or receive material from others. We don’t claim ownership of Your Content. Your Content remains Your Content and you are responsible for it.

  • a. When you share Your Content with other people, you understand that they may be able to, on a worldwide basis, use, save, record, reproduce, transmit, display (and on HealthVault delete) Your Content without compensating you. If you do not want others to have that ability, do not use the Services to share Your Content. You represent and warrant that for the duration of these Terms, you have (and will have) all the rights necessary for Your Content that is uploaded, stored or shared on or through the Services and that the collection, use, and retention of Your Content will not violate any law or rights of others. Microsoft cannot be held responsible for Your Content or the material others upload, store or share using the Services.
  • b. To the extent necessary to provide the Services to you and others, to protect you and the Services, and to improve Microsoft products and services, you grant to Microsoft a worldwide and royalty-free intellectual property license to use Your Content, for example, to make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat, display, and distribute via communication tools Your Content on the Services. If you publish Your Content in areas of the Service where it is available broadly online without restrictions, Your Content may appear in demonstrations or materials that promote the Service. Controls for how Microsoft personalizes advertising are available on the Security & privacy page of the Microsoft account management website. We do not use what you say in email, chat, video calls or voice mail, or your documents, photos or other personal files to target advertising to you. Our advertising policies are covered in detail in the Privacy Statements.

 

To the extent necessary to provide the Services to you and others, to protect you and the Services, and to improve Microsoft products and services, you grant to Microsoft a worldwide and royalty-free intellectual property license to use Your Content, for example, to make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat, display, and distribute via communication tools Your Content on the Services.

 

And you are comfortable and compliant with this ?


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#10 britechguy

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 10:13 AM

 

 

From the Microsoft Services Agreement, Section 2, Your Content (bolding mine):

 

2. Your Content. Many of our Services allow you to store or share Your Content or receive material from others. We don’t claim ownership of Your Content. Your Content remains Your Content and you are responsible for it.

  • a. When you share Your Content with other people, you understand that they may be able to, on a worldwide basis, use, save, record, reproduce, transmit, display (and on HealthVault delete) Your Content without compensating you. If you do not want others to have that ability, do not use the Services to share Your Content. You represent and warrant that for the duration of these Terms, you have (and will have) all the rights necessary for Your Content that is uploaded, stored or shared on or through the Services and that the collection, use, and retention of Your Content will not violate any law or rights of others. Microsoft cannot be held responsible for Your Content or the material others upload, store or share using the Services.
  • b. To the extent necessary to provide the Services to you and others, to protect you and the Services, and to improve Microsoft products and services, you grant to Microsoft a worldwide and royalty-free intellectual property license to use Your Content, for example, to make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat, display, and distribute via communication tools Your Content on the Services. If you publish Your Content in areas of the Service where it is available broadly online without restrictions, Your Content may appear in demonstrations or materials that promote the Service. Controls for how Microsoft personalizes advertising are available on the Security & privacy page of the Microsoft account management website. We do not use what you say in email, chat, video calls or voice mail, or your documents, photos or other personal files to target advertising to you. Our advertising policies are covered in detail in the Privacy Statements.

 

To the extent necessary to provide the Services to you and others, to protect you and the Services, and to improve Microsoft products and services, you grant to Microsoft a worldwide and royalty-free intellectual property license to use Your Content, for example, to make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat, display, and distribute via communication tools Your Content on the Services.

 

And you are comfortable and compliant with this ?

 

 

Yes, I am comfortable with this.  The proviso "to the extent necessary to provide services to you and others" is critically important here.  If you are using those services to share information how is *any* company supposed to be able to do that unless they can "make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat, display and distribute via communication tools Your Content on the Services."  I don't know how you think your current e-mail, these very forums posts, and myriad other electronic communications are taking place without precisely the list of items in the MS service agreement already taking place, just with other entities doing it.

 

You also conveniently ignore the multiple references to variants on "If you publish Your Content in areas of the Service where it is broadly available online without restrictions."  Any idiot knows that if you put something out "in public" on the internet it is de facto if not de jure in the public domain.  Microsoft telling you that your stuff might appear in demonstrations or materials when you've already made it public is just a way for them to tell you that they're not going to pay you  (nor should they) if your public stuff happens to be seen during a public demonstration or captured in a still photo for an advertisement.

 

This does not apply to every scrap of information you have in the services being a wide open field for them to use as they see fit.

The amount of histrionics, mostly by people who are completely unfamiliar with legalese, is just astounding.  MS is not The Borg and Windows 10 isn't spying on you any more than a great many things already are (and, really, aren't).

 

These beliefs, as well as those that the MS Legal Department didn't go through all this with a very fine tooth comb prior to its release, are just false on their face.


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#11 leithanne

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 01:26 PM

Quite right, britechguy. I've been trying to explain this for ages. And, just for the record, the above applies only to Services. I could chose not to use any Services, and that part of the agreement would not apply to me. I do, however use a few Services, and am fine with the agreement.



#12 britechguy

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 01:59 PM

Quite right, britechguy. I've been trying to explain this for ages. And, just for the record, the above applies only to Services. I could chose not to use any Services, and that part of the agreement would not apply to me. I do, however use a few Services, and am fine with the agreement.

 

If you start looking through other parts of the EULA and Privacy Statement it's obvious that there are elements of the Services Agreement that are repeated elsewhere when they apply to things other than the Services.  Take a look at the Microsoft Privacy Statement.  I actually think it does a better job at being more explicit about what's collected, what it's collected for, the activities you may engage in that would cause it to be collected (and, if one so desires, you now know what to avoid), and what you do not have to submit at all (though that may have an impact on the ability to use certain services).

 

The fact of the matter is that any contemporary software is using telemetry as part of continuous process improvement.  My concern is limited to stuff that's actually personal that is gathered without my knowledge, and that seems to be quite sparse with the exception of search engines, which create truly elaborate profiles, even if those profiles don't contain my name.  This is one of the reasons I converted to using DuckDuckGo as my search engine almost exclusively several years ago:  they don't track.

 

I know that Google, for instance, runs analysis software on my e-mail messages to create targeted advertising.  I also use ad blocking software, so I don't see it.  No one at Google is sitting there and reading my mail, so I don't feel my privacy is violated.  Word analysis by software to target ads is nothing like someone reading my e-mail in any way, shape, or form as far as I am concerned.

 

When I read the new agreements Microsoft put out for Windows 10 my feeling about them is that:

 

       1.  They are being more transparent than has been common in the past about what's collected, when, and why.

 

       2.  There are additions, such as the Code of Conduct, not because someone at Microsoft is going to be sitting there being the Services nanny but because without one there exists no mechanism to allow for removal of material when that is considered justified.  The terms of service for these very forums are not all that dissimilar to much of what's in the Code of Conduct.  If there's "no law" then everything goes, and if it's not abundantly clear by this day and time that this simply does not work and will not do on publicly accessible services where some real whack jobs often can destroy their utility for virtually everyone else, I don't know when it could become clear.

 

       3.  For those of us who are not lawyers, but who are familiar with a lot of legalese due to our licensure (I am licensed as a provider in the health care arena), the Microsoft agreements are neither shocking nor overly broad.  The provisos are written such that one can fairly easily tell both their scope and the specific situations in which that scope applies.

 

I'm not losing sleep at night thinking that the Minions of Redmond are poring over my every word, turning on my webcam to watch my every move, and hijacking my microphone to listen in on my life.  That would not only be a huge waste of their time, but were they to actually do that the damage to the company's reputation and credibility would be so severe that I simply can't imagine them doing that.  That being said, I won't say it's impossible because all it would take is some overly zealous individual (or small group) to give orders akin to what someone (or some group of someones) at Volkswagen did with regard to committing fraud on emissions testing.  Those that did this knew exactly what they were doing and that doing so is illegal.  It's really nearly impossible to preemptively prevent the occasional lawbreaking of this ilk unless we were willing to have oversight far more draconian/Orwellian than those complaining most loudly about Microsoft's new user agreements can imagine in their wildest dreams.


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#13 jargos

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 07:41 PM

Tell me something chaps. Is Windows Mail a Service, and if so, is Microsoft entitled, under their W10 EULA to the content of my emails when I use WM?

 

Also, if the answer is in the affirmative, if someone sends me an email (not using WM) and I open it using WM, is Microsoft then entitled to that  emails content - for whatever purpose.


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#14 NickAu

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 08:02 PM

 

"to the extent necessary to provide services to you and others"

And Microsoft decides what's necessary, and if they like they can change the EULA at any time to anything they like. 

 

 

Also, if the answer is in the affirmative, if someone sends me an email (not using WM) and I open it using WM, is Microsoft then entitled to that  emails content - for whatever purpose.

Technically yes, This way they can "improve" the service, For example I use Thunderbird on Linux and somebody uses Outlook ( or what ever the default spyware is in Windows ), I always encrypt my email to my family and friends and they do the same when sending me stuff, and if I must send an attachment its always zipped and pw protected.



#15 leithanne

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Posted 23 October 2015 - 08:09 PM

No.

 

zTpwqmm.png

 

 

http://www.microsoft.com/security/online-privacy/outlook.aspx






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