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Secure boot and linux install


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#1 paul88ks

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Posted 19 October 2015 - 12:06 AM

Hey guys- haven't been around in a while and posted this in another forum with no response,so I thought I would try here.

 

I recently got my Samsung DP700A3D AIO Desktop out of layaway and want to dual boot it with Linux.i have done many installs in the past but this is my first encounter with Secure Boot and Windows Bootloader in the BIOS. I have heard it discussed here that I need to disable Secure Boot in order to install Linux as a dual boot. There is also an option to disable Windows Boot loader in the BIOS. I am planning on using Easy BCD to install as this will only be a Dual Boot and not multi booting which I have on my other computer.Any comments-suggestions are welcome.I am a little unsure how to proceed-Paul



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#2 DeimosChaos

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Posted 19 October 2015 - 08:04 AM

Don't disable the Windows boot loader. Grub won't pick up the Windows install then and you won't be able to choose via the grub menu at boot. You shouldn't need to disable secure boot to install the newer iterations of Ubuntu... but I am not sure about Mint or others. I would think Mint would be the same as Ubuntu since its based off of it.


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#3 pcpunk

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Posted 19 October 2015 - 11:41 AM

UEFI is fully supported.
 
Note: Linux Mint does not use digital signatures and does not register to be certified by Microsoft as being a "secure" OS. As such, it will not boot with SecureBoot. If your system is using secureBoot, turn it off.
 
Note: Linux Mint places its boot files in /boot/efi/EFI/ubuntu to work around this bug. This does not prevent the installation of multiple releases or distributions, or dual-boots between Ubuntu and Linux Mint, as they can all be bootable from the same grub menu.

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#4 paul88ks

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Posted 20 October 2015 - 12:22 AM

Thanks guys- I will try the install with secure boot off and windows bootloader on first- i think i will use Easy BCD first,i've had good success with that on just a dual-boot machine.Then I will configure Grub to take over after that. I am concerned that the automatic touch-sensor for the DVD player will not work correctly after install- and thus not be able to eject the CD/DVD.I would hat to have to boot back into Windows everytme I want to eject a cd. the owners manual says that the computer will boot from a USB drive,so maybe I will have to learn how to do a bootable flash drive with persistence.I have seen that a lot of people have done that here.It might be the safest way to go about this-



#5 wizardfromoz

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Posted 20 October 2015 - 02:38 AM

Hi Paul:

 

  1. What version of Windows mate?
  2. HDD capacity and is it MBR or GPT (likely GPT)
  3. Which Linux Distro do you want to dual/duel with ? :hysterical:

Any good gigs lately?

 

Cheers

 

:wizardball: Wiz

BTW if you get us a screenshot via Windozey using a combo of the Disk Management Tool  and Windows Snipping Tool, that will assist



#6 paul88ks

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Posted 20 October 2015 - 03:12 AM

 

  1. What version of Windows mate?
  2. HDD capacity and is it MBR or GPT (likely GPT)
  3. Which Linux Distro do you want to dual/duel with ?

Hi Wiz- It's a Windoze 10 AIO Samsung- check out my posted specs under my signature. I has a 1 Terabyte Drive- I don't know if it is MBR or GPT,and I will be installing Linux Mint 17.2 either the Mate or Cinnamon edition.Can you show me how to find out if it is GPT or MBR? It is 64-bit so i'm thinking it is GPT.

 

And yes- I haven't been on in a while because the Music Biz is going fast and furious right now,and likely will be until New Years.I am hoping that i will be able to buy that Crucial 1Terabyte SSD for 350.It's the best deal I have found so far,we shall see if Santa will be good to me this year. It is now 3 A.M and I will have to do the screenshots tomorrow- Hope you are well! Paul  PS- I am so tired right now i don't think I would know the difference between GPT and BBQ-although as i remember I really like BBQ! Time to go to bed!!


Edited by paul88ks, 20 October 2015 - 03:21 AM.


#7 wizardfromoz

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Posted 20 October 2015 - 05:33 PM

Paul

 

Mate, hi. Two of jargos' posts at his two Topics on the same matter will give you a visual cue.

 

First was at http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/584803/linux-usb-doesnt-do-anything/page-4

 

... which at #60 page 4 featured his link to Imgur, which was http://imgur.com/gallery/NLo1tkD

 

There we found

 

NLo1tkD.png

 

Then at his newer Topic http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/588870/dual-booting-linux-alongside-win-7/

 

#es 9 and 10 refer, also to Imgur pics. After JA followed my instructions, the output was as follows:

 

4PMhCzE.jpg

 

jargos was using Windows 7 but the same applies to 8.1 etc.

 

Yours will either have something about MBR, or else something about GUID Partition Table (GPT).

 

Cheers

 

:wizardball: Wiz



#8 paul88ks

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 12:32 AM

Update! just thought i would let you guys know-- My Samsung is a EUFI Mobo with secure boot,and after numerous attempts to install Linux in the usual manner,Needless to say that this computer will in NO WAY let me install anything other than a Windows OS. There is no legacy Bios mode to select no Legacy MBR- even easy BCD said that on my computer it isn't possible.(Cat) I know you are shaking your head saying,"I told you so"-which you did.

 

However,i did find an acceptable workaround and downloaded and  installed Virtual Box,and then installed Linux Mint 17.1 which I love.And lo and behold- Voila'! This is the computer i use in my little bedroom/office and having WinDoze and Mint in a VM is sufficient for what I need here.My Main Machine under My PC Specs has taken it's rightful place out in my home recording studio- I will post some pics at a later time-. All i am waiting for now is for Santa to find me a good deal on an SSD for my Main machine,which contains Ubuntu Studio as well as various other installs.

 

NOW-for my rant-Cat - you will love this- at what point in time did Microsoft climb in bed with computer manufacturers to implement EUFI? I think this is an OUTRAGE!Are ALL Motherboards going to be made this way from now on?And should I start buying up former BIOS MOBOS with MBR and GPT-GUID?I just can't imagine this being true for all MOBOS- and if it is-I will start looking for every older computer and mobo i can find.Intel or AMD.Someone tell me that this is not the case! What are we supposed to install Linux on?---?????



#9 pcpunk

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 01:22 AM

I think it is a Samsung thing Paul, but, I've had issues installing for other reasons also, like graphics cards.  My toshiba with ATI Mobility Radeon 4100 will not let me install either.  It boots up fine from LiveDVD but will not install no matter what, I even tried single boot, pre configured partitions etc.  I know I can do it now after researching it, but don't want to risk messing it up, its my only good windows machine.


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#10 wizardfromoz

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 01:34 AM

Hi Dallas friend, just reading friend punk's post that beat me.

 

Google or DuckDuckGo, whatever, up the following:

 

"uefi history"

 

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Extensible_Firmware_Interface

 

... which you may or may not read through.

 

More relevant to your question/rant is the fourth, fifth, whatever hyperlink in the second paragraph (you can make a fulltime occupation of reading Wikipedia's hyperlinks, lol):

 

 

The Unified EFI Forum is the industry body that manages the UEFI specification.

 

 

Now click that, and you will read, amongst other things:

 

 

The board of directors includes representatives from eleven "Promoter" companies: AMD, American Megatrends, Apple, Dell, HP, IBM, Insyde Software, Intel, Lenovo, Microsoft, and Phoenix Technologies.

 

Any more questions, put them in writing to my Secretary :hysterical: :hysterical:

 

:wizardball: Wiz



#11 paul88ks

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 01:47 AM

 

I think it is a Samsung thing Paul, but, I've had issues installing for other reasons also, like graphics cards.  My toshiba with ATI Mobility Radeon 4100 will not let me install either.  It boots up fine from LiveDVD but will not install no matter what, I even tried single boot, pre configured partitions etc.  I know I can do it now after researching it, but don't want to risk messing it up, its my only good windows machine.

PC- you may well be right on that- as i did some reading after posting my last comment- it seems that quite a few people were in a tiff over some Samsung Laptops a couple of years ago,to the extent that people were sending there units to Samsung to have them "Unbricked" so that they could use a legacy mode Bios for the purposes of multi-booting or Linux installs. I have read through most of the literature on my Samsung and they clearly state to not try and install any other OS besides Windows- funny-thank God for Virtual Box-Linux 17.1 works like a charm in that environment.



#12 paul88ks

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 01:55 AM

Hi Wiz- how are things in the Land Down Under? All of your links to reading material have been duly noted,and trust me,I will have time tomorrow to peruse through all of it! I was reading that some MOBO manufacturers give you an option in the EUFI- to swith to a legacy BIOS/MBR . I am reading lots of negative reports abot EUFI and Secure Boot, this whole thing just befuddles me- time to edumacate-"that's a Texas word"- myself on these matters! -Paul



#13 cat1092

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 02:02 AM

Paul, that's 'UEFI firmware'. 

 

And yes, I did warn you about purchasing this particular computer, yet you went ahead anyway, now you first hand see what I was telling you. But on mine, I was able to disable Secure Boot, it's the first thing that I do with any newer computer that I check out.......as a favor to the owner. No harm is done, in fact, bootable utilities like rescue CD's or Flash drives won't boot with it enabled. The only thing that Secure Boot does is 'places handcuffs' on the computer, so that you can't use it the way you wish. 

 

Now, before we go to bashing UEFI, first off, it's not the fault of the standard as to 'why' you can't install Linux on that PC, rather it was how Samsung implemented it beginning in 2012, whom by chance are out of the business of building Windows computers. Horrible firmware issues with their later models, look at the one in my bottom Speccy sig. Samsung had to replace the MB because it was bricked after a UEFI firmware update (not to be confused with a BIOS update, the standards are different, though the procedure may appear the same). It left the notebook in a permanent boot loop cycle less than two months after purchase, and rather than let the battery drain (which may or may not have helped), my relative plugged while awaiting a call from a Samsung rep & it sat in that state until the heat generated from the endless boot loop finally destroyed the MB. 

 

Anyway, she got the notebook back two weeks later, with a brand new, factory updated MB & was told 'there would be no more firmware updates of this type available'. So far there hasn't, and to think, it cost over $1,300 after taxes new & it's still two months from being 3 years old & I've had it for 6 months or so, was given to me for setting up a new notebook, printer & new wireless router (was given the one year old of that also), but don't have any 'AC' devices & the brand of router may not play well with my VoIP service. So will keep the router, which cost more than the one I purchased early this year, and when it goes, will have another, with more features to take it's place. All I would need to do would be purchase a few 'AC' wireless cards for upgrading what I have for about $25 each (new pulls from corporate workstation notebooks). 

 

Furthermore, Microsoft didn't even come up with the technology, though they later purchased the rights to it before Windows 7 was released, seeing potential in it. It's been greatly altered since that time. Note that everything Windows does has a left slash (\), if it were Linux, would be a right one (/). That's the proof that Microsoft altered it. 

 

At least you were lucky (or maybe you weren't?) to have Windows 10 installed, it won't run right on my Samsung & furthermore, removed all Samsung software from the OS, which I didn't like. Hopefully you have a local & not a signed in OS, where Microsoft can access your data anytime they wish, they even use some users GPU's to upload data (& this was proven on this forum with snapshots). If GPU's can keep the worlds virtual currency in Bitcoin flowing, surely Microsoft would figure out a way to make the same work for them. 

 

Windows 10 Pro even slowed my main PC, AV & AM scans were taking 2x longer & superAntiSpyware scans that were taking 17-21 seconds to complete, over a minute. What a resource hog of an OS, Windows 8.1 has over 7 years of life left (until early 2023), I don't need Windows 10, and I also don't sign into my 8.1 Pro w/Media Center OS's, just use a Local account. 

 

Yes, you can run any version of Linux by VM, at least Samsung didn't mess that up. 

 

I told you so months ago, thought you were going to choose another computer. :)

 

You must have forgotten, or maybe think there wasn't substance to what I said. If I didn't have the computer myself, wouldn't have been able to inform you. Yet I can live with 8.1 Pro w/Media Center, nice running notebook for being less than 3 years in use that I got as a gift for a day's labor. Being disabled, anything I do is volunteer work on those terms. If someone wants to give me something for my time, then am thankful for any donations received. That's why I only help close friends/relatives, they know my situation & how to make sure I'm looked after. I'm allowed to do as much volunteer work as I want. 

 

Cat


Performing full disc images weekly and keeping important data off of the 'C' drive as generated can be the best defence against Malware/Ransomware attacks, as well as a wide range of other issues. 


#14 paul88ks

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 02:09 AM

 

I think it is a Samsung thing Paul, but, I've had issues installing for other reasons also, like graphics cards.  My toshiba with ATI Mobility Radeon 4100 will not let me install either.  It boots up fine from LiveDVD but will not install no matter what, I even tried single boot, pre configured partitions etc.  I know I can do it now after researching it, but don't want to risk messing it up, its my only good windows machine.

i also had a video card issue when upgrading to WIN10- video would only display as a box- so had to upgrade to get the rectanglular view- but that is another topic!



#15 paul88ks

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Posted 30 October 2015 - 02:32 AM

 

I told you so months ago, thought you were going to choose another computer. :)

 

You must have forgotten, or maybe think there wasn't substance to what I said. If I didn't have the computer myself, wouldn't have been able to inform you.

Yes you did Cat,but at the time the computer was already in Layaway,the pawn shop said they would let me exchange for any other computer, or for that matter,any other thing in the store,but there just wasn't anything there comparable in value! i checked the manufacture date on it ,and it was less than 2 years old.As a matter of fact it still had some factory wrapping on the chrome parts,and i bought it for less than half of retail.that being said ,I DO value everything you post,but I was kinda stuck in the middle with what to do.I do have it on a "Local"account" and am in the process of getting rid of all the pesky Samsung software.It came with WIN8.1 on it and I upgraded it to 10 and it works greats,I had to do some tweaking to get the boot time down to about 38 seconds,and since I have a VM running Mint 17.1- it's really fast.SO- I'm not really sorry i bought it- it's just my everyday Computer.The one i spent so much time and money on is now out in the Studio- which had become a storeroom,but not anymore.I'm kinda proud of it and will post some pics when I am done remodeling and cleaning up! Still wait in on that SSD- I saw Samsund advertising a 500 gig for 150.00 Thought about getting 2 instead of the 1 TB from Crucial for 350.00 Still not sure what i want to do there.






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