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cascading routers, different subnet


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#1 brucewol

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 12:59 AM

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Registered: ‎10-28-2013
 
I got cascading routers to work with a different subnet to work in a test environment. Now, moving ti to a production environemt, I can no longer get it to work. What am I screwing up? Below is what I wrote up to get it to work. Routers are both wrt400n.
 

‎07-05-2015 02:04 PM

I'm posting all the screen shots along with text for the config stuff to get cascading routers to work - Lan to Wan which gives you 2 subnets. router 1.1 is the primary router ip address 192.168.1.1      router 2.1 is the secondray router, ip address 192.168.2.1

 

First, use the linksys article http://www.linksys.com/ca/support-article?articleNum=132275 to initally configure your routers and what ports to use.

 

Then connect a pc to the primary router, which i label 1.1 for 192.168.1.1. Your internet connection type is whatever your isp requires. the ip address should be 192.168.1.1

 

192.168.1.1  setup

Then you need to use the adv routing tap.You need provide a route entry, seems any name will work. Then destination lan ip. in my case is 198.168.2.0 since my secondary router has an ip of 192.168.2.1. note the last digit of destination ip is 0 not 1. I used a gateway of 192.168.1.10. My primary router is 192.168.1.1 and my dhcp ip's start at 100. So I quess the gateway needs to be in the range of 192.168.1.2 - 99. Not really sure about this but just know what I've got works for me.

 

192.168.1.1 advance rounting

 

 

 

Novw connect a pc to the secondary router with a ethernet cable. Use the static ip dropdown for internet setup. The internet ip address comes from router 1.1 adv routing. the gateway is the 1.1 router ip. i set my 2.1 router ip to 192.168.2.1. You need to have dhcp activated since this is a different subnet and router 1.1 can not provice ip's for it.

 

192.168.2.1 setup

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then NAT needs to be turned off on router 2.1. Some screens might call this mode and give you options of gateway or router. Select router. So for the lan connected to router 2.1, lan ip's will come from router 2.1, wan stuff will be gatewayed from router 1.1

 

192.168.2.1 advance routing

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

,,,,,

 

 

Then you need to use the adv routing tap.You need provide a route entry, seems any name will work. Then destination lan ip. in my case is 198.168.2.0 since my secondary router has an ip of 192.168.2.1. note the last digit of destination ip is 0 not 1. I used a gateway of 192.168.1.10. My primary router is 192.168.1.1 and my dhcp ip's start at 100. So I quess the gateway needs to be in the range of 192.168.1.2 - 99. Not really sure about this but just know what I've got works for me.

 

192.168.1.1 advance rounting

 

 

 

Novw connect a pc to the secondary router with a ethernet cable. Use the static ip dropdown for internet setup. The internet ip address comes from router 1.1 adv routing. the gateway is the 1.1 router ip. i set my 2.1 router ip to 192.168.2.1. You need to have dhcp activated since this is a different subnet and router 1.1 can not provice ip's for it.

 

192.168.2.1 setup

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then NAT needs to be turned off on router 2.1. Some screens might call this mode and give you options of gateway or router. Select router. So for the lan connected to router 2.1, lan ip's will come from router 2.1, wan stuff will be gatewayed from router 1.1

 

192.168.2.1 advance routing

 

Attached File  1.1_adv_routing.jpg   45.21KB   2 downloadsAttached File  1.1_setup.jpg   64.34KB   1 downloads

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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#2 CaveDweller2

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 02:14 AM

Do you have a cable from Router 1 to Router 2's WAN port?


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#3 Wand3r3r

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 10:20 AM

This statement contradicts itself

Then NAT needs to be turned off on router 2.1. Some screens might call this mode and give you options of gateway or router. Select router.

 

Router = NAT You also do not want to turn NAT off given your situation.



#4 brucewol

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 10:38 AM

cavedweller2   yes, cable from router 1.1 lan to router 2.1 wan

 

wand3r3r - my understanding that with nat on, 2.1 is both a gateway and router. with nat off it is just a router. some screens have nat on/off, some have gateway/router options.

 

I got the following from my isp tech support. it took me a bit to figure out where to put the info in the screens. but once I did, it worked in my test setup. Then I dissasembled and now can't get it to work in my production environment. Later today I'll setup both production and test setups so i can just unplug from my isp to switch back and forth.

 

Here's a brief overview to get you started.

ISP POE -Internet < --- > RouterA < --- > RouterB

RouterA
WAN: PPPOE CONNECTION
LAN: 192.168.1.0/24

RouterB
WAN: 192.168.1.10 [static_IP]
LAN: 192.168.2.0/24

RouterA will be handling network address translation (NAT) which is a setting on the linksys router which is set by default.. I believe they call it "gateway" mode or something to that effect.

RouterB will be a simple router with a static IP defined on the WAN interface. You'll also need to change this mode from gateway to router under the "Advanced Routing" tab.

RouterA will need a static route so that it knows where 192.168.2.0/24 is:

RouterA:
Destination Network: 192.168.2.0
Mask: 255.255.255.0
Gateway: 192.168.1.10
Interface: specify correct interface
 



#5 CaveDweller2

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 11:51 AM

Directly connected routers know each other so you don't have to mess with the routing. You need NAT on for both. Unless you are going to do all static IPs.

 

I am curious why you are doing this?


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#6 brucewol

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 12:34 PM

I initially followed the linksys recommendation

 

I plan on adding an ip camera and web accessible weather station to router 1.1. This requires me to open ports on router 1.1. So my goal is to have the open ports only on subnet 1.1 and my main lan - subnet 2.1 would not have the open ports. I don't think the ip cameras are as secure as routers and pcs that can have software vendors firewall and virus protection. This might be overkill on my part because a lot of the security problems with ip cameras are by people using the default passwords and likely having default passwords on their routers, no firewalls, no pc passwords - etc. But maybe there's a better way.

 

If I hadn't gotten it to work, I might consider going to a VLAN just to get it done. Probbaly less than $50. But since I did get it to work, it's really frustrating that I can't reproduce it. And if I can not pin down exactly what it is to get it to work, maybe I'll go the VLAN route so I know I've got a reliable configuration. 

 

Anyway, I've now got my test lan and production lan all cabled up, so just need to switch my isp cable in/out to test.  



#7 brucewol

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 12:36 PM

well my url for linksys got stripped out, but if you google linksys cascading routers, click on article 132275



#8 CaveDweller2

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 12:47 PM

I am assuming that router 1 is and has been able to connect to the net? If not you need to get that working or the rest is sorta pointless.

 

If router 1 is set what I would try is setting router 2's Internet Setup to Automatic Configuration - DHCP. Set the LAN IP to 192.168.2.1. Make sure you save settings. And unplug the power to Router 2. Plug a cord in from Router 1's switch ports to Router 2's WAN port. Then plug the power back into Router 2. Then surf back into router 2 and see what address it was given from Router 1 or if it was given one.

 

If that doesn't work, you are doing something wrong or a setting is wrong in Router 2. I'd reset it back to defaults and start again. I'd stay out of advanced routing.


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#9 Wand3r3r

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 01:16 PM

"Then surf back into router 2 and see what address it was given from Router 1 or if it was given one."

 

Router1 can't give a dhcp ip address to anything connected to Router2's lan.  If it did there would be no communication since it would list router1 as gateway when it needs to list router2 as gateway. It would also require a dhcp helper on Router2 to pass the dhcp request past the wan port.

 

Brucewol it is unclear what you are trying to accomplish.  Setting up the two routers using NAT as you have will work just fine except 0.1 won't be able to access lan devices on 2.1.  Which is the reason you are setting this up the way you are since you are opening ports on router1.

 

Reviewed your Linksys article.  Standard configuration of lan to lan or lan to wan which is what you are doing.  No mention of going into advanced routing in either scenario.  Only if you click on the link about static routing do you get the going to advanced routing button.


Edited by Wand3r3r, 08 July 2015 - 01:30 PM.


#10 CaveDweller2

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 03:14 PM

umm what? I am talking about Router 2's WAN using DHCP, rather than static, to get an address from Router 1 to use as it's WAN address. Like ALL home modem/routers do with their ISP, unless you have a static IP. I am not talking about Router 1 doing DHCP for Router 2. If Router 2 can pull a DHCP assigned IP for it's WAN from Router 1, then you know the 2 are talking.


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#11 Wand3r3r

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 03:46 PM

Ah I see.  I read that differently since router2 wan port has a static assignment.



#12 brucewol

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 04:18 PM

well, darn now it works. and i just followed the instructions found at www linksys com /ca/support-article?articleNum=132275. No static routing needed. But what I did this time was very, very carefully cooridinate power cycles with cable connectors and logging on to the pc. I'm guessing in some of my prior attempts I might not have rebooted the pc and although it had the correct lan stuff, the wan stuff - like NAT was confused. There were times when connected to the 2.1 router i could not ping yahoo.com but could ping  206.190.36.45 - yahoos's ip.

 

One thing that tripped me up a few times was when i changed the ip for router 2.1 from the factory reset of 1.1 to 2.1, the controling pc that used the routers web interface wouldn't connect. That's because the pc had the old ip/subnet.of 192.168.1.100 and could not see the router now on 192.168.2.1.

 

So I just shut the pc down, power cycle the rotuter and then booted the pc. This got me too thinking that I needed to follow a similar process with the routers. So my rule became make the changes, power down pcs and routers. Then switch cables as needed, power up the roiter and once it was stable, power up the pc. Probbaly didn't do this correctly when i moved from the working test environment to a production environment but accidently did it when i used the static routing. So the stic routing can work but don't need the complexity.

 

Anyway, wand3r3r and cavedweller2, thanks for your help and questions. got me to rexamine what i was doing and get the problem solved.



#13 CaveDweller2

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 04:22 PM

So it boiled down to you'd forget to do an ipconfig /release and /renew when switching from one router to the other? smh


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#14 brucewol

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Posted 08 July 2015 - 11:11 PM

CaveDweller2 - well maybe it was a smh on my part. But that's why i find community forums so useful. After many hours working on the problem, it was clear that I didn't have the sanity to solve the problem myself. At least I was smart enough to seek help from a forum.

 

I learned to use ipconfig /release /renew. Better than doing a PC reboot. But I was able to work through the ipconfig /release by rebooting and get connected to the newly configured router. What I don't understand is when I was able to connect to the router, I could see other pc's on the lan, do a ping to the ip of yahoo but not be able to ping directly to yahoo.com. Seems to me if I could connect to the router, then I shouldn't have still had NAT problems since the ipconfig /release had been accomplished by rebooting.

 

But since it appears I've got a working solution, guess I don't really care to understand it all.



#15 CaveDweller2

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Posted 09 July 2015 - 01:55 AM

that is a DNS thing IP vs URL.


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