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Data Belt and Drives


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#1 biferibiferi

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 10:21 PM

How many Pins did the Floppy Drive Data Belt have on it's Connectors?

And how many Bytes did it Transfer per sec?



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#2 YeahBleeping

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 10:42 PM

34 pins for a floppy drive and a maximum of 500 KBps or 1000 Kbps (not Mbps) the 1000 Kbps drives were not widely available.



#3 yu gnomi

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 10:42 PM

# of pins was 40 for ribbon cables (I think that is what you are asking about)

 

Transfer rates depend on your hardware, it is not as simple as SATA standards.

 

Read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parallel_ATA

 

edit: I may not know what you meant by data belt


Edited by yu gnomi, 05 February 2015 - 10:46 PM.


#4 YeahBleeping

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 10:54 PM

Nope It was 34 pins

 

And way back when there was no way to tell which way to put the ribbon cable on the drive so that it worked so it was trial and error.  Then the cable people got smart and marked pin 1 ribbon with a red line.  But then you still had to remember that pin 1 red line goes closest to the power supply for the floppy drive.



#5 mjd420nova

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 11:00 PM

Straightened out a bunch of those "34" pin floppy interface ribbon cables that were mounted backwards.  Any sharp assembly inspection should have found the red or black edge of the ribbon is PIN #1.  A look at the MOBO should have identified one corner of the plastic connector with a pin #1 on the board.  Match it up.


Edited by mjd420nova, 05 February 2015 - 11:01 PM.


#6 YeahBleeping

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Posted 05 February 2015 - 11:11 PM

^^ Yep and pin 1 should have been the one closest to the power supply to the motherboard too.. but this was not always the case so you had to really get in there and look at the pcb to see if pin 1 was marked.  Then they got even smarter and ' notched ' the connector on the motherboard so you couldn't screw that part up but you could still put the cable on backwards on the floppy if you were not watching what you were doing.

 

#feelsreallyoldnow


Edited by YeahBleeping, 05 February 2015 - 11:13 PM.


#7 biferibiferi

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Posted 07 February 2015 - 01:30 PM

Am I right that they used this RED Strip on the bet to tell Pin One for the IDE Hard Drives as well?



#8 mjd420nova

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Posted 07 February 2015 - 07:39 PM

Yes, red, white, black, blue, that's the pin one side.  IDE cables were marked the same way.  SCCI too come to think of it.



#9 biferibiferi

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Posted 08 February 2015 - 12:06 AM

When they did use Floppy Drives I remember the Data Ribbon Belt had 3 connectors on it.

Am I right that all 3 Connectors where Black?



#10 Platypus

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Posted 08 February 2015 - 01:43 AM

Floppy cables could have two, three or four connectors depending on how much allowance they made for alternative drive types. The first drives in PC compatibles were 5¼" which used a thick edge connector that plugged onto the circuit board, later 3½" drives used a smaller IDC connector. A single cable can connect two drives, so older ones carried two of the old connectors, interim period cables added extra, then once 5¼" drives became obsolete, the cables typically provided only the modern connector (two or occasionally just one). They were mostly black, but not necessarily.


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#11 mjd420nova

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Posted 08 February 2015 - 12:37 PM

I've seen the ribbon cables all colors with a contrasting color for the pin one identifier.  The old floppy cables also had a twist in the control lines between the first and second connectors.  Many even had different color connectors.  When the floppy diskette(3 1/2 inch, 2.44 MB) became the standard with the PS2 from IBM (flop).  All in one desktops just weren't shielded enough from the up to 24,000 volts needed for the CRT.  Apple had the same problems with the MAC units.  Early PC hard drives often needed the external expansion cabinet to hold the control card and 8 inch drive.  Then the 10 MB was released with the PCXT.  Twenty MB followed and the rush began.  The ribbon cables seldom had the relief strap at the connector and became prone to being pulled apart during removal.



#12 biferibiferi

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Posted 08 February 2015 - 04:15 PM

Even though the Floppy Drive Ribbon Cable connector is smaller then an IDE Connector is it an IDE Connector?



#13 Platypus

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Posted 08 February 2015 - 07:01 PM

It's unclear to me if the connector was actually developed for IDE, or just used an existing connector. The IDE specification is specifically for the 40 data connections required for hard drive control on the PC-AT (ISA) bus, so in that regard the floppy connector isn't IDE.

 

IDE stands for Integrated Drive Electronics, and was initially the system developed by Western Digital to fit Control Data hard drives to PC Compatibles made by Compaq. Unlike the previous ST-506 (which was derived from the floppy drive interface) and ESDI systems which had discrete drives and dedicated controller boards, IDE moved the device dependent controller electronics onto the hard drive and implemented an instruction based interface for control. This was subsequently formalised across the industry as the AT Attachment (ATA interface), and IDE is often colloquially used to mean this interface.

 

So if IDE is strictly taken to mean having the electronics on the drive, then it's been argued most drives, floppy, ATA, SCSI, SATA, could be classed as IDE, along with their connectors (even though they're different). But the connector itself is just an IDC (Insulation Displacement Connector) and as far as I'm aware being in the electronics industry, has no special association with IDE or the interface, it's just a convenient connector.


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#14 mjd420nova

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Posted 09 February 2015 - 02:43 PM

So many early units did have custom interfaces to custom drives, a standard of any flavor was welcomed.  Standard serial, parallel and keyboard interfaces also finished the missing pieces to "compatible hardware" develpment by third party. 






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