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Computer won't start after initial boot, but works after restart.


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#1 brc2000

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 01:54 PM

Hi,

 

After a few problems with my PC recently, the motherboard eventually began to fail. I recently had it replaced, along with the PSU, and added an extra GB of ram, but I kept my old hard drive (which was wiped after backup to accommodate the new settings) and graphics card. The computer runs okay when it actually starts, but there's a problem when cold booting it. Instead of starting regularly, there's no signal sent to my monitor. mouse of keyboard, but the fans run and I can here a few other processing noises. However, once I hit the restart button or quickly hard boot it of and on, it starts and runs smoothly. I read somewhere that it might be because the computer is booting too quickly and the disk can't keep up. It was suggested that adding a 2-3 second delay to the hard disk booting may help, but I can't find such an option on my BIOS settings (I have a Winsonic WS10213 mainboard with and Intel 965G chipset). There is an option to disable a "quick boot", but that doesn't seem to make any difference. Carrying on this way is not ideal, so I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas. Thanks.



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#2 ranchhand_

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 06:15 PM

You said:

 

there's no signal sent to my monitor. mouse of keyboard

I hate to say this, but I suspect the mainboard or power supply. The only way to arrive at a conclusion is by testing the involved components 1x1 via process of elimination. There is no single program that tests the complete motherboard.

From your post, I assume that the monitor is dark and unresponsive. I assume from your quote that there used to be a system beep when booting (correct me if I am wrong), and now there is none. However, the fans spin up and I assume that the power-on light on the motherboard ("mobo") is on (if your board has one-some don't). At this point, the boot signal from the power supply is not even reaching the BIOS; the "beep" that you usually hear indicates keyboard recognition and that comes from the BIOS long before the hard drive is recognized. Computers will not boot unless a keyboard is plugged in. That indicates a low-level hardware failure. A low-level failure can be caused by only one of four things: a failed CPU, a failed Motherboard, a corrupted or failed BIOS (extremely rare), or a failed Power Supply.
 

> First, establish if your motherboard is still under warranty or not. Check with whoever did your work for you.

> Next, reset the BIOS.  In your users' manual you will find a jumper switch on the motherboard that you move from one side to the other, and that clears the CMOS entirely. Power down; unplug your computer from the wall socket; remove that battery; move the Clear CMOS jumper per your book instructions, usually from one set of pins to another, wait 10 seconds, then move back into original position. Replace the battery and try to boot. Now...if your board does not have a clear jumper, then skip that step. Just remove the battery with the power cord disconnected.
 

> While the case side is open, check the motherboard capacitors for failure. This is becoming a common problem as companies are buying cheaper capacitors and they fail regularly. Capacitors look like small, "Quaker Oats" round boxes set on-end. They are commonly silver color, but can be black, green or brown. The tops of these should be perfectly flat on top; if there are any that are bulging upward, and if there is "goo" on the tops, possibly running down the side, or even on the bottom, that capacitor has failed. Even if the cap to is bulging with no electrolyte seeping out it is bad. I suspect you will find nothing since the mainboard is new, but you never know.

There are many capacitors on a motherboard, some large and some small. Check them all. The easiest way to do this is disconnect the computer and lay it on its side with a bright light shining in, a flashlight is good. If you find any, you have found your problem.

Additional info link:   http://badcaps.net/pages.php?vid=5
Note the pictures on the right hand side. If you find even only one on your mobo, you have found your problem. I have also attached a picture I took of one unit I recently worked on. Note the good caps on the left, and the bad caps covered with electrolyte on the right.

 

> Run a check on your hard drive. I do not think this is the problem, but we must be thorough. A failed hard drive will not prevent the POST screen from appearing (POST=Power On Self Test). Download Seatools For DOS (free) from my link; in the site screen, click "DOWNLOADS" tab, then "Seatools For DOS" and save the file.  Burn the ISO file to a CD. Reboot with it in your drive. Make sure your BIOS is set to 1st Boot Device = CD. If it is not, this may not work. In the screen that appears, first check that SMART has (or has not) been tripped. Then click the upper left corner of the screen for the short test and let it run. It will notify you either Pass or Fail. This is from Seagate Corp. but will test all other drives, not just Seagate.
http://www.seagate.com/support/downloads/seatools/#
 

>The only way to check if a CPU has failed is to remove it and install it on a different computer that you know is running properly. Realistically, that will be difficult for you to do. As a reality check, it is extremely rare that a CPU fails. I have had only one fail on me in all the years I have been doing this.
 

> The only way to check a power supply is either to purchase a tester, they run between $20-$50 on average, or change out the power supply with another you know is good. Realistically, it appears that your power supply is enabling the fans to spin up. If you have a power-on light on the mobo itself and it is lit, that is another indication that the board is getting power. If you still have your old power supply, swap it with the new one to see if that stops the problem. If it does, you have found you problem.
 

> A virus will not prevent the POST screen from booting, although one could prevent Windows from loading. But that is not your problem. You are not getting keyboard recognition from the getgo. Without that you can't go anywhere.
 

> Carefully remove the front panel connectors for the reset switch (if your computer has one) and the power-on switch. With the computer plugged in, take a flat-bladed screwdriver and short the two small connectors for the power-on switch. The computer will (should) start and boot. Run it as long as you can to test for crashes. If no crashes, the power switch or the reset switch are shorting out. I actually have had several older units do this, once I even replaced a mainboard before discovering it was a bad bad reset switch in the case that was shorting. I unplugged it and the unit is running fine up to this day

 

Please check out the above, and get back to me. I would be very interested to see your results. Post back with any questions. Wish you good hunting!


Edited by ranchhand_, 27 January 2015 - 08:43 PM.

Help Requests: If there is no reply after 3 days I remove the thread from my answer list. For further help PM me.


#3 YeahBleeping

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 10:17 PM

Have you checked the hard drive using the tools provided by the maker of your hard drive?  It could be that the hard drive is failing.  And simply cannot spin up in time for your computer to boot the first time.  After your computer tries to boot up the first time it cant but on reboot since the drive is already spinning... it boots.



#4 brc2000

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 06:52 AM

Thanks for the replies. The power supply and motherboard are brand new and tested in store, so I doubt that they're malfunctioning already (and like I said, everything seems to function properly after I reset the computer). I'll carry out some of those checks just to be sure though. Before I do any of that, I thought I'd mention a couple more things I forgot in my initial post:

 

- The keyboard and mouse light up when my monitor is not plugged in and I cold boot the PC.

- The first time I booted the PC, the monitor, keyboard and mouse received power, but there was a message on screen that read "Reboot and select proper boot device or insert boot media in selected boot device and press a key." The same thing happened again, just before I typed this, after I had unplugged everything and then plugged everything back. Again, resetting starts it as normal.

 

Edit: After leaving it on and idle for sometime, the screen went blank as usual, but it wouldn't display anything even after pressing all of my keys or clicking the mouse. The keyboard and mouse were lit up and the CAPS and NUM keys worked. It worked again after a reboot.


Edited by brc2000, 28 January 2015 - 09:05 AM.


#5 ranchhand_

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 09:16 AM

 

The power supply and motherboard are brand new and tested in store, so I doubt that they're malfunctioning already

I remember a quote from a movie, The Long Kiss Goodnight: "Assumption makes an ass out of you and Umption." First, I really doubt that any retail store has pre-tested a motherboard that you purchase. To do that, first they would have to know what they are doing, and second, there are expensive pro hardware testing units for motherboards out there, and I really doubt this store is going to invest in one and even those are not 100% dependable. You can purchase a power supply tester from Newegg for under $40, so they may have one. But....it's your decision.

As I stated, the only way to for sure find your problem is to follow the steps I outlined. I have found many bad mainboards this way. I have also sent several brand new ones back because they were bad from the factory.

Do not let your warranty run out. Retail stores have an "immediate return" policy that expires in short-term, then they refer you to the manufacturer and you really do not want to go through that hell. They may or may not stand behind their product. Do not let your warranty run out. :cowboy:


Edited by ranchhand_, 28 January 2015 - 09:24 AM.

Help Requests: If there is no reply after 3 days I remove the thread from my answer list. For further help PM me.


#6 brc2000

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 10:41 AM

I should have clarified. It wasn't purchased from a retail store, but from the place I gave my computer for repairs. They installed everything, since I don't really have the patience to mess with internal hardware. By "tested", I mean that I asked them to make sure everything worked when put together.

Anyway , I'm probably going to take it back there and hope they can do something about it, and if not, I'll try some of the things you mentioned.




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