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Puppy LiveUSB Dualboot-SavePartition?


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#1 pcpunk

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Posted 02 January 2015 - 03:49 PM

I've been experimenting with my Puppy LiveUSB.  It seems one of the drawbacks is that I could not create a pupsavefile back to the USB.  I guess I could have chosen "Multisession" at beginning and kept all my settings that way back to usb, but did not realize I would not be able to do this.  This creates an issue as I deleted firefox and installed a full fledge FF, so when I go back FF will be gone.  I can fix that but it still creates an issue with puppy and rebooting?  I did not want to save to HDD as I ran into some troubles in doing this recently, I will go into that later.

 

What I would like to do eventually is dual boot two pups on a USB, and I am aware there is software to do so, but like UNetbootin(which I used to create the USB in question) has it's limitations.  But for now let's keep the topic to single boot on usb with space to save. 

 

The most important thing to me now is to create a LiveUSB that I can save too, via. "folder" or "savefile".  I don't understand the difference of these two filesystems accept that the Folder grows as one needs it to without attention.  

 

I am also aware that one can install to usb manually and that is what I would like to do to accomplish this.  

Using a 16GB USB:

My idea is to create a small partition for the OS in fat32 and another in ext. for a Save Partition.  I am not even sure that "fat" is required for a manual install and not sure what the best ext. file partition would be.  I have seen all the info. on ext. but it does not help me being a noob.  I have read that fat. is needed for boot purposes or something.

 

I saw a video on manual install, so I can pull that off, but just want some advice from the long time pup runners on the best way to do this.  I have looked all over youtube for this but there are so many videos on pupusb stuff.

 

I am going to PM Al000 also, thanks pcpunk


Edited by pcpunk, 02 January 2015 - 03:50 PM.

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#2 NickAu

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Posted 02 January 2015 - 05:20 PM

I think you should install ONE operating system and learn it. All this jumping around trying to multiboot Mint 17 32 and 64 bit and puppy, It's confusing.



#3 Al1000

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Posted 02 January 2015 - 05:38 PM

I've never used a bootable usb so unfortunately I don't know anything about them. Although I might be able to help with a couple of points:

 

I've been experimenting with my Puppy LiveUSB. It seems one of the drawbacks is that I could not create a pupsavefile back to the USB. I guess I could have chosen "Multisession" at beginning and kept all my settings that way back to usb, but did not realize I would not be able to do this.

When you shut Puppy down, are you presented with any options to save?

 

The most important thing to me now is to create a LiveUSB that I can save too, via. "folder" or "savefile". I don't understand the difference of these two filesystems accept that the Folder grows as one needs it to without attention.

That is the difference. A save-folder is the same size as the contents that it contains (more or less), just like any other folder. It grows and shrinks depending on what you put in it or delete from it. Whereas a save file is whatever size you decide to make it, and as you have indicated you also have to pay attention to how much space is left in it.

 

My idea is to create a small partition for the OS in fat32 and another in ext. for a Save Partition.

Puppy save files and folders contain their own file systems, independent of the file system they are stored on. I have never had a problem using fat32 USB sticks to store Puppy savefiles on, and if anything would be more inclined to format the partition for the operating system.


Edited by Al1000, 02 January 2015 - 06:32 PM.


#4 pcpunk

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Posted 02 January 2015 - 08:56 PM

I've never used a bootable usb so unfortunately I don't know anything about them. Although I might be able to help with a couple of points:

 

I've been experimenting with my Puppy LiveUSB. It seems one of the drawbacks is that I could not create a pupsavefile back to the USB. I guess I could have chosen "Multisession" at beginning and kept all my settings that way back to usb, but did not realize I would not be able to do this.

When you shut Puppy down, are you presented with any options to save?

 

My idea is to create a small partition for the OS in fat32 and another in ext. for a Save Partition.

Puppy save files and folders contain their own file systems, independent of the file system they are stored on. I have never had a problem using fat32 USB sticks to store Puppy savefiles on, and if anything would be more inclined to format the partition for the operating system.

Yes, I am presented with the option to save, and went through the process many times to try and figure it out.

 

I don't quite understand the last part of statement: " and if anything would be more inclined to format the partition for the operating system."

My thinking was that if save partition was formatted to ext then one could just use a Folder, and, would not get the  error seen below.  Just an idea.

Also I noticed today that upon boot, I see the choice to "save to usb", what does that mean exactly.  Is this meant for LiveDVD to save to external source? or, for the very issue that I am trying.  I would try this myself but usb will no longer boot, and many of my DVD's won't boot, but only the puppy dvd's.  I must be doing something wrong.

 

I wonder if installing the full version of Firefox is presenting an issue? but don't think it should.

 

Here is an article about how UNetbootin is not a good software for some things but this does not account for my other issues, and the usb booted fine but after I installed Friefox it did not:  https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/USB_Flash_Installation_Media#Using_UNetbootin

 

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#5 pcpunk

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Posted 02 January 2015 - 09:58 PM

Trying to use Gimp, bare with me.

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Edited by pcpunk, 02 January 2015 - 10:03 PM.

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#6 Al1000

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 03:09 PM

I don't quite understand the last part of statement: " and if anything would be more inclined to format the partition for the operating system."

I just meant that if I was going to format a partition on the usb stick, I would format the one that the operating system is going on, and wouldn't bother formatting the partition for savefiles. But I've never even considered formating a file system on a usb stick, as I've never had any problems with fat32.

My thinking was that if save partition was formatted to ext then one could just use a Folder, and, would not get the error seen below. Just an idea.

Because the savefiles (and save flders) contain their own file systems, formatting the partition to a different file system wouldn't make any difference.

You can't just make your own folder with a text editor and expect it to be the Puppy save folder, if that's what you mean by "just use a folder."

Here is an ext3 Puppy save file (lupusave-USB.3fs) on a fat32 USB stick:

pupsaveusb_zps7af93d5d.png

It would make no difference in this respect if it was a save folder instead of a save file.

Here is another Puppy. This one is (a frugal installation) on my hard drive.

With this Puppy everything is in the puppy528 folder.

pupsavehd_zpsb8f277d8.jpg

I've opened the puppy528 folder in the lower window, and as you can see the savefile (lupusave_LAPTOP.3fs) is there, along with all of the other Puppy files for this installation of Puppy.

So with the first Puppy, the save file is at the top of the file system of a partition (sdb1), while with the second Puppy, the savefile is one level deep in the filesystem hierarchy of a partition (sda5).

One level deep in the filesystem hierarchy of any partition, is as deep as you can put any savefile.

The only issue that I have ever had with Puppy not recognising savefiles, is with a frugal installation like the Puppy in the lower screenshot. This happens if Puppy puts the savefile outside of the folder that everything else is in (puppy528). When that happens all I do is move the save file into the folder, reboot the computer, and Puppy finds it no problem.

With the Puppy in the first screenshot, I boot from the CD which has the ISO burned to it. It would be the same if I was booting from a USB with the ISO burned to it. You would have burned the ISO to USB, booted up with it, and attempted to select the options that you are offered to create a save file (or save folder) when you shut down.

But you did say that you "installed" Puppy to USB, which would be like what I did with the Puppy in the second screenshot when I installed it to the hard drive. In that case you would have burned the ISO to USB, booted up with it, then subsequently have installed Puppy to USB. (In this case you should also idealy have run a bootloader, but would still be able to boot into that installation by booting from an ISO burned to USB)

Can you please confirm which one you did? If you are booting with an ISO burned to USB, you should be able to put the savefile up to one level deep on any partition (/device).

Whereas if you installed Puppy to USB after booting up with it, the savefile must be in the Puppy folder along with the other Puppy files.

The only other thing I could say without knowing more about what you did, is that the name of the savefile in your screenshot strikes me as odd. An ext4 Puppy savefile would normally end with the extension .4fs, rather than ext4. (It is not an ext4 file system; it is a file that contains an ext4 file system). Unless FatDog64 is different in this respect from all the other Pups I've created save files and save folders for, something is wrong there. Did you change the name of the file from ending in .4fs to ending in .ext4?

(EDIT: Please ignore that last question and my comments regarding the name of the file)

Edited by Al1000, 04 January 2015 - 03:54 PM.


#7 NickAu

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 03:27 PM

FatDog700

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#8 Al1000

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 03:53 PM

Thanks for the info. Looks like the name of pcpunk's save file is fine.

#9 pcpunk

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 07:47 PM

Al000, I am getting help at another site so maybe we should quit here.  When I am done there I will come back as I like the format here better.  I will provide you with the info. you asked though.  I have one more file that I want to delete on Mint root? I think is what you call it.  Someone is helping me figure out if it belongs to Mint or not, then I can trash it.  The others I deleted helped out a lot.  The only thing that is weird is that the usb would not be bootable after changing some setting and trying to save to usb.  I guess it makes sense the more I learn about different install methods.

 

I don't know what that screenshot is or means, it is not a savefile at that point so the name is not important.  

 

I used UNetbootin to install to usb, booted, changed some settings, then just tried to create a savefile back to usb.  I don't even know if this is possible but thought it was because of a video that I watched.  Or because of what is says at this site under USB Flash Drive: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=60302

 

I realize now, that it could be the install method.  The first time I did this with UNetbootin - I saved to XP partition and all worked well.  But as mentioned before - I started having other weird issues recently I believe because of old savefiles, perhaps even one that I can't see on damaged XP partition.  

 

I am finally running Tahr now, with no issues saving files back to the DVD I am booting from, so that is good.  Before I could only boot a DVD once after making changes.

Thanks Al


Edited by pcpunk, 04 January 2015 - 07:57 PM.

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#10 NickAu

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 09:25 PM

This is only for Tahr Pup.
 

But you did say that you "installed" Puppy to USB

Yes how do you mean installed. When I say installed I mean like to hard drive, Full install. I also install grub.

 

With Tahr pup installed I do not use a save file, Don't need 1,



#11 pcpunk

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 11:34 PM

This is only for Tahr Pup.
 

But you did say that you "installed" Puppy to USB

Yes how do you mean installed. When I say installed I mean like to hard drive, Full install. I also install grub.

 

With Tahr pup installed I do not use a save file, Don't need 1,

I used UNetbootin to install to usb, booted, changed some settings, then just tried to create a savefile back to usb.  I don't even know if this is possible but thought it was because of a video that I watched, orr because of what is says at this site under USB Flash Drive: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=60302

 

I realize now, that it could be the install method.  The first time I did this with UNetbootin - I saved to XP partition and all worked well.  But as mentioned before - I started having other weird issues recently, I believe because of old savefiles, perhaps even one that I can't see on damaged XP partition.

 

All old savefiles that can been seen are gone now.  No worries I will just keep playing around with it and see if I can get it all working.  Like just today, I ran Tahr via. DVD, installed chrome surfed for a while and saved to dvd.  I just booted it up tonight and the two savefiles loaded but now my mousepad don't work lol.  I did nothing unusual while in tahr and I get this omg lol.  Okay I'm done bothering you guys with this. 


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#12 Al1000

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 06:25 AM

I used UNetbootin to install to usb, booted, changed some settings, then just tried to create a savefile back to usb. I don't even know if this is possible but thought it was because of a video that I watched, orr because of what is says at this site under USB Flash Drive: http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=60302


If you did this:

USB Flash Drive
install to a USB Flash drive and use it for booting. This will be a frugal install of Puppy.

..then you have to put the savefile in the folder that Puppy creates on your USB stick.


#13 Al1000

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 07:03 AM

Al000, I am getting help at another site so maybe we should quit here.


You were getting help with these topics on the other site before you started this thread.

http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=97050&start=60

You are also well aware that experienced Puppy users such as Semme on the Puppy forum, who's post happens to be at the top of the page in the above link in your thread, know far more about Puppy than anyone here does.

So, why did you start this thread here?

I will provide you with the info. you asked though.

Please try to understand that I ask you these questions for your benefit, not mine. It's you who has the problem with Puppy, not me.

If you do not want help on this forum, please do not ask for it.

#14 pcpunk

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 06:08 PM

Of course I wanted help, but a lot of the answers I was getting there were over my head and they don't seem to want to elaborate or provide step by step directions.  This is fine for most but I am a noob to puppies and computers in general.  For instance, Nick taught me how to install a current browser here via. video he made, one the other site I could not get this info. or info. that I could use with my current knowledge.  That thread is quite long, but I would not have learned what I did with out both sites.  I can change my username lie and jump around if you like? but I have chose to be honest.

Good night


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#15 NickAu

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 06:30 PM

 

 For instance, Nick taught me how to install a current browser here via. video he made, one the other site I could not get this info. or info. that I could use with my current knowledge.

Yes I know most Linux forums are like that , they assume you just know how to do it. And if you dare ask for an explanation they treat people like idiots. This is why I try to keep my replys short and simple, and make a video when I can.






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