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The curse of the cartridge chip


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#1 godzilla1347

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 01:16 AM

I was thrilled that my Brother-in-law gave me his HP Photosmart C6100 All-in-One. Then I had learned it uses 5 color cartridges that now contain chips that cannot be reset so supposedly, you can't refill the cartridges, but worse, the ink has an expiration date so that half full cartridges have to be thrown out because these cartridges won't work after the expiration date. Being that HP has a 3 month Warranty and you aren't leasing but buying these units, all these restrictions do is force you to buy overpriced ink, which pretty soon eclipses the cost of the unit. HP is simply becoming Big Brother extortionists and are forcing restraint of trade upon the refillers plus creating ridiculous expenses for users. If I can't get a workaround, I'm going to give this unit away as this is ridiculous and I'll never buy any HP products in the future as I see what they're up to.

 

Now, I've looked on the Internet and had found that by removing the printer battery (it's supposed to be near the carriage), you can do away with the the ink expiration issue and that some say that you can refill the 02 color cartridges regardless of the chip but I'm not clear how effective that is. I'm told, however, you can't refill the black 02 cartridges.

 

I'm wondering if anyone has had success with refiling these cartridges and what you have done to resolve this.


Edited by godzilla1347, 09 April 2014 - 01:22 AM.


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#2 jonuk76

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 06:11 AM

I have an old Photosmart 8200 which also uses the five six HP363 cartridge setup.  It seems to use an inordinate amount of certain colours (yellow and magenta seem worse) and hardly any of some others which is frustrating because the cheapest way to get the genuine cartridges used to be through a multipack with a pack of photo paper thrown in.  It was much cheaper than buying the cartridges separately.

 

The 'expired ink' warning on this model you can just ignore by pressing "OK" a couple of times on the printer.  It warns you about your warranty, but it's long out of that anyway so it hardly matters...

 

From what I've found in the past, you cannot reset the chip on the OEM cartridges, although there are/were unofficial cartridge kits available with a chip that could be reset.  Here is one example.  I haven't tried one of those kits but as of the last few years I've been using non-HP cartridges.  The last lot I got from here, and they work well, cost a fraction of the price AND have a larger capacity than the genuine HP items.  They have the correct chip fitted.  They might not be the best option for US based customers as they are in the UK, I guess there must be local companies that do the same thing though.


Edited by jonuk76, 10 April 2014 - 04:59 AM.

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#3 godzilla1347

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 01:16 PM

Thanks, Jonuk76. I found a company in the US--printpayless.com who sells HP 02 resetting cartridges and I'll buy them from them. Two questions:

1)Once I set this printer up, I may have "expired ink" messages. As you have said, I just ignore them. However, have you refilled such cartridges? I see that you can do that from Internet videos but one states you can't refill the black cartridges.

2) On the fax instructions in the owner's manual, it states that the phone line can't be a generic one and must be the one that came with the printer. I didn't see another phone line with the printer as it was in a box from my brother-in-law who gave it to me when he got a new printer. Do you know what type of phone line they are talking about in case I have to buy one?



#4 Kilroy

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 02:45 PM

Personally I'm against refilling cartridges.  This is from an article from PC World

 


Problem: Ink and/or toner costs too much.

Solution: PC World has written a lot about the printing industry's sneaky practices over the years. To wit: They snare you with dirt-cheap printers sold at or below cost, and then stick it to you later with ultra-pricey consumables.

Based on our tests, we can't recommend third party vendors' remanufactured or refilled ink cartridges, which may not give you your money's worth. One cost-saving solution is to buy higher-capacity cartridges. If you print a lot, try an ink cartridge with a 250-plus page yield, or a toner cartridge with a 2,000-plus page yield.

 

My experience bears this out.  A company I worked for used remanufactured toner cartridges to "save money".  They stopped after a year as printer maintenance costs tripled due to toner leaks.  Saving $25 on a toner cartridge ins't much of a savings if you have to purchase a $400 maintenance kit to fix the problems caused by your cheap toner.

 

Myself, I only purchase laser printers.  Sure they are more expensive up front, but in the long run they cost less.  Toner doesn't dry out, it is dry to start.  Page yields per cartridge are much higher for laser printers over ink cartridges.



#5 JohnC_21

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Posted 09 April 2014 - 03:38 PM

I refill my Lexmark ink cartridges all the time using bulk ink. Never had a issue but I will say the cartridges the lexmark uses have built-in printing heads. If you plan on refilling cartridges with a printer that has a separate print head there could be a problem with clogging. The black cartridge on my Lexmark has been refilled at least 4 times and that is a remanufactured one I purchased from Office Depot. That's a savings of about $170 dollars on black alone over using an OEM cartridge and throwing it away when empty.

#6 godzilla1347

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 12:35 AM

I have only had good experiences refilling cartridges. None of them ever failed or leaked when I followed the instructions. I agree that if I were to buy a printer today, it would be a laser but I was just given the HP Photosmart c6100 and the cost of buying OEM cartridges--6 color and 1 black is senseless when I can buy refill kits and refill each cartridge for practically nothing in total. I can't see the difference between the OEM ink and the refill ink and I have very little need for color anyway but at the small cost of refill ink or aftermarket cartridges, I'm ok with them.

 

And I wouldn't even have a problem with the OEM cartridges if HP wasn't playing the con. They only give you a 3 month warranty so their claim that they put that chip in to protect you is bs. If they really were concerned about the consumer, they would give you a year warranty. The chip is there simply to thwart your purchasing cheap inks and refilling the ink tanks. Worse, they put expiration dates on the ink that is monitored by the chip. That's complete crap! Ink doesn't expire. I have filled my Canon Pixma with 2 year old ink from Atlantic and it works fine. No, they are forcing people do dump half full ink tanks because they have "expired." All this simply to sell cartridges not to protect anything other than their wallets.



#7 jonuk76

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 08:30 AM

Thanks, Jonuk76. I found a company in the US--printpayless.com who sells HP 02 resetting cartridges and I'll buy them from them. Two questions:

1)Once I set this printer up, I may have "expired ink" messages. As you have said, I just ignore them. However, have you refilled such cartridges? I see that you can do that from Internet videos but one states you can't refill the black cartridges.

2) On the fax instructions in the owner's manual, it states that the phone line can't be a generic one and must be the one that came with the printer. I didn't see another phone line with the printer as it was in a box from my brother-in-law who gave it to me when he got a new printer. Do you know what type of phone line they are talking about in case I have to buy one?

 

1) Sorry, I don't know as I have not used the refillable cartridges or CISS system, just non HP cartridges.  However, as they have 'auto reset' chips I suspect that will override any expiration date every time they are reset.  And the expiration dates (at least on my Photosmart 8200) is advisory anyway rather than enforced, i.e. it will still work after the ink has expired.

 

2) Again, I'm not sure. In the manual here they mention a supplied 2 wire phone cord for countries that use parallel telephone systems (like the US).  Having a look about, here is a firm that sells this type of cable for HP fax machines.


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#8 godzilla1347

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Posted 10 April 2014 - 10:49 AM

Thanks for your feedback. If I need the phone chord, your link will expedite that from the company you linked. It appears that I need a two contact chord not the standard 4 contact chord for faxing. Do these chords look the same from the outside?

 

As far as resetting cartridges, I was pleased to find a company, in the US--PrintPayless that ships aftermarket  cartridges with "auto reset chips" and that would solve my bigger problem of spending a fortune on OEM cartridges.  What company have have you used to get auto reset cartridges?  I have to set the printer up and see what's what.

 

As my brother-in-law gave it to me 6 months ago, I don't know the shape of the cartridges but that will be clear once the printer is set up. He gave me a whole set of aftermarket cartridges as well.

 

One other thing: the manual only talks about network setups.I am not using a network (even though I have a wireless router installed) because after taking my XP computer offline, I only have one working computer. I assume I can set up the printer just using a the USB cable.

 

I will have to learn how to set up the network at some point but I've never done that before.


Edited by godzilla1347, 10 April 2014 - 11:09 AM.


#9 wirenut1

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 10:31 AM

I had a refillable cartridge that, after two refills, was not recognized by the printer. Somewhere I read that the chips on some refillable cartridges have a refill counter and time limit..."100 refills;3-year time limit." I think the ink-outlet seal would fail before 100 refills, but the 3-year time limit is a mystery.  Some chips have a button cell, perhaps with a 3-year life. Maybe that's the reason for the time limit. Unfortunately I tossed the cartridge without thinking....duh!

 

I hear Epson is marketing a line of printers with built-in, refillable ink tanks!!!! If this is true, hats off to Epson! It's long overdue. But they're not available here in environmentally-backward USA.   Hey, what's a few trillion more plastic bits in the landfills? :nono:



#10 godzilla1347

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 01:46 AM

My Kudos to Epson as well.  The way some of these printer companies con you is that in short order, you are paying more for ink than for the printer itself. It's one big con job. All the cartridges i've ever filled have worked. In the case of HP, it's complete crap that ink expires. I've used very old inks from reputable refill companies and never had a problem. All it is, is a con job. I will never buy another printer that doesn't allow for refills and will never buy another HP product as long as I live! Now I see these ridiculous commercials from WB Mason that compare buying aftermarket refill cartridges with calamitous events that could be life threatening. Give me a break! What crap! I will never buy anything from them either as a result.



#11 JohnC_21

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 01:00 PM

The only problem I see with the Espon models and their refillable tanks is the price. They are supposed to be priced out at about $400. I would look for a cheap printer and do some research to see if chipped refillable cartridges are available or a CIS system.



#12 godzilla1347

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 01:15 PM

Makes sense.  I presently have a Cannon ip4300 with a chipsetter. It appears that HP doesn't allow for chipsetting so they can gouge you with original cartridges but the company printpayless has replacement cartridges with resetting chips. My HP Photosmart C8180 all in one works with refill kit ink, although you get no way of checking the ink levels and all the ink ends up being "expired," but you can workaround those warnings by pressing OK and the printer works fine with the replacement inks. That's the whole conundrum--expired inks and telling you that refill kits will destroy your system is total bs!  The HP warrantees end very quickly anyway and if you were to purchase their replacement cartridges--you need 5--you will quickly exceed the price of the printer. In fact, the more you use the printer, the costlier it becomes.

 

I have been using replacement cartridges and refill ink kits for years and have never found any problems with any of them. The companies who sell them have been consistently up front and proactive. I don't have to pay money for support as I would with HP once the warrantee is over.  I see this as nothing more than a scam to sell overpriced ink cartridges when no one has to be conned into that.



#13 JohnC_21

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Posted 24 November 2014 - 02:03 PM

Same here. Expiring cartridges based on time is a complete ripoff. I have a Lexmark and Canon that have the heads in the printer cartridges. The canon does chip the cartridges buts it more for ink level than anything. It can be overrided easily. I must be on my 6th refill of a remanufactured Lexmark cartridge and it still works great.






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