Jump to content


 


Register a free account to unlock additional features at BleepingComputer.com
Welcome to BleepingComputer, a free community where people like yourself come together to discuss and learn how to use their computers. Using the site is easy and fun. As a guest, you can browse and view the various discussions in the forums, but can not create a new topic or reply to an existing one unless you are logged in. Other benefits of registering an account are subscribing to topics and forums, creating a blog, and having no ads shown anywhere on the site.


Click here to Register a free account now! or read our Welcome Guide to learn how to use this site.

Photo

Rerouting packets around the internet


  • Please log in to reply
8 replies to this topic

#1 Dacar92

Dacar92

  • Members
  • 232 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Chicago
  • Local time:05:23 PM

Posted 15 March 2014 - 02:21 PM

Do I have any control over the path packets take on their way to their destination?  I have been running WinMtr and tracerts for several days and I am losing up to 100% packets 3 hops in the path.  These hops are outside of my home network and past the initial ISP hop.  See example below:

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------|



|                                      WinMTR statistics                                   |



|                       Host              -   %  | Sent | Recv | Best | Avrg | Wrst | Last |



|------------------------------------------------|------|------|------|------|------|------|



|                              homeportal -    1 |  616 |  613 |    1 |    6 |  185 |    3 |



|162-194-236-3.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net -   49 |  214 |  110 |   23 |   38 |  207 |   24 |



|                            71.145.65.24 -   77 |  156 |   37 |    0 |   31 |  115 |   26 |



|                            71.145.64.70 -   88 |  140 |   17 |    0 |   50 |  227 |   26 |



|                   No response from host -  100 |  126 |    0 |    0 |    0 |    0 |    0 |



|                             12.83.43.21 -    1 |  616 |  613 |   23 |   30 |  209 |   41 |



|                  gar20.la2ca.ip.att.net -    1 |  616 |  613 |   68 |   85 |  273 |   94 |



|               12-122-254-238.attens.net -    1 |  624 |  623 |   69 |   82 |  277 |   92 |



|mdf001c7613r0004-gig-10-1.lax1.attens.net -    1 |  616 |  613 |   69 |   82 |  271 |   96 |



|                          12.129.199.178 -    1 |  616 |  613 |   70 |   76 |  245 |   73 |



|                           12.129.209.68 -    1 |  616 |  613 |   70 |   76 |  264 |   74 |



|________________________________________________|______|______|______|______|______|______|



   WinMTR v0.92 GPL V2 by Appnor MSP - Fully Managed Hosting & Cloud Provider

and tracert to the same IP

Microsoft Windows [Version 6.1.7601]

Copyright (c) 2009 Microsoft Corporation.  All rights reserved.



C:\Windows\system32>tracert 12.129.209.68



Tracing route to 12.129.209.68 over a maximum of 30 hops



  1     7 ms     5 ms     5 ms  homeportal [192.168.1.254]

  2    25 ms    26 ms    34 ms  162-194-236-3.lightspeed.cicril.sbcglobal.net [162.194.236.3]

  3     *        *        *     Request timed out.

  4     *        *        *     Request timed out.

  5     *        *        *     Request timed out.

  6    50 ms    28 ms    27 ms  12.83.43.21

  7    80 ms    75 ms    72 ms  gar20.la2ca.ip.att.net [12.122.128.181]

  8    74 ms    80 ms    99 ms  12-122-254-238.attens.net [12.122.254.238]

  9   159 ms    74 ms   118 ms  mdf001c7613r0004-gig-10-1.lax1.attens.net [12.129.193.250]

 10    73 ms    74 ms    73 ms  12.129.199.178

 11    76 ms   132 ms    75 ms  12.129.209.68



Trace complete.

The losses seem to be at a server/router in the Austin TX area, and I am in the Chicago area.  I contacted my ISP and the chat ended with them sending a tech out to verify wiring in and around my house.  But these clearly show the issue is after the first hop outside my house.  They denied any issue with those IP's.  I'll show the tech these and ask if he has any advice on how to proceed.

 

Any ideas or help here is appreciated.

 

Thanks


Edited by Dacar92, 15 March 2014 - 02:24 PM.

What's the point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes? -- The Doctor

BC AdBot (Login to Remove)

 


m

#2 CaveDweller2

CaveDweller2

  • Members
  • 2,629 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:06:23 PM

Posted 16 March 2014 - 12:39 AM

No you can't pick where your packets get routed to.

 

But that "request timed out" doesn't mean the packets die, that means those hops said NO you can't have our name or know our IP address...kkthks. Now move along. If they died your tracrt would die there as well. It's fairly normal and nothing to worry about.


Hope this helps thumbup.gif

Associate in Applied Science - Network Systems Management - Trident Technical College


#3 Dacar92

Dacar92
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 232 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Chicago
  • Local time:05:23 PM

Posted 16 March 2014 - 08:45 AM

I didn't think there was any control over traffic paths.  But what about those packet losses shown in the WinMtr?  What can be done about that?  Am I right in pursueing AT&T for that? 


What's the point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes? -- The Doctor

#4 CaveDweller2

CaveDweller2

  • Members
  • 2,629 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:06:23 PM

Posted 16 March 2014 - 09:48 AM

I think you've stumbled into a Wizard of Oz moment. You've been happily going down the yellow brick road of the internet and in your travels you've discovered something that has peeled back the curtain a bit. It showed you how some of the magic happens and you're a bit confused now.

 

Be careful how much you want to learn because it's been years for me and I'm still learning. There is no easy way to explain it but I can point you in the direction if you want, Start with the OSI model, once you understand what happens to information that starts on your PC goes across the internet to another PC(server) and back, and I mean truly understand it, then you'll be astonished at this thing called the internet that we take for granted. 

 

is a decent video to explain it, I wish I could link a CBTNuggets video because there are a couple that are AMAZING at explaining it. What he is describing happens for EVERYTHING you do on the internet. There are also lots more routers ie hops.

 

In all honesty, there is nothing ATT can do about things that happen 3 and 4 hops off their network and unless you are affected by it in some way, you shouldn't worry about a packet loss either.


Hope this helps thumbup.gif

Associate in Applied Science - Network Systems Management - Trident Technical College


#5 JohnnyJammer

JohnnyJammer

  • Members
  • 1,107 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:QLD Australia
  • Local time:08:23 AM

Posted 17 March 2014 - 12:20 AM

You can configure routers to not give a response to a tracert or pathping command. Generally a * represents a Firewall Rule set by the ISP, and normally this is when the network addreses goes from one ISP subnet to another ISP subnet.



#6 Dacar92

Dacar92
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 232 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Chicago
  • Local time:05:23 PM

Posted 17 March 2014 - 05:28 PM

Thanks guys.  The IP's that are having trouble in my trace are AT&T routers.  Two of them are anyway.  The third doesn't reply to pings asking for it's ID.  That's the one that results in 100% packet loss. 

 

If you do a "whois-lookup" search, the two 71...IP addresses belong to AT&T so I would think there is something they can do there. 

 

When you say not to worry about packet loss, isn't that one cause of excessive latency, especially in online gaming?  That's what I am experiencing with two different games. So I am affected by it.  I am just trying to get AT&T to care a little.


What's the point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes? -- The Doctor

#7 CaveDweller2

CaveDweller2

  • Members
  • 2,629 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:06:23 PM

Posted 17 March 2014 - 06:10 PM

This is the first time you've mentioned online games. There are billions of packets going across those routers, maybe trillions I'm not sure. If you watched that video, the part with the routers, happens to every single packet. It is amazing the internet works at all.

 

There is nothing they can or will do to help you. You can help yourself by leaning your PC down so there are more resources. You can check the forums for the games on suggestions on dealing with latency. 

 

Ping has a time out period where it has to wait for a response. When it doesn't get a response that is when you see the "Request timed out". When you are 4 or 5 hops away that takes even more time to get back to you. It doesn't mean your packet got lost it just means the router you are pining is set to not respond to that ICMP packet

 

.


Hope this helps thumbup.gif

Associate in Applied Science - Network Systems Management - Trident Technical College


#8 JohnnyJammer

JohnnyJammer

  • Members
  • 1,107 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:QLD Australia
  • Local time:08:23 AM

Posted 18 March 2014 - 11:13 PM

Thanks guys.  The IP's that are having trouble in my trace are AT&T routers.  Two of them are anyway.  The third doesn't reply to pings asking for it's ID.  That's the one that results in 100% packet loss. 

 

If you do a "whois-lookup" search, the two 71...IP addresses belong to AT&T so I would think there is something they can do there. 

 

When you say not to worry about packet loss, isn't that one cause of excessive latency, especially in online gaming?  That's what I am experiencing with two different games. So I am affected by it.  I am just trying to get AT&T to care a little.

 

For a tracert packet i wouldnt care because its just a path/trace packet. It has nothign to do with online gaming because more advanced routing protocols like EIRG and BGP would take effect and i would assume all onlien games are udp anyway. Its like pinging a router or modem that doesnt allow an ICMP(7) request, does that mean its faulty. Nope just means they dont allow it. Allowing certain packets can allow nasty people to leverage that into DDoS broadcasts. Similar to a DNS amplification attack or WordPress PingBack attack which turns say a 8 byte packet into an 1 meg packet (Rough size). Times that by say 1000 zombies/slaves and you have your self a nice little IP Booter!



#9 Dacar92

Dacar92
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 232 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Chicago
  • Local time:05:23 PM

Posted 19 March 2014 - 11:47 AM

Thanks everyone.  I am still pursuing AT&T to at least ask them if there is a problem with their routers/servers in Texas.  There are many people around the world having latency issues with this game (Diablo 3).  That's why it could be the game servers in the long run. But my issues do not seem to happen at the game servers (ping seems to be fine and there is no packet loss there) so thats why I am looking at AT&T.  Not sure anything will happen but it's worth the time because as it is now, I cannot play.


What's the point in being grown up if you can't be childish sometimes? -- The Doctor




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users