Jump to content


 


Register a free account to unlock additional features at BleepingComputer.com
Welcome to BleepingComputer, a free community where people like yourself come together to discuss and learn how to use their computers. Using the site is easy and fun. As a guest, you can browse and view the various discussions in the forums, but can not create a new topic or reply to an existing one unless you are logged in. Other benefits of registering an account are subscribing to topics and forums, creating a blog, and having no ads shown anywhere on the site.


Click here to Register a free account now! or read our Welcome Guide to learn how to use this site.

Photo

Step 1 in building a computer


  • Please log in to reply
11 replies to this topic

#1 The ancient one

The ancient one

  • Members
  • 4 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:08:46 PM

Posted 14 July 2013 - 07:18 PM

I am in the earliest stages of building a computer.  I am looking at a computer case first of all and the following is a list of the various manufacturers that I have come across so far: Antec, Apevia, Azza, BitFenix, Cooler Master, Corsair, Cougar, DIYPC, Enermax, FractalDesign,Irwin, Lian-Li, NZXT, Rosewill, Sentry, Silverstone, Thermaltake, Xclio, Xigmatek, Zalman.  Each of these manufactures have cases that fit my needs (ATX Full Size)  I would like feedback on which manufactures are good, bad, or indifferent.

Price is not a major concern but other things are.  I don’t want a built in PSU (unless I can be assured that is of the highest quality and will meet my needs) and do not need a liquid cooling device or one that is liquid ready (not being liquid ready might eliminate too many choices.) I do have several concerns: 1) I am concerned that if the depth or length of the case is larger than average, this might cause a problem connecting a cable from a modular PSU (bottom located) to the upper most external bay. 2) I have read differing views concerning a side fan. – A) side fan will cool major portion of mother board, video card, etc B) side fan will interfere with airflow from front intake to rear and upper exhaust fans.  Or is the total amount of intake vs exhaust a more important consideration as far as airflow.  3) Should all intake fans have filters and if so ease of getting to and cleaning or removing filters would be a concern.  4) I am planning on mounting and securing the case to a wood board that has 4 casters for ease of movement.  Do you see any problems with that? What are your thoughts on this?

 

 



BC AdBot (Login to Remove)

 


#2 ranchhand1

ranchhand1

  • Members
  • 76 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:06:46 PM

Posted 15 July 2013 - 08:17 AM

First, I suggest that you order your parts from Newegg.com.  They have a stellar customer service reputation, most items have a 30 (or more) day return policy. Yes, there are other online retailers out there that may save you a couple of bucks (or may charge higher, also), but Newegg is dependable. While in the Newegg website, look up the component you want to use and read the users reviews on that component. That will give you more valuable feedback from actual users. Newegg does not whitewash their suppliers, if users don't like the item Newegg prints it.

) I am planning on mounting and securing the case to a wood board that has 4 casters for ease of movement.

That is what I call a "coaster" board. You can purchase those, and they are a great idea! The only thing to bear in mind is to have extra long connection cables so that you can roll it out completely from under the desk, a lot of folks forget about that. Annoying experience - you start pulling it out and your router/modem cable tugs tight and it won't go any further. If you use wireless mouse & keyboard it will give you a lot of freedom.

For building suggestions you might enjoy this link: Building Tips.


Edited by ranchhand1, 15 July 2013 - 08:57 AM.


#3 dpunisher

dpunisher

  • BC Advisor
  • 2,234 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South TX
  • Local time:07:46 PM

Posted 15 July 2013 - 09:33 AM

The big problem with Newegg reviews is that many reviews are done by idiots with little/no experience building or upgrading a computer, and for better or worse, Newegg prints them.  Reading the reviews sometimes makes my head hurt.  I like Newegg as much as the next guy, but as far as them being the "be all end all", nope.  5-6 years ago then yes, Newegg was that much better than the competition.  Now, not so much.

 

For me, a case is usually one of the last things I think about just because I don't really care about cases that much.  Black- check!  No annoying lights-check! I am not the most creative case owner in the world.  You have a valid concern about cable length.  Cheapie PSUs often come up short in the cable length department.  I have stuck with Corsair PSUs for may last few build and even with large cases, no problems.  Like anything, plan ahead.  Usually on reputable PSUs, cable lengths are available.....somewhere out there.    Every one of the case manufacturers you listed make cases that range from great to OK.  I also consider things like amount of USB 3 ports on the front panel.

 

Read actual reviews from REPUTABLE sites.  I usually head to Hard OCP, Hardware Secrets, JonnyGuru, Anandtech for reliable reviews, especially on PSUs.

 

Side fans- your call.  Convection is your friend. If you have a properly planned system, a good case, good fan/airflow layout, then a side fan is not really needed. Personally, I go for overpressured systems.  More intake fans than exhaust fans, if I even use exhaust fans at all.  If you overpressure a case, and filter your incoming air, then no dust bunnies around every single crack and air inlet of the case.  I hate dusting.  That being said, If you do run intake filters make sure the filters are easy to get to.


I am a retired Ford tech. Next to Fords, any computer is a piece of cake. (The cake, its not a lie)

3770K @4.5, Corsair H100, GTX780, 16gig Samsung, Obsidian 700 (yes there is a 700)


#4 ranchhand1

ranchhand1

  • Members
  • 76 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:06:46 PM

Posted 15 July 2013 - 04:01 PM

 I agree that many of those on Newegg are not techno-geeks. However, the fact remains that if, out of 20 reviews on a power supply five think it's really great, 5 say it's just ok, and 10 have had it fail within one year, that gives you a pretty good idea to pass on that brand. I wasn't suggesting that we learn how to build computers from the users' reviews, but you can get a good idea if there is a problem with that item you are considering. They have a 30 day return policy, and if you call the customer service number (do not RMA through online) they will waive the 15% restocking charge.

Also, couple of suggestions come to mind:

>Cooling:  I suggest considering a liquid cooling unit for a number of reasons. They are unsurpassed at keeping that CPU temp down, they are easy to install, they are now self-contained units, they cost no more that a good air unit, and they are extremely quiet-much more than most air cooled fans. I tried one on a build once (my current AMD quad core overclocked) and never went with air cooling again.

>Cases: make sure that you do not order a small form factor case by mistake; those are smaller cases that use mini motherboards.

>Motherboard: try to find out how many SATA data ports there are on the board; absolute minimum is six, more if possible. You think you will never use that many, but you will be surprised. All six of mine are used and I wish I had more. I have two DVD drives, one Windows 7 drive, one Windows 8 drive, one Windows XP drive and my system backup drive. I suggest three good brands: Asus, Asrock and Gigabite. Avoid Foxconn boards like bubonic plague.

>Power supply: try to make sure that there are as many SATA power connectors as there are ports on the motherboard, for obvious reasons. This sometimes is not easy, manufacturers are lax about spec'ing all the info on their boards.


Edited by ranchhand1, 16 July 2013 - 04:38 AM.


#5 The ancient one

The ancient one
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 4 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:08:46 PM

Posted 16 July 2013 - 01:48 PM

Thanks for all the good info.

When it come to paying attention to reviews, I use similar logic that you use and not just computer stuff, but for hotels and restaurants.  I also read reviews from what I think are reputable computer people or websites.  Also, thanks for the heads-up on doing an RMA via phone as opposed to doing it online.

As far as your comments concerning cooling, I guess I will have to take a second look at water cooling.  My reluctance comes from not ever having tried to do that but from what you imply that is not really a big deal.  I have not been a fan freak.  My current computer is 10 years old and only has one fan  (excluding the CPU and PSU fans) and that is an intake fan in the front. I am a believer in the inside pressure being greater than the outside pressure which helps blow the dust out. Only once in all this time did my computer send me a message that it was getting too hot and that was do to the ambient temperature in the computer room was somewhere in the 90’s.  Most of what I have been using my computer for does not require it to work very hard, but that is about to change with the new computer that I am building because I will be using Pinnacle Studio software to do video editing and Adobe CS for other photo projects.  And hopefully putting things from Adobe into my video editing along with music and voice over.  I do not plan on doing any gaming.

As far as cases are concerned, I am looking at full size towers only, because I need the space.  Like you I want to have as many SATA ports as I can get , 8 or 9 at least and at least 5 or more PCIe

At the present moment I am giving consideration to the Corsair HX Series HX850W ATX12V 2.3 / EPS12V 2.91 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS GOLD Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply New 4th Gen CPU Certified Haswell Ready.  One thing I have noticed about this PSU is that it is longer than the average by about 2 inches and I will need to be sure that it will not interfere with anything on the motherboard.  It is not easy to tell by looking at the photos of the various cases just how much room there is for the PSU.



#6 ranchhand1

ranchhand1

  • Members
  • 76 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:06:46 PM

Posted 16 July 2013 - 04:44 PM

I will be using Pinnacle Studio\

Glad to help. I have been a Studio Pinnacle user since vs. 10 which was a buggy program. The latest version is quite stable and I have done a lot of work in both. I suggest a powerful processor and at least 8 gigs of RAM. If you are going to create & edit Blue Ray or AVCHD, you will need a serious video card. My Evga has CUDA and makes a huge difference in rendering and playback. Don't even think of using integrated graphics on your motherboard, you will be in for a frustrating experience (I speak from experience :lol: ).  You will also see a big performance boost in Photoshop, I am running CS also.



#7 DJBPace07

DJBPace07

  • BC Advisor
  • 4,869 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:08:46 PM

Posted 17 July 2013 - 07:46 AM

A few things

 

CUDA is proprietary to Nvidia.  AMD does the same thing with OpenCL.  Nvidia also uses the term "CUDA Core" which is the same thing as AMD's Stream Processors.  Comparing the number of CUDA Cores to Stream Processors won't give a good comparison to performance as there are architecture differences.

 

Use caution with DIY liquid cooling, if it messes up, there is no recourse to getting your PC replaced.  An air cooler is good enough for most users and an aftermarket cooler can be pretty quiet.  If you do decide to go liquid, use a closed loop system.  I use an air cooler on an FX-8150 and it does quite well.

 

If you aren't really gaming, a gigantic full ATX tower is not needed unless you want the extra drive bays or increased fans.  Aftermarket fans are usually better and keeping noise down.

 

What exactly are you going to be using this PC for?


3939.png

 


#8 ranchhand1

ranchhand1

  • Members
  • 76 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:06:46 PM

Posted 17 July 2013 - 10:26 PM

Use caution with DIY liquid cooling, if it messes up, there is no recourse

If you do decide to go liquid, use a closed loop system

DJB... read my post carefully.


Edited by ranchhand1, 17 July 2013 - 10:28 PM.


#9 slgrieb

slgrieb

  • Members
  • 270 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Texas Panhandle
  • Local time:06:46 PM

Posted 17 July 2013 - 10:28 PM

Geez, Ancient One, could you just throw out a few more topics in a single post? :mellow: To cut to the chase I think Antec 300 2 and 1100 cases are about the best buys right now. Both offer good cable management, and excellent stock cooling. The Antec 1100 in particular cools better than more expensive cases from Silverstone, et. al. with only the two stock exhaust fans installed. Both have decent tools-free features. I live in the Texas Panhandle, so I really, really like filtered intakes. On the side panels, you will have to kinda cobble a filtration system together, but that's easy. Of course, depending on where you live that may not be a huge issue.

 

My experience is that all the extra fans you can mount (especially intake fans) don't really make a big difference in overall cooling performance. As long as you remove the hot air efficiently, life is good. Whether your power supply has long enough leads to reach to all your devices often depends on the power supply. Cheap PSUs cut corners on connectors just like they do construction quality. Seasonic, Corsair, Enermax, OCZ are all good. With a bottom mounted PSU, a bit of extra length shouldn't be an issue.

 

Liquid cooling is pointless for most users. Stock coolers these days are very good, and most of them will even support moderate overclocking without any issues, as long as you have a case with decent cooling. Self-contained liquid cooling systems cost more than good air coolers, tend to perform no better, and may be even noisier. Pointless for most users.


Yes, Mr. Death... I'll play you a game! But not CHESS !!! BAH... FOOEY! My game is... 
WIFFLEBALL!

 


#10 DJBPace07

DJBPace07

  • BC Advisor
  • 4,869 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:08:46 PM

Posted 18 July 2013 - 06:32 AM

 

Use caution with DIY liquid cooling, if it messes up, there is no recourse

If you do decide to go liquid, use a closed loop system

DJB... read my post carefully.

 

I did, what I am saying is be careful with it.  We could throw caution to the wind and go for Peltier cooling, those are great for keeping the CPU cool, but they do put out significant heat.


Edited by DJBPace07, 18 July 2013 - 06:34 AM.

3939.png

 


#11 The ancient one

The ancient one
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 4 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:08:46 PM

Posted 18 July 2013 - 06:34 PM

Thanks to everyone for the input.  I really appreciate the time all of you have taken to help me.  Though I have not made a final decision on which case I will purchase, I have narrowed it down from over 100 to just a handful.  I have been spending my time since my first post in looking further along in the process of building this computer and have pretty much come up with the PSU, the MOBO,and the CPU.  Of course this is just a start.  This is my list of categories that I need to address before I am finished with this project: 01. General info on building a comp 02,. Case or Tower, 03. Motherboard, 04.CPU 05,. Heatsink, 06. Fans, 07. PSU, 08. Hard Drives, 09. CD Playe,r 10. CD-DVD Burner, 11. Blue Ray, 12. Graphic or video Card, 13. Network or ethernet card, 14. Sound Card, 15. PCIe usb card, 16. PCI Wireless Adapter Card, 17. OS

Obviously, I will be back with more questions.

 

 



#12 slgrieb

slgrieb

  • Members
  • 270 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Texas Panhandle
  • Local time:06:46 PM

Posted 18 July 2013 - 07:09 PM

 

 

Use caution with DIY liquid cooling, if it messes up, there is no recourse

If you do decide to go liquid, use a closed loop system

DJB... read my post carefully.

 

I did, what I am saying is be careful with it.  We could throw caution to the wind and go for Peltier cooling, those are great for keeping the CPU cool, but they do put out significant heat.

 

Of course, we could pull out all the stops and go with refrigerated cooling systems, or even liquid nitrogen. But you're absolutely correct that most folks don't need a $1000+ cooling system for their PC. In fact, one of the more common mistakes for first time builders is to buy way more expensive hardware than they need for their intended usage. If you have money to burn, that's one thing, but you can really build a system with better than OEM hardware without selling your firstborn. Essentially, I think new builders tend to underestimate the quality of a lot of stock hardware in relation to their requirements.


Yes, Mr. Death... I'll play you a game! But not CHESS !!! BAH... FOOEY! My game is... 
WIFFLEBALL!

 





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users