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Need Help With Sizing Images In Paint And/or Infanview


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#1 Luvkitty

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Posted 08 April 2006 - 04:36 AM

Hello! This is my very first time posting here, and I'm really hoping someone can help me to figure out a few things regarding images that I've scanned. I'm VERY new to scanning and am still learning how that works, and I've NEVER used MS Paint or any other photo editing software before so I need the explanations to be done in very simple terms. So here's what's going on and what I need help with.

I have Windows XP, and my scanner is a Microtek ScanMaker 4800. I'm trying to scan homemade greeting cards to submit to magazines for publishing. They have very strict requirements regarding the file size, and that's what I'm having the most trouble with. Files must be .jpg only and no larger than 100kb. The suggested pixel size is 500X500. I've heard two different views on how to go about doing this, and I don't know which one is best.

The first view was to set up these requirements at the time I scan the card. The other view was to scan at a much better and/or bigger size, resolution, and pixels, etc. and then to edit it in Paint (which I have) or Photoshop (which I don't have). Which way is the best way and easiest way to do this?

Another question I have is regarding the size that I'm entering in for my scanner to scan at vs. the size I see when I open "My Pictures" folder and hold my cursor over the thumbnail image. They are two different sizes. Below is an example of what I see when I hold the cursor over the thumbnail image in "My Pictures."

Dimensions: 582 X 810
Type: GIMP image
Size: 4.75 KB

When I actually SCANNED this image, I put in the following information:

This is in Pixels...

100% Resolution
582 Width
810 Height
26% Scaling
Which gave me the following:
151 Output
211 Output
94 KB

So, what is the ACCURATE size? Is it 4.75 KB or 94 KB? Why are they different?

Another problem is that this image is so small that it's difficult to even see it and what I can see is not very good quality. How can I get a good image for on-the-web viewing using the dimensions and size restrictions given by the magazine? When they are saying that 500 X 500 is a good pixel size, are they referring to the Output number or the Width and Height numbers that I'm entering?

So, as you can see, I'm in a bit of a bind, and I have no real clue what I'm doing. LOL! I've spent night after night after night reading online tutorials, reading the help info. from my scanner, from MS Paint, from GIMP, and I've spent a ton of time just playing around. I would REALLY appreciate any help and/or guidance you can give me. Thanks so much!!!

Michele



* Mod Edit: This will be moved to a more appropriate Forum.

Edited by Scarlett, 11 April 2006 - 07:00 AM.


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#2 jgweed

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Posted 08 April 2006 - 07:38 AM

There are several BC Miniguides that might help you resize your media for both Paint and Irfanview:
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/f/99/images-image-editing-image-viewing-mini-guides/

Regards,
John
Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one should be silent.

#3 medab1

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Posted 08 April 2006 - 08:47 AM

It depends on what you scan & the aspect ratio.
If 500x500 is the limit,in width & height,you can scan at 100%.
100% scans the image at actual size.

I save as a .bmp first if I am worried about final quality.
When resizing you should retain aspect ratio.
That is,keep the width & height in proportion mathematically.
If the width & height aren't the same to start with,making them the same will make the image look odd.

In Irfanview you have the option to resize width & height & keep the aspect ratio.

Posted Image

When you go to save an image as .jpg you get a window with quality options.
I usually choose best.
Then open it with Paint & save it with the same name because Paint usually reduces file size with good quality.
That is something you will need to experiment with.
You should have no trouble keeping a 500x500 .jpg under 100KBs.

Learn to take screenshots & add them to your posts. :thumbup2:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/43088/how-to-capture-and-edit-a-screen-shot/#entry4532851

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#4 snyper

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Posted 08 April 2006 - 09:21 AM

Hi luvkitty

I work with paint all the time...its very simple to use but a bit limited, i mainly use it for simple editing like this....Posted Image




to this.....

Posted Image



Now these images are pretty lagse but there are simple programmes that will compress them, or what i do is i use MS Publisher which will compress them for you...i hope it is clear but if not just holler!

Snyper. :thumbsup:

#5 Luvkitty

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Posted 09 April 2006 - 06:15 PM

First I wanted to thank you for your help. I really appreciate it!

My question to Medab1, or anyone else who can respond to this question regarding their previous post above, is...

What happens if the original image is larger than the 500X500?

What would the steps be in that case? For example, I'm scanning something that's about 7 1/2 in. in height and about 5 1/2 inches in width. When I scan that item with those numbers in the width and height place with pixels as the measurement and a 100% resolution and 100% scaling, I get a size that's HUGE...something like over 1000KB. So, I'm not sure how to do that.

I hope it's not too much trouble to ask for a little more guidance with this. I'm just so new to scanning and haven't been able to figure out exactly the process and procedures, despite reading a bunch of online tutorials. Thanks again for your help!! Have a great day!!

Michele

#6 medab1

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Posted 09 April 2006 - 06:59 PM

First I wanted to thank you for your help. I really appreciate it!

My question to Medab1, or anyone else who can respond to this question regarding their previous post above, is...

What happens if the original image is larger than the 500X500?

What would the steps be in that case? For example, I'm scanning something that's about 7 1/2 in. in height and about 5 1/2 inches in width. When I scan that item with those numbers in the width and height place with pixels as the measurement and a 100% resolution and 100% scaling, I get a size that's HUGE...something like over 1000KB. So, I'm not sure how to do that.

I hope it's not too much trouble to ask for a little more guidance with this. I'm just so new to scanning and haven't been able to figure out exactly the process and procedures, despite reading a bunch of online tutorials. Thanks again for your help!! Have a great day!!

Michele



If the width is bigger than 500 change it to 500.
If the height is bigger than 500 change it to 500.

Look at the screen shot I posted.

Learn to take screenshots & add them to your posts. :thumbup2:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/43088/how-to-capture-and-edit-a-screen-shot/#entry4532851

Learn to use Google Search.  :busy:

Make full system images to restore to if your computer goes bonkers.


#7 snyper

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Posted 10 April 2006 - 05:29 AM

or download a compression tool...i'll google 1 for you and post it tomorro..

#8 medab1

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Posted 10 April 2006 - 06:17 AM

Posted Image

I have a scanner & digital camera.
Some pictures can start out 3 MBs or larger.
When I change them they end up 100 KBs on average.
This is for images usually 800x600 finished.
I could further reduce file size if I wanted to.
I could open one in Irfanview & Save As a .jpg & move the slider towards lowest AGAIN to say 50% & the file size would be cut in half.
The more you reduce it the more loss of quality usually.
The number of colors counts too.
6 million colors makes a bigger file size.
256 colors helps reduce file size.

Play with it a while.
It takes time & experience to get things working right.

Learn to take screenshots & add them to your posts. :thumbup2:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/43088/how-to-capture-and-edit-a-screen-shot/#entry4532851

Learn to use Google Search.  :busy:

Make full system images to restore to if your computer goes bonkers.


#9 Luvkitty

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Posted 11 April 2006 - 12:35 AM

I think I figured out what I was doing wrong. Should I just scan my image at the size it is in real life, and THEN open Infarview to reduce it to the size I need it to be?

Another question I have that I'm hoping you can help me with is that I'm getting different sizes listed for the SAME images, and I don't know which one is the correct size.

When I scanned the original image with a Microtek ImageMaker 4800, I was given the following information:

Dimensions are 700 X 525 and Size is 1,077 KB

I then used Infranview to resize the image twice. Listed below is the information for the original image and the two resized versions:

Image #1:
700 X 525 X 24 BPP 6/8 100% 60.33 KB / 1.05 MB

Image #2:
500 X 375 X 24 BPP 8/8 100% 32.87 KB / 549.36 KB


Image #3:
250 X 188 X 24 BPP 7/8 100% 9.61 KB / 138.10 KB

I have Windows XP, and when I open "My Pictures" and hold the cursor over the thumbnail images, I get the following information for the same three images:

1. Dimensions are 700 X 525 and Size is 60.3 KB
2. Dimensions are 500 X 375 and Size is 32.8 KB
3. Dimensions are 250 X 188 and Size is 9.61 KB


I don't know which information is correct. Can anyone clear this up for me? Thanks again for the help! It's much appreciated! Have a wonderful day!!

Michele

#10 medab1

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Posted 11 April 2006 - 07:46 AM

I think I figured out what I was doing wrong. Should I just scan my image at the size it is in real life, and THEN open Infarview to reduce it to the size I need it to be?

Another question I have that I'm hoping you can help me with is that I'm getting different sizes listed for the SAME images, and I don't know which one is the correct size.

When I scanned the original image with a Microtek ImageMaker 4800, I was given the following information:

Dimensions are 700 X 525 and Size is 1,077 KB

I then used Infranview to resize the image twice. Listed below is the information for the original image and the two resized versions:

Image #1:
700 X 525 X 24 BPP 6/8 100% 60.33 KB / 1.05 MB

Image #2:
500 X 375 X 24 BPP 8/8 100% 32.87 KB / 549.36 KB


Image #3:
250 X 188 X 24 BPP 7/8 100% 9.61 KB / 138.10 KB

I have Windows XP, and when I open "My Pictures" and hold the cursor over the thumbnail images, I get the following information for the same three images:

1. Dimensions are 700 X 525 and Size is 60.3 KB
2. Dimensions are 500 X 375 and Size is 32.8 KB
3. Dimensions are 250 X 188 and Size is 9.61 KB


I don't know which information is correct. Can anyone clear this up for me? Thanks again for the help! It's much appreciated! Have a wonderful day!!

Michele



You could probably scan it at the size you need.
It depends on how good the scanner is.
Try it both ways & see which result is better.
The hardest part is getting your technique fine tuned.

The ones in My Pictures are correct.
The 2 numbers in Irfanview are disk size & current memory size.
Open one in Irfanview & click on image information--

See image information in Irfanview

Next Picture

I assume the current memory size relates to the amount of memory being used to open it in Irfanview.
I could be wrong about that...

To help save image quality it might help to work with a bmp first & when you have the width & height reduced & the smaller image saved as a bmp,then convert the bmp to a jpg.

Maybe someone here has better & more knowledgeable advice.
I don't do fancy image editing.
I make screen shots with added text & arrows & boxes added.

If they ever get image compression using fractal geometry working right,one will be able to reduce images without much loss of quality.
Maybe there is a program available already.
One might Google it to see if there is.

Learn to take screenshots & add them to your posts. :thumbup2:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/43088/how-to-capture-and-edit-a-screen-shot/#entry4532851

Learn to use Google Search.  :busy:

Make full system images to restore to if your computer goes bonkers.


#11 Luvkitty

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Posted 11 April 2006 - 02:26 PM

I don't know if this is important to my problem here or not, but I thought I'd mention it just in case. The image that I'm scanning is a greeting card that I made, and the image is not going to be printed out. This is for onscreen viewing only. Like I said, I don't know if that makes a difference in how one would respond to my questions or not but thought I should mention it.

The previous poster here said that I "could probably scan my image at the size I need," but when I try to scan it at the size I need vs. the actual size of the image in real life, it only scans a portion of my image. The image in real life is 7 X 5.25 in. and I need the dimensions to be 500 X 500 pixels and 100 KB in size. When I put in the dimensions that I need my card to be (500 X 500 pixels and 100 KB in size), it will only scan a portion of the greeting card....like possibly the top right corner, or something like that. So, I don't get how I can put in the dimensions and size I need to end up with at the time I'm scanning the greeting card as the previous poster suggested........unless I'm just completely misunderstanding the advice.

I'm going to try looking at the images using the technique suggested, and I'll post what my results are. Thanks again for your help!

Michele

#12 handplane

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Posted 11 April 2006 - 06:24 PM

Have you seen this TUTORIAL for Irfanview?

#13 medab1

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Posted 11 April 2006 - 07:43 PM

See picture--

Scanner Preview picture

It's crooked.
But That's ok.

See next picture--

Resizing with scanner photo editor picture

Zooming & saving pictures next--

zooming picture

saving

Saved picture--
It went from 22 MBs to 112 KBs without any intentional file size reduction---

Posted Image

Hope this helps...

Learn to take screenshots & add them to your posts. :thumbup2:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/43088/how-to-capture-and-edit-a-screen-shot/#entry4532851

Learn to use Google Search.  :busy:

Make full system images to restore to if your computer goes bonkers.


#14 Luvkitty

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Posted 12 April 2006 - 04:40 AM

Thank you for the excellent photos with the directions! That's really helped me to get a much better understanding about the process. I still have a few more questions, though.

1. In the second step, you mention that the original large scan was 22 MB, but in the picture that you have posted with that comment, it shows a different size. It shows 56982 KB. I think this is where a lot of my confusion is coming from.....the fact that different places say different sizes. Would you please explain to me the discrepancy between the 22 MB and 56982 KB?

2. I thought I knew the answer to this next question, but I'm not sure now. The last part of your message says, "It went from 22 MBs to 112 KBs without any intentional file size reduction---" You mention the word "reduction" here, so does that mean that KB is a smaller unit size than MB? I thought it was the other way around, but now I'm not sure.

3. Is the "Zoom" that you set at 100% after doing the preview the same thing as the Resolution? Does the Zoom affect the size of the image by creating a larger file?

4. How did you decide to set your resolution at 300? I have mine set at 100% to start with, and then I thought that after the preview and after changing my dimensions to the size I needed that I was supposed to reduce the resolution until the image size that it shows on that same screen right below the resolution got to 100KB or less. I was having to go all the way down to 29% though!!! That doesn't seem right. I'm trying to figure out how you scanned a much larger image than I am (mine starts at approx. 5 X 7) yet you were able to get a much lower image size of 22 MB even though the screen said 56982 KB. Also, when I set the new dimensions, I chose the larger one to change to 500 pixels and checked to keep proportions as you showed me how to do in your images, but when the new image showed on the screen, it cut off part of my picture.....even though I had used the drag arrow to make it all fit before scanning. Why?

5. I read the tutorial again, and it doesn't really explain the difference between just choosing "Scan to" or "OCR". I don't know what OCR stands for, and the tutorial doesn't tell me either.

AND LAST QUESTION:

6. I noticed that you were able to to the image-editing with the program on your scanner. I don't see that option on my scanner, so does that mean that by following your steps, after I do the preview and after I change the dimension to the size I need, I would then hit the "Scan to" Button and from the drop-down menu choose to save it to one of the folders in "My Pictures" and send it to Irfanview to further reduce it? I noticed that you didn't have to go to any other place to get the size close to what I need. You state that you got 112 KB without any intentional reduction.

Well, I hope these questions make sense. I'm trying to explain my problems in a coherent way. I can't believe how much trouble I'm having with something that seems like it should be SO easy!!! LOL!! Thanks for your patience with my ignorance and for all your help!!! Take care!

Michele

#15 medab1

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Posted 12 April 2006 - 07:27 AM

Thank you for the excellent photos with the directions! That's really helped me to get a much better understanding about the process. I still have a few more questions, though.

1. In the second step, you mention that the original large scan was 22 MB, but in the picture that you have posted with that comment, it shows a different size. It shows 56982 KB. I think this is where a lot of my confusion is coming from.....the fact that different places say different sizes. Would you please explain to me the discrepancy between the 22 MB and 56982 KB?

2. I thought I knew the answer to this next question, but I'm not sure now. The last part of your message says, "It went from 22 MBs to 112 KBs without any intentional file size reduction---" You mention the word "reduction" here, so does that mean that KB is a smaller unit size than MB? I thought it was the other way around, but now I'm not sure.

3. Is the "Zoom" that you set at 100% after doing the preview the same thing as the Resolution? Does the Zoom affect the size of the image by creating a larger file?

4. How did you decide to set your resolution at 300? I have mine set at 100% to start with, and then I thought that after the preview and after changing my dimensions to the size I needed that I was supposed to reduce the resolution until the image size that it shows on that same screen right below the resolution got to 100KB or less. I was having to go all the way down to 29% though!!! That doesn't seem right. I'm trying to figure out how you scanned a much larger image than I am (mine starts at approx. 5 X 7) yet you were able to get a much lower image size of 22 MB even though the screen said 56982 KB. Also, when I set the new dimensions, I chose the larger one to change to 500 pixels and checked to keep proportions as you showed me how to do in your images, but when the new image showed on the screen, it cut off part of my picture.....even though I had used the drag arrow to make it all fit before scanning. Why?

5. I read the tutorial again, and it doesn't really explain the difference between just choosing "Scan to" or "OCR". I don't know what OCR stands for, and the tutorial doesn't tell me either.

AND LAST QUESTION:

6. I noticed that you were able to to the image-editing with the program on your scanner. I don't see that option on my scanner, so does that mean that by following your steps, after I do the preview and after I change the dimension to the size I need, I would then hit the "Scan to" Button and from the drop-down menu choose to save it to one of the folders in "My Pictures" and send it to Irfanview to further reduce it? I noticed that you didn't have to go to any other place to get the size close to what I need. You state that you got 112 KB without any intentional reduction.

Well, I hope these questions make sense. I'm trying to explain my problems in a coherent way. I can't believe how much trouble I'm having with something that seems like it should be SO easy!!! LOL!! Thanks for your patience with my ignorance and for all your help!!! Take care!

Michele



The image size was the size AFTER I changed the height to 500.
See it before it is changed HERE

MBs are bigger than KBs.
A thousand times bigger.
A thousand KBs=1 MB.
569.82 KBs NOT 56982 KBs.
Notice the dot after the 9.
When reading numbers make sure the decimal places are correct.

The zoom setting 100% just showed the smaller image full size.
An image that small will fit in the viewing area entirely.
The original big image was scaled to 27% or so, so it would fit in the viewing area.
After making the height 500,it was still scaled about 27%.
Hence the tiny image that I scaled up to 100%.
It does not affect saved image size to the best of my knowledge.
Zoom one 200% & save it & see if it does.

The resolution was set at 300 pixels/inch by default because I chose "magazine" from the scan options.
Other resolutions are available.


Your scanner software should have an image editor included.
They are usually set as the default program to send scanned images to.

See picture

OCR stands for Optical Character Recognition.
It reads the image text & transforms it into actual text characters.

On my scanner objects go on the plate to the left & bottom.
Yours may be different.
Sometimes if not placed correctly parts will be cut off.
Scanning good takes practice.

edit--

If your scanner has no photo editing program of its own,you could send it straight to My Documents or another image editing program like Irfanview ot Paint or whatever.

You Preview & drag lines & choose where to send it to.
Then you scan & save & change width & height.
Or scan & change width & height & save.
I hope that's not confusing...

Edited by medab1, 12 April 2006 - 07:49 AM.

Learn to take screenshots & add them to your posts. :thumbup2:

https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/43088/how-to-capture-and-edit-a-screen-shot/#entry4532851

Learn to use Google Search.  :busy:

Make full system images to restore to if your computer goes bonkers.





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