Jump to content


 


Register a free account to unlock additional features at BleepingComputer.com
Welcome to BleepingComputer, a free community where people like yourself come together to discuss and learn how to use their computers. Using the site is easy and fun. As a guest, you can browse and view the various discussions in the forums, but can not create a new topic or reply to an existing one unless you are logged in. Other benefits of registering an account are subscribing to topics and forums, creating a blog, and having no ads shown anywhere on the site.


Click here to Register a free account now! or read our Welcome Guide to learn how to use this site.

Photo

Booting problems with XP / SP3


  • Please log in to reply
23 replies to this topic

#1 NdotA

NdotA

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 28 June 2012 - 11:43 AM

Hello everybody,

after successfully recovering from a malware infection with help of Bleeping Gringo of your malware fighting team, I would like to adress the next issue, that troubles me for some time.

I learned to live with the situation, for I could not find any expert help on the Internet or in literature. I learned about this site only recently when looking for assistance in this malware issue and decided to give it a new start.

How it started:
For all I know the problem started with a substantial update that Windows performed automatically to end of 2011. (Sorry, I cannot give an exact date to retrace which update it was). I did not install any new software or hardware for some time then, so it either came while surfing the internet (Norton 360 updated and active) or by way of this update.

What happens:
This is a little hard to explain for I am using the German version of Windows and so I do not know the English names of the screens that pop up nor do I know the English equivalents of the textmessages. To identify the screens I am talking of I named them for easy reference here and added a kind of glossary at the end of this chapter to identify which screens I mean.

Startup after long shutdown (over night):
After clicking the start-button on my PC the resources screen shows up for a very short period of time (less than one second) and seems to be somewhat incomplete. Then I see a black screen for some time and then the XP-screen shows for a few seconds. After some time again the startup screen flashes (less than 1 sec), the screen returns to black and stays this way for times on end. This is accompanied by substantial hard drive activity which dies down after a minute or so to an occasional io-action (every 1 sec or so), may be a defrag or a scan going on, I have no means to know. Or, on other occasions, the computer seems to do nothing at all. My screen does not show its 'no input signal' - message or goes into standby, so I think that there is a signal and that my PC is still alive and did not just quit.

If now I wait for say 40 minutes or more and then press the resetbutton, the PC restarts with the sequence of events that I am used to on booting: system resources screen, XP-screen, startup screen, log in screen all seperated by more or less longish periods of black screen, just the login screen pops up immediately after the startupscreen. I can log in and everything is fine.

If I interfere earlier than these 40 minutes (not exact, its an estimate), then the events happen without a fixed sequence or pattern that I could recognise. Resources screen flashes up, followed by XP-screen or start failed screen or nothing or black screen with occasional changeing the grade of blackness. In the end I once again have that black screen with the PC doing apparently nothing. Pressing f8-key after the resources screen does not give any reaction at all. The only thing I can do is to interrupt the sequence by again pressing my PC's reset button just to start this sequence again.

I am on the winning tack when the XP screen shows for a longer time (longer than about 5 seconds) or the startup failed screen shows up and remains open. This happens occasionally after a few reset-starts. I could not establish any rule of how and when I should press reset to make either of these things happen. It remains to be a lottery like random hit or miss thing. Once I am in the startup screen, I can select Windows to start normally which it does and then I reach the login screen eventually and I am ready to go. Once my system started there is no more malfunction and it is working perfectly.

Restart behaviour:
Once my system has started successfully, it has no problem at all to do reboots when necessary. It behaves as if nothing ever was amiss. I did not establish how long a standstill could last for easy reboot. This 'memory period' is shorter than 3 hours and longer than five minutes.

Screen names I used in the above:
'Resources screen': this is the one to first show up when you start your computer giving the devices and drivers
'Start failed screen': This screen informs the user that the windows start failed and offers selection of diverse startup modes, will start booting automatically after 30 seconds (countdown) when no input occurs
'XP-screen': Screen with Windows XP-logo
'startup screen' : screen saying that Windows is being started
'log in screen' : to select username and input password if defined.

What I did to get rid of this:
- I disabled my virus protection just to see if this performs a scan during startups (Norton 360 is scanning things all the time) but no change
- I set my Wlan-manager to manual start, just to make sure that there is no internet connection during startup
- I cleared all entries form autostart - no effect
- check of system files ('sfc /scannow') - no results
- ran Norton Power Eraser without effect
- learned to live with this.

What I did not do:
- I did not want to reinstall my bios - version is still up to date - I read on the internet that this can go perfectly wrong and mess up things completely.
- I did not reinstall my OS because I hate the idea of reinstalling all my software.
- I could not restore my system to an earlier date for I had the automatic setting of system recovery points disabled at the time of infection.

As I said, I learned to live with this. Having my office at home I set up the routine to start my PC first thing I come down in the morning, then perform my morning rites and have breakfeast while my PC does its startup rites and when I come to my office I can restart by clicking reset and all is fine.

But still, I would be happy to return to normal again.

Norbert

p.s. Sorry, this got rather longish, but I gave all the details that I have observed on what is going on.

Edited by hamluis, 28 June 2012 - 03:46 PM.
Moved from XP to Internal Hardware - Hamluis.


BC AdBot (Login to Remove)

 


#2 hamluis

hamluis

    Moderator


  • Moderator
  • 56,435 posts
  • ONLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Killeen, TX
  • Local time:06:35 AM

Posted 28 June 2012 - 12:22 PM

Please try the following: Publish a Snapshot using Speccy - http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/topic323892.html/page__p__1797792#entry1797792

Louis

#3 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 28 June 2012 - 01:04 PM

http://speccy.piriform.com/results/JlNRozHjYguQIwIDdeAO4sK


Oops, your advice does not leave room for politeness ;-)

I want to thank you for your very fast reaction.

Norbert

Edited by NdotA, 28 June 2012 - 01:14 PM.


#4 hamluis

hamluis

    Moderator


  • Moderator
  • 56,435 posts
  • ONLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Killeen, TX
  • Local time:06:35 AM

Posted 28 June 2012 - 03:46 PM

Appears that your CPU is overheating, per the data reported by Speccy.

http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Core_2/Intel-Core%202%20Quad%20Q6600%20HH80562PH0568M%20(BX80562Q6600).html

http://communities.intel.com/thread/22322?start=0&tstart=0

IMO, that could explain any number of perceived system problems and/or result in damaged components.

I'll move this to Internal Hardware where something better than my novice opinions can be rendered :).

Louis

#5 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 29 June 2012 - 02:13 AM

Thanks for that. I will of course follow on this to resolve the overheating problem.

Buuuut, would this be a cause for my startup problems that occur whenb the PC is cold ??

Norbert

#6 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 29 June 2012 - 02:22 AM

Louis
The first link you gave me is no longer valid. This page does not exist any more.

I did not know that I have a temperature issue. So I checked my PC. Although I hear a fan running, there is no draft of air coming out of my PC and the grids look pretty clean. I'd say the cooloing fan is not running. How to solve this ?

Norbert

#7 hamluis

hamluis

    Moderator


  • Moderator
  • 56,435 posts
  • ONLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Killeen, TX
  • Local time:06:35 AM

Posted 29 June 2012 - 01:16 PM

Let's await some comments from those know much more about hardware than I do.

Is this a laptop or a desktop?

Louis

#8 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 30 June 2012 - 09:00 AM

Okay, that.

It is a tower type standing below my desk.

Norbert

#9 rotor123

rotor123

  • Moderator
  • 8,094 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Jersey
  • Local time:07:35 AM

Posted 05 July 2012 - 10:30 AM

Hi, Louis has asked me to take a look at this problem.

Since I suspect a hardware problem and it is a desktop which makes it easier in some ways lets make sure.

What brand of computer is it or is it a no name clone. Make and model if a brand name.
If you have the XP CD disk can you try booting from it. This may require going into the Bios to change.
The other way would be go into the bios and see if the screen stays on displaying the bios page. We just want to see if it boots and the screen stays on displaying the XP setup. Do not do any repairs or installs.

If you can't find your XP disk,

Introduction
Automated Recovery CD Creator (ARCDC) is a tool designed to create your own Recovery Console CD using the Microsoft Bootdisks, a toolkit and a lot of glue! Normally the process is to download a Microsoft Bootdisk, extract it to a folder, extract some files, create the boot loader and lastly add some extra files. Now to make Tech Life easier, ARCDC does this whole process for you!

http://artellos.com/arcdc-page

This is not an XP install disk, however it is handy to have to do repairs in case the computer does not boot.

Turn On and When the Logo appears for all the makes below
Dell, Lenovo, or Toshiba computers F12 for the boot device manager
ASUS motherboards F8 for the boot device manager
HP Press the ESC key for the boot device manager

This is to be sure software isn't causing it.

IF no success this way and you fell comfortable opening the computer, as an alternative you could remove the data cable from the hard drive/ It will be either a wide ribbon type for IDE or the smaller cable for SATA drives and see if the screen stays on.

Also I would like to see a sharp picture of the interior of the computer showing the motherboard. You can post it on an external site. This one should work. Or attach it here, Your choice.
http://imageshack.us/

If it turns out to be software then we move on to that. But we need to be sure the hardware is sound first.

Roger

Fortune Cookie says: Fortune not Found: Abort, Retry, Ignore?

Sent from my All-In-One Desktop. Perfect for Internet, Not for heavy usage or gaming however.

How Does a computer get Infected? http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/2520/how-did-i-get-infected/
Forum Rules,    The BC Welcome Guide

167 @ June 2015


#10 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 05 July 2012 - 11:49 AM

Hi Roger, nice to meet you.

Answers:

My PC was buildt in our local computershop - which unfortunately went out of business last year and the guy vanished.
Yes, I have my XP-disc ready and I will give it a try.

I come back when I have completed on your requests.

Thanks for your support

Norbert

#11 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 05 July 2012 - 02:07 PM

Hello Roger,

No success. I put in my XP disc to see if my system boots. As I never had such a screen with a manufacturer's logo coming up, I pressed F8, F12 and ESC on the three consequtive tries to boot. My system seems not impressed at all by either of these actions. The screen just goes through the different stages as given in my first post.

What I would need is detailed instructions on how to work on the cable of the hard drive:

Remove the cable and then try to boot ? Or boot and then remove the cable ???

Image of the interior of my PC to follow.

Norbert

#12 rotor123

rotor123

  • Moderator
  • 8,094 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Jersey
  • Local time:07:35 AM

Posted 05 July 2012 - 02:11 PM

Lets see the image first before going further.

Did the system also come with a drivers disk and motherboard manual?

Roger

Fortune Cookie says: Fortune not Found: Abort, Retry, Ignore?

Sent from my All-In-One Desktop. Perfect for Internet, Not for heavy usage or gaming however.

How Does a computer get Infected? http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/2520/how-did-i-get-infected/
Forum Rules,    The BC Welcome Guide

167 @ June 2015


#13 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 05 July 2012 - 03:35 PM

Here are images that show the interior of my PC:

Overall arrangement:

Posted Image

Top section of motherboard (above graphic card)

Posted Image

Bottom left:

Posted Image

Bottom right:

Posted Image

If you require more detailed images, please let me know, though i am not much of a photographer [blush]

I have the printed manuals here but the drivers CD seems not to be with me any more. However, I have a second PC available to download anything from the manufacturer's site.

Observation:
Blades of cooling fan are very clean. This thing never ran. Aparently only the fans of motherboard and graphiccard have been running, cooling to the exterior was by the air that found its way outside. The fan allways sohowed a blueish illumination when power was on, but did not run. Strange ...

Norbert

#14 rotor123

rotor123

  • Moderator
  • 8,094 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Jersey
  • Local time:07:35 AM

Posted 05 July 2012 - 04:12 PM

The Pictures were fine and showed me what I wanted to see.
Do you see the little black plastic wrapped cans? Those are the electrolytic capacitors. Are the all flat on top, no bulging or leaking?

This seems to be the link for your motherboard.
http://www.msi.com/product/mb/P35-Neo.html

In the first picture the red cable going to the box on the bottom right is the data cable for the hard drive.
From the manual:

Entering Setup

Power on the computer and the system will start POST (Power On Self Test) process.
When the message below appears on the screen, press <DEL> key to enter Setup.
Press DEL to enter SETUP
If the message disappears before you respond and you still wish to enter Setup,
restart the system by turning it OFF and On or pressing the RESET button. You may
also restart the system by simultaneously pressing <Ctrl>, <Alt>, and <Delete> keys.


What I'd like to see is if the BIOS screen appears and stays on or not.

If it does in the BIOS setup go to the advanced bios features page.
Bottom of the list should be: boot sequence
This is where you would set your CD/DVD drive to be first boot device. Then see if it boots from the XP disk.

For Later on once it is booting.
As you probably noticed the CPU heatsink needs cleaning. I do that with a small fairly stiff bristled brush that go reach the metal through the blades of the fan and a can of compressed air blowing at the same time.

My guess is that the video card needs cleaning too. Looking at the picture that is looking up into the card it doesn't look that bad after all.

Roger

Edited by rotor123, 05 July 2012 - 06:18 PM.

Fortune Cookie says: Fortune not Found: Abort, Retry, Ignore?

Sent from my All-In-One Desktop. Perfect for Internet, Not for heavy usage or gaming however.

How Does a computer get Infected? http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/2520/how-did-i-get-infected/
Forum Rules,    The BC Welcome Guide

167 @ June 2015


#15 NdotA

NdotA
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 59 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:35 PM

Posted 06 July 2012 - 03:07 AM

Hi Roger,

no good news, I assume. After pressing DEL the BIOS screen shows for a very short time only, less than one second, and then I have a blank screen.

I made a note to clean up the interior once we are through with this issue here.

Best regards

Norbert




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users