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windows update not working


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#1 petegt5012

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 09:21 AM

I have a gateway GT5012 with dual core 2.8 Ghz, and 3GB RAM (2 old 512MB simms + 2 new 1GB simms).
Windows update just results in blank page.
Zonealarm and PC TUNE-UP will not install.
Double click on zonealarm download and it just exits. no errors or events that I can find.
Installed PC Tune_UP seemed to install, but did not ask for activation key, and when program selected just sits with a partially completed screen.

I originally posted to this forum http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/topic451906.html
Then was directed to Malware forum http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/topic452044.html

So have done many things FSS, DDS, Malwarebytes, Superantispyware, combofix, minitoolbox,aswMBR, and many others ,mostly from a malware perspective. Made sense to look for malware first.
All the logs etc are posted in those threads.

I do have a lot of registry entries pointing to files or directories that do not exist any longer according to "Tuneup RegistryCleaner", but I have no cleaned yet. was not sure if a better product was available, mine is old, but since SP3.

I currently have McAfee virusscan and antispyware version 8.7i running.
Malwarebytes (mbamservice) and Superantispyware(SASCore) have something running that shows up in task manager.

Over the years (since 2005) I have had spybot running (teatimer), mcafee (8.5) and zonealarm (various versions).
That would be my normal setup for protection. I do/did have SAS and spyware blaster both the freeones installed , but they have no real time proctection according to my panels.

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#2 hamluis

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 10:15 AM

Bleeping Computer DOES NOT recommend the use of registry cleaners/optimizers for several reasons:
  • Registry cleaners are extremely powerful applications that can damage the registry by using aggressive cleaning routines and cause your computer to become unbootable.

    The Windows registry is a central repository (database) for storing configuration data, user settings and machine-dependent settings, and options for the operating system. It contains information and settings for all hardware, software, users, and preferences. Whenever a user makes changes to settings, file associations, system policies, or installed software, the changes are reflected and stored in this repository. The registry is a crucial component because it is where Windows "remembers" all this information, how it works together, how Windows boots the system and what files it uses when it does. The registry is also a vulnerable subsystem, in that relatively small changes done incorrectly can render the system inoperable. For a more detailed explanation, read Understanding The Registry.
  • Not all registry cleaners are created equal. There are a number of them available but they do not all work entirely the same way. Each vendor uses different criteria as to what constitutes a "bad entry". One cleaner may find entries on your system that will not cause problems when removed, another may not find the same entries, and still another may want to remove entries required for a program to work.
  • Not all registry cleaners create a backup of the registry before making changes. If the changes prevent the system from booting up, then there is no backup available to restore it in order to regain functionality. A backup of the registry is essential BEFORE making any changes to the registry.
  • Improperly removing registry entries can hamper malware disinfection and make the removal process more difficult if your computer becomes infected. For example, removing malware related registry entries before the infection is properly identified can contribute to system instability and even make the malware undetectable to removal tools.
  • The usefulness of cleaning the registry is highly overrated and can be dangerous. In most cases, using a cleaner to remove obsolete, invalid, and erroneous entries does not affect system performance but it can result in "unpredictable results".

Unless you have a particular problem that requires a registry edit to correct it, I would suggest you leave the registry alone. Using registry cleaning tools unnecessarily or incorrectly could lead to disastrous effects on your operating system such as preventing it from ever starting again. For routine use, the benefits to your computer are negligible while the potential risks are great.
FWIW: I suggest uninstalling Spybot, since SAS is generally considered superior in what each purports to do. The above covers PC Tune-Up.

Since you practically eliminated malware...I would start looking at the current install.

First...I'd run the sfc /scannow command, to attempt to ensure that all system files are installed and not damaged.

How To Use Sfc.exe To Repair System Files - http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/topic43051.html

Then...I would run the chkdsk /r command on the Windows partition.

I also suggest that you Publish a Snapshot using Speccy - http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/topic323892.html/page__p__1797792#entry1797792 so that we might glean some info easily.

Louis

#3 petegt5012

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 11:47 AM

I was recommended to use REVO uninstaller to resolve 2 issues Java (old versions that would not uninstall or reinstall, and McAfee which would not install. Ir does a back up of the registry first, but does remove many reg entries, albeit all related to the product being uninstalled.
Over 7 years of installing and uninstalling and following various procedures from forums(perhaps maybe some of these should not have been followed, but they seemed to be extremely close to my issues of the past, and in many cases solved the issues).

Yes after I posted this I searched and found the SFC topic. I was instructed to run that but I ran into the same problem as some others. I have SP3 installed and I do not have XP disks.

I have an XP that i got from a friend who no longer uses XP that I used to create a bootable xp disk from, slipstreamed with SP3. (Beause I had a problem were I could not get windows to start. So I setup a XP version using UBCD4WIN, and ran some utilities but the booting back and forth was so time consuming, I broke down and installed that XP on a new drive i bought, and only use it if I can't boot into windows normally. I update my virus stuff and windows stuff twice a year on that disk.
So used that disk with SFC and it wanted cd2 which i did not have. so many things did not happen as I had to cancel many times.

So part of the post says I can copy the SP3 to my disk and point SFC to that instead of the cd drive and my XP pro disk. I have media centre on my machine.
So my question is when it asks for "disk 2" do i point it to the SP3 directory? Or does it still need XP with sp2 on a disk?
I will try the former first and see how far i get.

So if reg cleaners are not recommended, what about all those entries in the registry that point to nothing?
They have to get cleaned out at some point don't they?

Free SAS does not have a real time component, whereas spybot does, spybot also has some utilities to look at things. does it hurt to have both?

Edited by petegt5012, 13 May 2012 - 08:59 PM.


#4 petegt5012

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Posted 13 May 2012 - 04:32 PM

from speccy
http://speccy.piriform.com/results/dMTN8nHIlVZ0VEZdQPOqRmd


tried SFC again even after copying SP3 to my harddrive and specifying the directory that I386 was in it still wanted CD2 . so 9 files failed .
from event viewer these are the files: all in windows\ehome directory from the message:
ehcircl.dll
zh-chs\ehepgdat.resources.dll
de\ehepgdat.resources.dll
fr\ehepgdat.resources.dll
ja\ehepgdat.resources.dll
ko\ehepgdat.resources.dll
ehiepg.dll
ehituner.dll
snchk.exe

Just tried doing a serch for microsoft updates , clicked on link, now updaes are running (scanning for updates).
Never thought of doing that before, i was always using the items in the start menu.
the only difference i see between the 2 urls is that the one in the google search has a "?ln=en-us" ,inus the quotes
at the end.
Is it possible that the first SFC I ran a few days ago messed up my computer such that the shortcuts don't workany more due to a language issue. or lack of some language files. It seems as though the files that failed on SFC are language related.

No! Wait it gets to the site (microsoft update) but does nothing , just displays the message saying searching for updates.

I did notice that in IE -> tools -> advanced it says for Java Oracle
"Use JRE %s for <applet> (requires restart)

In manage add-ons i have these three under "sun microsystems", but i removed update 29 with Revo uninstaller. That was the only way to get update 32 to install. I just disabled update 29 and restarted IE. This is what I see now.

Name Java Plug-in 1.6.0_32
Publisher Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Status Enabled
File date May 5, 2012, 1:57 PM
Version 1.6.0.32

Name Java Plug-in 1.6.0_29
Publisher Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Status Disabled
File date May 5, 2012, 1:57 PM
Version 1.6.0.29


Name Java Plug-in 1.6.0_32
Publisher Sun Microsystems, Inc.
Status Enabled
File date May 5, 2012, 1:57 PM
Version 1.6.0.32


also under "control name is not available"

Name Java™ Plug-In SSV Helper
Publisher Control name is not available
Status Enabled
Load time 0.01 s

Edited by petegt5012, 13 May 2012 - 04:38 PM.


#5 petegt5012

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 09:39 PM

So does anybody have any ideas?

Windows update results in blank IE window (using shortcut on start menu).

Is there anything I can reinstall other than windows itself, as I don't have original install disks for media centre.
I only have a recovery partition that is only usable as a "format and reinstall" . That sounds like giving up.

#6 noknojon

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Posted 16 May 2012 - 09:48 PM

Hi Pete -
M/soft claim - This linked Fix it troubleshooter: "Automatically diagnose and fix common problems with Windows Update" may automatically fix your problem.
http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9767096 << Try this Fix it and then try to install any update. Select one only from your Updates page, and cancel the others.

Next try this Help / Support item and see if it helps >> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/310353

Worth a try as it worked for my updates -

EDIT - You might try the uodates with your Antivirus turned off just for now -

Edited by noknojon, 16 May 2012 - 09:50 PM.


#7 hamluis

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Posted 17 May 2012 - 07:19 AM

<<Zonealarm and PC TUNE-UP will not install.>>

If you are using the McAfee product for firewall protection...I don't understand why you tried to install ZA. The result would be a conflict, I imagine.

Max temp for your CPU is 64 Celsius...your Speccy indicates that you are rather close to the max (56 Celsius). That may be your problem with your system.

Louis

#8 petegt5012

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Posted 17 May 2012 - 05:25 PM

My PC has 2 fans one kicks in every once in a while, so I assume that it is temp driven. so just before that the temp may be higher. What should be a normal temp, I could monitor that and run speccy just as the second fan starts and then just as it stops. to see if it is ok. It is in the basement which is rather cool. I have to were long sleves if I am down there for long periods.

I don't think the mcafee has a firewall, at least no indication of a firewall from the settings anywhere.
Maybe I am missing something. Is there something I can display that would tell me?

My previous setup was zonealarm one of the version 9 point something, plus mcafee virusscan and antispyware, plus spybot. At least these were the only items that I think had any real time components. windows firewall was turned off.
I did have SAS installeda older version.
I tried to upgrade zonealarm due to a message from zonealarm (v9.2.057.000) that there was a new version from zonealarm (v10.1.101.000) my version was out of date.
after the download I tried to install ...result nothing happens, just the window that says do you want to run. so RUN! nothing happens.
Then I uninstall the current version and try again same thing.

Then I think maybe something is stopping me , so I uninstall mcafee. and try again . same error. try a whole bunch of things, no progress.

Think my harddrive is maybe an issue , look for tools to determine, seems ok.

As this is going on i get a java update try to install (i think update 29) , does not work, now 2 issues. cannot install or uninstall javav (see descrition in previous post.
TRy to instal a new version of mcafee, will not install.
Go to store to get new hard drive then, but decide to get more memory instead (cause I have been wanting to do this for a long time). also got some out of memory messages. Memory solved memory messages, as best I can tell.
Get speccy it says my hard drive is fine. so that is not issue,...maybe.
do some more searches. find threads that say malware can make it look like your hard drive has a problem.
Run memtest86 (2 time in last while ) again no issues).

Post topic under this forum get directed to malware forum do a whole bunch of things ( see links at top of this post).
Finally get Java working (update 32), I think. then try to install mcafee again, seems to work also.

I think now that Java is not good because updae 29 still shows up in IE ?????

Java console ( from control panel) will not start.
Zone alarm still will not install.

Oh ya when i bought the memory the salesperson said PC Tune-up would fix all kinds of things, and i would get $20 rebate.
Gee I got fooled on that one $20 rebate is after you subscribe to yearly auto renewal. Will not be doing that.
But I am still very concerned that I cannot install that product and get it to initialize itself. It just hangs, have to kill it via task manager.


So all I am trying to do is get back to the products that I was running originaly. I did not think that Mcafee had a firewall (V8.7i), maybe it does, but you have not controls???

So it is not that I want to run 2 firewalls, I kinda like zonealarm since I can see what has been blocked via the display access levels etc.

Is zone alarm better than any other , i don't know. I may uninstall it If I find out that mcafee has one, or turn off the mcafee one and use zonealarm. but I don't know how to turn off mcafee firewall if it has one.

Mcafee does go nuts during startup for what seems like 10 minutes, it used to be 20 minutes (perhaps the extra memory alleviated some of the pain 1Gb to 3GB), or maybe the new version is just more efficient. no way to really tell.

Some where since my first post windows update stopped working also. I think that is my most important issue right now.
But I think that some how they are all related.

One option I am thinking is reinstalling SP3, but I don't know if that is a good idea or not, any comments?

Note: zonealarm now comes with antispyware also. so maybe i need to turn off one of them. But I have alsso read that sometimes it is good to have more than one antispyware as one doesn't always catch all the new stuff.

I hesitate to uninstall mcafee untill ican get zonealarm installed, so that I have a least something protecting me in the mean time. I also have not started teatimer yet. and I know your position on that one also.

If someone can conclusively say mcafee and zonealarm and spybot will not install together then that answers part of my issues (although they were together before for 5 years at least), maybe the new versions are incompatible.
How is the average Joe suppose to know this?

This would then leave java and windows update. maybe they are related....

Edited by petegt5012, 17 May 2012 - 05:30 PM.


#9 noknojon

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Posted 17 May 2012 - 06:28 PM

Details on McAfee - From McAfee Enterprise
This lists a built in Firewall as part of the program -

Hope it helps -
EDIT - Link repaired -
>" But I have alsso read that sometimes it is good to have more than one antispyware as one doesn't always catch all the new stuff."<
A copy of Malwarebytes Antimalware Pro (paid version) is the only other item I would add to your McAfee -

Edited by noknojon, 17 May 2012 - 06:54 PM.


#10 hamluis

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Posted 18 May 2012 - 06:37 AM

<<What should be a normal temp,>>

The listed range for your CPU is 5 degrees Celsius to 64 degrees Celsius. Generally speaking...any reading in the last 10-15 degrees of the upper limit...would be a cause for concern by me. I'm not an IT person or a technician of any sort...but this system generally reflects a reading somewhere around 32 degrees Celsius.

Overheating can result in physical harm to various other components, as well as preventing Windows from functioning properly. For more knowledgeable advice concerning overheating and the possibility of such on your system...I suggest you initiate a topic in the Internal Hardware forum, http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/forum7.html, providing your Speccy link along with questions concerning possible effects on the system and the steps you should take.

Louis

#11 rotor123

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Posted 18 May 2012 - 02:42 PM

Just a point of information:

The only reason I can think of for SFC to ask for cd2 is if you are running XP MCE (Media Center Edition) That came OEM when I bought it on two CDs. With Dells it came on one DVD.

Fortune Cookie says: Fortune not Found: Abort, Retry, Ignore?

Sent from my All-In-One Desktop. Perfect for Internet, Not for heavy usage or gaming however.

How Does a computer get Infected? http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/2520/how-did-i-get-infected/
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#12 petegt5012

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Posted 21 May 2012 - 10:16 PM

noknojon,
Somehow I did not see your post back on the 16th...duh!
It has been a long weekend over here in Canada so have been away for awhile.
tried your first link and viola windows update now works. awesome.

From your post of the 17th
yes Mcafee has a firewall it seems I upgraded from v8.5i (i am not sure if that one had a firewall or not), but I had zonealarm installed then. It appeared to work fine and I was able to upgrade zonealarm with mcafee running.
Something must have changed, maybe the new firewall in v 8.7i or just tighter control.
Although zonealarm would not install post uninstalling v 8.5i and prior to installing 8.7i. over a 4 or 5 day period.
No errors to indicate that mcafee or anything else is stopping it.
That fix also seems to have fixed my services window the blue box in the extended mode now shows descriptions and start/stop options.

Hamiuis,
Yes i don't need 2 firewalls, but why wouldn't there be a message somewhere that would say "can't do that mcafee is blocking" or something to that nature?
when I had v8.5i I upgraded zonealarm, and also deinstalled an older version of zonealarm and installed a newer one, both older than the current one I am trying to install.

Heat on the motherboard does seem a high, if I start up some programs with speccy running i see the temp go up to 62 or 63 once to 64. As soon as i start a pgm the extra cpu fan comes on (which is big fan that sucks air through the front of my case and directs it onto the CPU heat sink. It cools down to 56 or 57 right after that.

Rotor23,
I am running MCE. but I think my XP cd was from an XP pro. I explained why I have this one in previous post #3 , the part I may have left off is I was booting from the UBCD4WIN disk that I created from the XP disk I had, and that boot from cd was sucking up all my time (fixing one thing and trying to boot back into normal setup, cycle again and again, so I broke down and installed it to a second hard drive.
I think I am back to the way I was pre trying SFC ....

I have to boot now to complete the windows update fixes.

#13 petegt5012

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 10:05 PM

After that "Fix-it" link , and windows update (now i was prompted 3 or 4 times to install the same 3 fixes from microsoft), figured just best to keep installing, now when I start the "PC Tune-up" software it now shows some options that seem to be standard PC Tune-up window diplays. PC Tune-Up now seems to be working.

So 2 problems fixed. opps maybe I spoke to soon, ran the scan part of the tool it did a lot of stuff then seemed to get a couple of errors and hang. I did not write down the errors, i will have to start it again.
I am only running this to see what it does, I don't think I will let it make any changes, especially registry changes. I was just curious what it would tell me.

Edited by petegt5012, 22 May 2012 - 10:30 PM.


#14 noknojon

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 10:19 PM

now when I start the "PC Tune-up" software

Please disable this program, at least for now, as it will not be helping with your current problems.
>>"now i was prompted 3 or 4 times to install the same 3 fixes from microsoft"<<
There is a current problem with some of the M/soft updates and if you read the XP forum area you can see these -

Yesterday I spent 20 mins on the phone plus a Remote Session with M/soft to fix most problems.
If your updates fail you have 2 options 1 / Set the updates to download but not install (you may still see the Yellow ( ! ) in task bar)
2 / Contact M/soft and ask for help there (they have contact details where the updates are)

Thanks pete -
EDIT - Help is free for personal users -

Edited by noknojon, 22 May 2012 - 10:21 PM.


#15 petegt5012

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Posted 22 May 2012 - 10:41 PM

the updates seem to have stopped now (microsoft).
I went to microsoft update initially and it found 3 fixes (I think they were all .net related). It did not ask me to reboot but said i might need to before it started. So i did not, at least at first.
Note when I reboot I think windows checks for uopdates. That is when I got the yellow "!" saying updates...that same 3. This seemed to happen every time reboot. I will see on next reboot what happens.
Have to get some sleep. will try a reboot and see if i get another set of updates the same tomorrow.

When you say contact microsoft do you mean phone them? or search their web site for hits on this topic?




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