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Dell Datasafe online stopped being trusted by FireFox


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#1 Nawtheasta

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Posted 20 September 2011 - 07:25 PM

I have Dell datasafe online with the new Win 7 64 Dell. It did an update yesterday. When I tried to log on today
to check backup status I get a "This connection is untrusted" screen from Fire Fox. I am tempted to just add an exception but FF has so many warnings about doing this I am unsure if this would be wise.
Screen shows this:
Technical Details

delldatasafe.backup.com uses an invalid security certificate.

The certificate is only valid for nobu.backup.com

(Error code: ssl_error_bad_cert_domain)

Suggestions and input is welcome
Best Regards
Nawtheasta

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#2 Nawtheasta

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 02:01 AM

Have been doing some searching about Datasafe online backup.
Now I know a lot of online searches produce negative results because you read of peoples problems. Usually if you dig far enough you find folks that like a product or service.
Even on the Dell forum universally the comments are very negative. Found one slightly lukewarm endorsement from one women that was able to restore her data.
I guess I will keep using this until the subscription runs out then look at other services.
Maybe an online backup service is more complicated then I appreciate. Sounds reasonably simple and straightforward and an easy source of income for Dell.
Unfortunately there does not appear to be any support offered. No direct topic on the Dell forum, no E mail contact , Nothing.
When I had a problem with Datasafe online backup shortly after purchasing the computer Dell support was reluctant to help as this was considered “software”. I pointed out it was actually a subscription service that they promoted. That problem was eventually solved but only due to having a helpful tech. that had to go beyond his training to help.
I know this turned into a bit of a rant but I am disappointed in Dell. If the subscription rate is not enough to maintain a reasonable level of customer support then they should charge more or stop offering on line back up.

My current problem was described in my OP. I think that Dell has just not bothered to get the proper certs for Datasafe online and is either self-generating or trying to use the Cert by the actual independent service provider. This is a more complete version of the Fire fix warning.

Can anyone offer an opinion that it would be OK to make an exception for this? Thanks in advance


This Connection is Untrusted


You have asked Firefox to connect securely to delldatasafe.backup.com, but we can't confirm that your connection is secure.
Normally, when you try to connect securely, sites will present trusted identification to prove that you are
going to the right place. However, this site's identity can't be verified.


What Should I Do?

If you usually connect to this site without problems, this error could mean that someone is
trying to impersonate the site, and you shouldn't continue.


Technical Details
delldatasafe.backup.com uses an invalid security certificate.

The certificate is only valid for nobu.backup.com

(Error code: ssl_error_bad_cert_domain)

#3 FlannelBack

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 03:33 AM

Have you done a search on "nobu.backup.com"? Taking a look at some of the search results might help you decide.

#4 Nawtheasta

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 10:05 PM

Hi Flannelback
Thanks for the response.From doing some searching NOBU seems to be a Norton back up service.
I guess it's safe to make an exception in Fire Fox to allow this.Can't seem to find anything that specifically ties together NOBU, Datasafe and the problem with FF not trusting.
I guess I will go ahead and allow although I really resent Dell putting me in a position to have to "Kind of guess it's OK".
Kind of feel like the long suffering and misused customers in the "Dilbert" comic strip.
Although in Dilbert at least you had dogbert for "support". Datasafe doesn't even rise to that level. :hysterical:
Thanks again for the input
Best Regards
Nawtheasta

#5 FlannelBack

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Posted 24 September 2011 - 11:32 PM

Well, now I'm wishing I hadn't made that response. I checked the nobu sites out and the IP addresses do indeed belong to Symantic. I too have not been able to find a direct connection between "delldatasafe.backup.com" and Symantic. At this point I haven't even been able to find a "delldatasafe.backup.com" site.

If I go to "delldatasafe.com" site, I get a valid dell certificate but a warning that the site, an https site is not secure.

The reason: "The server does not support secure TLS renegotiation. The site owner should upgrade the server."

Think it would be best, for now, to error on the side of caution and heed the Fx warning. Call Dell back and tell them that you are unable to use the service you are paying for because of a problem with the certificate. Please fix or refund. This ordeal seems strange to me. In my dealings with Dell, they have always been strict when it comes to security.

Edit:
One other thought before you call Dell back. Have you tried a different browser when accessing delldatasafe? If not, try using I.E. and see what happens.

Edited by FlannelBack, 25 September 2011 - 12:21 AM.


#6 Nawtheasta

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Posted 25 September 2011 - 11:34 PM

Hi FlannelBack
I tried closing FF and opening IE then opening Datasafe. It must be linked to FF somehow because it opened the FF browser when I clicked it
I will try calling Dell but last time the standard line was this is a software probelm and not something they deal with.
I only have good things to say about my hardware related problems with Dell. They have always been responsive in the past. That's why this thing with Datasafe seems so out of character with them
Best Regards
Nawtheasta

#7 FlannelBack

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 08:55 AM

Try typing https://delldatasafe.backup.com/ in the address bar of I.E. You probably have Fx set as the default browser so, when ever you click on a link it will be opened up with Firefox. Both Opera and Firefox give me invalid certificate warnings for this site.

With Opera, I gave a one time approval for the certificate and ended up being redirected to https://www.delldatasafe.com/ having an IP address of "66.77.66.220" which belongs to Qwest Communications. The organization name for the IP address is Swapdrive which is now owned by Symantic(Norton).

In my previous post I said the https://www.delldatasafe.com/ has a valid certificate but Opera warned me that the site was not secure. That has now changed, Opera says the site is secure. Firefox also says the site has a valid Dell certificate and the site is secure.

If it were me, I would skip going to the https://delldatasafe.backup.com/ site, go directly to the https://www.delldatasafe.com/ site and see what can be done from there.

Edited by FlannelBack, 26 September 2011 - 08:57 AM.


#8 Nawtheasta

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Posted 26 September 2011 - 10:24 AM

Hi Flannelback
Well I think I tried as you suggested. I searched delldatasafe.com on IE / Bing
The Dell datasafe online log in page comes up fine. When I tried to log in I get :

“Certificate error-Navigation Blocked- Internet Explorer”
(Some of the text here

There is a problem with this website's security certificate.
The security certificate presented by this website was issued for a different website's address.

Security certificate problems may indicate an attempt to fool you or intercept any data you send to the server.


I did some Google searches but don’t see anyone else specifically commenting about this as a recent problem. Hard to believe that it’s just me.
Now I’m starting to get a little paranoid. I would think that an online backup service would be a high value target for bad guys. If they are so lacking in attention to detail as to let their certs lapse what else are they not doing? Or stretching out the paranoid thought even further what if the site has been hijacked?
I can’t tell for sure unless I log in but I haven’t seen it doing its daily backups.
I assumed that this has been blocked. If there truly is a security problem I guess this is a good thing. Back in April the tech I had talked to did advise the site had been down for maintenance. I am going to either wait until Dell tells me directly it’s OK to make an exception or maybe in a week or so they will get around to fixing things.
Thanks again very much for your input.
Best Regards
Nawtheasta

#9 FlannelBack

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Posted 27 September 2011 - 03:27 AM

Hi Nawtheasta.

There are a some threads and posts on sites about delldatasafe with similar problems, many security related but not all. The ones I've found range from 2008-2011, but most are from 2010. Many say that delldatasafe had been working fine and all of sudden it stopped working. Either it wouldn't perform the backup or they couldn't retrieve a backup. In most of these cases this happened after an update to delldatasafe.

Some had bought a new computer with delldatasafe and like you were getting the invalid certificate warning.

Two of particular interest, because the solution offered at: http://milanhelp.blogspot.com/2009/12/dell-data-safe-fails-solution-of-dell.htmlworked for them. One of those two had purchased a new computer with delldatasafe and hadn't been able to get it to work.

The solution did not work for a couple of others. No one was able to get help from Dell on this situation. A situation that seems awfully convoluted to me.

I can not recommend or refute the solution because I've never used delldatasafe and thus have never tried the solution. Of those who have, only four that I've found have reported back and that gives a 50% success rate.

The consensus of opinion is, delldatasafe is a good thing to stay away from. Of course that's natural for people having these kinds of problems with it. Especially those that have lost their backups.

One other item that might be of importance. There are two delldatasafe sites.1) https://www.delldatasafe.com/
2) https://www.delldatasafe.co.uk/The first has a valid certificate and is secure. The second has a valid certificate but is shown as not secure. If I've read every thing correctly, the second one was also down for maintenance recently. Anyone with delldatasafe that lives in England is assigned to the second one. Anyone with delldatasafe that does not live in England is assigned to the first one.

All in all, your thoughts of paranoia are well earned and your decision is the best. Wish I could have been of some help but there just doesn't seem to be any out there. Astonishing!

When you arrive at a final out come for this, please post it. I for one am stumped and curious.

Best of luck.

#10 Nawtheasta

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 01:45 AM

Hi FlannelBack
First I want to thank you for taking the time to dig into this.
I kind of assume what response I will get if I try and call Dell. Once anything other then a hardware question is mentioned they try to kick you into the fee based support. After all this is software.(Never mind that this is their product , sold by subscription and that the problem seems external to my computer).
I thought I would step back and just try from the beginning. I Emailed Dell support for non-urgent support questions. So far only robo Emails acknowledging receipt.Even the robo acknowledgments have a disclaimer about hardware only questions and reference a 888 fee based number for software questions.
Also went to the "Feedback" section of Delldatasafe.com. Put in a big !!!!PLEASE UPDATE YOUR SECURITY CERTIFICATE!!!!!!! in the comments block.
I hope that the intern that reads it might pass it along as possibly a legit problem.
As reference I was thinking of posting a new topic here on BC and just asking if anyone currently has Dell datasafe.online working for them. Although not a help question I am curious if it is just me having the problem.
Anyway its late ( Fell asleep in the recliner and just woke up <_< )
Thanks again for looking into this.
Best Regards
Nawtheasta

#11 Nawtheasta

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 11:28 PM

Well I had a surprise this evening. Been trying to log into Dell datasafe online every now and then. Kept getting the not trusted warning until this evening. Logged in fine. I can see it has not done a backup successfully since 9/19.
Dell never answered my E mail. Software problem are not their concern they will tell you.
But somehow the problem must have worked it's way through the land of OZ, to the emerald city and eventual to the man behind the curtain.
I guess this problem is solved for now. Maybe they were doing site maintenance.
But really, this is a subscription service that they sell.Having no way to contact them would be like subscribing to a magazine and have no one to tell that they have the zip code wrong.
It would be fascinating to have someone from Dell explain how they decided to allow zero customer contact for this product.




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