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Intermittant Crashing Issue


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#1 Lenton

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Posted 03 September 2011 - 02:08 PM

Motherboard: GIGABYTE|GA-880GA-UD3H R
Processer: AMD|ATH II X4 635 2.9G AM3 RT
RAM: 2Gx2|GSKILL F3-10666CL9D-4GBNS
Video: XFX HD-567X-ZNF3 HD5670 1G R
OS: Windows 7 64bit

I've been having an intermittant crashing issue. The screen goes black and then reverts to a No Signal message from my monitor. The computer appears to still be running but not getting anything from the video. I go to turn it off by the power button but it won't shut down. I have to physically remove the power cable from the back of the computer and let it sit for 10-15min before powering it back on. If I don't wait it won't start up (same symptoms and I have to remove the power cord to get it to shut down again).

Most recently I thought it was a temp issue but every monitoring tool I've used has yet to show me any heat issues with the CPU or GPU besides finding the Northbridge temp spiked to over 80C at one point but everything is roughly 30-40C and then sometimes the GPU goes up to 50C while under load.

I replaced the power supply on a friends suggestion while I thought it resolved the issue it has proved to be a rather troublesome problem because previously I thought I resolved it by swapping the video to the onboard HDMI and removing the video card. Neither has truely resolved the issue.

The only Windows crash reports I could find using the Reliability Monitor and WhoCrashed are below:

PROBLEM: Windows Stopped Working
The computer has rebooted from a bugcheck. The bugcheck was: 0x00000116 (0xfffffa80041f2010, 0xfffff88008740a48, 0x0000000000000000, 0x0000000000000002). A dump was saved in: C:\Windows\MEMORY.DMP. Report Id: 090111-72680-01.


PROBLEM: Video Hardware Error
Description
A problem with your video hardware caused Windows to stop working correctly.

Problem signature
Problem Event Name: LiveKernelEvent
OS Version: 6.1.7601.2.1.0.256.1
Locale ID: 1033

Extra information about the problem
BCCode: 117
BCP1: FFFFFA80041F2010
BCP2: FFFFF88008740A48
BCP3: 0000000000000000
BCP4: 0000000000000000
OS Version: 6_1_7601
Service Pack: 1_0
Product: 256_1
Bucket ID: X64_0x117_Tdr:2_IMAGE_atikmpag.sys
Server information: 6d963d9b-0eac-4c19-ac34-f15f0049d21d

WHOCRASHED REPORT:

On Thu 9/1/2011 10:46:47 PM GMT your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\Windows\Minidump\090111-72680-01.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: atikmpag.sys (atikmpag+0x7A48)
Bugcheck code: 0x116 (0xFFFFFA80041F2010, 0xFFFFF88008740A48, 0x0, 0x2)
Error: VIDEO_TDR_ERROR
file path: C:\Windows\system32\drivers\atikmpag.sys
product: AMD driver
company: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
description: AMD multi-vendor Miniport Driver
Bug check description: This indicates that an attempt to reset the display driver and recover from a timeout failed.
A third party driver was identified as the probable root cause of this system error. It is suggested you look for an update for the following driver: atikmpag.sys (AMD multi-vendor Miniport Driver, Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.).
Google query: atikmpag.sys Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. VIDEO_TDR_ERROR

On Thu 9/1/2011 10:46:47 PM GMT your computer crashed
crash dump file: C:\Windows\memory.dmp
This was probably caused by the following module: dxgkrnl.sys (dxgkrnl!TdrResetFromTimeout+0x214)
Bugcheck code: 0x116 (0xFFFFFA80041F2010, 0xFFFFF88008740A48, 0x0, 0x2)
Error: VIDEO_TDR_ERROR
file path: C:\Windows\system32\drivers\dxgkrnl.sys
product: Microsoft® Windows® Operating System
company: Microsoft Corporation
description: DirectX Graphics Kernel
Bug check description: This indicates that an attempt to reset the display driver and recover from a timeout failed.
The crash took place in a standard Microsoft module. Your system configuration may be incorrect. Possibly this problem is caused by another driver on your system which cannot be identified at this time.
-----------------------

Unfortunately I think those logs are an unrelated issue, because the problem that was plaguing me has happened at late as 2:30pm on 9/3 and there is no logs of it beyond "Windows was not shut down properly" I've updated the video card driver since the error.

If anyone has any ideas for me I'd really appreciate it, my next guess would be to swap out the motherboard but I'd rather not swap out parts without knowing for sure :-/

Thanks in advance,

- Lenton

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#2 Lenton

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:57 AM

If there's any diagnostic tools you want me to use to get more information just let me know and I'll do it ASAP... I'm still at a loss with this problem.

#3 Lenton

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 03:14 PM

Now it won't come on at all anymore. Same symptoms, everything appears to power on but I get the "no signal" from my monitor and no BIOS codes to say why it isn't booting up.

I've replaced the power supply
I've tested the monitor with another device
I've moved the Video Card to another PCIe slot
I've tried the onboard HDMI port
I've reseated all the internal components
I've cleared the CMOS

Anyone have any other suggestions for me?

#4 MrBruce1959

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 11:25 PM

Hello and welcome to Bleeping Computer!

There have been a lot of issues with Windows 7 and various video card drivers crashing.

This includes both ATI and Nvidia products.

I am going to start doing some research as to why this is becoming all to common.

The very same drivers seem to work fairly well with Windows XP, but once we start using Vista or Windows 7 the nvlddmkm.sys drivers for Nvidia and the atikmpag.sys for ATI seem to have issues with dxgkrnl.sys and the Windows kernel.

I am a hardware person and even I have been experiencing recent crashes with my Nvidia Gefore 6200 AGP card since I upgraded to Windows 7.

Sometimes it happens when I am starting up my computer and my desktop is loading, from there it just goes to a blue screen, or the computer just restarts. Sometimes it does it when I am starting Internet explorer, the screen will blink and then a notice appears from the system tray indicating that my video was recovered and it points to nvlddmkm.sys as causing a timeout.

The interesting part is you will not find a suitable answer from Microsoft, Nvidia or ATI/AMD for the cause.

Bug checking software is a daunting task and if a solution is to be found, the vendors do not get the message that something is amiss here, often the forum boards for such hardware vendors are not monitored by the programmers who write the software or drivers for such hardware.

Those forum boards are mostly monitored by the average user who is there to ask what the hell is wrong here. Either way the finger pointing charade starts and you get it's not us, it's them.

To me, when drivers crash, it means someone wrote a bad piece of code, it works for some but not all and that is not the way a driver should be written, it should work with all hardware and all the currently existing chipsets available.

That should be the easy part, since older hardware should already be on a list what needs what to work properly.

Please forgive my rant in your thread, but I figured I owed you a decent reply and to assure you that you are not alone with this driver crash issue regarding Windows 7 and certain drivers released by Nvidia and ATI.

Do we blame Microsoft? Do we blame ATI? It is not hard to tell when you use the same video card in a Linux distro and never see a video related crash while using that same video card.

So we are left with the guess work and limited solutions.

Anything I can suggest to you, you have already tried and I can say you did everything anyone else would have suggested, so it boils down to one thing, either a buggy chip set or a buggy Windows 7.

Take your pick.

Bruce.

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#5 Lenton

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 02:04 AM

Replaced Motherboard and added some more RAM. Still happens. Now it seems to happen even while the computer is idling which didn't seem to occur before.

Screen goes black and computer won't power off using the power button. Checked Monitor, works fine with other devices, checked Video Card (used onboard instead of external card and issue still occurs). The computer is indeed crashing, it doesn't appear as if the video is just cutting out because I can't ping or VNC into the box once it occurs.

I'm not getting any type of blue screen, no error messages, and the windows log just say the computer shut down unexpectedly. I'm not thinking it's a Windows 7/Video issue as you suspect as it happens with the onboard video as well. I think I may have even thrown one of my older cards in previously when this originally started happening to rule out the card because I normally don't use ATI.

I've been searching for some sort of logging program that can tell me what exactly is going on at the time of the crash seeing how Windows logs doesn't appear to have anything to tell me...

I hate to do it but I think I'm going to end up scrapping this PC and building another from scratch once I have the cash. I've replaced the Power Supply and Motherboard and haven't had any success. The only other suggestion I had was that perhaps the case was causing some sort of short or something and I'm not that versed on how to go about testing for that event besides attempting to swap the case?

#6 MrBruce1959

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Posted 22 September 2011 - 05:03 PM

If you suspect a short as being the cause of your issue, you can assemble your system outside of the computer case, it will still function outside of the case.

You should have it setup so only the major components are hooked up to the motherboard, then do a startup test run.

Suggestions for what should be hooked up on the first try:

1) Power supply 20/24 pin ATX power connector to motherboard.

2) 4 or 6 pin 12 Volt power connector to motherboard.

3) One stick of RAM in slot #1.

4) Monitor hooked up to VGA or DVI port on video output port.

5) CPU in slot and CPU cooling fan operative.
Test system and see the results.

Results Good?: Skip to step #6

Results bad?: Your RAM module may be bad, try switching to another stick and try again.

Results bad?; You a defective motherboard or there exists a problem with your CPU or you have improper setting in BIOS setup utility.


6) Power off the computer and connect the hard drive to the motherboard.
Power up the computer and enter the BIOS so it detects the addition of the hard drive.
Save changes to CMOS and allow it to boot.

Does it boot properly? Yes? Go to step #7.


7) Reconnect optical drives to motherboard and try again.

Results good?: Add other piece of hardware one at a time and retest the machine.

My flow chart above is not perfect, but it gives you a basic idea how to place the motherboard outside of the computer case and assemble it piece by piece until the problem pops up.

After all this testing is done and you find everything works fine outside of the computer case, this means your motherboard was shorted to the computer case.

Bruce.

Edited by MrBruce1959, 22 September 2011 - 05:18 PM.

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My Career Involves 45 Years as an Electronics Repair Technician, to Which I am Currently Retired From.

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