Jump to content


 


Register a free account to unlock additional features at BleepingComputer.com
Welcome to BleepingComputer, a free community where people like yourself come together to discuss and learn how to use their computers. Using the site is easy and fun. As a guest, you can browse and view the various discussions in the forums, but can not create a new topic or reply to an existing one unless you are logged in. Other benefits of registering an account are subscribing to topics and forums, creating a blog, and having no ads shown anywhere on the site.


Click here to Register a free account now! or read our Welcome Guide to learn how to use this site.

Photo

Death Penalty


  • Please log in to reply
37 replies to this topic

#1 yano

yano

    I can see what you post!


  • Members
  • 6,469 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:03:03 PM

Posted 11 January 2006 - 04:33 PM

What are your views on the death penalty?

Should a murderer be put to death?

Should a rapist be put to death?

Should a robberer be put to death?

Should someone who has embezzled money be put to death?

Amazingly enough there are a few countries who actually do put people to death over those. (Not all the same.)

BC AdBot (Login to Remove)

 


#2 AL...

AL...

  • Members
  • 32 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Location:NZ. It's very long and in 2 bits
  • Local time:08:03 AM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 02:16 AM

Against! Kind of hard to dig up your mistakes and bring them back to life. But in saying that if your given "life" it should mean that.
Your interests (Check Length), Your location (Check Length). What if I dont need to check my length?
Religion has a built-in defense system: anything that questions a belief, no matter how logical the argument is, is the work of "the devil" by the very fact that it makes you question a belief.
Don't eat yellow snow.

#3 tg1911

tg1911

    Lord Spam Magnet


  • Members
  • 19,274 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:SW Louisiana
  • Local time:02:03 PM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 07:32 AM

My opinion, an eye for an eye.
If you take someones life, you should forfeit yours.
PERIOD.
MOBO: GIGABYTE GA-MA790X-UD4P, CPU: Phenom II X4 955 Deneb BE, HS/F: CoolerMaster V8, RAM: 2 x 1G Kingston HyperX DDR2 800, VGA: ECS GeForce Black GTX 560, PSU: Antec TruePower Modular 750W, Soundcard: Asus Xonar D1, Case: CoolerMaster COSMOS 1000, Storage: Internal - 2 x Seagate 250GB SATA, 2 x WD 1TB SATA; External - Seagate 500GB USB, WD 640GB eSATA, 3 x WD 1TB eSATA

Become a BleepingComputer fan: Facebook

#4 rms4evr

rms4evr

  • Members
  • 812 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:East Coast
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 12:03 PM

I'm against the death penalty. Partly because of my religious beliefs (people can't come to believe in Jesus Christ if they are dead), but also because some of the things I have observed of victims and their familes. Some family members of the murdered person (I emphasize some) seem to live for revenge. Since they can't do anything for their dead child, spouse, or whatever, they want to make sure that the killer dies. But executing the killer won't bring back the deceased person. "So?" The family members say, "this will give me closure." Putting someone to death brings closure? How morbid can you be? I can't imagine living my life just to make sure that someone else suffers. I believe in forgiving the people who screw you over. It's hard, I know (I still have some issues to work on :thumbsup: ), but I don't think that the person who loved and cared about you will want you living everyday in a sea of hate over the muderer.

Then again, I haven't seen someone close to me raped or murdered. So, I can't accuratly judge how I would react. And even though I am against capital punishment, God granted the authorites the right to govern and judge. So, I will have to live with it for now.

#5 Heretic Monkey

Heretic Monkey

  • Members
  • 1,122 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NCSU
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 12:04 PM

I sorta agree with tg1911, i've always loved the "whatever you did to someone, they get to do to you" idea.

However, in the case of murder, rape, genocide, manslaughter, etc., i think the death penalty is letting them off easy....... yeah, you heard me..... easy.

Someone who commits hateful acts against other humans shouldn't experience the joy of escaping this world any sooner. I think it would be better for them to rot in jail the rest of their natural life. Of course, this also lends itself to higher taxes for the rest of us, more crowded prisons, etc.

Overall, i think i'm pretty split on this decision....

#6 chlazzaro177

chlazzaro177

  • Members
  • 109 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:03:03 PM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 01:38 PM

How bad is prison anyway? I've never been to one so I wouldn't know. Do you think all of the prisoners are having a horrible time? Don't some of them like being in prison? Oh well, If you seriously wish them to rot in prison I think we should build an underground prison. Not ever letting them see the light. And serve them food in the cells instead of letting them go to a cafeteria to eat with other people. I'm not exactly sure how I feel about the death penalty.

#7 Scarlett

Scarlett

    Bleeping Diva


  • Members
  • 7,479 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:As always I'm beside myself ;)
  • Local time:03:03 PM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 02:35 PM

Death Penalty for murderers and rapists/child molesters.
It has been proven time and time again, that rapists and child molesters are nearly always repeat offenders!
Why give them a second chance to harm someone else in such a horrifying way!

Life in prison may not be a big bowl of cherries, but they are taken care of way to well in my opinion!
If one has no respect for life, then one's life should not be respected.
Most all are aware of what they are doing is wrong!
And know of the consequences should they commit a crime.
As for the other's, that have life sentences or have commited theft and other less serious crimes. I think that the entire U.S. prison system should be worked over.
Take away all of the perks prisoners receive!
They have a better quality of life than some hard working law abiding American's do.
And at all American's tax payers expense!
Cut what all they receive in prison down to the bare bones.
They should only be given what they absolutely need in order to survive.
That alone will save a fortune in taxes.
Take all of the gym equipment and computers etc. away and hand them out
to the more deserving.
I saw a show where a film crew went into a max security prison and in one case in particular. One of the prisoners was whining that his pancakes were not big enough. :thumbsup:
See what I mean?
And as far as vegans being served vegan meals, well that is outlandish! Being a vegan is a life style choice.
Those who request meals served to them that reflect their religious views, is another matter entirely.

Edited by Scarlett, 12 January 2006 - 03:08 PM.

Posted Image

#8 Salo

Salo

  • Banned
  • 108 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:03:03 PM

Posted 12 January 2006 - 11:20 PM

Im for the death penalty. An eye for an eye.

Im christian, I believe in the death penalty, not only does it state in the bible. But god teaches it throughout his sermons.


Let me also bring to you some non-religious reasons:

- To keep a prisoner inside of jail/county/death row, it costs nearly 5 million dollars a year per inmate. We are destroying our budget so we can keep heartless/remorseless/angry killers in prison. Although we give them some extra perks, if we eliminate the number of unneeded prisoners we can help.

- The majority are indeed repeat offenders, but still during the length of there questioning do not cooperate with police.

- During questioning, most show no remorse for what they have done.

- Most prisoners on death row, and county/state jails, have regular visits from preists/missionarys/pastors/worshipers so they can clearly repent and change their ways. But they still refuse.

Edited by Salo, 12 January 2006 - 11:21 PM.


#9 Mr Alpha

Mr Alpha

  • Members
  • 1,875 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Finland
  • Local time:11:03 PM

Posted 13 January 2006 - 05:39 PM

On a completely amoral level the death penalty makes sense. The punishment serves three main objectives:
1. As a deterrent against committing the crime; and as such, the death penalty can be effective.
2. To keep the offender from repeating his offence; and here the death penalty is flawless.
3. To satisfy a bloodthirsty population; which judging from your post (except Heretic Monkey :thumbsup:) it seems to do.

Now on a moral level things aren't nearly as clear. Although I do not think highly of arguments that rely on what other people have said here I find it irresistible to quote The Fellowship of the Ring:

Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends.

While I'm in the quoting mood I'll throw in another one, just to preface my next argument:

"What a pity that Bilbo did not stab that vile creature, when he had a chance!"
"Pity? It was Pity that stayed his hand. Pity, and Mercy: not to strike without need. And he has been well rewarded, Frodo. Be sure that he took so little hurt from the evil, and escaped in the end, because he began his ownership of the Ring so. With Pity."

What you really should do now isn't looking at the monster who committed the crime nor on the victim, but to your self, and how you cry out for blood, like a pack of starved wolfs, and ask yourselfs: How do your cries for death affect yourselves? What monsters do they make of you? Why should you then not be guilty, and receive the punishment of death you are so quick to give to others?

I believe you cannot judge someone else to death without killing part of yourself in the process. When no mercy you here give, then, according to your own principles, no mercy in your life you deserve.


My opinion, an eye for an eye.
If you take someones life, you should forfeit yours.
PERIOD.

Isn't there a flaw in your argument? A killer kills somebody, then the killer is found guilty and killed. This then makes the executioner a killer in stead, and so he himself should be killed, making his executioner a killer. And so it goes on until we have only one killer, and human, left in the world.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
Intel Core 2 Quad | XFX 780i SLI | 8GB Corsair | Gigabyte GeForce 8800GTX | Auzentech X-Fi Prelude| Logitech G15 | Logitech MX Revolution | LG Flatron L2000C | Logitech Z-5500 Digital

#10 Salo

Salo

  • Banned
  • 108 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:03:03 PM

Posted 14 January 2006 - 02:11 AM

Isn't there a flaw in your argument? A killer kills somebody, then the killer is found guilty and killed. This then makes the executioner a killer in stead, and so he himself should be killed, making his executioner a killer. And so it goes on until we have only one killer, and human, left in the world.


Havent we stopped using executioners? Last time I remember it was sometime in the 1800's
Machines are the ones that physically end their lives, but yes whatever you inflict upon another it needs to be done to you.

#11 Heretic Monkey

Heretic Monkey

  • Members
  • 1,122 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NCSU
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 14 January 2006 - 11:52 AM

A thought i've been wondering about for a long time:

Why is it that most christians believe and follow the bible so strongly, but are always up for a little of the ultra-violence? Isn't one of the commandments "Thou shalt not kill", or is that just a "prettied up" version of the real thing?

How can you justify killing at all when it clearly says that you shouldn't kill? From what i've seen, most religious people (of any religion) seem to be split half-and-half on the idea of the dealth penalty. Some favor it, going for the "eye for an eye" and "sending the guy to hell" routine, while others fight against it, claiming that he "can be saved" and that "every life is precious".

So, which is it? Is killing a criminal justified in the bible? Should the "thou shalt not kill" statement override everything else? Should they tack on "except: in the name of god, in a war, criminals, etc" on the end of the commandment?

#12 rms4evr

rms4evr

  • Members
  • 812 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:East Coast
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 14 January 2006 - 08:11 PM

A thought i've been wondering about for a long time:

Why is it that most christians believe and follow the bible so strongly, but are always up for a little of the ultra-violence? Isn't one of the commandments "Thou shalt not kill", or is that just a "prettied up" version of the real thing?

How can you justify killing at all when it clearly says that you shouldn't kill? From what i've seen, most religious people (of any religion) seem to be split half-and-half on the idea of the dealth penalty. Some favor it, going for the "eye for an eye" and "sending the guy to hell" routine, while others fight against it, claiming that he "can be saved" and that "every life is precious".

So, which is it? Is killing a criminal justified in the bible? Should the "thou shalt not kill" statement override everything else? Should they tack on "except: in the name of god, in a war, criminals, etc" on the end of the commandment?


Point One:

"Thou shall not kill" was written in the old testament, when Moses brought the Ten Comandments down from Mt. Sinai. However, adulterers were stoned to death in Jewish society. No. Joke. Capital punishment was around even among the most religious. But, that was before Jesus came onto the scene. And he preached the concept of forgivness, ie, you forgive those who screw you over. And he also taught about loving these people as well. Those are two of the reasons that I am against capital punishment. The other reason is what Heritic Monkey cited: I am one of those "maybe he/she can be saved" people.

Point Two:

Some Christians (once again, I emphasize some), from what I have observed, believe that they are involved in a war for God. And in any war, the other side may try to adopt the tactics of their enemy to get ahead. Which means that some Christians can get violent when they are passionate about what they believe. I don't think that this is a good way to show your faith. Do you really think that Jesus would approve if, when you go on TV after a loved one has been killed, you rant and rave about how you want the person who murdered him/her to fry in hell? How is that showing God's love?

However, I will admit that I do not have all of the answers. I do not know how God really feels about capital punishment (there are not many 'burning bush' incidents in today's day and age). Your personal beliefs are between you and God. Some believe that the ten comandments do not apply to murderers or rapists.

I don't think that those comandments were written to include exceptions. But that's just me.

#13 cowsgonemadd3

cowsgonemadd3

    Feed me some spyware!


  • Banned
  • 4,557 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 14 January 2006 - 10:16 PM

"- To keep a prisoner inside of jail/county/death row, it costs nearly 5 million dollars a year per inmate"

Thats no way possible.....5 million per inmate? Come on now??

"while others fight against it, claiming that he "can be saved" and that "every life is precious"."

How can you justify killing at all when it clearly says that you shouldn't kill?


Every life is precious. In the Bible God told the Israelites to kill and destroy everything when they were going into the promised land. They were told to kill even the animals.

I think that if they kill someone and are not even sorry for it(cold murder) they deserve the death penalty.

#14 boopme

boopme

    To Insanity and Beyond


  • Global Moderator
  • 73,430 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:NJ USA
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 15 January 2006 - 02:18 AM

I would say that I do agree with death penalty punishment for murder ( with malice and premeditation). I would also be in favor for rape and I may add children of either gender. Not so for robbery and embezzlement.
I believe it can become a better deterrent once the lenghtly appeals process is reduced. Perhaps that will improve thru DNA evidence. As such if execution were swifter ,it would be a stronger deterrent.
I believe the cost of the average 7 year appeal system for death row inmates is costing approximately 2-2.5 million per inmate. The life without parole incarceration is conservatively 3o,ooo per year. That times an average stay of 50 years equals 1.5 million. This does not include many variables along the way. Such as medical costs, in the form of injury to one self or another inmate or prison personnel. The immense geriatric care or the frivolous legal expenses these inmates like to abuse. these items will drive the lifers cost way past the execution cost.

In response to some items I've seen among the other posts.

I also agree with those who've said prison life should be more difficult.
Execution is not murder
That two wrongs do not make a right, therefore, executions are equivalent to murder. First of all, the term murder is specifically defined in any dictionary as the UNLAWFUL killing of a person with malice and aforethought. So logically, the word murder cannot be used to describe executions since the death penalty is the law. To do so is an obvious abuse of semantics. Second of all, comparing executions to murders is like comparing incarcerating people to kidnapping or charging taxes and fines to extortion. There is a difference between violent crime and punishment. Is there a contradiction in a policeman speeding after a speeder to enforce speeding laws? One displays a serious lack of moral judgment to believe that just because two practices share a physical similarity means that they are morally identical. Law enforcement officials act well within the law when they punish criminals whether it be by charging fines, incarcerating them, or conducting executions, thereby, defending public safety.

The word kill in the 6th Commandment means murder, in Exodus 20:13
"Thou shall not kill" But if one translated directly from the original Hebrew version, it is: "Thou shall not MURDER." And murder is defined in any dictionary as the UNLAWFUL killing of a person with malice and aforethought. No need to pull some words out of context to suit one's religious agenda.

Death of an innocent
Far more innocent lives have been taken by convicted murderers than the supposedly 23 innocents mistakenly executed this century. In fact, there is absolutely no evidence that the death penalty in this country has ever executed even ONE innocent in the past century! Also consider that thousands of American citizens are murdered each year by released and paroled criminals. These are the serious flaws in life sentences that abolitionists prefer to trivialize to nonexistence. There is no doubt whatsoever that keeping murderers alive is far, far more dangerous to innocents than putting them to death. One US Senate report stated this position this way:

All that can be expected of...[human authorities] is that they take every reasonable precaution against the danger of error... If errors are...made, this is the necessary price that must be paid within a society which is made up of human beings.

Also, the death penalty isn't the only institution that contain risks in exchange for social benefits. We, in fact, mindlessly use far more dangerous institutions that take the lives of innocents by the hundreds every day, like the three or four tons of lethal metal we call automobiles for example. After all, how can we accept the average 45,000 person a year death toll in this nation due to car wrecks for our personal conveniences when the slim risk of a wrongful execution is so unbearable?


Death Penalty Quiz
In a large group invite participants to respond to the following questions providing them with an answer concluding each question. (note the highlighted option is the correct answer)

How many homicides occur in the United States annually?
60,000
50,000
22,000
3,000

In what percentage of committed homicides is the death penalty sought?
1%
50%
25%
10%

Who make the decision to seek the death penalty?
Judge
Grand Jury
District Attorney
Depends on Crime

About half of all murder victims are white. What percentage of victims are white in death penalty cases?
80%
74%
50%
30%

What is the cost per execution over the cost of a non-death penalty murder case with a sentence of life imprisonment?:
2 million dollars
$200,000
$100,000
None

Since 1970 how many people released have been from death row with evidence of their innocence?
None
66
300
3

According to a 1992 study in how many cases since 1900 have innocent people been executed?
None
23
59
300

When asked of their views of the death penalty what percentage of police chiefs and county sheriffs responded, "philosophically I support the death penalty, but I don't think it is an effective law enforcement tool in practice?
15%
58%
90%
2%

Murderers think about the range of possible punishments before committing homicide." What percentage of police chiefs and sheriffs say this statement is inaccurate?"
10%
22%
60%
82%
How much does it cost to keep a person in a maximum security prison for a year?"
$15,000
$20,000
$50,000
$7,000

What percentage of Americans are in favor of the death penalty?
30%
50%
77%
90%

(source: Amnesty International)
How do I get help? Who is helping me?For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear....Become a BleepingComputer fan: Facebook

#15 Pandy

Pandy

    Bleepin'


  • Members
  • 9,559 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Female
  • Local time:04:03 PM

Posted 15 January 2006 - 09:56 AM

In the Bible it does say "Thou Shalt Not Kill". Hmmm In the Bible it ALSO says "turn the other cheek". So what is that supposed to mean?

I don't know if the death penalty is right. I think there are some that are beyond redemption.. but determiming that is where it gets sticky for me. How can we know if we are not executing an innocent person.. For me and my own opinion I do think the death penalty is warranted in some cases. At the same time I also feel that humans may be inadequate to be the judge of it.

:thumbsup: Religions kill in their own name every day. I have no respect for that really. It's evil in a guise of self-righteousness. Look at the Inquisition.. that was EVIL imho. Just crazy evil and in the name of God too. You gotta wonder who was running that show. PFFT!!

Do not anticipate trouble, or worry about what may never happen. Keep in the sunlight.

Hide not your talents. They for use were made. What's a sundial in the shade?

~ Benjamin Franklin

I am a Bleeping Computer fan! Are you?

Facebook

Follow us on Twitter





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users