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Low Fps In Counter Strike 1.6/ati Catalyst Error Message


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#1 boosted84wagon

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Posted 18 December 2005 - 06:44 PM

I've been having problems with my in game FPS rate.

Here's my specs:
AMD Athlon XP 3000+ 2.16ghz and 512mb of ram. I'm currently running Windows XP 2002 Home Edition w/ service pack 2 installed. I have a Radeon 9200 SE Gold 128mb video card installed, with the latest Omega Catalyst based drivers and am connected to cable internet via Belkin Wireless-G network adapter.

It seems like no matter how much I tweak my settings, I can never get more than 35-40fps while playing CS.

I've turned off Vsnyc, ran lower and higher resolution, turned off all firewalls/virus protection/etc, I've also done all the console tweaks (cl_rate, etc). It seems like I've done EVERYTHING and can't get a good FPS rate!

You guys have any ideas?

Thanks in advance,

Daniel

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#2 welco

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Posted 18 December 2005 - 07:06 PM

Click on the options menu when you get into the main screen and look under the visual settings and check to make sure you're running in Open GL mode not software mode. I know this had been a problem for me on this computer and now it's smooth as butter and this machine only has a 1.6 ghz Pentium 4.
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#3 Wizdabest

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Posted 18 December 2005 - 09:32 PM

okay, this seemed to work with me

OpenGL worked a lot better than D3D and I had an x300.

So, try change your video mode to OpenGL then go into console and set,

ati_npatch 0
ati_subdiv 0

I guess you have to change those for Nvidia cards too, but obviously Nvidia is OpenGL.
:thumbsup:

#4 Mr Alpha

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 06:01 AM

With the risk of sounding stupid, why do you need more than 40 fps?
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
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#5 Wizdabest

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 08:45 AM

Maybe I'm just weird.

I've heard people say that 30 fps is what the human eye sees.

However, I notice quite a bit of choppyness until FPS is above 60.

Edited by Wizdabest, 19 December 2005 - 08:47 AM.


#6 Mr Alpha

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 03:20 PM

The human eye sees at 15 fps, but you can notice some visual illusion up to 30 fps, but that shouldn't be a problem since that monitor runs at 60-120 fps. The reason I like to have at least 35 fps in shooters is because that is an average measured over a time period and with a 35 fps average the low point isn't noticable even in the most hectic of games. In something like Civilization 20 fps is enough.

However, I notice quite a bit of choppyness until FPS is above 60.

Solution, the fps wasn't above 60.

Three possible reasons:
1. You were mistaken, and it wasn't above 60 fps.
2. The meter was screwed up and was reported the wrong fps.
3. The meter was measuring the fps over such a long period of time, as to making the measurement useless.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
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#7 Wizdabest

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 04:29 PM

Counter Strike: Condition Zero.

FPS not above 60?

cl_showfps 1
net_graph 1
Fraps fps counter

fps_max 30 and 60 were used.

Screenshots taken with fraps.

http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/2608/30fps4nr.jpg

http://img45.imageshack.us/img45/9005/60fps0cj.jpg

For me, 30 fps in Counter Strike is very noticable and is unplayable for me due to sickness from looking at the screen.

#8 Mr Alpha

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 05:16 PM

You might want to increase your refresh rate if you get motion sickness.

Oh, and disable v-sync.

Edited by Mr Alpha, 19 December 2005 - 05:20 PM.

"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
Intel Core 2 Quad | XFX 780i SLI | 8GB Corsair | Gigabyte GeForce 8800GTX | Auzentech X-Fi Prelude| Logitech G15 | Logitech MX Revolution | LG Flatron L2000C | Logitech Z-5500 Digital

#9 Wizdabest

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 05:28 PM

refresh rate is 85 and vsync is [already] off.

*edit* low fps is the biggest reason I don't play too many First Person Shooters on consoles. I can get quite sick after a little bit.

Edited by Wizdabest, 19 December 2005 - 06:05 PM.


#10 Mr Alpha

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 06:19 PM

I just thought of something that would mean I am, at least partially, wrong. There might be a reason why you get sick when playing with under 60 fps. If I haven't gotten my biology completely wrong motion will become a bit diffused when the eye sends the picture to the brain. The picture that arrives at the brain doesn't look anything like we see it, the part of the brain that is associated with sight does a lot of processing with it first. After that it is passed on to another part where it is sync-ed and processed in combination with all the other sensory input.

Now during all this processing the diffuseness from the motion is gotten rid of and a created still picture is put in its stead. There is a lot of out of sync and corrupt information the brain replaces with artificially created information. If I got how motion sickness works right, it is when the brain get confused by mixed signals about what is standing still and what is in motion that causes the motion sickness.

Here I will start to speculate, but I hope I'm on the right track at least. Since the monitor is refreshing with the same frame several times, everything is in theory standing still until it jumps to the next frame. This means that there won't be the normal diffuseness you get with motion. Now if your brain is getting caught up on this bit of information more than mine and it is this confusion that arrives from the conflicting motion data. That is what is giving you the motion sickness even at such high fps. It might also be because your brains focus on this bit of data that leads it to create a sense of artificial choppiness that in reality is too fine for you to actually see.

You might even say that you have superior sense of reality that lets you perceive of choppiness to fine for me to notice, although, it may be, that your just sick of it.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
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#11 Wizdabest

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Posted 19 December 2005 - 10:08 PM

I could never really explain a reason why I would get sick after so much time. I had even read suggestions in the Steam powered forums that people should play their games in window mode so its easier on the eyes. The only thing I really know is the situations when it happens.

One of the biggest causes of sickness depends on the amount of control during gameplay, which is why I like first person shooters on the PC rather than on console. What I mean is, when I am watching somebody else play a first person shooter I usually start feeling a migrane fast because I am not in control of their movements and I don't know when and am not prepared for any sudden movements and whatnot. So, that along with a low frame rate really gets to me after a short amount of time. However, when I am in complete control with the keyboard and mouse, I know where and by how much the camera will be turned and because I am in control, I am able to be prepared for any movement and feeling weird usually comes slower. Exept for sudden FPS slow downs though, I've had to stop many times because of a contant choppyness to smooth, back to choppyness, then back to smooth.

I really don't think its anything special other than a pain in the butt at times. My original monitor for my new computer was an Acer 19" 8ms LCD through newegg. I was really excited to get it because it was cheap for a 19 inch and response time and it had just about all positive reviews. It turned out to be a huge misteak. The instant I loaded up Counter Strike, I regretted buying it. Not only was the refresh rate of 75 causing massive eye strain, the 8ms response time (though all I saw were postive reviews of no problems with 8ms) produced a big ghosting/blur effect that I couldn't stand at all and the next two days later, it was in the box heading back. Then I had to deal with all the computer people at all the local stores' confused looks when telling why I needed a CRT monitor. Luckily I found this KDS 19" Flat Screen CRT.

I know I really went into detail of when it happens, but I didn't mean it to be like I suffer from it every second when I play games. Its usually after a little time passes when I start to feel a migrane or eye strain when playing games. Also, depending on the game depends on how I feel. For example, it is easy to not notice it as much because I'm so into the game at that moment. However, Counter Strike is probably the only FPS exeption where like said, anything under 60 is too low for my eyes, its probably the nature of how CS runs that it bothers me so much.

#12 Mr Alpha

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Posted 20 December 2005 - 07:01 AM

My original monitor for my new computer was an Acer 19" 8ms LCD through newegg. I was really excited to get it because it was cheap for a 19 inch and response time and it had just about all positive reviews. It turned out to be a huge misteak. The instant I loaded up Counter Strike, I regretted buying it. Not only was the refresh rate of 75 causing massive eye strain, the 8ms response time (though all I saw were postive reviews of no problems with 8ms) produced a big ghosting/blur effect that I couldn't stand at all and the next two days later, it was in the box heading back. Then I had to deal with all the computer people at all the local stores' confused looks when telling why I needed a CRT monitor. Luckily I found this KDS 19" Flat Screen CRT.

Tell me about it. My brother's got and LCD and I got a headache from the ghosting, but he had no idea why it was bothering me. But low refresh rate on LCDs shouldn't have that big of a difference since they don't draw the picture the same way as CRT monitors do, they kind of float from one picture to the next. This is what gives all the ghosting and other problems on LCDs.

Sorry to hear about your problem with the monitor, but sadly that isn't too uncommon. :thumbsup: There are doesens of different ways to measure response time so when somebody says it is 8ms that doesn't really tell you anything. I had a similar experience and now I also stick to CRTs.

I know I really went into detail of when it happens, but I didn't mean it to be like I suffer from it every second when I play games. Its usually after a little time passes when I start to feel a migrane or eye strain when playing games. Also, depending on the game depends on how I feel. For example, it is easy to not notice it as much because I'm so into the game at that moment. However, Counter Strike is probably the only FPS exeption where like said, anything under 60 is too low for my eyes, its probably the nature of how CS runs that it bothers me so much.

Now that I think about it I often hear how people want really high fps in CS, that is how this thread also got started. I wonder if there is something about how CS is rendered that makes it so sensitive to fps.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
Intel Core 2 Quad | XFX 780i SLI | 8GB Corsair | Gigabyte GeForce 8800GTX | Auzentech X-Fi Prelude| Logitech G15 | Logitech MX Revolution | LG Flatron L2000C | Logitech Z-5500 Digital

#13 Wizdabest

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Posted 20 December 2005 - 01:46 PM

Yea, its extremly easy to see and be effected by a lower fps in CS. In something like BF2, I usually have 40-80 fps, which doesn't bother me all that much to see it choppy, but in CS, 40 fps would be vomit causing.

#14 Heretic Monkey

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Posted 20 December 2005 - 03:19 PM

Yea, its extremly easy to see and be effected by a lower fps in CS. In something like BF2, I usually have 40-80 fps, which doesn't bother me all that much to see it choppy, but in CS, 40 fps would be vomit causing.

And pretty much mean instant death to anyone playing respectable players....

I get a smooth 70 fps on most maps, with dips in the more complex ones or when there's an intense firefight going on.

#15 Wizdabest

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Posted 20 December 2005 - 06:05 PM

I think the statsme mods should be abolished, they cause me from having a constant 99 fps to having 50-60 fps at the end of the maps when the round stats come up for those 5 seconds before the next round.

*edit* on a side note, what do you think of my new avatar? I get a kick out of it.

Edited by Wizdabest, 20 December 2005 - 06:07 PM.





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