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Gaming Pc


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#1 Klinkaroo

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 08:56 PM

I was wondering if anyone could tell me the best parts to put into a gaming pc that will cost me under 2000$ canadian around 1675$ american. I can build a PC myself and I was thinking of probably buying the parts online at www.ncix.com but I don't really know what is the most bang for my buck.

I need a whole kit : motherboard, processor (preferably AMD), ram..., video card (preferably with the new PCI express slot) and all the other stuff. I want to cool the processor with a liquid cooling system. I already own a Sound Blaster Audigy 2 sound card that I have in my parents computer with some 5.1 speakers and I would like to get the logitech gaming keyboard and the gaming mouse.

It's really the motherboard stuff I have a hard time understanding how the darn thing works.

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#2 Leurgy

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 09:45 PM

I'm not going to get to deep into this cause the gamers will probably beat me up about my choices but a couple of suggestions are to look at the system requirements of the games you want to play and have a look at tigerdirect.ca also for some good prices.

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#3 legoman786

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 11:05 PM

If you are to get a gaming PC for under $2000 Canadian with a liquid cooling system, you'll go way out of your budget. That's my opinion.

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#4 boopme

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 11:47 PM

This may be of help, This is the AMD link. You'll need to decide on the processor and Mobo first that your existing parts will work with.

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Processors/Produc...,30_118,00.html

You're at processors. pick one and click. Then scroll down to configuration info and click.
On the right side of this screen you can find the compatible components.

Then obviously you'll have to shop them. Here's is NEWEGG link http://www.newegg.com/

My son built his PC 2 years ago and has no problems playing WoW online or Doom3, no lag.
Have Audigy2Zs sound card and GAINWARD Ultra/1300XT GS Geforce FX5900XT 256MB DDR AGP 4X/8X Video Card. 2 Gig Corsair Ram . With P4 and Intel d865PERL mobo. The last 4 pieces were about $1000 US.

I've seen Watercooling here at Corsair

http://www.corsairmemory.com/corsair/COOL_water.html

Hopefully this has helped you along.
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#5 Mr Alpha

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 02:05 AM

Are you sure you want liquid cooling? After paying a few hundred buck for it, you won't have enough left for a gaming PC.
"Anyone who cannot form a community with others, or who does not need to because he is self-sufficient [...] is either a beast or a god." Aristotle
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#6 Saxif

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 09:52 AM

These are just some recommendations off the top of my head -- everyone has their own preference, and you'll just have to weigh the pros and cons each choice vs. your budget and tastes.

Motherboard

If this machine is to be used primarily for gaming, especially anything built on the Doom 3 engine, you should consider an SLI capable board. SLI allows you to use paired NVidia cards to achieve and sustain higher framerates than a single card. Take that claim with a grain (or two) of salt. Games have to be specifically written to take advantage of SLI (the new Doom engine is), your power supply must be beefy enough to handle them (450-500 watts, 30 amps) and you're locked into getting two of the same Nvidia video card. I doubt SLI will make any real difference to anyone for the next couple of years, and chances are you'll have a new rig by then anyhow.

Asus and MSI are probably the top rated SLI mobos right now.

If you don't think you're going to take advantage of SLI, just look for an NForce4 chipset and PCI Express slot on a socket 939 board from a reputable manufacturer like Abit, Asus or Gigabyte and the other features you need (network adapter, RAID, Firewire or whatever).

Processor

The value chip right now from AMD is the 3500+ in my opinion. 2.2 GHz will serve you plenty well, and if you decide to overclock, there's enough room for growth. The San Diego are hands down the fastest widely available single core processors, but you can buy a whole new 3500+ based machine for the price of a CPU. If you want to go dual core, the 4200+ is a reasonable choice, but expect to pay more than twice the price of a 3500+ for two cores running at 3500+ speed. Dual core is great if you tie up your machine with background tasks all the time, like doing a lot of encoding or compiling while you play games. The vast majority of users don't suffer significant problems with a single core CPUs, and 99% of people who go dual core are probably wasting money.

RAM

Again, RAM selection is more or less based on whether you plan on overclocking. As long as you get a matched pair (for purposes of DDR), even generic RAM will do pretty well at stock to mildly OCed systems. There's no real need to run out and pay $280 US for Corsair XMS.

Optical Drive

All DVD drives seem to cost around US$40, give or take a couple of bucks. Just make sure you're getting dual layer, dual format.

Hard Drive

The best gaming drive is the Western Digital Raptor, spinning at 10k rpm. At US$2/MB, it's also relatively expensive and only comes in 36 and 74 MB sizes. Higher RPMs mean more case heat too. Just get a generously sized SATA drive that works out to US$0.40/MB and comes from a manufacturer you trust.

Video Card

I've been running Nvidia cards for the last few years, and based on the various video card roundups, Nvidia has the edge at every price point, if only by a few percent. There's nothing wrong with ATI cards, I'm sure, but I just don't know much about them. The 6600GT does plenty well, and you can get it for as low as US$120. Again, look for a reputable manufacturer. If you want higher performance and more room for growth, take a look at the 7800 GT. The king of the hill right now is the 7800 GTX, but the GT is only marginally slower in practical terms for nearly US$200 less.

Sound Card

I use onboard sound, so I'm not really the one to comment on what cards are good. When I want to listen to music, I use my stereo.

Cooling

Unless you overclock, there is absolutely no need to go to exotic cooling solutions. The stock AMD heatsink and fan will keep your CPU well within normal operating temps in a room temp environment. If you OC mildly, you can still do plenty well with an aftermarket heatsink and fan from Zalman or Thermaltake and a tube of Arctic Silver. Water cooling is expensive and the US$150 water cooling solutions don't perform much better than fans costing only one third as much.

So there you have it. In every category except sound, you have a "best" suggestion and a value suggestion. Everyone wants the "best" of everything, but deciding what you actually need vs. what you only want goes a long way to making you happy. Game makers code for an installed base of users who have average machines because people don't rush out to get $4000 Alienware rigs to play a $50 game.

Getting a moderately powerful system now will last you plenty long enough before you start drooling after the next big thing. Hardware makers seem to run on six month marketing cycles, so you can pretty much bet that every spring and every fall, something new will catch your eye. You can build a really nice system from the bottom up for around US$800 (no OS). Then you can spend the rest of your budget on games.

#7 usasma

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 10:57 AM

Just a few, quick comments about my views.

1) The most bang for your buck in a system for gaming is likely to come from the video. Go for the best there (SLI and 2 cards on the PCI-E slots)

2) Watercooling - only if you're going to overclock - and then only if you're gonna get wild with the BIOS settings. BUT, this may compromise your gaming by the pursuit of pure performance vs gaming performance.

3) Tomshardware and AnandTech have good reviews of the latest hardware that's available.

4) It's looking like the AMD is the choice of CPU. The GPU is nVidia - but it's very close with ATI. The chipset of choice seems to be the nForce4. And PCI-E is fast becoming a requirement for gaming (as may happen to SLI). With memory - it looks like faster is better, as long as it's quality RAM.

5) As with anything - you get what you pay for. Shop for deals on the best components that you can afford - with an eye towards gaming performance. But it won't do to get 2 of the latest nVidia cards for SLI while using a 500 mHz Duron - that's where the tradeoffs come in. After a lot of studying you'll get a feel for the best bang for your buck - and then you'll be in a position to make an informed decision.
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#8 Leurgy

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 11:47 AM

klinkaroo mentioned to me elsewhere this computer would be used for LAN parties. Is it cool to cart around a machine with liquid cooling? I'd be afraid the jostling would cause leaks.

Any comments or has anyone tried this?

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#9 Mr Alpha

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 01:43 PM

Is it cool to cart around a machine with liquid cooling? I'd be afraid the jostling would cause leaks.

A quality liquid cooling system properly installed doesn't leak. You could probably drop the machine without it starting to leak. A $150 system I wouldn't be so sure of, but then again I wouldn't use a $150 system in the first place. But dragging around a liquid cooling system would be kinda horrible anyways.

On the sound front I would get a soundcard. A Creative SoundBlaster of some kind, depending on how much you're willing to spend on it. It greatly helps by offloading the sound processing from the CPU. Something from their new X-Fi line.

I'm not sold on the SLI idea. I would rather get a single new card than two old ones. But definitely PCIe.
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#10 Klinkaroo

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 06:43 PM

Thanks everyone I have now abandoned the liquid cooling idea but about the thing of it leaking and carrying it around it wouldn't be all that bad because all the parts are either in the case or the radioator that is attached to the outside. The one I was looking at had a small 12V pump that you put in the bottom of the case, a tank in one of the 5" drive bays, the part that goes on top of the CPU (I forgot what it is called) and the radiator that is basically a fan that screws to the side of the case.

I will be getting a Sound Blaster Audigy 2 for Christmas (can't wait) with the Logitech X-530 5.1 speaker system (there cheap and the reviews say that they aren't all that bad for the cash it costs).

P.S. What is overclocking?

#11 chiefmasterjedi

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 08:09 PM

I would suggest buying the best Mobo you can afford and then add the other hardware, this way you can always upgrade any part if you need to.
If it was my money i would buy an Nforce4 SLI board (AMD socket 939), Asus or DFI. Remember just because it's an SLI Mobo, doesn't mean you have to use two cards, start with one Nvidia card and add another one later when newer and better games require it. If your an overclocker, then get an AMD64 3000+ Venice core (around $130) these run at 1.8GHz and normally overclock to about 2.4GHz easy, which is the same speed as the AMD 4000+ which costs around $400. If your not an overclocker then go for a AMD 3500+ or 3800+.
Next get 2GB of good memory (2x1GB sticks). AMD doesn't support DDR2 (they will sometime in 2006!) so you'll have to get 184 pin DDR..........If you overclock try and find PC3500 or above, it will be a big help.
Finally the video card.......... Don't listen to the ATI versus Nvidia Bullsh*t, they are both great card manufacturers and there is little to choose between them, it is really up to personal preference, but as i stated above, if you choose the Nvidia side of the coin toss, you'll have the choice to upgrade and add another card (before the ATI purists slam me, ATI also has dual card Mobo's, but lets face it, the new "Crossfire" has quite a few bugs in it and isn't as fast YET as Nvidia SLI). Also SLI isn't overkill if you have a big monitor or you like to play all the latest games on MAX settings.


Well thats the CPU, Memory, Motherboard and Video card taken care of, all the other parts you buy will probably be cheaper and not have a huge impact on performance, so it's mostly up to personal preference from here on. One thing you will need though is a good power supply, none sli system will need a PSU (power supply unit) of about 450watts and 20amps on the +12 volt rail (PCI-e mobo will need a ATX 2.0 PSU to run smoothly). SLI system will need alot more power depending on the type of cards used>>>

2x6600GT = 450+watts and 20 amp +12volt
2x6800GT = 550+watts and 34+ amps +12volt
2x7800GTX = 500+watts and 30+ amps +12volt (yes these are less power hungry than 6800gt's!!!)


There is a hundred an one different ways to build a gaming system and this is just my 2 cents worth!

Chief.

P.S. Ummm the "what is overclocking" question has a bit of a long answer, in short you take say a 2.0GHz processor, enter your computer's bios and fiddle with a few settings and you end up with a 2.4 GHz processor at no extra cost. Down sides are more heat and less stability but done right it can improve performance by over 20%.

Edited by Leurgy, 17 November 2005 - 08:19 PM.


#12 usasma

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Posted 17 November 2005 - 09:06 PM

IMO, a very good overclocking resource:
http://www.overclockers.com/
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#13 Klinkaroo

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Posted 18 November 2005 - 12:41 PM

Thanks chiefmasterjedi I think that is what I will do with the cpu get the cheaper 1.8 and fiddle around with it to pump it up a little.




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