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Good upgrade?


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#1 ohai

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Posted 29 July 2009 - 10:05 PM

my other forum went belly up so...


current spex:
AMD A64 X2 6400+ @ 3396MHz
MSI K9N neo-f v3
antec ea650 650w cpu with 72A on the 12v rails
4GB DDR2 @ 852MHz
500GB 7200RPM HDD
Coolermaster Hyper tx2 CPU cooler


http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWi...Number=14556968 I'm planning to get that soon, is that a good upgrade? I mean I don't want to pay $50 more for what I can do for free.

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#2 ohai

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Posted 30 July 2009 - 03:35 PM

BumpBump

#3 nodnarB7891

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 12:26 AM

It will be quite a large upgrade, provided you use applications that can take advantage of the extra processing power provided by Phenom II. If not, I'd consider more of a "sidegrade" in that you most likely would not be able to tell the difference in applications that don't need large amounts of processing power.

#4 ohai

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Posted 31 July 2009 - 06:54 AM

It will be quite a large upgrade, provided you use applications that can take advantage of the extra processing power provided by Phenom II. If not, I'd consider more of a "sidegrade" in that you most likely would not be able to tell the difference in applications that don't need large amounts of processing power.

I map for games like CS:S and TF2. I also like to have 30000 windows open at once so I guess that's good reason, right? And most new-era and even some old-era games use up to 8 cores if they can.

Edited by ohai, 31 July 2009 - 06:55 AM.


#5 DJBPace07

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Posted 02 August 2009 - 06:29 PM

AM2/AM2+ motherboards are getting a bit old. Purchasing an AM3 CPU and motherboard will help keep future upgrade paths open. However, the CPU's are a little more expensive as is the DDR3 RAM necessary to run them. If you want a comparable AM3 configuration an AMD Phenom II X4 945 Deneb 3.0GHz or an AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition Deneb 3.2GHz CPU on an ASRock M3A780GXH/128M AM3 AMD 780G HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard with Crucial 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1066 would be good combination. If you wish to remain with the older AM2 boards, a different motherboard is suggested. The ASRock A780GXE/128M AM2+/AM2 AMD 780G ATX AMD Motherboard gets great reviews. Note that AM3 CPU's will work with AM2/AM2+ motherboards. You won't get the benefits of running DDR3, though. However, if you want to use an AM3 CPU in an AM2/AM2+ motherboard, the motherboard manufacturer must support the CPU in the CPU support list and, if needed, the appropriate BIOS must be downloaded and flashed from them.

Edited by DJBPace07, 02 August 2009 - 06:31 PM.

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#6 ohai

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Posted 02 August 2009 - 11:19 PM

AM2/AM2+ motherboards are getting a bit old. Purchasing an AM3 CPU and motherboard will help keep future upgrade paths open. However, the CPU's are a little more expensive as is the DDR3 RAM necessary to run them. If you want a comparable AM3 configuration an AMD Phenom II X4 945 Deneb 3.0GHz or an AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition Deneb 3.2GHz CPU on an ASRock M3A780GXH/128M AM3 AMD 780G HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard with Crucial 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1066 would be good combination. If you wish to remain with the older AM2 boards, a different motherboard is suggested. The ASRock A780GXE/128M AM2+/AM2 AMD 780G ATX AMD Motherboard gets great reviews. Note that AM3 CPU's will work with AM2/AM2+ motherboards. You won't get the benefits of running DDR3, though. However, if you want to use an AM3 CPU in an AM2/AM2+ motherboard, the motherboard manufacturer must support the CPU in the CPU support list and, if needed, the appropriate BIOS must be downloaded and flashed from them.


tl;dr
OK forgot to mention this; I am not paying $50 extra for ram that has 5% better performance. I am not buying an AM3 motherboard because AM2/AM2+ motherboards work with AM3.

Edited by ohai, 02 August 2009 - 11:19 PM.


#7 DJBPace07

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Posted 03 August 2009 - 03:31 PM

You're reusing your old RAM. It's a cost-effective move, even though your RAM is slow. This will limit the boards you can use to AM2/AM2+ boards that can run the slower DDR2 speeds, such as DDR2-800. The DDR2 board I suggested will take DDR2-1066. Many AM2/AM2+ boards will work with AM3, but not all do and support for every single AM3 CPU is not guaranteed. As the AM3 platform becomes more mature, some motherboard manufacturers will stop releasing BIOS updates for AM2 boards. There are other benefits to using DDR3, but the difference between DDR3 and DDR2 is relatively minor.

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#8 ohai

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Posted 04 August 2009 - 10:37 AM

You're reusing your old RAM. It's a cost-effective move, even though your RAM is slow. This will limit the boards you can use to AM2/AM2+ boards that can run the slower DDR2 speeds, such as DDR2-800. The DDR2 board I suggested will take DDR2-1066. Many AM2/AM2+ boards will work with AM3, but not all do and support for every single AM3 CPU is not guaranteed. As the AM3 platform becomes more mature, some motherboard manufacturers will stop releasing BIOS updates for AM2 boards. There are other benefits to using DDR3, but the difference between DDR3 and DDR2 is relatively minor.

What will happen if I change my 2 older sticks to 1066MHz sticks? Will it run at 800MHz like the newer sticks or will it run at speed without dual channel?

#9 DJBPace07

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Posted 04 August 2009 - 03:39 PM

You will get increased performance, but if you're going to replace the RAM anyway, go for DDR3 since it is new and can be reused in another DDR3 board if you choose to upgrade later. However, it is about $5 to $10 more expensive than DDR2. DDR2-1066 (Note that there are DDR3-1066 sticks as well, double check what you're getting before ordering) can downclock itself to DDR2-800 speeds, but DDR2-800 cannot go to DDR2-1066. If the motherboard supports dual channel and you have identical sticks in the appropriate slots, they will be dual channel.

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#10 ohai

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 09:55 AM

You will get increased performance, but if you're going to replace the RAM anyway, go for DDR3 since it is new and can be reused in another DDR3 board if you choose to upgrade later. However, it is about $5 to $10 more expensive than DDR2. DDR2-1066 (Note that there are DDR3-1066 sticks as well, double check what you're getting before ordering) can downclock itself to DDR2-800 speeds, but DDR2-800 cannot go to DDR2-1066. If the motherboard supports dual channel and you have identical sticks in the appropriate slots, they will be dual channel.

And how's this to cool it? I was gonna step up to an $80 air cooler but this is almost no doubt better AMIRITE?

#11 ohai

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 02:54 PM

You will get increased performance, but if you're going to replace the RAM anyway, go for DDR3 since it is new and can be reused in another DDR3 board if you choose to upgrade later. However, it is about $5 to $10 more expensive than DDR2. DDR2-1066 (Note that there are DDR3-1066 sticks as well, double check what you're getting before ordering) can downclock itself to DDR2-800 speeds, but DDR2-800 cannot go to DDR2-1066. If the motherboard supports dual channel and you have identical sticks in the appropriate slots, they will be dual channel.

And how's this to cool it? I was gonna step up to an $80 air cooler but this is almost no doubt better AMIRITE?

amirite?

#12 DJBPace07

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 04:14 PM

Liquid cooling systems are more efficient in that they use liquid not air as the heat transfer medium. However, they are far from perfect and are not suggested for normal users who don't do extreme overclocking. Depending on the cooling system, you may need to replace the liquid. Also, if the components corrode or otherwise start to leak, your system can be destoryed. This is why do-it-youreslf liquid cooling systems aren't suggested. Buying a water cooled system from an OEM is a better choice since it will be covered under a warranty and it is more difficult to blame the user should something go wrong.

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#13 ohai

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 10:30 PM

Liquid cooling systems are more efficient in that they use liquid not air as the heat transfer medium. However, they are far from perfect and are not suggested for normal users who don't do extreme overclocking. Depending on the cooling system, you may need to replace the liquid. Also, if the components corrode or otherwise start to leak, your system can be destoryed. This is why do-it-youreslf liquid cooling systems aren't suggested. Buying a water cooled system from an OEM is a better choice since it will be covered under a warranty and it is more difficult to blame the user should something go wrong.

I do perform extreme overclocks, if you don't think so what do you call me OCing a 4000+ (2.1G stock) to 3.6GHz? :thumbsup: lol I was going to do a do-it-yourself system but those cost a lot more and NO ONE sells seperate tubes, you need to go to a store and find out if they won't rot under the basic or acidic power of the coolant.

And the ALC I showed you doesn't need its liquid filled or replaced EVER. and it would last 7+ years (assuming there are no odd conditions that you put it in) if you put it in say, a 24/7 server.

#14 DJBPace07

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 11:04 PM

I still stand by my suggestion, the potential damages from a malfunctioning water cooling system overrides the need in most situations. I'm more facinated with Peltier (a thermoelectric-based method) cooling than traditional water cooling. Basically, a Peltier is a small heat pump that works using an electrical current to heat one side of the device and then transfers the heat to the other against a thermal gradient. Other websites can explain the physics better than I can. With Peltier coolers, you can reach temperatures below the ambient temperature of the room. I'm not saying you should get one, but they are available in the extreme cooling category of heatsinks alongside water cooling.

ArsTechnica: The Ars Guide to Advanced Cooling: Peltier Edition
Wikipedia - Thermoelectric cooling

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#15 ohai

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Posted 08 August 2009 - 12:50 AM

I still stand by my suggestion, the potential damages from a malfunctioning water cooling system overrides the need in most situations. I'm more facinated with Peltier (a thermoelectric-based method) cooling than traditional water cooling. Basically, a Peltier is a small heat pump that works using an electrical current to heat one side of the device and then transfers the heat to the other against a thermal gradient. Other websites can explain the physics better than I can. With Peltier coolers, you can reach temperatures below the ambient temperature of the room. I'm not saying you should get one, but they are available in the extreme cooling category of heatsinks alongside water cooling.

ArsTechnica: The Ars Guide to Advanced Cooling: Peltier Edition
Wikipedia - Thermoelectric cooling

Can I say something to keep me from feeling stupid? Yes? OK!

I know everything there is to know about hardware, cooling, CPUs, RAM, video cards, ETC, i just dont like spending 2x as much for 1 degree cooler.




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