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Random BSODs


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#1 Eisenherz

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 08:13 AM

Hi there,

For about a month now, I have been experiencing random BSODs. I have tried to find something constant about when they happen, but to no avail. It sometimes happens after my computer has been on for 2 days with no problems - sometimes only after an hour. The message of the BSOD is quite different from a time to another, though the most common are BAD_POOL_HEADER and BAD_POOL_CALLER. I also once had MEMORY_MANAGEMENT and a few times NO_MORE_IRP_STACKS. The BSODs contain no driver information. After doing some research, everything lead to think my RAM was faulty, so I ran memtest86+ on each of my 4 RAM sticks on its own, but no error was found. The other possible cause I could find was a driver problem, so I updated the drivers I could think of - video card, sound card, a few USB devices... still didn't help. Now I am rather clueless, I am thinking maybe one of my HDs has a problem, or maybe my power supply, or CPU, or.......

It is important to mention that some other side-problems have also been affecting me, in case they are linked to this one. For a period of time (maybe 2 weeks), booting windows would take like 15 minutes. Then, once, my USB ports stopped working in 2.0 mode though they used to, and shortly after, my computer wouldn't boot at all, remaining stuck at the first step, before I could even access the BIOS. So in a last hope attempt I opened my computer, cleaned all the dust, removed all devices and put them in again, making sure everything was tight and clean (I also changed the thermal paste in the CPU, though it wasnt really dry), tried again, and magically, it booted fast enough and the USB issue was solved. First thing I did after getting in again, was backup everything and update the BIOS...

Another side-problem, which started maybe 1 month before all the rest, is that once in a while when rebooting, after windows has loaded, my screen starts showing everything with flashing lines making it impossible to read or use. This is always solved by a new reboot and only happens about 1 time out of 10. This hinted me towards a video card problem, but then again, now I am quite puzzled, I updated its driver and it didn't change anything, and most of the time it seems to be working just fine, for extended periods of time.

So I guess the BSODs could be both software or hardware related, and I'm having a really hard time to pinpoint where they come from precisely. The only thing I can remember having changed before they started is adding a 4 ports USB hub, though I'm not sure it actually was before. I tried disconnecting the hub and rebooting to see if it caused the problem, but it still crashed with a BSOD, so I guess that's not it (I had to install no drivers to use the hub).

Here are my specs:
CPU: Intel Pentium 4 640, 3200 MHz (16 x 200)
Motherboard: Asus P5LD2-VM
RAM: 2048 MB (DDR2-533 DDR2 SDRAM)
Video Card: All-in-Wonder X1900 (256 MB)
Monitor: HP w2207 Wide LCD
Sound card: Creative SB X-Fi Platinum
Other PCI: None
HDs: WDC WD2500JS-00MVB1 (232 GB, IDE) + Maxtor 6 L250R0 SCSI (250 GB, 7200 RPM, Ultra-ATA/133)
Drives: Floppy drive, LITE-ON DVDRW SHW-160P6S, SONY DVD RW DRU-810A
Router: Apple Airport Extreme, though it is only linked to the computer through the Ethernet wire.
USB:
- WD 10EAVS External HD (931 GB)
- M-Audio FastTrack USB
- USRobotics USR809600
- iPod (not always connected, BSDOs happen also when its not connected)
- Printer, Canon MX850
- 2-ports USB hub which is part of my screen
- Apple Mighty Mouse
- The 4-ports hub which is now disconnected.
- 3 other external HDs which, however, I have disconnected already 1 week ago as I don't need them right now, in case they might be the problem.
- Logitech Dual Action, but I also disconnected it, 3 weeks ago.
Power supply is 450w (I always thought it was quite low as 500 is recommended for my X1900, but I've had it for 2 years with no problems before...).

I am used to googling my computer problems and solve them myself, but I have been trying to fix this for 2 weeks now and I'm getting nowhere. Thanks in advance to anyone who reads and tries helping!!

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#2 DaffyKantReed

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 10:14 AM

Hi there,

For about a month now, I have been experiencing random BSODs. I have tried to find something constant about when they happen, but to no avail. It sometimes happens after my computer has been on for 2 days with no problems - sometimes only after an hour. The message of the BSOD is quite different from a time to another, though the most common are BAD_POOL_HEADER and BAD_POOL_CALLER. I also once had MEMORY_MANAGEMENT and a few times NO_MORE_IRP_STACKS. The BSODs contain no driver information. After doing some research, everything lead to think my RAM was faulty, so I ran memtest86+ on each of my 4 RAM sticks on its own, but no error was found. The other possible cause I could find was a driver problem, so I updated the drivers I could think of - video card, sound card, a few USB devices... still didn't help. Now I am rather clueless, I am thinking maybe one of my HDs has a problem, or maybe my power supply, or CPU, or.......

It is important to mention that some other side-problems have also been affecting me, in case they are linked to this one. For a period of time (maybe 2 weeks), booting windows would take like 15 minutes. Then, once, my USB ports stopped working in 2.0 mode though they used to, and shortly after, my computer wouldn't boot at all, remaining stuck at the first step, before I could even access the BIOS. So in a last hope attempt I opened my computer, cleaned all the dust, removed all devices and put them in again, making sure everything was tight and clean (I also changed the thermal paste in the CPU, though it wasnt really dry), tried again, and magically, it booted fast enough and the USB issue was solved. First thing I did after getting in again, was backup everything and update the BIOS...



Strip the machine down to the bare minimum of internal hardware. Remove all external devices as other than the HP monitor, KB, and mouse.

- single RAM module
- onboard video
- one harddrive
- CPU
- power supply




Monitor the PC for several days or even a week in this hardware configuration. Leave it running 24/7. If the symptoms continue, you now have few components which require troubleshooting. If the problems clear up, begin to add components at a rate of one piece every three days.

What brand and model number is the power supply? How old is it?

#3 Eisenherz

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 10:28 AM

Thanks a lot for the suggestion! I will be doing this experience next week then, and will report on it.

After verifying on the power supply what model it was, I found out it's not a 450w, but a 350! This is probably much under what I should be having, and it is quite shocking as the seller told me he installed a 450w one. Brand and model are FSP Group FSP350-60THN (doesn't seem like very high quality to me either). I guess this could explain a lot, though I've been having it for a bit more than 2 years with the same hardware inside the computer (but I did add more USB devices over time).

Edited by Eisenherz, 08 February 2009 - 10:29 AM.


#4 dc3

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 10:38 AM

The manufacturer suggest at least a 450W PSU for your graphics card, this could explain your problem.

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#5 DaffyKantReed

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 10:59 AM

Thanks a lot for the suggestion! I will be doing this experience next week then, and will report on it.

After verifying on the power supply what model it was, I found out it's not a 450w, but a 350! This is probably much under what I should be having, and it is quite shocking as the seller told me he installed a 450w one. Brand and model are FSP Group FSP350-60THN (doesn't seem like very high quality to me either). I guess this could explain a lot, though I've been having it for a bit more than 2 years with the same hardware inside the computer (but I did add more USB devices over time).



Your current power supply /might/ be able to deliver 22-25W on the +12V rails, and even that is not enough for a video card like the AIW X1900, never mind the processor and remaining hardware.

I suspect that once you strip the PC down as mentioned earlier in the thread it should run without flaw.

#6 Eisenherz

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 11:18 AM

Thanks again for these replies. I sure won't shop again where I bought this computer! I told them about the fact I had just ordered an X1900 and asked them specifically if they were sure the power supply was fine for it, they said it was.

I have just ordered a new one of 550w (ROSEWILL RP550V2-D-SL 550W - sounds ok?), but while waiting to receive it I'll still strip down the computer to test all hardware anyway.

#7 dc3

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 11:48 AM

I would just wait for the PSU and install it, I suspect that this is your problem. If the PSU is causing this stripping it down isn't going to help.

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#8 DaffyKantReed

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 02:59 PM

I have just ordered a new one of 550w (ROSEWILL RP550V2-D-SL 550W - sounds ok?), but while waiting to receive it I'll still strip down the computer to test all hardware anyway.



The RP550V2-D-SL 550W looks marginal for a power supply rated at 550W. I suggest looking at the Corsair CMPSU-550VX.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16817139004

#9 Eisenherz

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Posted 08 February 2009 - 03:11 PM

I have just ordered a new one of 550w (ROSEWILL RP550V2-D-SL 550W - sounds ok?), but while waiting to receive it I'll still strip down the computer to test all hardware anyway.



The RP550V2-D-SL 550W looks marginal for a power supply rated at 550W. I suggest looking at the Corsair CMPSU-550VX.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx...N82E16817139004


Well, I fear it's too late... I hope it wasn't a bad choice, maybe I shouldve taken the Corsair one, but now I've already paid. :thumbsup: Thanks anyway for the heads up :flowers:

#10 Eisenherz

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 12:02 AM

Hi again!

I have now changed my power supply, but it hasn't solved the problem. However, I kept experimenting with removing devices and such, and I am now pretty sure I narrowed down the problem: it seems to only happen when I have uTorrent running. I did some research and while I could find a few cases of blue screens "caused" by uTorrent, none had the same messages as me, and I could find no answer about it. According to their staff, it seems the program itself cannot cause BSODs, and that if they happen with the program running only, it reveals a hardware or driver problem. Does anyone have ideas or theories as to how uTorrent could cause this, and any tips on how it could (maybe) be solved?

Thanks again!

Edited by Eisenherz, 22 February 2009 - 12:03 AM.


#11 dc3

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 03:39 AM

Look in the Event Viewer and see what errors are showing up at the times that this is happening.

Start> right click on My Computer> Manage> Event Viewer.

On the right side of the page you will see the options Applications, Security, and Systems, double click on Systems. There are eight columns on this page, the three that you will want are Type, Date, Time, and Event.

The errors will appear in the Type column, they are red dots with a white X inside of them.

Warnings will appear as a yellow triangle with an exclamation mark inside.

When you see an error, double click on it and see what the description is.

Please post the error code/s found in the Event column and the descriptions back in this topic.

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#12 usasma

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 07:58 AM

"According to their staff, it seems the program itself cannot cause BSODs"
This is simply not true. Any program can cause a BSOD.

For example, if the uTorrent program want's to access your hard drive, it uses drivers to do this. If it calls to the drivers incorrectly, a BSOD will be the result. While not as common as driver/hardware issues - BSOD's are documented to have occurred from user-mode processes.

Most times this will happen (with a previously well-behaved program) due to a corruption occurring in the program - or in the driver.
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#13 Eisenherz

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 11:55 AM

Look in the Event Viewer and see what errors are showing up at the times that this is happening.

Start> right click on My Computer> Manage> Event Viewer.

On the right side of the page you will see the options Applications, Security, and Systems, double click on Systems. There are eight columns on this page, the three that you will want are Type, Date, Time, and Event.

The errors will appear in the Type column, they are red dots with a white X inside of them.

Warnings will appear as a yellow triangle with an exclamation mark inside.

When you see an error, double click on it and see what the description is.

Please post the error code/s found in the Event column and the descriptions back in this topic.


Ok, so I have a few 1002 errors in the last day or two though these did not result in BSODs. I am afraid the description might not mean so much to you as my system is in French, but here it is anyway: "Le bail de l'adresse IP 10.23.42.13 pour la carte réseau dont l'adresse réseau est 00FF83C17986 a été refusé par le serveur DHCP 10.23.42.14 (celui-ci a envoyé un message DHCPNACK)." It's the same for every 1002 error but with different IP adresses.

I also have some 10010 errors from the last weeks (not resulting in a BSOD either), with the message: "Le serveur {DC0C2640-1415-4644-875C-6F4D769839BA} ne s'est pas enregistré sur DCOM avant la fin du temps imparti."

The last error where I had a BSOD: error 1003, description: "Code erreur 000000c2, paramètre 1 00000007, paramètre 2 00000cd4, paramètre 3 0000075d, paramètre 4 8a7e0f1c." All the instances I could find of this one error have matched with the times I had my BSODs, and the description always remains the same except for some changing letters and numbers in the parameters.

I also had this a bit more than a week ago, it did not result in a BSOD: error 7000, description: "Le service NTPort Library Driver n'a pas pu démarrer en raison de l'erreur : Le fichier spécifié est introuvable."

#14 Eisenherz

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 11:58 AM

"According to their staff, it seems the program itself cannot cause BSODs"
This is simply not true. Any program can cause a BSOD.

For example, if the uTorrent program want's to access your hard drive, it uses drivers to do this. If it calls to the drivers incorrectly, a BSOD will be the result. While not as common as driver/hardware issues - BSOD's are documented to have occurred from user-mode processes.

Most times this will happen (with a previously well-behaved program) due to a corruption occurring in the program - or in the driver.


I must say, I am not sure that I can say it was a previously well-behaved program. After some thought, it is possible that the problems started directly when I started using uTorrent, though I cannot remember precisely enough to be 100% sure. Do you think I should think of blaming the software itself and just stop using it?

#15 dc3

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Posted 22 February 2009 - 12:15 PM

It may be worth uninstalling the u-torrent to see if this is causing the problem, it could be corrupted.

Is this computer connected to a network?

Do you have DSL modem connected over USB?

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