Jump to content


 


Register a free account to unlock additional features at BleepingComputer.com
Welcome to BleepingComputer, a free community where people like yourself come together to discuss and learn how to use their computers. Using the site is easy and fun. As a guest, you can browse and view the various discussions in the forums, but can not create a new topic or reply to an existing one unless you are logged in. Other benefits of registering an account are subscribing to topics and forums, creating a blog, and having no ads shown anywhere on the site.


Click here to Register a free account now! or read our Welcome Guide to learn how to use this site.

Photo

Artificial intelligence?


  • Please log in to reply
23 replies to this topic

#1 Wolfy87

Wolfy87

  • Members
  • 414 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 11 December 2008 - 03:19 PM

Hi there, would it ever be possible to create real evolving AI from just random numbers untill it finds its own patturn and creates its own method of thinking whilst evolving if you know what i mean, so you start with 0 and 1 and it evolves into a huge amout of data, say 1075 Mb large and for it to like just keep on growing and learning? Maby it would become dangerous though and overcome defences or somthing, is that possible too?

Thanks alot,

Wolfy87.

BC AdBot (Login to Remove)

 


#2 groovicus

groovicus

  • Security Colleague
  • 9,963 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Centerville, SD
  • Local time:02:39 PM

Posted 11 December 2008 - 06:33 PM

Not without some underlying structure. Something needs to generate those random numbers; they will not just appear on their own. Unlike the physical world where there are various atoms flinging about and colliding with each other, numbers do not merely exist. Even if there were some way to generate random on and off states (ones and zeroes) in some media (like a hard drive, or ram, etc), perhaps through random magnetism, then they remain just ones and zeroes. In the physical world, certain sorts of atoms are attracted to other atoms, and when they collide, reactions occur.Ones and zeroes are just ones and zeroes.

You are trying to apply evolution to a machine, which by definition has to have some rules, otherwise the machine would not work. Ones and zeros can not exist outside of that machine. Ones and zeroes will only ever be ones and zeroes. They can never be anything else. In the real world, atoms can combine to form new atoms.

#3 Wolfy87

Wolfy87
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 414 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 11 December 2008 - 06:40 PM

I do understand physics and this isnt realy like them in my eyes, i it read a load of data (its memory) and then had worked out its own way of processing it from the random numbers, it would keep "evolving" wouldnt it, it would make its own rules.

#4 groovicus

groovicus

  • Security Colleague
  • 9,963 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Centerville, SD
  • Local time:02:39 PM

Posted 11 December 2008 - 07:03 PM

A computer can't do anything that we don't tell it to do, so if it is to somehow interpret random data, we have to tell it how to do that. If we create the rules that tell it how to interpret random data, then there is no intelligence other than the programmer's. And if it were to make its own rules, someone would have to tell it how to do that. Again, they would be based on the programmer's algorithm. A machine can learn, but it learns based on rules it has been given. The answer is still no. :thumbsup:

That is why it is called artificial intelligence.

#5 Net_Surfer

Net_Surfer

  • Banned
  • 2,154 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Local time:01:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 02:20 AM

Hey Guys

Reading this post made me look for another post I did a few months ago.
Check it out,
It makes sense what you guys are mentioning in this post, I like this kind of topics, they are my favorite ones.


Here is the link to my thread.

Do you Know Computers?????? :huh:
(Needed to share this with the rest of the BleepingComputer Members, So they can reply with their own ideas)
:trumpet: In the mid 70s, an aspiring theoretical physicist made what he and many others feel is "the most important discovery in the world". This very significant film is about the resulting invention: (Computer Creativity Machine) "Simulates the Human Brain", one that can author all subsequent ideas, provide a totally unanticipated cosmology, and possibly deliver us from death. :woot:
In Its Image :cool:



:( I know, I had to sit on what I just saw for a few minutes before I posted it. I think its a good idea. But, some people will said, it could be extremely bad for humanity if the wrong person gets a hold of it. The only thing that kinda bothered me was how when you die, you could live on in cyberspace. What if you get caught in a glitch?? lol
:flowers:

:inlove: Well, from what I concluded, he was saying that he created a computer with a brain. It has two boxes that run it, One box absorbs information and creates connections between the information, finds patterns and so on. The other side: Looks for inconsistencies, incorrect logic, wrong math, etc. in short, he mimicked the function of a human brain. -

Right: "Creative",<--> Left: "Logic". :)

People who believe that this is like your average computer program with binary, this or that, reasoning. This is no different than how our brains already operate. Afterall, We are a binary reasoning organic computer already!!!
This is an upgrade! And one HELL of an upgrade it is!!!

Psss.... look at the US patent number at 12:11 into the video....US 5.656.666.....!? :thumbsup:

666!Hummmm

What Stephen Thaler has created is essentially "Thomas Edison in a box", said Rusty Miller, a government contractor at General Dynamics and one of Thaler's chief cheerleaders.

Edit: Moved topic from General Chat to the more appropriate forum. ~ Animal



A computer can't do anything that we don't tell it to do, so if it is to somehow interpret random data, we have to tell it how to do that. If we create the rules that tell it how to interpret random data, then there is no intelligence other than the programmer's. And if it were to make its own rules, someone would have to tell it how to do that. Again, they would be based on the programmer's algorithm. A machine can learn, but it learns based on rules it has been given. The answer is still no. :)

That is why it is called artificial intelligence.



#6 Wolfy87

Wolfy87
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 414 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 02:41 AM

Well we have never had a program that has reached a actual stage of itellegence though trial and error and very few rules, he built a computer to do it so why not a program?

#7 Wolfy87

Wolfy87
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 414 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 07:55 AM

Not without some underlying structure. Something needs to generate those random numbers; they will not just appear on their own.

No, if you generate the numbers and it depicts which ones to use ie it sort of uses the 0's and 1's as a binart form and slowly forms intellegence using the already made random numbers to choose the right ones. It makes its own rules in binary and could run directly through the processor and not windows.

#8 groovicus

groovicus

  • Security Colleague
  • 9,963 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Centerville, SD
  • Local time:02:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 08:32 AM

How will the CPU know what to do with random data?

#9 Wolfy87

Wolfy87
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 414 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 11:14 AM

You tell me :flowers: im just going on a hunch and threory but i guess it can never truely be acheved and if it was we would proboly go all strange and give it a random name like Jane, so is it possible or not to make artificial intellegence? Sum it up in 2 words please lol :thumbsup:

#10 reece

reece

  • Members
  • 25 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Local time:09:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 11:54 AM

it WONT know it will yust keep trying untill something works

#11 groovicus

groovicus

  • Security Colleague
  • 9,963 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Centerville, SD
  • Local time:02:39 PM

Posted 12 December 2008 - 12:01 PM

Artificial intelligence is a valid science backed by theory, and is used in a great many ways. You are talking about sentience.

#12 sausage

sausage

  • Members
  • 390 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Colorado
  • Local time:02:39 PM

Posted 13 December 2008 - 12:58 AM

I had some ok AI going in my java game. I don't know exactly what kind of AI you need but I hace a goblin attack with different attacks using if statements but if you are trying to get something to move araound then I can't help you there.

Edited by sausage, 13 December 2008 - 12:58 AM.


#13 nigglesnush85

nigglesnush85

  • Members
  • 4,371 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 13 December 2008 - 07:42 AM

The problem with AI on computers is that computers do what they are told to do.
For example double clicking on a folder on the desktop will open that folder and display its contents(manual task)
A script can be used to open the folder at a certain time. This doesn't demonstrate AI as it was told to perform the task.

In most cases AI is not in fact AI, but a series of statements designed to give the impression of intelligence.

With a game, for something to happen would use statements to control behavior. such as

enemy.scanArea
{
if target located
{
fire
}
else
{
Keep pacing.
}

Have a look at http://www.jabberwacky.com/ is is an AI chat bot.
Also http://robocode.sourceforge.net/ is a java based game where you can build bots and tell command them using basic Java.
Regards,

Alan.

#14 Wolfy87

Wolfy87
  • Topic Starter

  • Members
  • 414 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 14 December 2008 - 10:46 AM

Is this jabbawaky real AI though and not just preset commands that are unlocked through interaction?

#15 nigglesnush85

nigglesnush85

  • Members
  • 4,371 posts
  • OFFLINE
  •  
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:UK
  • Local time:08:39 PM

Posted 14 December 2008 - 02:15 PM

http://www.jabberwacky.com/j2about explains more about it
Regards,

Alan.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users