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kbk
Well what do you all think? I think there are some drugs which can be legalized (marijuana, DXM, and LSD for example), but there is no way that all drugs could be legalized, there are some things just not meant for human consumption. What do you guys think about this? And finally, how would you go about legalizing if you are for it?
MaraM
Vancouver has 'free needles and shoot-up sites' (sorry, can't remember the proper name for them right now) - and it seems to be working - less people zoned out and flopped on the street, less Aids and infections spread through using dirty needles and thankfully, less needles found by children in the parks and playgrounds!

But for legalizing the drugs themselves, hmmm. For marijuana, apparently it's relatively 'harmless' and I suspect very much like alchohol - so would vote 'yes' (providing it the same laws applied - legal age or it's still against the law).

As for the more 'serious' drugs - I'd vote 'no'. I think if the police had a change to have a real say in this, they too may vote hands-down - if for no other reason that with drugs go gangs, violence, B & E's and on and on. And for police officers themself, apparently they are few things as truly terrifying as trying to 'take down' someone 'souped up on PCP, etc'.

Have no idea how individual citizens would go about 'legalizing drugs' - but then again, other than perhaps marijuana, I wouldn't want to. (Personally, I have a wee theory about life - we are not our diseases or physical bodies/appearances - nope, we are, in reality, our brains - and why anyone would want to risk messing this magical things up is a bit beyond me).
Wildabeast
I don't see why Pot isn't legal yet, it's no worse than having a drunk drive.. maybe better. What I can remember, 25mph seemed like flying!
As for LSD, no, don't want someone tripping behind the wheel, don't know what DXM is. Guess I'm too old.
And I don't know how you can get it legal, I thought that all the people from the 70's would be running Congress and have that taken care of by now. blink.gif
Heretic Monkey
I really think marijuana should be legal. I'm not a pothead myself, but i do have a LOT of friends that smoke/have-smoked the stuff on a regular basis, and they're still completely normal. As others have said, i see that it's no worse than alcohol.

Of course, there would have to be rules. No driving under the influence of ANYTHING that impairs your reflexes or decisions.

As for the "harder" drugs, like crack, coke, meth, etc, i'm kind of split on a decision. If idiots want to shove that stuff into their own bodies, it doesn't affect me at all. However, if it's legalized, more people may take the chance and just see "what it's like" and completely destroy any possibility of leading a normal life...
kbk
DXM=Dextromethorphan (sp?) and it's the stuff in cough syrups and stuff. It's not technically illegal yet, but it's heading that way. I feel the same as you all do about the legalization of marijuana, and I feel the same as far as the 'hard' drugs go too. LSD though is a different issue, it fascinates me, I have no intention of ever using it, but I've been with people who are on it, and it's really amazing that a couple pieces of paper can make you go insane for 12 hours. I think LSD could be legalized, there would of course be an age limit, I don't think someone on LSD would be able to figure out how to even work a car let alone drive. As for DXM I think it should be legal as well, but with limitations on it, and I don't think one would be able to drive while on that either, I know I couldn't even leave my room because I was afraid of the hallway..
ussr1943
i believe that legalizing drugs is not that great of an idea. sure it makes you feel good, but it lasts a short period of time and in reality you are slowly killing yourself, or smoking yourself retarded. i know this stuff becuase some of my friends smoke pot now, and, jeez. i cant hang around with them any more its so rediculus they act so messed up and are jerks. not only that but alot more people would be tempted to say, its legal so it must be an ok thing! then more people would do it. not to mention that it would be ok for dealers to be around in the open selling, possibly imposing on someone elses territory starting a drugwar within the U.S.
i was talking to one of my friends and he said
"well it feels ok and it doesnt seem ba, it hasnt hurt me"
i told him " no, it hasnt hurt you yet. if you want something that makes you feel better while you kill yourself try youthenasia"
Heretic Monkey
Cigarettes and alcohol are legal, and are FAR from "good" for you, or even "neutral" for you. Again, people have the choice as to whether or not that use them, so why shouldn't they be legal?
cowsgonemadd3
QUOTE
As for the "harder" drugs, like crack, coke, meth, etc, i'm kind of split on a decision. If idiots want to shove that stuff into their own bodies, it doesn't affect me at all. However, if it's legalized, more people may take the chance and just see "what it's like" and completely destroy any possibility of leading a normal life...


No but people all "out of it" can pick up a gun and kill somebody.
Peoples lives are ruined by drugs. We have a relative who can still think and drive but he isnt all there. He is not handicapped but is you know not like us.

QUOTE
Cigarettes and alcohol are legal, and are FAR from "good" for you, or even "neutral" for you. Again, people have the choice as to whether or not that use them, so why shouldn't they be legal?


Drugs and alcohol are very different. Like comparing apples to oranges.

Cigs and Beer well they dont cause you to see things and fry your brain. If your drunk the effects wear off after a while if you take to much METH you can die or be a "dummy" for the rest of your life.

Legalizing those drugs so kids can get it is like giving a 2 year old a loaded gun. They wont know what "toooo much" is and they will ruin there lives.

Its very addictive.

EFFECTS OF MARIJUANA
http://www.marijuanaaddiction.info/effects-of-marijuana.htm
yano
Personally I laugh about marijuana being illegal. laugh.gif

Look at some movies, TV shows, they talk about it, and portray it in more and more occurrences it is hysterical!.

Also, so many still do marijuana, and if I remember correctly the average amount of people still do it.

Mexico recently legalized small possessions of certain drugs, including marijuana for personal use.(Source)

I think the "war on drugs," is another waste of money. We fighting a way that will never end. People will continue to use it, and the government HAS TO REALIZE that people will do transactions without paying taxes.

You don't pay taxes for a side job, when you are payed via paypal...

Why do you think the government wants to make gambling illegal? It's not about your addiction, it's about the money. All congress and the government sees is $


EDIT: Alcohol and cigarettes are just as addictive as marijuana. Look at the alcoholism in our country, and how much money the tobacco companies make off of people's addiction. sad.gif
kbk
[quote name='cowsgonemadd3' date='Oct 19 2006, 11:37 PM' post='377438']
[quote]EFFECTS OF MARIJUANA
http://www.marijuanaaddiction.info/effects-of-marijuana.htm
[/quote]


I agree with what you had to say about legalizing drugs like meth and things like that, however, those "effects" of marijuana, don't happen with every user. It effects everyone differently, such as, I've never hallucinated, nor do I know anyone who has hallucinated from marijuana use, most people I know who smoke can still drive cars, I only know one person who has anxiety or panic attacks and that is because of a pre-existing condition. Also, the cancer thing has been disproven, {Source}. It is less harmful for your body (overall) than smoking tabacco, and although more addictive than alcohol, it doesn't effect your judgement and thinking ability for nearly as long as alcohol does. I also know people who smoke every day and if/when they run out they aren't all of a sudden unable to pay attention and whatnot, they do just fine.. Almost everyone I know who smokes is either passing school or doing better than me in school..
Scarlett
In case anyone is interested, this topic has been covered here as well:

http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/ind...mp;hl=marijuana

wink.gif
moomoo
NO NEVER!!! THEY SHOLDNT LEGALIZED DRUGS!!! Whats it gonna bring to the streets? more gang violence...more innocent deaths...more homocides, gang wars and it'll be TOTAL CHAOS. Drugs make you do crazy things as you know and if it gets legalized...ur gonna have pot heads all over the streets...robbing you or jumping you at any time possible..legalizing drugs would be a HUGE MISTAKE.
kbk
QUOTE(moomoo @ Oct 21 2006, 04:26 PM) *
NO NEVER!!! THEY SHOLDNT LEGALIZED DRUGS!!! Whats it gonna bring to the streets? more gang violence...more innocent deaths...more homocides, gang wars and it'll be TOTAL CHAOS. Drugs make you do crazy things as you know and if it gets legalized...ur gonna have pot heads all over the streets...robbing you or jumping you at any time possible..legalizing drugs would be a HUGE MISTAKE.

Are you kidding? It would reduce gang violence because it would remove drug dealers from the streets (although crack/coke/meth/H/E dealers would probably still be around if only marijuana was legalized). Also, I don't know anyone who has EVER gone crazy from smoking grass, at least not to the point of killing people or anything. Everything you just said you probably heard in highschool/middleschool health class, show me some stats of people getting stoned and going on crazy rampages.. I'd love to see it.
cowsgonemadd3
QUOTE
Are you kidding? It would reduce gang violence because it would remove drug dealers from the streets (although crack/coke/meth/H/E dealers would probably still be around if only marijuana was legalized). Also, I don't know anyone who has EVER gone crazy from smoking grass, at least not to the point of killing people or anything. Everything you just said you probably heard in highschool/middleschool health class, show me some stats of people getting stoned and going on crazy rampages.. I'd love to see it.


Not just the one drug but the really bad ones.

It wouldnt remove them from the street. It would PUT THEM On the street in the OPEN selling it freely as kids fry there brains and people kill each other.

Marajuana will mess you up to. Saying it wont is crazy. Drugs arent meant for the body. Over time something will happen.
Heretic Monkey
That's why people are selling cigarettes and alcohol on every street corner.....

Back in the days of prohibition, there WERE places selling alcohol illegally, in back alleys and "speak easies". Once it became legal again, it was once again controlled.... well, to the best of the authorities ability.
cowsgonemadd3
Its just not the same with beer and cigs vs these drugs. The effects are so different. Its not a wise move to legalize them unless you are trying to get rid of a lot of teens/adults because drugs will mess you up.
Scarlett
Thinking out loud here. I wonder how high taxes would be on marijuana if ever legal. Especially considering the size of taxes on cigarettes. blink.gif
ryan_w_quick
I think that all drugs should be legalized. If we made it so people didn't have to sneak around to get things to put in their body, there would be less gang related crimes (since I am pretty sure that illegal drugs is how gangs are able to operate, main revenue) and then we could clear space in jail for the real criminals.

I don't really care how bad the drugs are for people. I mean, gasoline is really bad for you if consumed also. I can get it very easily at a gas station. That doesn't mean that I will just drink it.
cowsgonemadd3
QUOTE
Especially considering the size of taxes on cigarettes.


Which they ought to add about 2 bucks more per pack so people WONT start smoking or continue if they do.

QUOTE
I think that all drugs should be legalized. If we made it so people didn't have to sneak around to get things to put in their body, there would be less gang related crimes (since I am pretty sure that illegal drugs is how gangs are able to operate, main revenue) and then we could clear space in jail for the real criminals.


Maybe less gang crimes but more kids getting in a lot of trouble.

With all the people who would fry there brains out i'm sure taking care of the mental would be a lot too.

Nobody is going to drink gas. Just a little of that and your dead.
ryan_w_quick
QUOTE(cowsgonemadd3 @ Oct 23 2006, 12:00 AM) *
QUOTE
Especially considering the size of taxes on cigarettes.


Which they ought to add about 2 bucks more per pack so people WONT start smoking or continue if they do.

QUOTE
I think that all drugs should be legalized. If we made it so people didn't have to sneak around to get things to put in their body, there would be less gang related crimes (since I am pretty sure that illegal drugs is how gangs are able to operate, main revenue) and then we could clear space in jail for the real criminals.


Maybe less gang crimes but more kids getting in a lot of trouble.

With all the people who would fry there brains out i'm sure taking care of the mental would be a lot too.

Nobody is going to drink gas. Just a little of that and your dead.


My point with the gas is a little over exagerated I know. But, say I could go by some meth legally from the CVS down the road right now. Would I do it? No. No.

I mean, what ever happened to parenting in this country? Everyone is saying that drugs should not be legalized cause kids would get in to much trouble and fry their brains. For you old timers with teens in high school who are still oblivious, when your kids go out Friday night and spend the night somewhere and don't come home until 5:00 PM the next day, they didn't just have a long night, they had a wild night.

I am a Freshman in college, where it is even worse than highshcool. But, just a year ago in high school, I could obviously easily obtain marijuana and alcohol whenver I wanted. Now, it was also possible on most weekends to get a hold of cocaine or meth, which I never chose to partake of.

And you think that if drugs were legalized that this would be more of a problem????

Parents should take control and stop looking to the government to solve all their problems. If you're one of those parents who works 50 hours to 60 hours a week maybe you should get a regular job so that you can spend some time with your kids and teach them some important things, like "don't put this in your body."
What The Who
QUOTE(cowsgonemadd3 @ Oct 21 2006, 10:06 PM) *
Drugs arent meant for the body.

Are you serious? That's EXACTLY what drugs are for. Both the synthetic and naturally occuring ones. I would honestly like to know what you think drugs are for, if not for the body.

This conversation has been had before. I've shown you statistics from studies paid for and sponsored by the U.S. government that show, in theory, crime will decrease if and when marijuana is legalized. Here is that forum.. Denver Lagalizes Marijuana.
DSTM
QUOTE(What The Who @ Dec 28 2006, 01:08 AM) *
QUOTE(cowsgonemadd3 @ Oct 21 2006, 10:06 PM) *
Drugs arent meant for the body.

Are you serious? That's EXACTLY what drugs are for. Both the synthetic and naturally occuring ones. I would honestly like to know what you think drugs are for, if not for the body.

This conversation has been had before. I've shown you statistics from studies paid for and sponsored by the U.S. government that show, in theory, crime will decrease if and when marijuana is legalized. Here is that forum.. Denver Lagalizes Marijuana.


Are you serious "What The Who"? Synthetic and Natural occuring Drugs are used and prescribed by trained Medical Practitioners and Specialists for use in the Medical field.
Marijuana, should never be legalised,in my opinion, because what medical qualifications do you have, to say what drug is safe and in what quantities.
If you couldn't get high on it you wouldn't go near it,I would guess.
So why should our Governments make it easier for you or anybody else to access Marijuana?
To me the crime argument is a pretty weak one.Make the penalties tougher would be a good start.IMO.
My niece started smoking Marijuana and she has turned into a real "Dope Head",and in my opinion Marijuana is merely a stepping stone on the way to harder drugs.
What The Who
The so-called "Gateway Theory" was dismissed many years ago as a baseless assumption. I really wish people would stop citing that theory.

I will freely admit I do not have the medical qualifications to say what drug is safe and which isn't. I have however, read the studies and reports published by those with the proper medical qualifications. Example; You would need to smoke the equivalant of 900 joints in a 15 minute period to overdose on marijuana. That's impossible. Conversely, it only takes a few bottles of liquor to overdose from alcohol.

QUOTE
Synthetic and Natural occuring Drugs are used and prescribed by trained Medical Practitioners and Specialists for use in the Medical field.

...yeah. And what are they used for? What are they used in?? The body. My point was this.. What are drugs for if not the body?
arcman
Marijuana I'm kind of on the fence about, technically it's not much worse than tobacco aside from making you an inebriated pothead, so I don't know of a very compelling argument for it to remain an illegal substance.

For things like meth and crack however, these substances are incredibly addicting with rather devastating effects on the body, and no matter which way you cut it, it's detrimental to society. Not only are there no benefits to making physically addicting drugs like that legal, but it would also be licensing full blown exploitation of the consumer base by whoever manufactured and distributes the drugs.
DSTM
QUOTE(What The Who @ Dec 28 2006, 03:54 PM) *
The so-called "Gateway Theory" was dismissed many years ago as a baseless assumption. I really wish people would stop citing that theory.

I will freely admit I do not have the medical qualifications to say what drug is safe and which isn't. I have however, read the studies and reports published by those with the proper medical qualifications. Example; You would need to smoke the equivalant of 900 joints in a 15 minute period to overdose on marijuana. That's impossible. Conversely, it only takes a few bottles of liquor to overdose from alcohol.

QUOTE
Synthetic and Natural occuring Drugs are used and prescribed by trained Medical Practitioners and Specialists for use in the Medical field.

...yeah. And what are they used for? What are they used in?? The body. My point was this.. What are drugs for if not the body?


You brought up a good point regarding Alcohol.To me this is a scurge on our society.The amount of road deaths and misery caused by Alcohol is alarming to me anyway.

I have never seen a Marijuana smoke in your mouth cause a road fatality,or any sort of smoke for that matter.The difference being Marijuana is an illegal drug in most countries,and our Governments from their research considers it to have harmful effects on the human body.

Experimenting with these drugs is not very smart to me.
Every drug has some affect on our bodies, and should only be taken only when absolutely necessary.IMO.
yoopergirl
It's like deja vu, this topic has to have been here before.

Yes legalize pot! It's no worse than alcohol and could actually help some people kick that harmful habit! I am also surprised that it has not been legalized already. Some people say no, it's harmful and the government should block it. Well, how about fat? Should they make fat illegal? It can block arteries! it can cause heart attacks! How about high blood pressure? No more FAT! Get real! The decision shouldn't be in the governments hands at all since it can be grown naturally in every back yard in the world, don't we all have the right to what god has given us? THATS the problem, It can't be taxed! Ahuh! that's why they wont legalize it! I swear if some man or woman for that matter ran for president in the next election with the slogan, I'll legalize pot, they'd be elected without question! lol

I don't like pot, it makes me sick, literally. BUT I have a zillion friends that love the stuff and they are not wacked, addicted, violent, hallucinating or I dunno, I can't even tell if they're stoned or not actually, maybe they smile a lil more. I think it's harmless, it's a lil like the effects of chocolate, only magnified. Whats the harm of happy people now and then?

The other drugs listed, the thought of legalizing them scares the crap out of me! Not cause I wanna block people from it, just cause I don't wanna have to around someone at the mall who's tripping on acid or something, thats scary stuff! They don't even have a clue, that's not a good thing. Maybe legalize it in a controlled environment, like it's legal if you agree to being straightjacketed and in a padded, locked cell. LMAO Ridiculous I know, but noone should be allowed to trip if it means harming innocent people. Legalizing it somehow would end a lot of crime though.

And for the person that said something like a pot head would attack them on the street for pot money? What planet are you on and what are you smoking? hmmm? hysterical.gif I bet there's not one report anywhere that states that someone that was high on pot attacked them, ever. If you find one, make sure that's ALL they were said to be on.
Constantine
Legalise drugs. Take control of supple. Control quality and price. Treat it like a health issue.

One further point. Look at the statistics. The number of people killed by alcohol, tobacco, heroin, pot etc...

Its not even a contest. Alcohol and tobacco kill many many times more people than all the rest combined..argue with that!!
joygreen
Let's think about this. I have a quote from http://www.prohibitioncosts.org/

"Milton Friedman, 500+ Economists Call for Marijuana Regulation Debate; New Report Projects $10-14 Billion Annual Savings and Revenues
Savings/Revenues Projected in New Study by Harvard Economist Could Pay For:
**Implementing Required Port Security Plans in Just One Year
**Securing Soviet-Era "Loose Nukes" in Under Three Years
Replacing marijuana prohibition with a system of taxation and regulation similar to that used for alcoholic beverages would produce combined savings and tax revenues of between $10 billion and $14 billion per year, finds a June 2005 report by Dr. Jeffrey Miron, visiting professor of economics at Harvard University.

The report has been endorsed by more than 530 distinguished economists, who have signed an open letter to President Bush and other public officials calling for "an open and honest debate about marijuana prohibition," adding, "We believe such a debate will favor a regime in which marijuana is legal but taxed and regulated like other goods."

Chief among the endorsing economists are three Nobel Laureates in economics: Dr. Milton Friedman of the Hoover Institute, Dr. George Akerlof of the University of California at Berkeley, and Dr. Vernon Smith of George Mason University.

Dr. Miron's paper, "The Budgetary Implications of Marijuana Prohibition," concludes:
**Replacing marijuana prohibition with a system of legal regulation would save approximately $7.7 billion in government expenditures on prohibition enforcement -- $2.4 billion at the federal level and $5.3 billion at the state and local levels.

**Revenue from taxation of marijuana sales would range from $2.4 billion per year if marijuana were taxed like ordinary consumer goods to $6.2 billion if it were taxed like alcohol or tobacco.

These impacts are considerable, according to the Marijuana Policy Project in Washington, D.C. For example, $14 billion in annual combined annual savings and revenues would cover the securing of all "loose nukes" in the former Soviet Union (estimated by former Assistant Secretary of Defense Lawrence Korb at $30 billion) in less than three years. Just one year's savings would cover the full cost of anti-terrorism port security measures required by the Maritime Transportation Security Act of 2002. The Coast Guard has estimated these costs, covering 3,150 port facilities and 9,200 vessels, at $7.3 billion total.

"As Milton Friedman and over 500 economists have now said, it's time for a serious debate about whether marijuana prohibition makes any sense," said Rob Kampia, executive director of the Marijuana Policy Project in Washington, D.C. "We know that prohibition hasn't kept marijuana away from kids, since year after year 85% of high school seniors tell government survey-takers that marijuana is 'easy to get.' Conservatives, especially, are beginning to ask whether we're getting our money's worth or simply throwing away billions of tax dollars that might be used to protect America from real threats like those unsecured Soviet-era nukes."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I encourage Americans to study this and to write to congress.org. The "War against Poverty" just made more poor people. The "War against Drugs" now has a "Drug Czar" who uses his budget to impact elections (which is illegal) and puts non-violent American youngsters in jail; using up beds that are needed for the illegal aliens invading our country...

Let's get real, people. Cannabis was demonized by the liquor industry. Hemp is a cash crop that is imported as a wood-product substitute. Cannabis is a pain-killer and it has even been suggested that it helps people lose weight! Cannabis is not addictive like alcohol is, and can be used to help alcoholics stop destroying their livers and killing people with their cars. We have TOO MUCH GOVERNMENT when it comes to individuals' rights. Cannabis could be a great new industry that provides food protein, oil for power, grows fast and easy to clean our air, and on and on. We need border patrol agents more than we need the DEA. People who suffer constant pain are treated like criminals, along with the doctors who try to help them. Step up and tell the politicians to get logical. Spend the money where it is needed first!

Peace and Love,
Joy
joygreen
Did anybody see the History Channel's "Illegal Drugs and how they got that way?" (in America). They said the early 1900's laws passed against now-illegal drugs were racist-oriented. I agree that hard (addictive) drugs should be controlled, but cocaine is used for eye surgery and that is why people can have their cataracts removed safely. Cannabis (hemp) is a relatively harmless substance - not addictive. As long as corporations don't get ahold of it it would stay that way. It's a great treatment for alcoholism, nausea, pain and insomnia. We import hemp as a lumber substitute. It is also a source for protein, renewable-energy oil, and grows anywhere so it cleans the air. If you don't like to be around stoned-out people, just don't hang out with them! But just like with Prohibition; law-breakers are getting rich, anybody can get the stuff if they have enough money, and the government is wasting jail beds locking up non-violent pot-heads, ruining young peoples' future opportunities to get licensed or employed in some jobs. Drug testing goes on for everybody but our lawmakers! What's good for the goose should be good for the gander... I know doctors who think pot should be legalized - if you OD, you just go to sleep, not get in a car and kill somebody... To get the real research and not the propaganda, see MPP and NORML.
MaraM
Re: Cannabis (hemp) is a relatively harmless substance - not addictive.

I honestly don't know a lot about street drugs, but while I agree that the people I've seen who were "pot heads" were pretty 'mellow' - I really hate it when they get behind the wheel of a vehicle, claiming they are actually better drivers while under the influence.

'Grass' may not be addictive in the ordinary sense (for every medical 'authority' that says it is, there's one that says it isn't) - and I'm the first to admit that the people I know who use it are still gainfully employed, but I do wonder about the effect it can have 'long term', both on family life and general health.

And for instance, the cost is so high that surely it must affect finances drastically?

Edit: Hmmm, I may have to rethink some things I simply have taken for granted, after all. For instance, while finding information on Holland re legalization of drugs, (under 'Gay Marriage' thread), found that apparently there are less young people using there than here in Canada, for instance. Yup, hmmmmm to myself - gentle smile.
joygreen
Way to go, Mara!

With a very friendly smile, I suggest there is at least 50 years experience with Cannabis ("if you remember the sixties you weren't there" hysterical.gif ); and way more history than that since it has been used around the world for generations. Alcoholics in rehab are there to die. Anybody else can recover, especially if they have cannabis to tide them through the tough times. Some people use a glass of wine: OK; but bottles of the stuff? When I worked downtown I used to see drunks outside the window, lying down to roll over and urinate on the sidewalks: gag me out!

We have an American website called "DontVote". Too many people vote here without knowing the issues or the candidates. We are ending up with way too much government and not enough protection.

Our drug companies are making BILLIONS of dollars in profits. The American middle class has been destroyed. We outsource our jobs and insource aliens to work cheap and drive up the stock market. All our stuff is now imported from China that is now so rich she doesn't know what to do with her money except to burn gas with junk cars destroying the ozone layer (further) and watch the American military in action. That is the country that kills girl babies.

I hope that people give thought to the economists' study, and vote accordingly when the subject comes up in their states and countries. Illegal stuff is far easier for kids to get than regulated stuff. People are not willing to lose their business licenses to sell alcohol or cigarettes illegally. Drug dealers know how to trick children with small quantities and low prices...

Peace!
MaraM
Yup, I often have to re-think stuff - drat! smile.gif

In reality, I do wonder about the non-legalization of 'grass' yet alchohol and cigarettes, etc are legal. Not only legal, but the government makes a fortune on taxes alone on these items.

In fact, our society does seem to be a bit unbalanced about this stuff. People who smoke are the society outcasts for the 2000s, yet as DSTM said, smoking does not kill hundreds of thousands on our highways each year. Nor does it have the family violence problems and inability to hold down a job, etc that alchohol often causes.

Let's see - while neither is 'good', given a choice of booze and violence or 'grass' and mellow laid back people. Hmmm. Yup, I really do have to rethink some things I've always taken for granted. Gentle smile.

P.S. Joygreen ... please tell me that the 'NoVote' site really means 'know before you vote' - grin. For myself, if I don't vote I can't grumble about the government - another grin.
inertiatic
True, our society is a bit backwards, having legalized alcohol and not marijuana. Given the choice, I would rather have marijuana legalized than alcohol. I have friends that smoke weed, and they are completely harmless. Alcohol kills people. I don't have any desire to do drugs, but I believe that weed is definitely the lesser of the two evils, so to speak.
Smoking kills, too. My grandfather, whom I was very close to, died when I was 7. He was in his 60's, and had been a smoker since 16. He got lung cancer from smoking, and it killed him. I find it interesting that problems, such as lung cancer, that are directly caused by smoking kill 20 times more people than murder. That is a fact, and one that, combined with the death of my grandfather, has turned me against smoking. I won't shove my ideology down your throat, but I will give you the facts, and my own personal experience, and you can decide if being addicted to nicotine is worth it.
blueandgold04
QUOTE(moomoo @ Oct 21 2006, 02:26 PM) *
NO NEVER!!! THEY SHOLDNT LEGALIZED DRUGS!!! Whats it gonna bring to the streets? more gang violence...more innocent deaths...more homocides, gang wars and it'll be TOTAL CHAOS. Drugs make you do crazy things as you know and if it gets legalized...ur gonna have pot heads all over the streets...robbing you or jumping you at any time possible..legalizing drugs would be a HUGE MISTAKE.



why would there be more gang violence? the drugs are legal now, there is no money in it for the gangs. in developed countries where drugs are legal, the crime rates are low because there is nothing to be gained from violence.

true drugs make you do crazy things, some drugs. but the natural drugs, such as pot or mushrooms, make you paranoid. thus, roaming the streets looking to mess with people is the last thing from ones mind. if anyone knows true potheads, name one that beats their children.

the truth is, in our system, drugs are lucrative. money leads to greed, and greed leads to violence. take the money out of the equation. where would thugs get their motivation from? they would actually have less motivation.
TheTerrorist_75
I have smoked pot on and off since 1967 without any side effects, personality disorders or medical issues. I can state it is just as dangerous to drive stoned on weed as it is being drunk. It impairs your reactive timing. It has shown to be beneficial for some diseases. I do believe it should be legalized and taxed. Don't believe the hype going around that weed is evil.

As for LSD forget it. I messed with it in the early '70s and can state it will harm you. A very good friend of mine suffered a bad trip in '74 and is still undergoing mental treatment. He cannot function normally nor take care of himself.

Coke, crack, meth and many other hard line drugs can kill you. I have seen too many die from these hard drugs.

As for the kiddie drugs such as DXM there is not enough research on the long term consequences to determine if they are truly safe.
joygreen
Why are our governments not as logical as we? I just got some Hemp protein at the health food store. It's a complete protein, with the Omega 3 and 6 fatty acids that feed the brain, and an excellent fiber. As a plant, it has no natural enemies (except man) and so can be grown organically. Why should America import this weed that would provide fuel, food, fiber for clothing, wood-substitutes and clean the air without the need for water and fertilizers? If ever there were a perfect plant, Cannabis and Hemp are IT!

Let's find out what Rudy thinks about it!
blueandgold04
QUOTE
The difference being Marijuana is an illegal drug in most countries,and our Governments from their research considers it to have harmful effects on the human body.


DSTM, respectfully, what drug prescribed by doctors doesn't have harmful effects on the body? i am sure you have listened to television ads about new prescription drugs on the market. some of the side effects are ghastly, occasionally worse than the condition it 'fixes'. forgive me, but i don't really trust the government to give me a straight story about my personal protection. they are in the pockets of the pharmaceutical companies.

i can respect your views about legalization. but the choice to put something in one's own body should be their choice. i understand that the burden of insurance and health care increases with this assertion. yet, why is a 35 year old obese male, whose only good choice in diet is to drink the occasional glass of water, granted health insurance without scrutiny?

as for the legalization of pot, of course the government/pharma companies resist it. a natural and cheap remedy for many ailments, from toothaches, to upset stomach, to high blood pressure. add to that the limited amount and severity of side-effects, and i would say many people would be on-board.

many doctors have financial interest in drug companies. if you had a monopoly on the current mechanism to heal people and you were making a killing, wouldn't that be difficult to surrender?

i guess what i am trying to say is that everyone, at some time or another in life, tries to avoid or dampen suffering.
DSTM
Hi blueandgold4,I agree some of the phama Co's and Doctors are corrupt.There was an inquiry here about 2 yrs ago looking into the perks Doctors were recieving from Pharma Co's in the way of expensive gifts and overseas holidays.Didn't hear what the end result was
.
Also I said in a previous post that all drugs have some harmful affect on you.Why,because I am a classic case of the results of over prescribed medicines and worse still pain killers.I have permantly damaged internal organs as a direct result.I won't tell you why I had to have all this medication,except to say I came close to death last September from organ failure,as a direct result of too many prescription drugs.

I would think Marijuana has been tested as a possible alternative to some prescription drugs and most likely failed some of the tests reguired.I also would guess a lot of pot heads would like to see it legalised,so they can obtain better quality at a cheaper price.You dont have to convince me of the benifits of Marijuana,take all your scientific data to your Government,because thats who you have to convince to have it legalised.
I merely gave an opinion the same as you,and we respect each others right to do so.
joygreen
With all respect to those participating in this discussion, I submit that our Governments have not found a way to exploit Cannabis for their political campaign coffers. Therefore, they "find" it an illicit narcotic. Who in their right mind would believe "Reefer Madness", a government issued propaganda film about how "Marijuana" causes people to rape and murder. In fact, the word "Marijuana" was invented by the American government (or the liquor industries) to demonize this plant. Cannabis is an excellent pain reliever: it is not addictive, and it can be taken as food so that our lungs are not assaulted by smoke. Yet the government and their wealthy pharmaceutical companies with deeeeeep pockets buy their way into government preference because of their large campaign donations. Hemp and Cannabis, if legalized, would enable new industries in America which we sorely need since we have outsourced most of our jobs.

One other point: the FDA (Food & Drug Association, a government agency in the U.S.) is supposed to certify the safety and efficacy of drugs released to the public. Those guys are in bed with the Pharmaceutical companies. I have seen a number of investigative reports on this very scary issue. When such huge amounts of money are involved, it is almost impossible to expect those in the distribution chain to not stick their hands in the coffers.

We would all like to believe in the honesty and ethics of our governments, but it just isn't so. Greed overpowers the needs of 'the people'. Why is it legal to require drug testing by corporations of their employees, when there is no such thing required of Government officials? Teachers are required to take courses in Ethics, but our political leaders do not. Cigarette smoking has been banned indoors in several states for years now; yet it was only just decided that there would be no smoking in the lobby just outside the doors of where Congress assembles to vote (the places we see on C-Span). Government agencies cook their books to get their bonuses, whereas employees of corporations who do not follow Generally Accepted Accounting Principles would be fined and jailed. What's good for the goose is not good for the gander in our political society. We must be informed, and read between the lines, to make the right voting decisions. Here in Tampa, an attorney who worked for the Clerk of the Circuit Court for seven years (a very complex organization) was defeated in the election: the job was given to a politico who had better name recognition.

I love my Country, but I fear the political corruption and uninformed Americans will destroy us in the next ten years; unless "We The People" rise up and get smart about what's really going on. Who here has heard about the Mexican Army's incursion into Arizona in January 2007? They were in uniform and carrying AK-47's. But our politically correct, liberal left news organizations did not report this attack. Our Constitution mandates our legislators to protect us from invasion; America has a right to her sovereignty. Yet our legislators ignore their duty in exchange for votes. sad.gif
joygreen
Hey, if life insurance companies are willing to insure cannabis users, I'd say they've done their homework. Here's a quote from the insurance company, and its findings on long term cannabis use:

Washington, DC: The National Organization for the Reform of Marijuana Laws (NORML), the nation's oldest and most respected cannabis-law reform organization, today announced that life insurance is finally available for adult cannabis consumers.

NORML has partnered with The McLaughlin Company and a pair of nationally recognized insurance providers to offer life insurance products to responsible cannabis consumers. Previously, adults who self-reported using cannabis ­-- even in moderate amounts --­ were denied life insurance coverage or, at best, offered coverage at a grossly inflated premium. Starting today, cannabis consumers will have access to the same types of life insurance plans as non-users, and they will no longer be forced to pay excessively high premiums.

"Unlike cigarettes or even alcohol, moderate use of cannabis --­ even when used long-term ­-- is not shown to have significant negative ramifications on health or mortality," ** NORML Executive Director Allen St. Pierre said. "As a result, responsible cannabis consumers should not be forced to pay inflated premiums or be denied insurance coverage because of their marijuana use."

NORML and its partners hope to expand its life insurance program to offer cannabis-friendly disability and health insurance products later this year.

For more information, please contact NORML Executive Director Allen St. Pierre at (202) 483-5500 or visit: http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=7128.

PS: Hemp is now sold in health food stores as a vegan, kosher, organic source of COMPLETE PROTEIN that also provides the essential fatty acids and fiber. It's a perfect food, made from the seeds of a weed that grows everywhere in the world except the north and south poles. It requires no fertilizer, pesticides or extra water. It's made of the seeds, ground into a powder that is a lovely shade of green.

Joy
fozzie
QUOTE
I would think Marijuana has been tested as a possible alternative to some prescription drugs and most likely failed some of the tests reguired.I also would guess a lot of pot heads would like to see it legalised,so they can obtain better quality at a cheaper price.You dont have to convince me of the benifits of Marijuana,take all your scientific data to your Government,because thats who you have to convince to have it legalised.
I merely gave an opinion the same as you,and we respect each others right to do so.


THis article of the Journal of the American Medical Association might interest you DSTM
thrillhouse
here's an interesting article aswell:

QUOTE
Medical Marijuana, American Federalism, and the Supreme Court

Lawrence O. Gostin, JD, LLD (Hon)

JAMA. 2005;294:842-844.

In Gonzalez v Raich, the US Supreme Court held that federal law enforcement authorities could criminally prosecute patients for possessing marijuana prescribed by a physician in accordance with state law.1 The Court did not overturn state medical marijuana laws but did open the door to criminal prosecution under federal drug statutes. The Court also did not foreclose future challenges to federal enforcement on other constitutional grounds (eg, an unwarranted invasion of patient-physician privacy).

Explaining the significance of Raich requires examination of 2 issues. The first concerns American federalism and raises an important constitutional principle about the appropriate scope of federal public health powers. The second issue concerns the use of marijuana as a medical treatment and raises intriguing questions about the practice of medicine and the patient-physician relationship. In Raich, the Supreme Court pointedly questioned the wisdom of prosecuting patients: "The case is made difficult by respondents’ strong arguments that they will suffer irreparable harm because . . . marijuana does have valid therapeutic purposes. The question before us, however, is not whether [the policy] is wise, [but] whether Congress has the power to regulate . . . medicinal substances . . . produced and consumed locally."

Gonzalez v Raich


California’s Compassionate Use Act of 1996 (enacted by Proposition 215) was designed to ensure that "seriously ill" residents have access to marijuana for medical purposes to relieve suffering. The act exempts physicians, patients, and primary caregivers from criminal prosecution for possessing or cultivating marijuana for medicinal purposes with a physician’s approval. Notably, the act states that physicians shall not be "punished, or denied any right or privilege, for having recommended marijuana to a patient for medical purposes."2 Ten additional states—Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Maine, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, Washington, and Vermont—allow use of marijuana for medical purposes.

Angel Raich and Diane Monson (respondents) use marijuana prescribed by board-certified family physicians who concluded that it is the only drug that provides effective treatment. Ms Raich has an inoperable brain tumor and wasting syndrome, and Ms Monson has a degenerative spine condition with chronic back pain. On August 15, 2002, county sheriffs and Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) agents went to Ms Monson’s home: the sheriffs found her use of marijuana to be entirely lawful, but the federal agents seized and destroyed all 6 of her cannabis plants. The respondents sued to prohibit the enforcement of the federal Controlled Substances Act (CSA).3

The CSA, enacted in 1970 as part of President Nixon’s "war on drugs," regulates controlled substances. Marijuana, together with heroin and LSD (lysergic acid diethylamide), are classified as schedule I drugs based on the following findings: the high potential for abuse, no accepted medical use, and no accepted safety for use in medically supervised treatment. Marijuana, therefore, is strictly criminally prohibited except as part of a research study preapproved by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA).4 The US attorney general has routinely denied petitions to reclassify marijuana,5-6 despite a ruling from Administrative Law Judge Francis Young that "it is unreasonable, arbitrary, and capricious for DEA to continue to stand between sufferers and the benefits of this substance in light of the evidence."7-8

In Raich, the Supreme Court held that Congress’ authority to regulate interstate commerce includes the power to prohibit local cultivation and use of marijuana approved by a physician and in compliance with California law. Congress’ power to regulate purely local activities that are part of an economic "class of activities" that have a substantial effect on interstate commerce is firmly established, Justice Stevens wrote. The Court found "striking similarities" between this case and a 1942 case that upheld a federal prohibition on a farmer growing wheat for his own consumption9: "Like the farmer, respondents are cultivating, for home consumption, a fungible commodity for which there is an established, albeit illegal, interstate market." The Court said that its prior decisions, striking down the federal Gun-Free School Zones Act10 and the federal Violence Against Women Act11 on the ground that those laws exceeded congressional authority, were read "far too broadly." The 6-3 decision in Raich revealed a fissure within the coalition on the Rehnquist Court that over the past decade has curtailed federal power and safeguarded state sovereignty.


American Federalism: Protection of Health, Safety, and Welfare

American federalism, the most basic constitutional arrangement, has become a hallmark of the Rehnquist Court.12 Federalism is a form of governance in which states cede certain powers (eg, foreign affairs and interstate commerce) to a national government while retaining most other aspects of sovereignty. Ever since the nation’s founding, the political community has differed on whether the powers delegated to the federal government are, as James Madison said, "few and defined" or, as Alexander Hamilton argued, more expansive.13 In this debate, the Rehnquist Court usually has taken a "states rights" position, protecting spheres of state sovereignty from federal encroachment.

Medical marijuana exemplifies the role of states as laboratories for innovative solutions to the most intractable problems, where "a single courageous State may . . . try novel social and economic experiments without risk to the rest of the country."14 Justice O’Connor, dissenting in Raich, lamented that the Court had extinguished an experiment on the difficult and sensitive question of whether marijuana should be available to relieve severe pain and suffering. The Supreme Court will soon decide the fate of another social experiment—whether the state of Oregon may legalize physician-assisted suicide.15

Although states should be free to be inventive in the face of difficult social problems, this ought not negate federal authority to set national standards for health protection. The Rehnquist Court’s federalism jurisprudence rarely has protected innovative state experiments but rather has simply repudiated federal health and safety regulation. Not only has the Court thwarted federal regulation of firearms10 and violence against women,11 but it has also struck down environmental regulation16 and antidiscrimination legislation.17 Barely a week after Raich was decided, the Court refused to hear federalism cases involving such key public health issues as federal authority over endangered species and homemade machine guns, suggesting perhaps that the Rehnquist Court’s federalism revolution is on the wane.

Affirming federal constitutional power to safeguard the public’s health and safety is vital to the population’s well-being. It is important to remember that citizens have historically turned to federal authority in times of hardship to create equality before the law, protect workers from injury, safeguard the environment, provide social security, and finance health care for poor and elderly persons. The next time the Supreme Court hears a federal-powers case relating, for example, to pollution, occupational safety, or nondiscrimination, it ought to be guided by its decision in Raich. In this sense, the Court’s possible retreat from strict federalism may ultimately advance protection for people and the environment.


Medical Marijuana: Evidence-Based Health Policy

The use of marijuana for medicinal purposes touches on ethical problems with significant implications for health care and public health. Sound policy requires regulatory oversight based on public health, a rigorous research agenda, a private patient-physician relationship, and relief of patient suffering.

Public Health Regulation. Medical marijuana ideally should be regulated by a specialized health agency using the best available scientific evidence and having a strong research agenda. "Medicine by regulation is better than by referendum," said Justice Breyer during oral arguments.18 Marijuana need not necessarily be subject to the same kind of preapproval drug evaluation as other prescription medications because of the legal and cultural differences. However, a rational system based on science should be in place.

Current federal regulation of marijuana is flawed. The CSA is not an appropriate model for regulating drugs with potential medical benefits. It primarily addresses enforcement of drug laws, not clinical practice and research. The Supreme Court has unanimously ruled that there is no medical necessity exception to the CSA’s prohibitions on marijuana. "The statute reflects a determination that marijuana has no medical benefits worthy of an exception," wrote Justice Thomas.4 The agencies responsible for medical marijuana, moreover, have conflicting missions: law enforcement (DEA), prevention of drug abuse and addiction (National Institute of Drug Abuse [NIDA]), and public health (FDA).

Research. The Institute of Medicine found that "scientific data indicate the potential therapeutic value of cannabinoid drugs, primarily THC [tetrahydrocannabinol], for pain relief, control of nausea and vomiting, and appetite stimulation."19 Yet research has been sporadic, with the federal apparatus posing multiple hurdles to scientists. The FDA must approve research on scientific grounds and an institutional review board must approve on ethics grounds. The only legal source of marijuana is a farm in Mississippi run by NIDA. As gatekeeper of the supply, NIDA must also approve the research project. The marijuana supplied by the NIDA facility lacks purity and strength, depriving researchers of a stable source of raw material.20 Once a study is approved, the DEA monitors distribution of marijuana to physicians and patients and requires tight security (eg, locked safes, adequate ventilation, secure transportation, and accurate scales to weigh the arriving and dispensed product). Since the mission of NIDA does not include development of marijuana as a prescription medicine, private funding sources are required. To objectively answer the questions about the efficacy and safety of marijuana, the federal government must be open to the results of scientific research.

Patient-Physician Relationship. Federal drug policy chills clinical judgment relating to marijuana. Agency officials have sought to punish physicians who prescribe marijuana by excluding them from the Medicare program and suspending or revoking their registration to prescribe restricted drugs. They have threatened prosecution of physicians and their patients for supplying or possessing marijuana.21 The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals held that punishing physicians for recommending marijuana "strikes at core First Amendment interests" because "an integral component of the practice of medicine is the communication between a doctor and a patient."22 Physicians must be able to speak frankly and openly with patients to gain their trust and to accurately diagnose and treat disease.

Relief of Suffering. The prime objective of medical marijuana is to relieve patient suffering. Seriously or terminally ill patients have an abiding interest in living with dignity by having the highest possible quality of life. Marijuana use may help relieve the symptoms of illness and lessen the adverse effects of conventional treatments such as chemotherapy.19 Perhaps the greatest public concern with strict federal enforcement of drug restrictions is the perception that it denies patients needed relief.


Sound Regulation of Medical Marijuana

Sound regulation of medical marijuana requires government oversight based on public health, a rigorous research agenda, a private physician-patient relationship, and respect for patients who seek relief from suffering. A first step would be to reclassify marijuana as a schedule II drug because, like the schedule II substances cocaine and morphine, it fits well within the statutory definition of having "a high potential for abuse" but "a currently accepted medical use with severe restrictions."23 This would allow for medical prescriptions subject to strict regulation without unduly interfering with federal drug policy. Allowing restricted access to marijuana for seriously ill patients would not necessarily send a "soft" or "wrong" message about drug abuse. The public can make a distinction between a drug of abuse and a drug prescribed by a physician for a compassionate purpose. The data suggest that marijuana may offer respite for some patients—a position supported by patient experiences and physician opinions. The "drug war" metaphor does not justify an ideology that removes hope from patients when they are most vulnerable and in need.


AUTHOR INFORMATION

Correspondence: Lawrence O. Gostin, JD, LLD (Hon), Georgetown Law Center, 600 New Jersey Law Center, NW, Washington, DC 20001 (gostin@georgetown.edu).

Financial Disclosures: None reported.

Author Affiliation: Georgetown Law Center, Washington, DC.


REFERENCES

1. Gonzalez v Raich, 125 SCt 2195 (2005).
2. Cal Health & Safety Cod Ann §11362.5(d) (West 2005).
3. Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act of 1970, 21 USC §801 et seq.
4. United States v Oakland Cannabis Buyers’ Cooperative, 532 US 483, 490 (2001).
5. 66 Federal Register, 20,038 (2001).
6. Alliance for Cannabis Therapeutics v DEA, 15 F3d 1131, 1133 (DC Cir 1994).
7. Grinspoon v DEA, 828 F2d 881, 883-884 (1st Cir 1987).
8. Isikoff M Administrative law judge urges medicinal use of marijuana: DEA expected to reject call for limited legalization. Washington Post. September 7, 1988;sect 1:A2.
9. Wickard v Filburn, 317 US 111 (1942).
10. United States v Lopez, 514 US 549 (1995).
11. United States v Morrison, 529 US 598 (2000).
12. Greenhouse L The Rehnquist Court and its imperiled states’ rights legacy. New York Times. June 12, 2005;sect 4:3.
13. Madison J. Federalist No. 45. In: Rossiter C, ed. The Federalist Papers. New York, NY: New American Library; 1961:292-293.
14. New State Ice Co v Liebmann , 285 US 262, 311 (1932) (J. Brandeis, dissenting).
15. Oregon v Ashcroft, 368 F3d 1118 (9th Cir 2004), cert granted sub nom, Gonzalez v Oregon, 125 SCt 1299 (2005).
16. New York v United States, 505 US 144 (1992).
17. University of Alabama v Garrett, 531 US 356 (2001).
18. Oral Argument, US Supreme Court Official Transcript at 50, Gonzalez v Raich, 125 SCt 2195 (2005). No. 03-1454.
19. Institute of Medicine. Marijuana and Medicine: Assessing the Science Base. Washington, DC: National Academy Press; 1999.
20. Satel S Good to grow. New York Times. June 8, 2005;sect 4:3.
21. Steinbrook R. Medical marijuana, physician-assisted suicide, and the controlled substances act. N Engl J Med. 2004;351:1380-1383. FREE FULL TEXT
22. Conant v Walters 309 F3d 629 (9th Cir 2002), cert denied, 540 US 946 (2003).
23. Kassirer JP. Federal foolishness and marijuana. N Engl J Med. 1997;336:366-367. FREE FULL TEXT
DSTM
QUOTE(fozzie @ Feb 14 2007, 11:44 PM) *
QUOTE
I would think Marijuana has been tested as a possible alternative to some prescription drugs and most likely failed some of the tests reguired.I also would guess a lot of pot heads would like to see it legalised,so they can obtain better quality at a cheaper price.You dont have to convince me of the benifits of Marijuana,take all your scientific data to your Government,because thats who you have to convince to have it legalised.
I merely gave an opinion the same as you,and we respect each others right to do so.


THis article of the Journal of the American Medical Association might interest you DSTM

Fozzie,every article on Marijuana interests me.I didn't word my Post correctly,so I'll endeavour to correct it.I am not against Medical Marijuana in the least.I am against Marijuana used as a Party Drug,because I believe it is addictive,and so do the Governments in most Countries.When they can seperate the two,then I think it will be Legalised and the benefits can help the Suffering and the Terminally ill.

My youngest Son who is now 41 yrs old,started with a career in Architecture,got into Dope smoking and became a dazed Pot Head for around 7 yrs.Completely dropped out of society and lived a Dropouts life.He was very intelligent before he chose this path,and now to me is as thick as a brick.Do I think this Drug stewed his Brain? YES.Can I prove it? NO.A Father just knows.I am covinced it slows the Brain.

A brilliant Doctor and also an Industrial Chemist has been arrested here for growing 4000 Industrial Marijuana Plants for the sole purpose of his research.These plants have absolutely no use on the Streets.The Police pulled all the plants and burnt them.He is charged with Growing a prohibited Drug,and will lose his Property and his savings fighting this Charge in court.Do I think this charge is outrageous?You bet I do.

Recently My Uncle died a Shocking Death in Hospital.The doctors injected him with Prescription pain killers which left him in a comatose state.I think if he was given Medical Marijuana in the correct dosage,I honestly believe he would have been awake enough to talk to.Too late now.

As I have stated previous,you don't have to convice me.Lobby your Governments because they make the Laws, not me.I hope this explains better,where I stand on this issue.
blueandgold04
for medicinal purposes, of course!

for recreational use, why not? DSTM, I am sorry to hear about your son, truly. mellow.gif
however, not all handle addiction the same, and i think our societal experiments with prohibition have shown that it doesn't work as a tactic. we all choose to escape our reality occasionally, whether it is through alcohol, meditation, exercise, etc... (computer use whistling.gif ) ALL have risks and rewards. who truly has the power to decide what is best for everyone else? after all, some people cannot even balance a proper diet, but we don't outlaw fat, caffeine, sugar, etc...
joygreen
I wonder how quickly cannabis would be legalized if government legislators were subjected to regular, random drug testing. Cannabis addictive? More so than alcohol? Absolutely not. Schedule 1 and 2 drugs and liquor are far more harmful to the liver, and far more addictive than cannabis.

We are watching our government fall apart. Legislators refer to Illegal aliens as "undocumented". Cannabis for pain relief may be prescribed by doctors, yet the DEA has arrest powers? Lawmakers are chosing which laws to enforce. The reason we have more and more government is because of huge amounts of funding money that never finds its way to paying for the services.

The system of checks and balances is totally out of whack: the President should never have had the extent of power he had for the first 6 years. Watch C-Span and see them vote to not vote so it will hurt the other party. It's time for a complete government reorganization. Notice I did not say revolt/overthrow because as an American citizen I would probably be arrested. The Prez has pardoned 5 drug dealers. Two border patrol agents are in jail because the state's attorney gave a mexican national drug-runner immunity to testify against our armed forces. Our military is in jail while lawbreakers go free. Welfare applications are translated into Spanish. This is insane. I do write to my legislators. They tell me that they don't want what I want and they're not going to do anything about it.

Iraq has democracy; and America is becoming a dictatorship. We have Americans thrown in jail depending on which law is chosen to be enforced. We are quickly losing our sovereignty. Racism is rampant: every hispanic legislator supports open borders and amnesty. That was a great post, Thrillhouse. For all of you who want to speak to your legislators, please go to www.congress.org, www.mpp.com, and www.norml.com. Note that www.numbersusa.com and www.votehemp.com/voter_guide.html report the positions of 2008 candidates.

DSTM, I am sorry about your son. But if you look a little deeper, something must have been bothering him and he sought relief. Instead of seeing a doctor, he self-medicated and from the sound of it, something was going terribly wrong in his life. I was hooked on cigaretted on my first drag. But I can take or leave cannabis. Mostly I leave it because I cannot afford it and am under doctors care for pain management. I had a much better personality when I drank beer and smoked pot. Politically, I have always leaned 60% to the right and 40% to the left (I took a test). hysterical.gif
MaraM
British Columbia (specifically the west coast area) is 'renowned' for it's grow-ops for grass.

And every month or so, Police raid a home and often find millions of dollars worth - arrest them and poof, a minimal fine and they are free again. Sor, right or wrong, it's appears to me that even our own Court systems here are 'confused' about the degree of crime that is being commited?

I hate the fact that people buy these near-million dollar homes in the middle of up-scale residental neighbourhoods and turn them into grow-ops ... and especially hate the fact that it's often twits that do the electrical connections and start fires, endangering their neighbours.

If it were legal, these would cease to exist plus those that need it for medical purposes could get it at a price they can afford and the quality would be controlled, etc.

While I had to do some re-adjusting of my brain to come to these above conclusions that 'grass is okay' and should be legalized just like alcohol, etc., I do think that for some people it would be very dangerous to even use once or twice.

Dangerous because one never knows what they will become addicted to until they try it - eg, cigarettes, alchohol or whatever. I read your words about your son with great sadness, DSTM - gentle hug - what a huge, huge waste and it must be heart-breaking.

Personally, several people I know use 'grass' on occassion but I do know a 'friendlie', for instance, that has smoked grass for nearly 30 years , lights one the moment her eyes open in the morning and is truly a 'duh' when it comes to carrying on a normal conversation with her. (And right now she is paying $300 an ounce from a friend who sells it to her 'cheap').
DSTM
Read this recently and found Interesting.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/stor...5006007,00.html
MaraM
It is an interesting article, DSTM ... and I do wonder about all 'drugs' and their effect on the brain. Guess I've spent my entire life feeling if there was even a small chance smoking grass would kill a few extra brain cells it wasn't worth the risk for myself to even try it. Lose a leg, you're still 'you' ... loose your brain and hmmm.
WlkingMan
Sadly I didn't have the time to read this whole thing, but based on what I read this is what I have to say:

The only thing I could see being legalized is marijuana.

Reason's being is because:
  1. Unlike alchohol and cigarettes it is not addictive. I quit cold turkey once for a year. I have my own reasons for doing so but I can assure you that Myself and everyone I know who have ever quit in their life had no problems in doing so. I have only heard of one person who said they were "Addicted to marijuana" and chances are if you ever here someone say that to you, they have absolutely no life. It is likely that they are just calling out for attention. In this case the guy was an alchoholic, and everytime he drank he insisted on getting high.
  2. Unlike alchohol, you can consume as much as you want of it, even all night if you could, but you will not end up tripping over your own feet or blurt out the first random ignorant thought that comes to your head.
  3. It does not promote violence. Most gang violence is coke related. Not just because of the coke, but for what you can make out of it. Crack is actually where gangs make most of their money. Crack's addictiveness and mental side-effects are exactly the reason why I believe coke should, and will stay illegal.
  4. When an individual, or group, smokes Marijuana it actually makes it easier to enjoy the finer things in life. Its not that it makes you lazy, you just find that you really don't need to travel far to find entertainment. We would actually play baseball at the neihborhood park immediately after smoking.
joygreen
WlkingMan, I agree. Cannabis helped me quit drinking. Because I did not like my drunken behavior, I decided to quit. I used Cannabis. Got to sleep just fine when the Cannabis was quality. Unfortunately it was quite expensive, so I occasionally used beer. But the end result is that I was able to quit drinking, to the point that I do not even like beer any more. So I back up every word you wrote. I don't think I have ever encountered a crack user, but briefly dated a man who used coke. At work, he was nice, but other times he was extremely aggressive. I certainly do not want to be around coke/crack users. But guess what? I just got a positive TB test!!! I am practically a shut-in, and because of my financial situation, I was shopping at a wal mart where English was hardly spoken.

So, If it came down to a choice between keeping ALL DRUGS illegal, or continuing the invasion of illegal aliens, I am afraid I would vote to legalize all drugs. One of my MDs even said she thought they should all be legalized! And if people wanted to beat their addictions, they could go to rehab.

People find all kinds of ways to hurt themselves, some with those boy-toys (no offense gentlemen) that go out of control and mash/maim/kill themselves. These are endorphine-addicts. Nobody complains about them wacko.gif The war on drugs is a huge waste of money. Pot users are taking up jail beds that violent illegal aliens should be in. Alas, America must build even more jails, but chooses not to enforce certain laws so they can be politically-correct. This is ridiculous to me.

I feel America MUST legalize cannabis for its multiple uses for fuel, protein, fiber and etc. It requires no fertilizer or watering, grows everywhere in the world except the North and South poles, and MAN is its only predator, so it doesn't even need pesticides. It grows quickly and cleans the air just like trees. Now why are we importing it? It actually creates a perfect protein for human nutrition. The only other powdered proteins available are allergens for many people (whey and soy and they are not complete proteins).

What are the politicians saying to strike fear into Americans about going green? We will have to use up our water and fertilizer and the price of corn will go up. OOooh, scare me much, let's keep big oil and auto makers receiving their corporate welfare and stuffing the pockets of politicians. mad.gif

If American government asked Americans to produce alternative fuel sources without arresting them, mis-informing them and taxing them like crazy, we could have rich farmers and clean fuel. Carmakers will have to re-tool, but it's about time. They haven't made a decent advancement in decades. And tough luck for the oil companies, they can suffer downsizing like the rest of us.

Have we concluded that it would be ok, even good to legalize cannabis? DSTM, I too am sorry about your son, and for all who have lost loved ones because of their choices. But it might be impossible to know what kind of "demons" were on his mind, why he was self-medicating. My Aunt told me today that babies are being born with Acid Reflux Disease! These are babies of well-to-do, loving happy women. The cause? All those ultrasound and other tests to "see" the baby before it is born. Apparently, these tests upset the fetus, by invading the uterus meant to be dark and nourished and peaceful during pregnancy.

Get thee behind me, oil and pharmaceutical companies!!! And release the cures for AIDS, cancer and herpes rather than keeping people sick so they can keep selling their drugs. Did anybody notice how fast they cured HPV when they figured out how it impacted fertility? I know, sorry, offtopic.gif
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