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acklan
QUOTE(WlkingMan @ Feb 21 2006, 03:06 PM) *
There is no particularly right or wrong way to raise your children. Every parent has their own way of disciplining, and teaching their children. My view is that, as long as you are doing everything you can to make you feel that you are raising your children correctly, then you are succeeding at doing so.


I have till now kept it to how I will raise my kids and not critizie others and thier opiniion. This is the limit.

I have been a Fire Fighter for 26 yrs, a Medic for 29, I was also a Shieff's Deputy for 4 yrs. and work, for the past 7 yrs, tracking and turning in online child preditor to the Parish and State Law Enforcement. There is a wrong way to raise children. Visit your local juvenile detention center, and talk with the intake personal as to how these childern are raise. If you don't thing there is a wrong way then you are probiliy doing it wrong. You never stop learning new way of teaching and influencing your childern.
WlkingMan
That isn't exactly what I meant.....

I mean even the best parents in the world have their differences in how they raise their children. Not every parents view's will be the same. That was my point.

I know that there are wrong way's to raise your children. I was just trying to point out that this topic is no longer on the original topic. It has gone to an argument on how to raise your children.
yano
Personally I don't think it's so much as restricting what the child does, I think it should be more of educating them of what to look out for.

The human will always want what it can't have. - Curiosity

From my point of view I think the trick to protecting the young children of today from Child Predadtors and such is to educate them what to do if they approach someone online. Like teach them not to meet with them, unless they know who they are talking to *** ie: only let them meet with kids from school, that they chat with online.

I think education is more powerful than any filter or blocking program on the net. No matter what is restricted, a child predadtors could still get in. So please, educate your children on what to avoid online.
Scarlett
QUOTE(WlkingMan @ Feb 21 2006, 03:06 PM) *
This is simply beginning to become a pointless argument about how different people feel about raising their children. Honestly, I think this subject should just fly away and be forgotten.


There is nothing pointless about this at all. IMHO

This topic has garnered a huge response, to where many have given their opinion.

I myself as the topic starter, am quite pleased with the results.

Because.... regardless of the many opposing opinions posted here, information has been shared.

Pertinent information is now available to all.

Hopefully all parents/guardians that view this thread, will now be able to make an informed decision
concerning the protection of their children whilst on the internet.


QUOTE(WlkingMan @ Feb 21 2006, 05:02 PM) *
I know that there are wrong way's to raise your children. I was just trying to point out that this topic is no longer on the original topic. It has gone to an argument on how to raise your children.



Quite the opposite. An "argument on how to raise your children" fits in nicely with this topic.

Learning the in's and out's of online safety and possible dangers, are all just one of many
parental obligations.

Parental obligations = raising a child
Protecting a child = raising a child


No worries, this topic has not strayed off topic.

Id say something if it had.

Thanks for participating, my objective has been met.
This is not to say that future replies are not welcome.

Sincerly,
Scarlett
Heretic Monkey
QUOTE(acklan @ Feb 21 2006, 05:42 PM) *
Visit your local juvenile detention center, and talk with the intake personal as to how these childern are raise. If you don't thing there is a wrong way then you are probiliy doing it wrong. You never stop learning new way of teaching and influencing your childern.

So you automatically assume that since the kids got into trouble, they weren't raised "correctly", and have careless parents? Not every kid that is raised "your way" will be perfect, and not every kid that is raised "the wrong way" will turn into a thug.

My mom and dad are middle school teachers (7th and 8th grades, respectively) and deal with kids and parents all day long. Some kids that have deadbeat parents are perfectly fine, not getting into trouble, earning respectable grades, etc. Some kids that have "caring" and "loving" parents are the trouble-makers, always making fun of other kids, getting into fights, etc. A large part of a childs' actions outside of the parents "umbrella" depends on the the personality and character of the child (notice, i didn't say that's the only thing).

Also, how can you call what you DON'T do the "wrong way" to raise a child? Millions of kids were raised without the methods you're listing, and the majority of them are perfectly fine (me included). So, what would you have to say to a couple that raised perfectly good kids WITHOUT spying on them
WlkingMan
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 07:52 PM) *
Also, how can you call what you DON'T do the "wrong way" to raise a child? Millions of kids were raised without the methods you're listing, and the majority of them are perfectly fine (me included). So, what would you have to say to a couple that raised perfectly good kids WITHOUT spying on them


I agree with that particular phrase. I was never spied on but I turned out fine. HOWEVER: I did get a foot up my rear end if I ever got caught doing something I was not permitted to do.
acklan
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 06:52 PM) *
QUOTE(acklan @ Feb 21 2006, 05:42 PM) *

Visit your local juvenile detention center, and talk with the intake personal as to how these childern are raise. If you don't thing there is a wrong way then you are probiliy doing it wrong. You never stop learning new way of teaching and influencing your childern.

So you automatically assume that since the kids got into trouble, they weren't raised "correctly", and have careless parents? Not every kid that is raised "your way" will be perfect, and not every kid that is raised "the wrong way" will turn into a thug.

My mom and dad are middle school teachers (7th and 8th grades, respectively) and deal with kids and parents all day long. Some kids that have deadbeat parents are perfectly fine, not getting into trouble, earning respectable grades, etc. Some kids that have "caring" and "loving" parents are the trouble-makers, always making fun of other kids, getting into fights, etc. A large part of a childs' actions outside of the parents "umbrella" depends on the the personality and character of the child (notice, i didn't say that's the only thing).

Also, how can you call what you DON'T do the "wrong way" to raise a child? Millions of kids were raised without the methods you're listing, and the majority of them are perfectly fine (me included). So, what would you have to say to a couple that raised perfectly good kids WITHOUT spying on them


Right. Post back on your kids 18 birthday and tell me how you raised him/her and include all the notions you have now that you had to rethink along the way. You cannot imagin the shock you are in for. It's very easy to talk about a trip you have never been on, by looking at the post cards.
I am glad your parents are telling you about what you obviously have never experenced. Real life and what you are told are two totally different things. Before you embark on whatever career you have in mind, join your local EMS, police, or fire service. The human garbage you will have to deal with that victimized 99% of the rest of the population will knock the shine off that bright idealistic tower your mind is locked in.
You talk of what you know little or nothing about.
Heretic Monkey
QUOTE(acklan @ Feb 21 2006, 09:19 PM) *
Right. Post back on your kids 18 birthday and tell me how you raised him/her and include all the notions you have now that you had to rethink along the way. You cannot imagin the shock you are in for. It's very easy to talk about a trip you have never been on, by looking at the post cards.
I am glad your parents are telling you about what you obviously have never experenced. Real life and what you are told are two totally different things. Before you embark on whatever career you have in mind, join your local EMS, police, or fire service. The human garbage you will have to deal with that victimized 99% of the rest of the population will knock the shine off that bright idealistic tower your mind is locked in.
You talk of what you know little or nothing about.

So, you claim you know more about what's best for a child because you've been an EMT, correct? So, what do you know about BEING a child in this day and age?

Once again, i ask you to put yourself in the place of your kids. Imagine Mr. Bushy and his cronies watching and analyzing your every move, screening all your phone calls and e-mails, key-logging everything you type and recording everything you watch on tv. Wouldn't you just feel secure? You claim that it's the parents' responsibility to keep the kids safe. Well, it's the government's responsibility to keep us safe, isn't it? So why wouldn't their actions be justified? Same concept, larger scale.

QUOTE
I am glad your parents are telling you about what you obviously have never experenced. Real life and what you are told are two totally different things.

That pretty much sums up the entire concept behind education. Why do you think my and millions of other parents TELL their children what they should and shouldn't be doing? I never experienced the "human garbage" because i was taught how to avoid it. Once again, going back to the "teaching" aspect of protecting your children....

This is pretty much going in circles....
yano
Looks like maybe we need to make classes in the schools about "Common Sense for Online Protection."
acklan
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 09:00 PM) *
So, you claim you know more about what's best for a child because you've been an EMT, correct? So, what do you know about BEING a child in this day and age?

I know being child in this day and age is extremely dangrous. That without very close supervision a child can disappear and never be seen alive again. It plays out on the news eveery night. I see it first hand, without someone "telling me about it...". No, not because I'm and EMT , because I KNOW what the risks are. They grow more and more lethal as out technology become more sophicated. It use to be you had to watch at the playgrounds, mall, and amusement park. Now it is end side your home. A child can be stalked inches from a parent and that parent would not even know it. All you are concern about is having your way. Even if that means putting children at risk.
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 09:00 PM) *
Once again, i ask you to put yourself in the place of your kids. Imagine Mr. Bushy and his cronies watching and analyzing your every move, screening all your phone calls and e-mails, key-logging everything you type and recording everything you watch on tv. Wouldn't you just feel secure? You claim that it's the parents' responsibility to keep the kids safe. Well, it's the government's responsibility to keep us safe, isn't it? So why wouldn't their actions be justified? Same concept, larger scale.

Here is where you show your ignorance. The Government has no responsibility to keep you safe. The Supreme Court has said as much. The Government's role is reactive not proactive. The are allow to interceed where a crime is happening or is conspired to happen, but is only allow to intervine if probable cause exsists. It is not the same. As an adult you are a free citizen , who without proof or just cause, shall not be detained by the Government or any agent of the Government. As a child your are a ward of that parent, and as such the parent is required to provide for that child. I guess they haven't covered that in Civics yet.
You need to get your head out of the blogs and read the Bills purposed and watch Cspan and Cspan2. Drink the Water of life not the Koolaid. Get educated not informed, there is a difference.
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 09:00 PM) *
That pretty much sums up the entire concept behind education. Why do you think my and millions of other parents TELL their children what they should and shouldn't be doing? I never experienced the "human garbage" because i was taught how to avoid it. Once again, going back to the "teaching" aspect of protecting your children....

Unfortunicately there are parents who feel the Government should raise thier childern and notify them when the child is educated. Then they wonder "What did I do wrong?". They did nothing, that is what they did, or did not do.
Avoid it or bury you head in the sand to it? It's out there, and turning a blind eye is exzactly why the problem is getting bigger. Of course you may be one of the elite upper class that is removed from the dirty and grime of average life. You can't even rap your mind around wht is waiting for you in the world.
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 09:00 PM) *
This is pretty much going in circles....

Yep and if your are not real careful it will run you over when it comes back around.
Heretic Monkey
QUOTE(acklan @ Feb 21 2006, 11:57 PM) *
I know being child in this day and age is extremely dangrous. That without very close supervision a child can disappear and never be seen alive again. It plays out on the news eveery night. I see it first hand, without someone "telling me about it...". No, not because I'm and EMT , because I KNOW what the risks are. They grow more and more lethal as out technology become more sophicated. It use to be you had to watch at the playgrounds, mall, and amusement park. Now it is end side your home. A child can be stalked inches from a parent and that parent would not even know it. All you are concern about is having your way. Even if that means putting children at risk.

I was speaking more of viewing the world from a kid's point of view... unless you deem it appropriate to treat them as mindless, feeling-less, thoughtless pets....
QUOTE
Here is where you show your ignorance. The Government has no responsibility to keep you safe. The Supreme Court has said as much. The Government's role is reactive not proactive. The are allow to interceed where a crime is happening or is conspired to happen, but is only allow to intervine if probable cause exsists. It is not the same. As an adult you are a free citizen , who without proof or just cause, shall not be detained by the Government or any agent of the Government. As a child your are a ward of that parent, and as such the parent is required to provide for that child. I guess they haven't covered that in Civics yet.
You need to get your head out of the blogs and read the Bills purposed and watch Cspan and Cspan2. Drink the Water of life not the Koolaid. Get educated not informed, there is a difference.


I was speaking of the US in relation to foreign security, not domestic crime. The government is in no way responsible for keeping terrorists out of America or to prevent them from attacking us? Then what's the point of "Homeland Security"?

The question here is still "How would you feel if the government treated you like you treat your children?". Get your head out of your own posts and think about what others have been posting. (in response to your comment about where my head is)

QUOTE
Unfortunicately there are parents who feel the Government should raise thier childern and notify them when the child is educated. Then they wonder "What did I do wrong?". They did nothing, that is what they did, or did not do.
Avoid it or bury you head in the sand to it? It's out there, and turning a blind eye is exzactly why the problem is getting bigger. Of course you may be one of the elite upper class that is removed from the dirty and grime of average life. You can't even rap your mind around wht is waiting for you in the world.

.....i'm not talking about the schools educating children, i'm talking about PARENTS educating THEIR kids about the dangers. My parents constantly reminded me what i should and shouldn't be doing in my life, and i listened. Parents seem too quick to restrict everything imaginable, and don't even think to try and talk to their kids about common sense.

You seemed to have misinterpreted just about every point i was trying to make in the previous post. I thought i made the points clear, but i guess not. I've said the majority of them multiple times...
jgweed
QUOTE
I think education is more powerful than any filter or blocking program on the net

I have to agree.

QUOTE
Looks like maybe we need to make classes in the schools about "Common Sense for Online Protection."

Yes, and make parental attendence mandatory.

John
acklan
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 22 2006, 12:06 AM) *
I was speaking more of viewing the world from a kid's point of view... unless you deem it appropriate to treat them as mindless, feeling-less, thoughtless pets....

I give my kids great lattitude ith everything but thier safety.

QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 22 2006, 12:06 AM) *
I was speaking of the US in relation to foreign security, not domestic crime. The government is in no way responsible for keeping terrorists out of America or to prevent them from attacking us? Then what's the point of "Homeland Security"?

I read your posts from page one, and you never address Homeland Security, or International Affairs in not one of them. Once again the Government is incharge of defending this Country and Her people, not proactively attacking a forgien nation because we thing were going to be attacked. We act on intelegence, on specific incidents.

QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 22 2006, 12:06 AM) *
The question here is still "How would you feel if the government treated you like you treat your children?". Get your head out of your own posts and think about what others have been posting. (in response to your comment about where my head is)

No, the question is Parents and MySpace. If you want the answer to your question then I will provide one. If I gave the Government reason to revoke my right under law, such as committing a crime, then then not only should they but I should exspect it. My head is where it should be. Level and looking straight ahead.

QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 22 2006, 12:06 AM) *
.....i'm not talking about the schools educating children, i'm talking about PARENTS educating THEIR kids about the dangers. My parents constantly reminded me what i should and shouldn't be doing in my life, and i listened. Parents seem too quick to restrict everything imaginable, and don't even think to try and [b]talk to their kids about common sense.[/b]

You do not have a very wide view of the world or atleast this Country. Juvenile crime is at an all time High and it promises to only get worst. There are not enough parents being held responsble for the kids actions. When I work a call at a teen club at 3am and the parents are nowheres to be found I find that irresponsible.
There is no reason kids under the age of 17 should be out at that time of the night. Not to menition unsupervisied. The problem with alot of parents I see is the want to be thier childs friends. If that work out fine, but not if it means loosing control.

QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 22 2006, 12:06 AM) *
You seemed to have misinterpreted just about every point i was trying to make in the previous post. I thought i made the points clear, but i guess not. I've said the majority of them multiple times...

I have replied on point to every statement you made. Your point is very clear. Parents, hands off and let the kids have thier MySpace and privacy. You have never been a parent and have never shouldered that responsibility, so you scope lock on one side of this issue. the childs. Your problem is you think you are going to spout your point of view, take a hard nose stand, and no one will call you on it.

QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 21 2006, 12:37 PM) *
Is it not enough to TEACH your kids what they should or shouldn't be doing? Don't get me wrong, i'm all for supervision on-line, but not to the point of being "nazi-ish" about it. Keylogging everything they type and standing over their shoulder whenever they're near the box seems a bit of an overkill. Imagine the US government treating every american citizen just like that.... You wouldn't be too happy, would you? But, afterall, it's the governments responsibility to keep us safe...

Using bold talk and referring to people as Nazi is what I am talking about. If you can't POST and not flame may be you should not post. I have not made personal attacks on you or your parents, but you have no problem flaming me if I don't coward down to your heavy handed points of view. Don't get me wrong. I like this little exchange. I don't agree with you, and quite frankly I think you are wrong, but I have no problem repling as forceful as I am replied to.
SoulAndroid13
Since I'm not a parent, I admittedly cannot look completely from that angle. But eh... got something to say and I'll say it.

The problem with porn and other undesireables on Myspace is that you don't have to look for it to find it. Usually you have to look on shady web sites with illegal downloads of games to come across porn accidentally. But for the most part you have to look for it honestly.

A common exercise on myspace when one is bored is to pick a friend, and look at their friend's list, and pick a friend. You then look at that page and when you get bored, you click on the next interesting looking picture of someone's legs hanging out of a trashcan and click. Repeat.

If you do this long enough, eventually within 10-15 repeats, you start getting into the shadier side, and all sorts of oddballs, such as how and where to grow pot successfully, and where the best locations in city X to get laid at are. You don't have to look, you just eventually run into it.

I joined myspace because I realized from conversations on text games I played that some people check that more often than they do their e-mail and phone messages. My friends list consists of people I know, and I have, I think, 15. I also have a link to the board for my university, CSULB.

Now for parent child relationships.

First to say... I can understand getting pumped, but you two main guys are taking it so personal it's amusing. But you guys have made me think.

There is a point to the arguement about national security. Stated or not, it is the assumed responsibility of the government to protect us, even if we are not directly under attack. Develop technology, weapons, detection systems, color coded warnings, whatever it takes. As we have found out over and over we may not always get a warning to muster our forces before we are attacked.

In my opinion, this includes spying on me. I personally don't do anything suspicious, and I certainly don't do anything that, if investigated, would be found offensive enough to warrant men with radios in their sleeves. A guy in a cubicle in the local AF base doesn't care how much I love my girlfriend or that my laptop is having trouble and I'm e-mailing desperately to find a cure. Not only do they not have the interest, they don't have the time to read all the e-mails. They look for markers or flags.

Just like my parents did. All of the parents who I've looked at who had the 'best children' knew how to read their children. My parents knew when I could be left alone and when I needed to be watched like a hawk just by reading me. So when I got curious enough to type 'lesbian sex' into the search that one time, my dad cornered me in my room the next morning before school and told me what was wrong with it and IF I EVER DID IT AGAIN THERE WOULD BE NO COMPUTER ACCESS WITHOUT MY PARENT SITTING THERE. With previous and similar threats he had followed through when I bucked. I didn't this time.

My parents have put passwords on computers because they thought I was playing too much and not doing homework enough (they were right). They knew when I would figgure out the passwords. And when I did they just changed it. If they thought I was doing better, they'd wait till I figgured it out and let me think they were still watching my every move for a while.

If you know how to use a computer, it's easy to tell if someone is doing something or not. If your kids have enough time and space to do something they know is wrong till they are satisfied AND clean up the evidence so thuroughly you can't tell... You're ignoring your kids.

When my parents saw something wrong, they took measures to fix it, but they also showed me how to behave. I don't mind sticking out my phone number in lots of situations because if I don't recognise the phone number, I let my voice mail pick it up. If a person IMs me without me knowing who they are, I give them a certain amount of time before I say, "Look, either tell me who you are or I'm blocking you."

My parents taught me to be suspicious and cautious. Be sure I'm in control of a situation. If I'm not, take control or back off.

The first person I gave my phone number out to online was a year ago. He was a guy I played online RPG text games with constantly for two years prior. I've since me him in person, and met my girlfriend through him.

You can go Nazi on your kids. You can armlock them and steer them around untill they're 18 and throw them out and find they don't know how to steer. It seems to me if they haven't been able to step outside that boundary, they'll eventually do it, and they might not know how to properly deal with it. They may also get baffled with situations they don't know how to deal with. How can your kids learn if they are too scared to push that edge because you'll cut them off?

You can also go hands off on your kids. You can let them wander around, unable to tell the difference between pathways and wilderness. It seems like if you don't teach your kids the way to deal with situations correctly, they'll just blunder from mistake to mistake and not learn. They may also end up so far off the path they can't find their way back again.

If you have to literally watch your kids to know what they're doing, maybe you need to learn to read and understand your kids more. If you're so afraid to watch your kids you let them do whatever, you're not being a parent, and THAT is the bottom line.

Now I'm tired, and need sleep.
In closing, feel free to flip me off if you feel it's appropriate.
WlkingMan
I have a suggestion..... Log onto myspace, pick some random individual's profile, and click away at the many links in his/her profile. Repeat the process until you feel comfortable.

My point?

I can gaurentee you that you will not run into any porn simply by clicking through your friends profile.

QUOTE
The problem with porn and other undesireables on Myspace is that you don't have to look for it to find it.

I am yet to see any of these "undersireables on Myspace."



As for the stalkers, and such: If you feel that your child is ignorant enough to post uneccisary info about themselves, then go ahead: Ignore that fact, and be "Proactive".

What I would do is simply monitor their Myspace experience. Make sure that when they post something you don't like, they understand why it is wrong. Not prevent them from doing it entirely.
Scarlett
QUOTE(WlkingMan @ Feb 22 2006, 10:21 AM) *
I have a suggestion..... Log onto myspace, pick some random individual's profile, and click away at the many links in his/her profile. Repeat the process until you feel comfortable.

My point?

I can gaurentee you that you will not run into any porn simply by clicking through your friends profile.


Yes you can. I have seen it with my own eyes.
But....It all depends on who your MySpace friends, have as "friends".
Heretic Monkey
So, which is more important, education and slight observation, or strict restrictions and total control.

I say go with education while monitoring their online/offline activities (meaning webpage history and where they go). Then, if they seem to be getting into something they shouldn't, and KNOW they shouldn't then go onto the restrictions/probation.

All i'm saying is to have trust in your children before treating them as though they're TRYING to get into trouble. If you are able to teach them well enough to know how they should be acting, there should be no reason to monitor every keystroke and phone call.
Lily Livered
QUOTE(Heretic Monkey @ Feb 22 2006, 02:07 PM) *
So, which is more important, education and slight observation, or strict restrictions and total control.

I say go with education while monitoring their online/offline activities (meaning webpage history and where they go). Then, if they seem to be getting into something they shouldn't, and KNOW they shouldn't then go onto the restrictions/probation.

All i'm saying is to have trust in your children before treating them as though they're TRYING to get into trouble. If you are able to teach them well enough to know how they should be acting, there should be no reason to monitor every keystroke and phone call.



I have to agree with you here. I have a 15 year old son who is so obediant that it sometimes baffles me.

I "slightly" monitor his computer usage, but on the whole, I am able to "read" him and I trust him. He's given me no reason not to (yet). I'm not going to break his trust in ME by snooping in his room or his computer unless I feel that something is wrong.

However, I am told that I'm overly protective in other ways, and that is due to the complete and utter fear I have of predators and accidents. I learned just a couple days ago that his friends tease him that he has to ASK all the time, and has to inform me where he is at all times and call me once an hour. He thinks it's odd that they think he's a "momma's boy". He doesn't MIND following the rules!

I asked him yesterday if he knows what MySpace is. He said he's heard the kids at school talk about it, plus some other similar sites, but that since I once told him not to go to one of the others (can't remember the name), he doesn't go to any of them. And I believe him.

I let him drive his car by himself yesterday for the first time. He was only going down several blocks to the school to pick up a shirt, but I followed at a distance to see how he drove with no parents with him because he does talk about hotrodding and "drifting". I hid down the street and waited for him to leave the school. He did everything "by the book". I rushed home and into the garage and back into the house and pretended I'd been here all along.....

He walks in and says "no trust, huh?" with a smile on his face. I was busted! He saw me pulling into the driveway.
So, he didn't know until the end of the little trip that I'd spied on him and he did as he knew he should before he even knew that I was watching.
I'm actually glad that he busted me, because now he'll keep that in mind and always wonder if I'm watching.

So all in all, I think SOME spying is in order with children/teenagers, but I also believe in overdoing it and causing relationship issues. I think that overly controlling them will cause resentment and distrust and a perceived need to lie (even about something minor). I think overbearing parents will, many times, cause the same rebelliousness as a parent who doesn't care what their kids are doing.
WlkingMan
Hurray!! That is my exact opinion. I couldn't have said it better myself. thumbup.gif
rms4evr
Even though I may be inviting a river of flames, I just want to jump in and defend the spyers among us. Some of you seem to think that anyone who spies on thier kids has no trust in them at all, and are trying to control and manipulate their kids. I don't see it that way. I see parents who would do anything to make sure that their kid stays safe and alive.

My parents trust me. They let me take the car on errands, to my job, or to go out and see a movie. They let me access the internet whenever I want, and they trust that I won't watch something obscene. They trust that when they give me money or their credit cards, I won't go and blow it on electronics, clothes, and video games. But they still spyed on my interent access!!!!! They grilled me whenever I went out: "Where are you going? Who are you going with? What will you be doing? When are you getting back?" (You should have seen my dad grilling my 9th grade homecoming date!!! hysterical.gif ) They trust me, but they still do all that. They wanted to make sure that their trust in me wasn't misplaced, and that they could continue to trust me. While its true that the kids may not understand that and rebel, some (like me) understand that their folks care about them and want them to stay safe.

Different people have different ways of parenting. Just please lay off on those who spy on their kids. They are simply doing what they feel is the best way to keep their children safe. Some of you obviously feel that they are overdoing it, but that is not your call. It is theirs. I personally found some of the spying a little over the top, but that wasn't for me to decide.

rms4evr
Alpha_Blue
Myspace at the moment has no content restrictions that I am aware of, and thus if young people add users or join groups with explicit content, it will not be filtered. Additionally as many have stated it is a 'great way to find people' thus meaning internet predators love it.

However, if parents closely monitor their child's myspace, or if the child waits until he/she is of the age no longer interesting to predators, or is careful to to post any personal info/photos, then it should be at least somewhat safer.

I would never recommend meeting anyone in real life that you met over the internet, some say its paranoia but there is no such thing as too much safety in my opinion.

I am not saying i believe it is right for them to 'spy' on myspace , but then, how is one to know what occurs? It is a difficult problem at best.

WlkingMan from personal experience on myspace I disagree with the statement of how it is very hard to find explicit content. All I had to do was click on a friends' profile, and click on a usergroup he was in, and I soon found another rather inappropriate profile...i wont go into specifics here...it is QUITE easy to access that kind of thing through myspace, not that I am interested in it anyways...but it is very hard to filter what gets through, and at the moment I dont believe that any filtering has been done.
yano
QUOTE
So all in all, I think SOME spying is in order with children/teenagers, but I also believe in overdoing it and causing relationship issues. I think that overly controlling them will cause resentment and distrust and a perceived need to lie (even about something minor). I think overbearing parents will, many times, cause the same rebelliousness as a parent who doesn't care what their kids are doing.


I think this nails the points. The more a child resents being spied on, the more likely they'll become rebilious. Just make sure your on the same level with your children and that they understand that you are concerned for there safety and there wellbeing before sneaking around and spying on them without them knowing.
Lily Livered
QUOTE(Scarlett @ Jan 30 2006, 09:08 AM) *
QUOTE
Posting too much information on social networking sites may be dangerous.
By Rob Stafford
Correspondent
NBC News
Updated: 10:02 p.m. ET Jan. 27, 2006
This report aired Dateline Friday, Jan. 27, 9 p.m.

You may never have heard of MySpace.com, but it's a safe bet, your kids have.
It's a social networking sites - sort of a cyber combination of a yearbook, personal diary and social club. The biggest of them is MySpace.com. With more than 50 million members, its one of the fastest growing Web sites in the country.



~ Sites such as MySpace.com are fast becoming a growing threat to our childrens online saftey. Others include, Xanga.com, LiveJournal.com and facebook.com. The age requirements for My Space.com for instance is set at 14. The age limit should be set at 18, but it does not matter much, because kids LIE about their age in order to sign up. Personally I would never consider allowing a child of mine to create a blog on My Space. Kids post personal content of their own, in an attempt to draw attention to themselves. The goal is for their blog to be one of the most popular ones. The more comments, and so called "friends" one has at My Space, the more popular one will become. And we all know popularity among ones peers has always been sought after by kids. Responding to blog comments, could then lead to lengthy correspondence with what may even be an online predator.

All in all, a sad, sad situation indeed.
Parents please step up to your responsibility as a parent, and monitor your childrens online activities!
Before it is to late ~ Scarlett

Complete MSNBC Article
Internet safety: What parents need to know
Online-Safe Resources for Home & School


Internal Link: WiredKids.org, Internet Saftey, Help and Education



Scarlett, I apologise for getting caught up in the parenting-style debate on your thread. I don't think that's what you meant this to become. I appreciate the heads up you were conveying! I'll check into it more and try to be a bit more cautious myself. Promise. Thanks!
Silver Fern
Well said rms4ever; Until one is a parent a child cannot really understand the responsibility of a parent/s. There are some kids who rebel just for the sake of it, or from peer pressure, or because it's what kids do, some parents have thought that they were doing the right thing by being more lenient only to be told in later years by their kids 'you should have had more controls on us.' or, 'if you had loved me you would have been more firm."
Your damned if you do and damned if you don't.
nsb823
I find this messed up parents can monitor you to a certain extent but they shouldn't be going through your personal website to find bleep out about you... If they wanna know something they should just ask you... parents shouldnt go out of your way to make you life miserable... i meen come on now weed every teen tries it one time or another... sex? thats another thing its touchy but if you go about it right then it isnt that bad i realise im gonna upset alot of parents but they really to realize im not the only kid out there that is thinking like this its everyone... if your gonna go reading your childs myspace do it quick cause very soon thier will be a way to make your myspace private and not readable by people whom are not on your friends list and then your back to nothing like the typical household parent, nothing....
jgweed
While the news, as usual, exagerates the problem to the point of hysteria, the whole issue of children on line is something every parent should take seriously.
It is a good subject, it seems to me, to improve childrens' on-line search abilities, as well as foster some mature decision-making on their part. Let them learn about these problems, then discuss the dangers with them, and coach them on making the sensible decisions about their on-line life.
If parents do some research themselves, including browsing blog sites and public chat rooms, they can validate their children's research and conclusions, while coaching them towards acting safely and responsibly on-line.
And because it the child's own decision, it will tend, I think, to be far stronger than overtly policing him and more long-lasting than putting him in a protective plastic bubble that will burst once he leaves home.
Regards,
John
Datababe
QUOTE
have 3 teenagers, NONE of them have a computer in their bedrooms! They all share 1 computer, and that 1 computer is in the Living room.


I have no children, but if I did that would be my exact stance as well. I wasn't allowed a telephone in my room until I was 16, and that was only with the expectation that if I was responsible enough to drive a car, I was responsible enough to have a phone. Of course, when I got my first ticket (yeah, speeding), guess what immediately got yanked from my room?

My husband had a client call him just the other day asking for a computer setup in his daughters' bedroom. He had already called the cable company to have them come and put a direct line into the girls' room for internet access. Their ages? Nine and six.

Hubby told said client very firmly that he absolutely would not do it, and the client would have to go find another tech who put money before ethics. End of discussion. I was quite proud of him, though not in the least surprised. ; )
Heretic Monkey
QUOTE(Datababe @ Feb 24 2006, 01:35 PM) *
Hubby told said client very firmly that he absolutely would not do it, and the client would have to go find another tech who put money before ethics. End of discussion. I was quite proud of him, though not in the least surprised. ; )

How is that unethical? How do you know the man wasn't going to put programs to restrict access? How do you know the man didn't have plans for the room later? How do you know that the kids would automatically start doing things they shouldn't be doing?

That's a pretty harsh accusation, saying that the man was being "un-ethical" by giving his daughters internet access in their room.
WlkingMan
QUOTE(Datababe @ Feb 24 2006, 01:35 PM) *
Hubby told said client very firmly that he absolutely would not do it, and the client would have to go find another tech who put money before ethics. End of discussion. I was quite proud of him, though not in the least surprised. ; )


Just because your views are one way, doesn't mean that everyone else should be that way..... I believe that was actually fairly ignorant. Denying someone service just because they don't think like you? Thats just as bad as prejudice in my book.
Scarlett
Everyone should be allowed their own principles.
Regardless on whether anyone else agrees with them or not.

Let's keep this civil shall we?

~ Scarlett - Forum Mod
Alpha_Blue
Agreed
yano
QUOTE(Scarlett @ Feb 24 2006, 06:40 PM) *
Everyone should be allowed their own principles.
Regardless on whether anyone else agrees with them or not.

Let's keep this civil shall we?

~ Scarlett - Forum Mod

Agreed. I think we may taken Myspace too literal.

On topic sounds better than listening to everyone supporting "how to raise children."
buffythemouse
I have 5 sons aged between 25 and 16. so it now is a matter of privacy for them.. however the internet is a powerful tool for good and bad reasons.. i wouldn't let my children ( if they were younger )put any info about themselves anywhere on the net. even for signing and registering new games.. I would ask them to use my name ... there are a lot of strange people out there

However Myspace has been useful for 1 of my sons.. he is playing at a gig in London tonight...One boy and his guitar.. i hope they dont throw tomatoes at him blush.gif
ihateadware52792
ok well im a teenager. i could name a ton of kids at my school that are on myspace. I'll admit I used to have a myspace, but then i saw the news ONCE! just once, and i realized i needed to delete my account, so i did. when i DID have as i call it now "getrapedspace" i had like2 friends cuz i was too lazy to "accept" people. and im glad that i wasnt one of those kids with like 100 + random people searching thru their personal information.
I'd like you all to know that ive deleted my myspace account, and sent an email to "myspace" regarding the issue of predators etc. etc. I made sure that my email was VERY VERY well written, clear, and to the point. I talked about how i told EVERYONE i know to delete their accounts, and how worried i am for the other kids who don't know anybetter. I pretty much burned the crap out of myspace.
Is there a way for the government to shut down myspace? because I'd support that 100%

DOWN WITH "getrapedspace"!!!
Heretic Monkey
.....i honestly can't tell if that last response was sarcasm or not......

You realize, of course, that you can't get "raped" over the internet..... You'd have to actually meet the person in question somewhere, and that would be your own decision. If you're mature enough to have a myspace account, i see no reason why people shouldn't have one.

Having a myspace account doesn't automatically mean you're going to be the victim of some massive attack, sexual or otherwise. If you're that into shutting down myspace, why not shutdown Tagworld, Facebook, and every singles-meet-here site in the world?

QUOTE
I'll admit I used to have a myspace, but then i saw the news ONCE! just once, and i realized i needed to delete my account, so i did.

If you see a car-wreck on the news, do you stop driving? Do you stop cooking if there's a house fire on the news? Would you stop using the computer if a virus made headlines? No offense, but you seemed to have been scared senseless by a news story...

QUOTE
I talked about how i told EVERYONE i know to delete their accounts, and how worried i am for the other kids who don't know anybetter

Once again, just because they have a myspace account doesn't mean they're in imminent danger, and that "they don't know any better." So, everyone that has a profile on a site like myspace is asking to be raped, correct? That doesn't make much sense.
ihateadware52792
of course i know you gotta meet the person, im not stupid....but the thing that freaked me out was that there are sexual predators out there on myspace, looking for kids you know? its just one risk im not willing to take. im not a paranoid person "heretic monkey" im just trying to keep myself safe on the internet because i know how dangerous it can be.
also i never said that people with myspace are asking to be raped, im saying im worried for them because there are plenty of stalkers/predators on there looking to get someone.
Look, heretic monkey, im just trying to get my opinion out. I realize that i made it seem like i was scared senseless, but truth is im not scared at all for myself, i'm worried for anyone thats using myspace and doesnt realize the possible danger.
WlkingMan
Dude.... there are sexual preditors everywhere. I guarentee that you have met one or two and didn't even know it. There are registered sex offenders in almost every county in the US...

There are most likely tons who have read this exact post.

QUOTE
Look, heretic monkey, im just trying to get my opinion out. I realize that i made it seem like i was scared senseless, but truth is im not scared at all for myself, i'm worried for anyone thats using myspace and doesnt realize the possible danger.


"Possible danger" Possible being the key word. It is possible if you make the mistake of actually talking to the person. If there was some 42 year old guy who randomly started talking to me, I would pretty much ignore him immediately and report him, and that is the end of that.

Also, you either have to have a band profile, or be on a persons friends list to send them a message, and in some cases (if they enable this feature) you can't even view their profile without being on their friends list.
Scarlett
You all he is a kid. And at least he is using his head.
I for one am happy to know that. Some kids do not pay attention at all. Those are the ones who get in trouble and/or get hurt. Well the chances of that happening is higher any ways.
ihateadware52792
QUOTE(Scarlett @ Mar 25 2006, 01:06 AM) *
You all he is a kid. And at least he is using his head.
I for one am happy to know that. Some kids do not pay attention at all. Those are the ones who get in trouble and/or get hurt. Well the chances of that happening is higher any ways.


THANK YOU
Scarlett
You are very welcome, ihateadware52792. smile.gif

Good kids finish on top. No matter what they choose to do with their life. ;)
Jesse Bassett
I for one am against Myspace. I have a blog, but I rarely post in it. I find it pointless...if people want to get to know me, talk to me in the forums, or see me in person. That's my belief. Here in Minnesota, all we hear lately is bad things about Myspace. So I avoid it at all costs.
JonPaulOnLine
http://www.k9webprotection.com/

I recommend
K9 Web Protection to my relatives and friends

Its free and can be used to monitor sites in a report and/or Stop the child from entering groups

if you are interesred in this software click above link
red59convt
QUOTE(thenoose @ Jan 31 2006, 06:01 PM) *
i think this article is completely stupid. its much easier for a child to just go to google and search for "pornographic content" than go on myspace, yet i dont see any complaints about google being made?
And about some people wanting to keylog their kids and spy on them. thats just being overprotective. kids need some private space and thats crossing the line between caring for your child and spying.


Your coment is exactly what is wrong with parents today.
Kids need privacy like I need another hole in my head.
Parents spend too much time treating their kids like adults.
Wise up, they are kids, not adults.
They need to be supervised llike kids should be, not coddled too like some adult would be.
Why do you feel kids need privacy?
For what?
They need a good crack on the a*s when they mis behave.
Giving them "privacy" is treating them like the adults they are not.
Grow up. they are only kids, let them be kids.
They will grow up fast enough.
Bob.


Mod Edit: This post has ben edited in order to remove offensive text.
Scarlett
I couldn't agree with you more red59convt.

Breaking news on the MySpace front:

QUOTE
MySpace.com Begins Running Child-Safety Ads

Tuesday, April 11, 2006
Associated Press

LOS ANGELES — Along with ads for bottled water and iTunes, a new campaign has begun appearing on the online social networking hub MySpace.com.

"1 in 5 kids online is sexually solicited. Online predators know what they're doing. Do you?" read the public service ads that began running Monday.
boopme
Another reason to pay attention:

MySpace.com hosts wannabe terrorists

QUOTE
While concerns about MySpace.com often focus on its use by sexual predators, the popular youth networking website may also pose a risk to the nation's security.

An investigation found the website to be fertile ground for inspiring and recruiting a new generation of Islamic terrorists, according to independent analyst Laura Mansfield.
ryan_w_quick
Being able to search google for pornographic material is not the same as being subjected to sexual predators via sites like myspace.com. Those who do not see the diference and call parents who have blocked my space on their childrens computers overprotective, are simply ignorant.
yano
Also as a tip for teeneagers with MySpaces. Keep an eye out on what people say on your myspace and what you put on there.

Future employeers have them search MySpace and dig up everything about you when they do the background check on you.

whistling.gif
Scarlett
QUOTE(ryan_w_quick @ May 17 2006, 06:11 PM) *
Being able to search google for pornographic material is not the same as being subjected to sexual predators via sites like myspace.com. Those who do not see the diference and call parents who have blocked my space on their childrens computers overprotective, are simply ignorant.


I agree. Viewing pornograpy and, interacting
with strangers, are two completely different things.

QUOTE(yano @ May 17 2006, 06:28 PM) *
Also as a tip for teeneagers with MySpaces. Keep an eye out on what people say on your myspace and what you put on there.

Future employeers have them search MySpace and dig up everything about you when they do the background check on you.

whistling.gif


A most valid point yano. dry.gif

And as a heads up for those that do have "My Space" accounts,
quietman7 has posted some info. concerning "My Space" here:

180solutions Jumps In Bed With Myspace
cowsgonemadd3
I dont use my space. Its a stupid slow opening site. People cuss and go on posting there nasty pics and such.

QUOTE
Giving them "privacy" is treating them like the adults they are not.


Kids dont get privacy from all things. If you are a responsable parent you will keep a eye on them.

Would you let your kid play in the road because they want to? It may not be safe but let them do what they want they need to be free and have privacy. Kids are still learning about life. Keep them safe by keeping a eye on them.
Scarlett
QUOTE
Child's room no place for computer

.....People magazine just devoted an entire story to MySpace.com, a website that allows young people to create and maintain their own personal web page and blog, complete with photos and video clips. If you have a teenager in the house, chances are they have a web page on MySpace (or at the very least, visit the site regularly). Don't believe me? Ask them.

According to the article, MySpace.com is "an online playground for kids." More than 16 million people take up real estate on the site and 80 million are members. A significant portion of users are young people, which means "MySpace.com also attracts creeps and pervs."

One mom, Niki Martin, and her 12-year-old daughter Ashley, were shocked when a 26-year-old man contacted Ashley through MySpace and suggested they meet......


QUOTE
Jordan Detains Michigan Girl En Route to Israel to Meet Man From MySpace.com
Friday, June 09, 2006
Assoiciated Press

SAGINAW, Mich. — Jordanian authorities have detained a 16-year-old Michigan girl who told her parents she was going to Canada but then got on a plane to the Middle East to see a West Bank man she met on the popular Web site MySpace.com.

.....The next day, Shawn Lester left her daughter asleep at their home in Gilford, just east of Saginaw. When she returned, Katherine Lester was gone.

She called three times since leaving home, her mother said, but no one suspected the teen was leaving the country until Wednesday, when Katherine Lester's stepmother looked at the teen's MySpace account and learned of the older man.


Thank God the step-mother thought to check her daughters MySpace account!!!

BOTTOM LINE Parents PLEASE pay attention to what your childrens online activities are! For thier sakes!
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