Help BleepingComputer Defend Freedom of Speech

Lawrence Abrams

February 1, 2016
10:11 AM
392

BleepingComputer needs your help to fight a frivolous lawsuit and defend its
RIGHT TO FREE SPEECH!

Enigma Software is suing us because of a negative review of SpyHunter.

Enigma Software doesn't like this post and instead of publicly defending their product, they are trying to bully us into censoring it.

We are asking for your help to defend the suit. The hallmark of a SLAPP suit, which is what we think this is, is to file a frivolous claim to try and silence your opponent. It is true, “freedom isn’t free”. We can’t afford to fight on our own. But you can help us crowd fund our defense.

CLICK HERE TO CONTRIBUTE TO OUR DEFENSE USING GOFUNDME

CLICK HERE TO CONTRIBUTE TO OUR DEFENSE USING PAYPAL

CLICK HERE TO CONTRIBUTE TO OUR DEFENSE USING BITCOIN

A case like this could easily cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Enigma Software has a history of filing lawsuits to censor and bully people into removing reviews or opinions about their products.

If BleepingComputer does not get the help we need and we lose this battle, it will only embolden Enigma Software to try to silence other bloggers, IT technicians, or computer security enthusiasts.

We have provided free support. When people asked how they could pay us back we always said to pay it forward to a local charity.

But now we need your help!

Please help us by contributing towards our legal defense.

We also need you to help spread the word so that others contribute to our defense.

The Internet community needs to show a united front in support of Freedom of Speech without fear of being bullied! The more people who know about this will enable us to raise the funds we need to fight for our Right to Free Speech!

Lawrence Abrams

Lawrence Abrams is the creator and owner of BleepingComputer.com. Lawrence's area of expertise includes malware removal and computer forensics. Lawrence Abrams is a co-author of the Winternals Defragmentation, Recovery, and Administration Field Guide and the technical editor for Rootkits for Dummies.

Comments

Aura - 6 months ago
Enigma Software Group can BTFO. They won't have it their way.
CrazyGaston - 6 months ago
@Aura

BTFO? Is this AOL usage of the acronym? Or is this common usage of the acronym?
Aura - 5 months ago
An acronym used on a popular image board that means "Back The F Down".
NightbirD - 5 months ago
:)
TheCyberGhosT - 5 months ago
I tried to visit Spyhunters Website and it was blocked by Adguard for being dangerous.
That speaks volumes. You defense team needs to add that and other "ad protecting" software
and screenshot their reactions to Enigma's website. It goes to serve as a reference point establishing that not just Bleeping's opinion, but other software used to protect consumers feel the same way, or have reason to believe it's a crap product. This will help the BC defense team. PeAcE
PS: I can't upload the SS i took to accompany this post, wish you had that option enabled.
Truthseeker1 - 5 months ago
Why does Bleeping need "donations" to defend themselves? I'm sure this site has been making a fortune on Adsense and all the other Ad Units for 10 years now.

Plus all the money they have made for Malwarebytes?!?

I heard Marcin sold part of MBAM for 50 million dollars... This site helped Marcin get that company started and he's not helping out...

FYI - Bleepingcomputers.com is worth at least 1-3 millions dollars!

Lawrence is a freaking millionaire and he has the nerve to ask for "donations"

This guy does not need any help... Let him fight his own battles as he has been well paid for a very long time.

Donate to a worthy cause like homeless people or war vets.
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
I don't like rumors. Please explain the following:

- "Why does Bleeping need "donations" to defend themselves? I'm sure this site has been making a fortune on Adsense and all the other Ad Units for 10 years now."

How do you know? I don't.

- "Plus all the money they have made for Malwarebytes?!?"

How much?

- "I heard Marcin sold part of MBAM for 50 million dollars... This site helped Marcin get that company started and he's not helping out..."

Heard? Seriously?

- "FYI - Bleepingcomputers.com is worth at least 1-3 millions dollars!"

Glad to hear that. How did you compute the figure?

- "Lawrence is a freaking millionaire and he has the nerve to ask for "donations""

Hear say, again?

- "This guy does not need any help... Let him fight his own battles as he has been well paid for a very long time. Donate to a worthy cause like homeless people or war vets."

It's likely that people donating here will also donate to other causes.

I look forward to learning from where you got your financial information.
AKWolffan - 5 months ago
Hmm. Most intriguing. It seems that we have yet another astroturffer, and one calling itself 'truthseeker' at that.

Let's have a look at its screed, shall we?

"Why does Bleeping need "donations" to defend themselves? I'm sure this site has been making a fortune on Adsense and all the other Ad Units for 10 years now. "

On what do you base this? Do you have data showing how much they may have made, and how what their expenses may have been, over the alleged decade? And, btw, where did you get that particular number from, anyway?

"Plus all the money they have made for Malwarebytes?!? "

The version of Malwarebytes I've used has been free. They've made zero from me. This may change. I may purchase one of the pay versions just to hand 'em some cash, as Malwarebytes works... and I find Enigma Software's tactics utterly disgusting.

"I heard Marcin sold part of MBAM for 50 million dollars... This site helped Marcin get that company started and he's not helping out... "

Where did you 'hear' this? Could you provide a pointer so that others can have a look and evaluate this information for themselves?

"FYI - Bleepingcomputers.com is worth at least 1-3 millions dollars! "

And how did you calculate this? Where did you get the data for the 'estimate'?

"Lawrence is a freaking millionaire and he has the nerve to ask for "donations" "

What do you base this on? Please provide a pointer to the data supporting your position.

"This guy does not need any help... Let him fight his own battles as he has been well paid for a very long time. "

Why does he upset you? Where is the support for your position?

"Donate to a worthy cause like homeless people or war vets. "

53rd IBCT. Bite me, astroturfer.
AKWolffan - 5 months ago
I suspect that I know exactly where he got his info from.
Truthseeker1 - 5 months ago
Bleeping computers has been the #1 most visited site for virus removal and for solving computer issues since 2004. Bleeping Computer LLC is a FOR profit corporation- you people are acting like its the red cross or something.

This site has been receiving millions of visitors per month for at least 10 years now. Not to mention several years back when the virus traffic was 20 times what it is now.

I know all these things because I am an affiliate of malwarebytes through the cleverbridge affiliate network. I get paid a revenue share of every license of Malwarebytes that I sell, just like most of the offers of malwarebytes you find around the web.

Malwarebytes 50 Million dollar investment from Fidelity: https://press.malwarebytes.org/2016/01/21/malwarebytes-raises-50-million-investment-from-fidelity/

You can go on Alexa and see traffic estimates for this site and also google and find out how much a site is worth based on the traffic and ad revenue it receives. If you do, you will find estimates from 500K to 3 Millions for Bleepingcomputer.com

I think the real person to ask your questions to is Grinler. He can easily post a screenshot of his adsense earning for the last 10 years. Along with any additional revenue he may have received.

Personally I think its very tacky to set up a page like this asking for donations without providing some financial disclosure.

I challenge this website to disclose all the financial history before excepting another donation.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
You're assuming too much, & doin' here the same kind of things that you do in Youtube; a mercenary job for the stablishment. Fortunately most of the people wont take you seriously (i'm talking to "Truthseeker", but better name him "Truthdestroyer"). Homeless & vets could & might be helped too, don't mix the facts as you've cooking some terrific chop-suey.
billgateskickedmydog - 2 months ago
Truthseeker is correct.
AKWolffan - 5 months ago
I, for one, am acting exactly the way I act when someone gets hit with a SLAPP suit and then the astroturfers ooze out of their slimepits, untruthseeker.
Truthseeker1 - 5 months ago
NightBird - Not sure what you mean.

AKWolffan - Not sure what you mean either. Do you only participate in forum discussions when they involve lawsuits? Lets talk about the facts that surrounding this discussion. Is this really about freedom of speech or about someone who does not want to use their own money to pay for their attorney.

Personally I am shocked that Marcin has not stepped in and donated a million bucks.. after everything this site has done for them in the past. We all know he is living the high life in Palo Alto with all the other tech billionaires. Malwarebytes is worth over 100 million dollars and is not helping out- shame on them!

Grinler - Thanks for not erasing this thread. I think its important to discuss these issues and I know they are not easy for you.

I want to discuss why this site is accepting donations when it is a viable and thriving limited liability corporation?

Does anyone want else want to know the financial status of the website?

Maybe Lawrence has Millions in the bank?

Maybe this site is making 100K a month in ad revenue?

Maybe MBAM sponsors this site?

The GOFUNDME has nearly 20K in it. Thats a lot of money.

Is this site collecting donations because they dont want to reach into their pockets to pay attorney fees or because they cant?

I challenge everyone that reads this thread to ask the same questions.

I challenge BLEEP LLC to publish 10 years of financial records and show us if you really need the money or if you just don't want to pay the attorneys out of your own bank account.
myrti - 5 months ago
Malwarebytes, or rather Marcin, has donated $5000 to the GoFundMe campaign, as they have announced here:
https://blog.malwarebytes.org/news/2016/02/bleepingcomputer-defends-freedom-of-speech/
NightbirD - 5 months ago
You have not enough moral authority to judge NOBODY, hahaha...., you're just tryin' to produce in naive souls a deception sensation, absolutelly out of focus, embarrasing & using so known manipulation strategys, you're not a nice person trying to clarify nothing, at all, but it's ok, nevermind, is a total nonsense try to justify that, if someone has helped me, A LOT, & is in troubles by "x" circumstances, i will try to help, if i can, if i want to, specially 'cause when i was in troubles there was no doubt about helping me, & also because nobody has pointed me with a gun to donate. But...., there's something to justify here??? So, you're judging the situation very, very wrongly. I would never expect that Lawrence needs to be a homeless as a condition to receive a donation. & i'm really glad to know that MB has donated 5k bucks! :)

Abrams will win this scam-sue, & if he gets richer, i'll try to help even more, i don't see a problem or a crime about it!
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
Agreed,WTF business is it of toothsucker's anyway? Wholly crap, to me it's simple, for toothsucker, you either donate or not, else GFY. This site is a public site, not yours. Reminds me of those who claim as taxpayers they should be able to determine where the funds go, but fail to notice that once they pay taxes, they are done, it's no longer theirs to determine anything, it's up to the lawmakers elected for just that kind of thing.Yet they come up with a screed about,my vtaxes paid for blah blah blah. Also those who prefer a fascist state, over a democracy, as toothsucker must apparently believe if they pay more taxes than others, they should have more of a say. Doesn't work that way, at least a not democratic gov't, anyway. BUT with Citizens United and then SCOTUS removing any stops for how much is used to legally bribe lawmakers, it kinda is less of a democracy, and more of a 'he who has the gold makes the rules.' Again, it's of no interest to me, I've been helped here and it didn't cost me a dime. So, more power and good luck with the Enigma suit, it's so insane. Enigma should put up or shut up. Spyhunter seems to be bundled with other stuff, and it was a pain to for me know about it and then remove.
Good luck bleepingcomputer
advrider - 5 months ago
Is Bleeping Computer Rich? Hope so! Congratulations are in order for the great site, more power to them! How many of us have made out financially from the efforts of this site. Happy to donate a little for a lot of great education over the years!
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Best said ever.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
...sorry, double post, my ISP is the worst in 89 parsecs...
AKWolffan - 5 months ago
little man, it's really hard to see how you could get "Do you only participate in forum discussions when they involve lawsuits? Lets talk about the facts that surrounding this discussion. Is this really about freedom of speech or about someone who does not want to use their own money to pay for their attorney. " out of what I said. I said that I react that way when I see scum filing SLAPP suits. This does not in any way imply that I only respond to posts generated by microbrained astroturffers.
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
Seriously?
It's not a problem if BC's team and/or Grinler got rich. They deserve it...
I don't regret the few dollars I could afford to give as long as they are used to
a) get rid of this suit and
b) help prevent the spread of rogue software.
Keep up the good work, mates.
leechie - 3 months ago
Enigma software employe? I just donated, thx for the BS story.
Booh-kitty - 2 months ago
I haven't read through this entire thread. After reading the comments of the posters who are flaming Lawrence and Grinler.......

Well, I'm just so disgusted that I had to jump to the end to post my opinion.

Several years ago, I asked how I could make a financial contribution to this site. If Lawrence and Grinler were all that obsessed with money, they certainly wouldn't have told me not to worry about it.

Whether or not Lawrence and Grinler are 'freaking millionaires' is really a mute point. So what if they have some money. If they charged every person who has been helped by the people at this forum just $1, I bet they'd be a lot richer. But they don't.

Those people bashing them are obviously:
(1) Most likely sent here by Enigma Software and paid to do so
(2) Haven't a clue how expensive it is to go up against big business.
(3) Not aware that Bleeping Computer is an LLC, which is separate from Lawrence and Grinler
(4)Are completely ignorant of what an LLC is or how it is taxed, legally liable for and so forth.
(5) Don't realize that it takes money to keep this forum and free help available to the public.

People with an attitude like that are probably free loaders anyway, always expecting to get a whole lot for nothing at all. A whole lot for nothing at all is exactly what everyone who comes to BC gets.

If I could even begin to calculate how much money this forum has saved me, and continues to save me, and then add to that the amount of money saved by everyone else, it would more than likely be much more than enough to defend it.

Even if we only donated a small percentage of the money we've saved, I think it would STILL be more than enough.

I don't believe anyone could put a dollar value on the *EXPERT ADVICE* given freely here. Much of the FREE help here is given by *professionals* who would other wise be getting paid good money for their help.

I for one will be more than happy to do my part to make sure this invaluable source of knowledge is not jeopardized by money grubbing big business. This threat is not only against Lawrence and Grinler, it is against all of us! We all stand to lose a lot if we don't all help.
Angbblue - 2 months ago
Truthseeker says "This guy does not need any help... Let him fight his own battles as he has been well paid for a very long time."

For the past few days I have been getting excellent, professional quality advice from someone here at bleepingcomputer as I struggle to fix my computer. Computer technicians are not cheap. My computer tech here was free. He didn't ask me any questions so he could pass judgement on me, decide if I deserved help, or tell me to fight my own battles when I asked. If your facts are correct and millions of people visit this web site, can you imagine how many people get their computers fixed for free? How would you feel if you were always helping people and the moment you asked someone for help you were told "This guy does not need any help... Let him fight his own battles as he has been well paid for a very long time."
I am grateful for every little thing in life, and I'm grateful for the nice people who helped me here. I don't care who you are, you are going to get back what you give. You just keep on pointing your finger and turning your back on people when they ask for help. I will hope for you that you aren't treated so badly if you ever need help.
Aramus - 4 months ago
I agree
Aramus - 4 months ago
I agree
rogerw99 - 1 month ago
truethseeker is obviously an astroturfer or a troll or both. I say prove who you say you are! Otherwise, shut your face hole! I have never posted for personal help before, but that was because of the excellent help & advise that many, many others have received that I was able to use to help myself and many of my friends and neighbors when they needed my help in return. Bleeping Computer gave all this help for free, so I made my own contribution to a damn good cause. I've seen many good sites taken down by these same underhanded tactics. Not only that, I have personally run afoul of Spy Hunter and it's malicious tactics & damaging effects on several of my friends computers. No one will ever convince me that enigma software/spyhunter is anything but hacker/criminals producing malware with no intention of helping anyone but themselves & lining their pockets at other peoples expense.
Jman005 - 6 months ago
I agree, this isn't very fair...... Engima is trying to make BleepingComputer seem like some adware-filled site, ironically.
Elise - 6 months ago
I don't like bullying, but actually after reading the lawsuit, what are they thinking? They even found and quoted from congrats topics from 2006/2007. That just doesn't make sense (ftr, those topics are posted everywhere and just a normal way to let everyone know we have a new staffer).

Sure, I admit, they're showing great research skills (if any of you guys want to give malware removal training a shot, you got the basics just fine :wink: ), but besides that they accuse us from being software resellers and not computer experts. Maybe I decide I'm feeling insulted (but even then, isn't EnigmaSoftware a software seller as well? I won't extrapolate on that thought, but probably not the smartest thing to include in a lawsuit :whistle:).
Valinorum - 6 months ago
Agree with Elise. Bleeping Study Hall trainees can sure learn which research skills should be avoided. They are praying to the court to be awarded for this lawshit. "Holy!" I have no words in my mouth.
Good luck, Bleeping Computer against this frivolous suit.
xXToffeeXx - 6 months ago
Agreed, Elise. A lot of their points are moot or just information that is already out there. The post in question is not even a review, just a collection of links on Enigma.

I hope BC raises the funds to defend themselves from Enigma's bullying attempts.
darktwillight - 6 months ago
Help and DONATE, i have it.
For a freedom of expression.
NightbirD - 6 months ago
They wont prevail.
Captain_Chicken - 6 months ago
Unbelievable. It sickens me to see large companies taking advantage of poorly-informed computer users. They are so rich from there scare tactics and aggressive advertising that suing them will just end in a long lawsuit until the suing body can no longer afford to sue. More evidence of how corrupted the American justice system is.
Put this link in your signature!
thisisu - 6 months ago
PDF line 59. "Malewarebytes" :|
Aura - 6 months ago
Just noticed your comment lmao. I can't breath HAHAHA.
Union_Thug - 6 months ago
Ouch. That'll leave a mark :P
Nikhil_CV - 6 months ago
This is really bad.
Why don't they invest the money in development than legal to sue people who help people?
My prayers and support to Grinler.

Support the cause
softeyes - 6 months ago
How about a thermometer gage, showing how much money is being raised? IMO watching the dollars being raised encourages people to keep it growing! Donating now! Get em' Grinler!
Grinler - 6 months ago
Will see if I can get that.
Kurttb1 - 6 months ago
I like the idea of letting your supporters know how much you have raised with a thermometer or money guage gadget.
Naught McNoone - 6 months ago
"How about a thermometer gage, showing how much money is being raised? IMO watching the dollars being raised encourages people to keep it growing! Donating now! Get em' Grinler!"

The thermometer guage is a nice idea, but I would wish to keep my contribution to myself. Many of us use "nom de plume" here, and PayPal may link back to information not meant to be in the public forums.

Cheers!

Naught
ScathEnfys - 6 months ago
You have GOT to be kidding me... what is the world coming to...
Semi-Novice - 6 months ago
I'm really sorry you have to deal with jerks like this. You're right, if you can't legitimately defend your software publicly then you have no right to complain when someone gives an honest review--sniveling little cowards {considerably different than what I really wanted to say ;) }.

Your site has helped me immensely. I'm more than happy to do whatever I can to reciprocate.
Batzz - 5 months ago
I will be watching them as they burn, but really they had to choose this site. Well here's my free speech Your a Rogue antivirus, since that is not a threat, containing threatning, classified or dangerous info nothing you can do in court. I look forward to watching your money be burned.
tos226 - 6 months ago
Money well spent to help support this place.
Grinler, thanks for this great site. Get those scumbags.
Kasutaja - 6 months ago
Is this even possible? To sue someone because of publicly saying their product is crap?
ScathEnfys - 6 months ago
Not for that reason in the document per se... they typically come up with some argument that will barely hold water in court and use it to mask the true reason for the suit
Genex17 - 6 months ago
Needless to say, Grinier, your work as well as other volunteers in running Bleeping Computer without charge to those you help is certainly appreciated, and it is only right that we are here when you need us. Count me in.

Gene
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
If I can tack onto your positive comment, I felt a bit privileged to be thought of enough to be a part of this action. Usually,when I have a problem. But this toothsucker guy's comments made me think of the astroturfwars movie, where a(Americans for Prosperity seminar, I think)guy told everyone to go to Amazon, and where liberal publications are found and go down the list and mark one star in the review section for each published works, reading wasn't the point, the poor review was the action. I could only think of how much damage he did to an anonymous type of review process and to social discourse itself, citizens are already polarised and in knee jerk fashion in a state of distrust of the other's ideology making it so folks are even more distrustful, and maintaining our confirmation bias, whereby we tend to read only what we already agree with, and miss the other's honest opinion(I must admit as a Liberal, I start out reading National Review and Drudge Report, and dailycaller site, and often soon with a grimace and even clinching my teeth as I get more to the end, as I think, damn they are so full of shit. :-) Hillsdale College sends a monthly newsletter that I try to start to read with an attitude of giving a benefit of a doubt and try as I might reading these multiple lettered after these folks names, I can't help but by the end, the point they made is always UGG, Conservatives-good, Libs- bad. Haha
BC is a help to me, and any funds left, it's great they go to the EFF site. Good luck BC
NickAu - 6 months ago
With in a week hundreds of forums will be discussing this, and forums being forums people who used Spy Hunter and were not happy with it will start telling others about their experiences, The number of negative comments will be astronomical and will do far more damage to the Spy Hunter brand than a post on BC allegedly has.
GregoryJJ - 6 months ago
Well.. In my opinion, freedom of speech is not made for abusing it when talking false information about a commercial competitor and distributor of competing product in the US and EU. You're breaking laws while attempting to do that.
Grinler - 6 months ago
You are right. Telling false information would be against the law regardless if the subject was supposedly a competitor.

Unfortunately, the information presented, though, was backed up with numerous references showing the complaints from users over many years and throughout the world. Furthermore, Enigma is not a competitor of ours.

Therefore, is the information really false? Or wait...it must be a giant global conspiracy spanning many years against Enigma!

Comical.
GregoryJJ - 6 months ago
Comical? It's comical that fake user comments and "numerous references" (though, where can I find them?) are taken as a FACT, while it's not. Not a competitor? Right, you're working "for free" *GHEM* not. *GHEM*.

You shouldn't be afraid of the court if you did everything right. Why does bleepingcomputer need a funding campaign?
DonnaB - 6 months ago
I beg your pardon?!? I am truly offended by those who think I get paid to do this! I have been a volunteer member here at Bleeping Computer since 2011, offering help to those who do not have the knowledge or resources to help themselves and all that I ask in return is to pay my kindness forward.

Look up volunteer in the dictionary and you find:

Volunteer ~ a person who freely offers to do something..

You have been a member here for nearly one full day. What have you done for your fellow man besides criticize those who find comfort in helping others for free?
GregoryJJ - 6 months ago
Was I replying to you? Congratulations upon your contribution to the community. Let me lighten your mood. BleepingComputer is one of the top affiliates of Malwarebytes, thus, it has a lot of money. Even if it loses the court - it will be alright without any donations. Now asking for donations here is another question, but it's not the topic we're talking about.
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
Isn't your other moniker, toothsucker1? You sound just like him. LOOK give or don't, either way GFY. No you weren't talking to me either. People like you are fond of bad mouthing whomever, warrior typists.
Without_A_Monitor - 6 months ago
Please support your claim by explaining how "freedom of speech is not made for 'abusing' it when 'talking false information...breaking laws...'" Please define "abuse" and indicate where the examples of "abuse," "false information," and "breaking laws" are."

Currently, all your post consistent of is unsubstantiated claims. Moreover, a fallacious argument. You assume claims without proof and without certainty, yet you present your claims as if they were certain and true. Your post seems to be quite biased for a specific party...if arguments are not objective and reasonable, there is not much to discuss.
GregoryJJ - 6 months ago
How about the fact that it is (was?) listed as a rogue antispyware? That's not abuse towards competitors? I have read the BleepingComputer review about SpyHunter - it says, that it detects cookies, and it finds infections on an infected machine. And then proceeds to removal guide because it is malware. Really?

Did they even test the software they're reviewing? Or just had to write a bad review so wrote whatever, so that it would call it a bad application for no reason. And also, comments (which, obviously, were written by fake people "claiming" that SpyHunter is bad) are a trustable proof? :)
Elise - 6 months ago
Great point, for two days I'm trying to invite an Enigma Software affiliate to conduct a test, record it and share the droppers so we all can check this (no matter what our opinions are or what company we belong or don't belong to).

This would create an opportunity to actually refute statements that you claim are untrue.
GregoryJJ - 6 months ago
That was done already numerous times, you can find loads of videos in youtube. Though why write a bad review if you haven't conducted a test you're talking about here?
Elise - 6 months ago
Awesome, thank you, can you please link me to the droppers used in the most recent tests?

Obviously if I tested it without any input I'd be made a liar if I had any negative feedback, this is why I prefer a video from you and the droppers.
WhocraftPlays - 6 months ago
Like DonnaB, i am offended by your comment. The people here that volunteer for BleepingComputer AND the ones who post info and ask questions aren't here to make money. In fact, I have used this site for almost a year and just became a member yesterday! This site is TOTALLY authentic, whereas Enigma charges a lot of money. All you get is a "free scan" (I did it once, got some malware :|) Anyway, my point is ENIGMA should be the ones getting sued, and you should keep your rude comments to yourself. I am in total support of this site STAYING WHERE IT IS!
Semi-Novice - 6 months ago
"Like DonnaB, i am offended by your comment. The people here that volunteer for BleepingComputer AND the ones who post info and ask questions aren't here to make money. In fact, I have used this site for almost a year ...This site is TOTALLY authentic..."

Couldn't have said it better myself! I live in an isolated area. I have yet to find a reputable repair person, and, if I did, I couldn't afford the $100/per hour they charge for common problems that are most often easily fixed.

I have a nominal amount of technical knowledge, and none about the inner workings of the main software corporations. What I DO know is that all of the forums I've visited in search of help have similar characteristics:

1. They either charge for help or make a sales pitch for a specific software in the first 2 lines of text, or they don't--Bleeping Computer has never pressured me to buy anything, or pay for their help, ever.
2. The moderators of EVERY forum have software preferences, and expect users to stick to their preferences to diagnose problems. Forums unrelated to Bleeping Computer also prefer Malwarebytes, Hijack This, etc. I've used Trend Micro's FREE programs without help many times. They're more thorough and user friendly, and have never turned a simple problem into an endless nightmare. Most others expire 5 seconds after you download their malware-laden programs, then expect you to pay for "fixes" that mess the computer up more than it was to begin with.
4. Every site's moderators and users offer reasons why their preferences are better...all include uninformed, unresearched opinions from nominal users, like me, that think they know what they're talking about, but don't...and ALL have derogatory comments about other software, no different than the thread Bleeping Computer is being sued for. It's not a review, it's a forum thread.
5. Every site makes money. It's ludicrous to suggest they should or could support this site through other means. I'm in awe of their ability to offer friendly, professional, totally free help while still managing to not only keep the site running, but also keep it well-organized with a vast library of resources.

I'M OFFENDED {and a little frightened} that people can't offer help to one another purely for the sake of helping without being attacked and accused of being nefarious and self-serving; and even more offended that they've been sidetracked into this ridiculous waste of time that prevents them devoting as much time as they choose to continue being generous to others.
ugnius - 6 months ago
That not true! its not a freedom of speech, when you push other commercial product over the negative reviews of competing products. you should be ashamed for this and for collecting money from the people to support your lies.
Aura - 6 months ago
SpyHunter isn't even considered real competition... Well, it is real competition in the domain "the most laughable security product ever made", but still.
Grinler - 6 months ago
Ugnius! How are you? Hope all is well.

Let me introduce Ugnius Kiguolis to those who do not know him. Ugnius is an ex-employee of Enigma Software and one of their current affiliates. You were the CTO at Enigma for 2 years, right?
Elise - 6 months ago
Ah, so being an affiliate, I'm sure you know everything about affiliate sales and how it is not illegal.
I'm really glad about that, because otherwise if BC wouldn't be allowed to use affiliate sales (which are not hidden nor forced upon anyone as our help is ALWAYS free), neither would you (that is, if logic doesn't fail me).
Aura - 6 months ago
An ex-CTO whose avatar is a 12 years old looking kid with an Anonymous mask?

Geez, I knew that SpyHunter was a laughable product but that takes the cake...
ugnius - 6 months ago
For the full disclosure Ugnius Kiguolis and Lawrence Adams (owner of Bleeping) are affiliates of Malwarebytes too. Malwarebytes was not in the market when Spyhunter was popular already. Whole Bleepingcomputer site is affliate site for the competing product. The difference is that: I dont tell that malwarebytes is malware. I dont ban competing opinions, competing posts. the case is about that!

and yes I'm former CTO for Enigma. Worked there almost ten years ago. And seen a lot, a lot wining cases for false accusations. Currently I do not work for them. And I promote malwarebytes same way as spyhunter. Both programs are almost equal. sometimes one is better sometimes another. but Competitors acted differently. Soon we will see the Justice.
Elise - 6 months ago
Thanks for the explanation, but aren't you shooting yourself in the foot right now?

I mean, its irrelevant whether or not SpyHunter and MBAM were on the market at the same time or not, because that is not what the lawsuit is about.

I don't blame you for posting a removal guide and use/promote SpyHunter as long as it removes the malware discussed in the guide correctly (and if that product is SpyHunter, and removes the malware, perfectly fine), so maybe it would be a good idea if you stopped blaming others for doing the same thing.

However, if there are negative comments about a product, I would personally treat that very seriously, because negative feedback is still feedback and can help make a product better. That is a much better way to invest money than starting a pointless lawsuit and has the nice side-effect that it will cause less bad publicity.
ugnius - 6 months ago
Elise I do not work for Enigma, they will handle their problems the way they like. what I've seen through the years is illegal competition, illegal behavior of affiliate site. and if needed I will provide proofs.
Elise - 6 months ago
Purely personal curiosity, how much do you make from affiliate sales for SpyHunter?
Elise - 6 months ago
Oh and I forgot, I'm definitely interested in proof, if you don't want to share it in public, feel free to send me a PM.

Also since its pointless to bicker about what product is better, if you're interested we can set up a test and publish the results. Its obvious you trust SpyHunter as a good product, so this would be a great opportunity to show how effective it is.

A simple way to set this up is use the droppers from the last 8 or 10 removal guides you made, drop them on a VM, install SpyHunter and show them that it detects and removes them correctly (you can just record a video stream of the VM). I trust you know how to execute such a test, the only thing I'd ask you if to share the droppers used for transparency.
Grinler - 6 months ago
"For the full disclosure Ugnius Kiguolis and Lawrence Adams (owner of Bleeping) are affiliates of Malwarebytes too. Malwarebytes was not in the market when Spyhunter was popular already. Whole Bleepingcomputer site is affliate site for the competing product. The difference is that: I dont tell that malwarebytes is malware. I dont ban competing opinions, competing posts. the case is about that!"

Ugnius, once again I request that you show me proof that an employee of BleepingComputer is stating that SpyHunter is malware. In fact, I would love to see where it states that in Quietman's post?

I would also love to see proof of BleepingComputer banning competing opinions about Enigma Software? We welcome people coming to the site to have open discourse about different products.

Finally, if this is happening elsewhere, what does this have to do with BleepingComputer? We don't own the Internet. The only site I own and generate revenue from is this one.
ugnius - 6 months ago
Lawrence. Continuing our discussion from other site I can tell that All what you are asking, you need to ask Enigma. I do not work for them. Its not my business. I only post my opinion regarding this matter. I guess all the case is about that. It is not between you and me. But I have many many screenshots where posts which favors spyhunter were deleted and they were without the affiliate links, without the links at all, that is not a spam.
If that is not true, you will win the case. So we will see. Sorry that I do not respect the option to take the donations for wrong business practices. no one can Do that, and any site can get a legal case like that. it is unfair competition practices. You and I risk every time with every review, with every malware post we make. its normal. and you did wrong.
Grinler - 6 months ago
If Enigma had approached me in the spirit of resolving the issues reported by the site's visitors and other site's visitors, I would have been happy to act as a mediator. They chose instead to file a lawsuit. Not much more to say on that.

As I said, I would love to see even one screenshot from BleepingComputer where a post was removed when it was not spam. We keep extensive logs form the day the site was opened and would be easy to determine what happened.

I have also asked you to show me where an employee of BleepingComputer did anything wrong or where Quietman7 states SpyHunter is malware. You have not been able to provide that info.

Ugnius, though we stand on opposite sides, we have known of each other for a while. We have spoken in the past. I am a straight shooter and have nothing to hide. If Enigma wants to continue this lawsuit it is their perogative. I am sure we will win and do not plan on backing down. It is really simple as that.

Looking forward to you providing the proof of the activities you state BleepingComputer.com is involved in.
ugnius - 6 months ago
Lawrence. I'd like to add that your internet property is not only bleeping computer, you have many social profiles, many profiles in other forum sites, your employees have that too, so everything what I'm talking about is happening not only here, but in other sites too, managed by you, edited by you, pushing biased information by you. its a hint for you to think. you are talking to me like I sued you. I can only repeat that I seen a lot, but its not my fight. I collect my own logs for my own use. If we have some legal fight between you and me. So do not ask me, what is related to the current case. that is not my war and I'm neither your friend or enemy.

I said everything I want. thank you for listening.
Grinler - 6 months ago
"that is not my war and I'm neither your friend or enemy."

Then why are you even here? We didn't bring up your site.

Everything you say contradicts yourself.

Once again, show me proof of what you say as all I hear are lies.

The truth is that you have no proof, which is why you won't show it. Simple as that.
ugnius - 6 months ago
I'm here because I've seen and experienced everything what case is about. And I'm writing my opinion. you can delete it, the way you did for years as it is not in your favor. I doubt that court will ask me anything as a witness, but this might be an option too. so, sorry but you understand perfectly why I will not provide anything related to the case.
And you have the right to think whatever you want.
I hear lies from bleeping and the gang for years. now you are accusing me on that? :) interesting.
Elise - 6 months ago
I have to admit I am a bit disappointed. There are people posting who have good experiences with SpyHunter. I think you owe it to those people to help them understand they did in fact make a good choice. As you well know most normal computers users have no way to do some product tests.

I'm not asking you to let us set up a test system for you or conduct the test, I'm only asking you to conduct some tests and share the malware and test results with us (for example by streaming a simple test on VM and uploading the droppers you used). IMHO it would only be fair towards those SpyHunter users who are following this discussion.
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
As a user, somehow Spyhunter found its way onto my machine(sure I could have overlooked it bundled with other stuff, but it sux, and that can't be denied by another) opposed by this program as I'm just a PC user. If Spyhunter is so good and being made to seem bad by a Review, well put up or shut up, but to sue? That's a bit like Xians losing members in the church and so want to have all taxpayers pay for their continued fairytale myth worship, by forcing laws. BC is IMO honest and if a mistake was made would be the first to retract.
Without_A_Monitor - 6 months ago
"its not a freedom of speech, when you push other commercial product over the negative reviews of competing products. you should be ashamed for this and for collecting money from the people to support your lies."

It needs to be explained why "it's not freedom of speech." You simply provide an argument without any premises or support. It's just allegations. It is illogical to simply make claims without backing them up with evidence. Additionally, you're not proving anything, including your conclusion, in doing so. You are merely making a favorable post on the behalf a specific party, rather than approaching the subject with a logical argument. Again, your post is utterly fallacious. There is no attempt to prove your claims or explain any of your accusations with proof.

You even assert that bleeping computer and/or Lawrence Abrams is "lying." Where is your proof of that, or is that just another baseless claim of yours? Can that not be considered liable? If so, you could be taken court for such false accusations.
ugnius - 6 months ago
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/564529/spy-hunter-malware-tool/
one of many many many posts with false statements and slander. I know, that you might think differently, the court will decide if senior member in bleeping, and in any other sites can make such statements as "stay away", "rogueware", "so many better other like malwarebytes". If you can not understand what is wrong with it, I cant help you anymore,

if talking historically, back then, the first and foremost listing in spywarewarrior forum as a rogue, was a criminal activity, under false statements, and tech guys in bleeping write false statements by looking into false listing. they dont even check the product.
I can talk a lot about fake mywot rankings where they listed my sites as a rogues sites and based on that myths emerges.
I can talk a lot about illegal malecal statements, I think he had a case too.
I can talk a lot about botcrawl listings, he had a case too.
i can talk a lot about fake complaints boards with fake statements.
now bleeping crossed the line. But I guess all this info will be provided in court. I'm just a person, a victim, off all this stupid affiliation war, where I am called eastern Europa mafia for nothing. If you do not find something illegal here, there is no point in arguing. Court will decide. All this is related. There is no point in search the site now (and delete) as everything is recorded already, that case is not for one or recent review, that happens many many years.
even in this thread there are banned comments, just other opinion, I can show screenshot of banned account for nothing, but I can not upload pics here. I'll better add all this info in my sites, like that information will not be deleted.
Sintharius - 6 months ago
And exactly what is Aura wrong about? SpyHunter requires people to pay up for removing whatever crap it detects (which may or may not be malware - it detects cookies just to inflate the detection count) and that is common behavior for rogue AVs in the past.
As for what you think is lies and slander, personally I think you are wrong. But you are entitled to your opinion, just as the other staff are to theirs.
Aura - 6 months ago
If you have a problem with me, why don't you send me a message directly to discuss about it? I don't care about what you think of my recommendations and what I post on an online forum. These are my personal beliefs and BleepingComputer have nothing to do with it. Also, would you stop referring to the Staff members as "empoyees"? None of us are on the payroll here, and never will. This isn't a company, this is technical support and malware removal forum. For someone who used to work for a company that had a Rogueware company, and want to "stay out of it", you look way too implicated in the debate here. Just take your leave already if you don't like what's happening here. It looks like you just want to keep the drama going on.

There's a word that describe people like you who aren't able to handle what they read online when they don't agree with it or they feel "hurt" by it, but for the sake of staying polite here, I'll let you guess it.

If you want to continue this discussion, send me a PM but at least, try to sound like an adult, because right now, it's really hard for me to take you seriously (even less when knowing that you worked for a company that is practically a living joke).
Aura - 6 months ago
ugnius, did I scare you or something?
ugnius - 6 months ago
!
Elise - 6 months ago
"they dont even check the product."

Hence my question yesterday, why don't you create a nice test video for us and share the droppers so we have a transparent test that is not questionable (everyone can verify the results).
Typetje - 6 months ago
done.
Leurgy - 6 months ago
Its sad when a company decides to sue BleepingComputer over negative reviews rather than ask the forum users why they feel that way and how to improve their product and work toward that end.
Elise - 6 months ago
If getting a commission for affiliate sales (which is perfectly legit and also very commonly used) is illegal, then BleepingComputer wouldn't be the only one in trouble. Not sure, but last I checked Enigma Software was using affiliate sales as well.....

Just to explain for everyone wondering, in BC's removal guides various free versions of commercial applications are used, so that you (as affected user) can use them to remove malware from your computer. Those guides typically include something like "if this product helped you, consider buying it". If you then click that link and decide to buy the product, BC receives an affiliate commission (which does not change a thing about the end-user's price or the product they receive). This link is posted at the end of the guide after detailed instructions for free removal.

However, if I read the lawsuit correctly, the main concern Enigma Software has, is the fact that a post was published that presented a motivated opinion of their product. I'm wondering, are they also suing all article writers that are linked to in that post?

And most importantly, it raises the question; if we as individuals are no longer allowed to openly voice our opinions if they're negative ones, then who decides who's right and who's wrong and what precedent would that set?
DonnaB - 6 months ago
My fingers crossed that this attempt back fires on them. I would never wish the worst on anyone no matter who it is. I do believe they got themselves into the fight of their life and are messing with the wrong community. We are millions+ strong!
myrti - 6 months ago
Unfortunately this has been practised for a while: Threaten legal action against anyone that does not sing praise on your product to force them to take it down, fully relying on the fact that forums/blogs are not running huge for-profit-operations and won't be able to pay lawyers to stand their ground.
I'm very happy to see someone stand against this and fight back!
Sirawit - 6 months ago
Enigma Software shouldn't do something like this. Everyone has the right to review what they want. Suing people writing negative review just gonna backfired on yourself. I saw Enigma sued other companies such as Kaspersky, Ikarus and Malwarebytes before too. What are they thinking? Why not put money you use to do all this into your product development?
Gorbulan - 6 months ago
Because suing is cheaper in the long run than actually developing a product. If your competitors can't compete with you, then there is no incentive to improve your product. It's the only product on the market, therefore people must buy from you if they want security.
buddy215 - 6 months ago
Elise...Where can I read the actual suit that was filed?
Grinler - 6 months ago
Right here: http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/frivolous-lawsuits/enigma-software/Enigma-Software-vs-BleepingComputer.com-Amended.pdf
Captain_Chicken - 6 months ago
I was unable to pm you grinler because whenever I try to visit any part of the forums I get the http error 500. This is the error:
The website encountered an error while retrieving http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/u/3/grinler/. It may be down for maintenance or configured incorrectly.
Please fix.
Grinler - 6 months ago
Fixed. Sorry about that.
Union_Thug - 6 months ago
Union_Thug likes this, gladly donated a few bucks. :)
DeimosChaos - 6 months ago
I have never heard of SpyHunter, nor the company that makes and owns it, up until today. But you can bet it all on the fact that just because of this, regardless of how good or bad their software is, I will never use it nor recommend it. Any company that bullies around a site that offers up free advice to people that don't know what to do, is a pretty sad pathetic company. That just shows me they can't back up what they sell if they have to resort to those kind of tactics.
I hope this gets thrown out rather quickly. Any reasonable Judge should see what they are doing, and know that they have tried it before (apparently fro m what has been said). The internet is a free place where one is entitled to their own opinions. Enigma sounds like a whining two year old on the matter.
Good luck Grinler and Bleeping Computer. I'll continue to enjoy my stay here (mostly in the Linux forums)!
Shadow7655 - 6 months ago
DONATED :)
BloodDolly - 6 months ago
I never liked programs like SpyHunter, HitmanPro, malwarebytes and others those claim they can catch malware what a regular antivirus can't. (It is only my opinion) I only saw lawsuits from companies with bad tactics to sue another company in AV industry, but I never saw a company to sue website. But To be correct I downloaded and installed SpyHunter and scanned my test computer where I have part of my malware collection (296 pieces of malware) and it found 12 threads with pretty funny clarification and description. 2 found threads are in registry because I am using process explorer instead of task manager. if you want to fix something you have to pay of course. It just smell like FakeAV/RogueAV.

It is shamefull that SpyHunter is using the energy to sue someone and do not use that energy to improve their detection and protection algorithms.
MadmanRB - 6 months ago
In the case of malwarebytes though, I can attest to how good at it is at its job on a personal level
ntesla43 - 6 months ago
Well...I just read the pdf about the lawsuit. I do remember reading QM7's remarks on Spyhunter, and found them untrue at the time. I have been using Spyhunter for over a year now. It is the ONLY software that has found and remove adware/malware that Malwareybytes never found. As a matter of FACT Spyhunter found what all the other software, even "pay for" anti-virus/malware, did NOT find. Its a shame QM7 said these things, I truly love this website and have found it to be my favorite to get great software/freeware to remove malware/spyware/adware off of systems I constantly work on. I do hope statements were not made with a financial bias in mind...it would be unfortunate for Bleeping.com. I used to be a Malwarebytes fan until I used Spyhunter, it just plain works better at removing BAD software that other removers CANNOT even find. I hope the result of the lawsuit does not end in the demise of Bleeping.com, it is a great asset in this digital world we live in. Respects To All
Captain_Chicken - 6 months ago
What makes you so certain that the "adware" that spyhunter finds that malwarebytes "cannot find" is actual adware? What evidence do you have that spyhunter is actually detecting something and not scaring you by presenting a false positive so that you renew your product?
He B TeMy - 6 months ago
If you think SpyHunter can find adware/malware no other product can you're delusional, either prove or shut the *** up.
I hope SpyHunter burns to the ground.
Elise - 6 months ago
ntesla43, thank you for taking the time to share your experience with SpyHunter. We do not actually delete posts or comments that reflect positively on SpyHunter and/or negatively on MBAM.

Since you took the time to join and post this comment I'm sure you're happy we didn't delete or censor it. Likewise we want to give others the opportunity to post their opinion without being censored.

And thank you for your concerns, but no worries, its very unlikely this will have negative consequences for BC.
dannyboy950 - 6 months ago
As mentioned anyone can file a lawsuit, all you need to do is pay the legal fees to the court to file. In this type of case the only winner will be the lawyers and the court system.
I am no lawyer but have studied some business law in Texas and Louisiana.
Here I do not see how it would make it past the first motion of discovery.
However I know nothing of New York State laws.

Is there any other way to donate except the 2 listed?
DonnaB - 6 months ago
I do believe that ranhalt said it best in his post at

https://community.spiceworks.com/topic/1421297-software-company-sues-over-bad-review-please-read-and-help-if-you-can

"Prefacing with "I am not a lawyer", Enigma's case would have to be that the "speech" in question is harmful to their brand/product/company, and is malicious in nature, rather than purely informative. But if you look at it, it's people having a civilized discussion, and someone saying that the product "is no longer recommended by Bleeping computer", either the website itself or the community. They can absolutely support their argument of "not recommended" with evidence of false positive results, not catching legit threats, any other problem the program causes. That's not clearly malicious, and Enigma would have to find a way to argue that. Depending on where they file, they have varying chances of success. East Texas is where trolls file their suits, because the area has a history of favoring frivolous lawsuits from patent trolls and other IP suits. But if Bleeping computer actually chose to pay for legal representation, they'd probably win, though they'd be out all that money unless they counter sued for enough to pay back the first lawyer, and the second lawyer. It's just meant to drain people."
DanoNH - 6 months ago
Enigma should be ashamed of this completely absurd and childish attempt to bully others about what they allow or do not allow on their web sites. I don't have 100% of the facts, but I have enough to know that they are wasting time and money. You can count on the fact that that Enigma software, SpyHunter or any of their products, whether or not the product functions "properly", will NEVER be used or recommended by me. I have no respect for such a company...

That said, you will have my contribution and I hope you will counter-sue for all costs plus damages as well. Hopefully a reasonable judge can see how unfair this truly is and make an example of of Enigma for other potential bullies.

Who cares if affiliate revenue helps to run the site? Who cares if the site selects which products it wants to support or not? They are clearly counting on BC to back down, or worse, shut down.

Please don't give in to them. Shut THEM down.

Enigma is also a U.S.-run company? Just ridiculous. Enigma sales must be down or something...
rg43 - 6 months ago
A little background:
http://stockreich.com/hotstocked-precision-related-company-sued-fraud/

--Rg43
ChiefTech - 6 months ago
I'll be donating soon. Hopefully soon enough. This is complete bullshit. I hope they burn.
Metallica - 6 months ago
Disclosure: I have never used SpyHunter and I work for Malwarebytes. That being said the Bleeping Computer forums were a part of my training to become what I am today. How they did that? By being an open forum where civilized discussions could be had with civilized people. I would like to keep it that way.
MadmanRB - 6 months ago
I can only give $5.00 a month, but its better than nothing
MalwareMutilator - 6 months ago
After reading the lawsuit filed by Enigma Software Group, I paid a quick visit to their site to examine their product. The first thing of interest I noticed was the statement:

"SpyHunter's free scanner is for malware detection. You have the choice of buying SpyHunter for malware removal."

That statement, in my opinion, raised a major red flag. Any company worth its salt typically offers a fully-functional, 30 day trial of their program. Companies such as Malwarebytes, Emsisoft, Kaspersky, and a host of others are willing to prove their product is worth purchasing before a user is forced into purchasing it. Indeed, companies such as the above even create specialized and powerful malware removal (and protection) tools which are absolutely free to the end user.

In my opinion, offering a free SCAN ONLY speaks volumes about a product. Thus, based on Enigma's sale policy, I would never purchase, nor recommend, any Enigma product. Of course, that is only my opinion. Perhaps Enigma will now sue me too!
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
There's IOBit stuff,and it has several products,defragger,malwarefighter,drivebooster,registry compactor/cleaner, etc. sorta like ccleaner from Piriform. No I don't work for them, but years ago, they treated me fairly when I had a glitch with their ACSystem, and without a peep, offered money back, or extend the time. Also Macecraft, I use JVtools, since 2005,(5 machines per license). One trial use of Spyhunter, as it came with another offer,but no warning it was loaded and I figure it was slipped onto my machine as...can you guess it? malware, cuz I never agreed for it to be on my machine. By luck I found it via IOBit.
Now having said a negative thing about it, are they gonna sue me too?
olgun52 - 6 months ago
Is this a joke ! This is complete BS!

Mod Note: Removed strong language
GT500 - 6 months ago
When I first saw this, I said "That sucks, but I don't really have any money to spare." After reading the comments left by the Enigma Software trolls, I decided I should at least give a little bit. Hopefully, if this drags on very long, I can donate more in the future.
Starbuck - 6 months ago
It's hard to see that Enigma has a leg to stand on, seeing as the site rules clearly state:

[b]No Endorsement of Contributions[/b]. You acknowledge and agree that Bleeping Computer LLC does not endorse the content of any member and is not responsible or liable for any Contribution, even though it may be unlawful, harassing, libelous, privacy invading, abusive, threatening, harmful, vulgar, obscene, or otherwise objectionable, or that it infringes or may infringe the intellectual property or other rights of another.
DMBFAN - 6 months ago
You beat me to it. After reading the lawsuit (pretty funny), I don't see how enigma has any chance of winning. I hope the Judge tosses out the case and slaps enigma with sanctions or something along those lines!
Y kawika - 6 months ago
Wish I was surprised to see this kind of underhanded tactic being used by the likes of Enigma, but I am not. The lawsuit is completely unfounded and this forum has never purposefully driven sales away from any software company.

Spy Hunter representatives (as well as any other software vendor) are, and have always been welcomed to come and represent their program with their own voice just as the public is allowed to voice their own opinions. Actually Grinler and his team of volunteers have always been most welcoming to accommodating.

Spy Hunter is not recommended to clients from any forums, that I know of, for good reason, the product is flawed on multiple levels. Now Enigma is doing a fine job of shooting themselves in the foot by bringing their underhanded sleazy lawsuit out in the open for public consumption. This will hurt them and their sales will diminish even further regardless of whether they were to win or lose such a suit.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Hi, I'm thinking out loud now. We. mostly we defen on this site, there must be another site with the other version of the story. I too, like Blooddolly distrust all products, malware, av by personal beliefs. If I have a computer, and AV finds ten virus on it, the AV is crap, as I generally have none. If anti malware says the sam or includes rougue cookies I conclude the same.

If a program starts annoying me, like gwx from win 10, and it nags, then it is pup, malware, threath etc, this is a nagging and unwanted program, this program is not reagarded as malware never the less.

What does this say, can I now ne sued for tellimg my opinion that if someone acts differently than you expect, you are reouge, this is malware, no, what it says, I find the thing offending...

So this Spyhunter, i think I used it on one read "one" computer many years ago, that had alot of malware, I found it on ninite.com, otherwhise I would not know about it. I installed three or four anti malware at the same time, all fre to use, but not to remove.

If I do not remeber wrong, Syhunter sait potential infectios (or their wording) 400 and som items, I said, what?

The oters said about 20, hmm, this computer is a mess, 3 - 5 tool bars, babylon something, and more. It led me to... what do I do, remove with anti malware producs, reinstall computer or spen 10 - 20 hours my self removing the threats, I chos the last...

But i backed up the findings, If the anti malware product gave me file / registry details...
But as you probably understand, I do not trus a program claiming there are hundreds of threats, so I looked on many of the threats reported by many at the smae time.

Spyhunter was the one most out of sync with the others, and in some cases i did not even find the registry key my self and I really do not believe the reg-key was hidde...

Just my thoughts on the issue. No review, no other thing, just mye general sceptics to anti malware products for my use.

If the program in question cannot find my problem, it drops to the bottom of my list.

Same goes with AV-products but on AV-products I can check oon the a week later to see if they find it this time, and if so I say, well you did a bad job, but you are somwhat forgive.

With malware however, Inever, ever wnat to see the popup again, so it is completely utterly removed and a mor secure browser is chosen. With milliions of antiscripts, anti tracking, discard cookies etc.

I can do this on my systems, but not every user can do this, so it is important that the well informed users can advice, and if that tends to go for one comapnay instead of another, well so be it...

So please sue me for being open about this, and I will give your reasons for this.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
To every one, I might hve written the wrong name for the program. I could have been Spybot and SuperAntispyware I meant when I wrote my comment. The fact is still the same, i do not care what the name of the program, I do care how the program reacts to a speccific task.

I'm still sorry for the use of the wrong name. I remembered a program from Lavasoft long a go, that was my preferred anti malware and anti hassle/anti nagging program. An I'm sorry I mixed different Spy(named) programs in my comment for that sake. Using similar names to something thrusworthy is by the wa a tactic from rougue programs, so forgive me for being sceptical about thinks I might even have used. I woudl have to look on as screen shot to see I I recognize it.

If a program cries wolf to many times or in a suspicious way it is regarded as unthurstworthy nevertheless, this has been som of the descriptions and complaints I have read, and if someone is scared to be quiet, then there is even more reason to scream higher, both for attention but also for help.

I feel, this is exactly what Bleepingcomputer does, they cry for help, and we as users (to be selfish) cannot accept to lose this invaluable source for information, help, kindness, discussion, add what ever you like to this, so whoever is guilty, lets help us surviive any threats to "free speech", this is not about free speach, this is about false aquisations, and hidden motives, and even sponsoring American lawyers, that is simply not acceptable. jut look on it,it is 53 pages long, the same tactics used by companies in their Eulas and terms of conditions, making it difficult for the non "lawyer" person tu even understand it.

If a company receves payment from me. when i buy a product (pushed is a tough word) and I am recomended to buy it, even persuaded by the fact it works, that is my business alone. Until now I have not at all felt it like this. Yes there are links, yes they would be recomended however much the cost, as long as they do the job they are supposed to.

Yes BC has all right in the world to stop other from advertising others products they migh have interest in. No I have never felt my self deceived on this site, whatsoever.
No there are no links in the posts putting ads for a product, unless that product is supposed to fix my current issue. Lots of download sites do these things, and many users need the anti malware programs because of these deceitful practises.

So if the judge in this case have any competence in this matter that allegation will fall even before the first court meeting, or at least it should.

If I wanted to I could respond to each of the points in these 53 pages, with what I feel, hand how it is reactions.

So, there must be something behind this. If this site wanted to push a product it would promise hihly advanced ransomware program can easily be handled, just by this product... That has not been the case even the users are desperat getting back their lost data. BC could sell backup SW and recovery SW to 5 times the listed price if they wanted to, sure would be bead responds from the users and sure BC coud just monitor and erase but I cannot see I have seen even one missing commet, foru, post etc. About who gets, money, there is NO problem a company earns commision, both or all three wins on this, when the solution works, the user, BC and the product maker. And not to forget the next user, since a site like this has enough revenue to exist for another day.

I'm ameased it is even possible to file a lawsuit on these grounds, and the persons behind it should actually be grounded by their parents.

End of my headshaking response... for now
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Too all, do any one know a cantact number post etc to ESG? I tried to contact the company with some enquieries. I do not plan to be a customer, but I want their opinions on a few issues.

I have now downloaded their SW, so I know what I'm talkin about later.
I will test it, but I want to compare it to others. Not anyone mentioned from here (affiliated) bot others. I only want a SW that is on my computer, does a saerch and I can erase afterwards.
So anything that does not install it self and hides its settings etc is the best.

After my "review" I will try to post the results on BC and on ESG site. My review is not scinetiffically, only as a mean of if I trus or vote one more or less than another.

I have on ESG site noW added comments on all their articles on Tesla-versions ESG sw can remove the threath, but does not inform of anyway to decrypt the data, so I have added the comment it is in fact possible, if you invest some time in the matter.

Why my request for the email ... Simply one of the reasonse I use to trus / distrust a company, I cannot find any means to contact them, if I'm not a customer. Other than that I have spent about 3 hours on their site now, en the articles looks mostly true and accurate. The links to by the programs are easily spotted, but that is to expect, if you are on a site where the company sell their own SW.
Again sorry I mixed the names earlier. For the record I spen 3 or 4 days evaluatin BC befor I gave it thumbs up and trus was earned. There were simpy to many advices on matters I knew about that were accurate and were truthfully, so even my scepticism were ovecome

There are small parts already strting som of my bells on ESG, but rougue is not of them yet, not beein able to easily contact them however is one. I do not plan to send them a normal postal serviced message, I plan to ask them questions through email, or a simple contact schema. I do not intend to read all ther terms, Eulas etc, as those are quite long... Another factor in my case when judging, deciding solutions / companies, but then I realise this i a US company, where you might be sued for anything if it is not written by lawers.

Another response from me, I should quit now. ... for now at lest :)
DonnaB - 6 months ago
Hi vilhavekktesla,

Have you tried to contact them from the link below?

http://www.enigmasoftware.com/myaccount/contact-us/

Some software developers do not provide support unless you have purchased the software.

In the following link

http://www.enigmasoftware.com/spyhunter-rw/

you will find the following paragraph just above the red Download Free Scanner button:

"If SpyHunter is not able to automatically remove a malware object, the Spyware HelpDesk, an interactive feature integrated into SpyHunter, allows our technicians to remotely analyze your machine and directly deliver a custom fix to specific malware problems that may be unique to your computer."

So it appears that the only way you can contact them to discuss any issue is to purchase the product then contact the SpyWare HelpDesk which at that time they will access your computer remotely to analyze your machine and directly provide a custom fix to resolve the problem.

Personally, in my opinion, I would never allow a total stranger to access my computer remotely. That is a choice you would have to make.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Hi. Thanks for your reply.

I was able to contact them, but had to chose general enquiery as you say I'm not a customer.

I intend to discuss my findings with them.
I also found an email link which I do not plan to "abuse" yet. i'll let the customer support handle the first. Reason I could not the firs time... i had to loosen some of my script-restrictions, as some service they used was outside their domain, even to get a send enquiery link.

My assumptions tracking or maybe just plain outsourcing :)
Anyway they now have my name as I had to give a way enough info to be able to send the enquiery. To BC.try to act as the advocat of the devil on your self... then find anything that might hurt and se if you have valid resons for doing things like you have done.

Another If Ii were a lawyer and wanted som fuss, this is an interesting case about accusing others for unfair trade, not freedom to speach... but you do this too, and you also earn money (can hardly think that is illegal in US) and to accuse about dragging other names into the mud etc. Well, there have been many cases like this before and it will happen again, so this will certaintly not be a lost fight. Maybe the battle as there is always possible to find a judge to accept the case, but when this goes on, things will come to the surface so ...
The lawyer will be happy though.

And to all, please refrain you from acting angry, it wil not help, and it seldom does. Lets keep up the good spirits from the forums. And to all. have a look on EFF's fighting theese days. I remeber the Ec-sw-patents a few years ago in Europe, now the opponent is even more formidable :)
Allen - 6 months ago
www.bbb.org/west-florida/business-reviews/computers-hardware-software-and-services/enigma-software-group-usa-in-clearwater-fl-90083408

Their phone # can be found on there :)
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Hmm, I had the same but from elsewere. I expect the comany to tell about them self, unless they do not want to be contacted. I read on the pages for 3 - 4 hours and found some earlier posts etc so I can send to the CEO :)
AlexSmithFanning - 6 months ago
Hey everybody at BleepingComputer. I'm sorry this happened to you.

I read a little bit of the lawsuit and its a total load of bull. This probably isn't going to go anywhere, but if it does, know that I will support you 100%.
NightbirD - 6 months ago
Enigma Software is pure S**T, period.

Lawrence, forgive me please.

SpyHunter is S**T, & the troll infection over here is disguisting like S**T, even a newbie can easily check it.

As BloodDolly surely knows, this soft is dedicated to destroy valuable registry chains turning windows systems almost unmanageable, instead of neutralize the possible malware infections. After those kind of disasters is better back up & re-install than loose hours tryn to fix the registry

I'm sorry for my language.
GregoryJJ - 6 months ago
That's pure bullcrap what you're saying here.
NightbirD - 6 months ago
No, it isn't. How do you call a software that does not appear in the windows uninstall manager list?, & Spyhunter behavior is more agressive than just this, you know that. For a simple user this behavior could mean hours of lost time, confussion, & the chance of a total mess as a direct consequence of the errors originated in that situation.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
You guys, calm down and look on my post. This is a factual post runnning on my computer for the last two days.
I'll try not to be biased, but that is difficult.

This whole situation has prevented me from playing a few simple 2 hours online games, so I need to sue some one too for time thefts :) ... corrections unwillingly and not free time thefts the others are my choices.
NightbirD - 6 months ago
Go on mate, & i'm gonna read you 4 sure.
zacarna - 6 months ago
Hello, I has been infected and now I have thousands of .micro files.
I did a google search for ".micro files" and I found a lot of suspicius web sites, very bad translated in my language, giving you instructions on how to have your files back. Each web site explain how to do in manual mode, that's bullshit, and in "automatic mode". In this last method there is a link, for each web site, where a download of SH software will be started.
I thought that this software was bullshit also, because I feel all those web sites like a SPAM to get money (the software should be able to remove the virus, I don't know, but for sure it'll not be able to recover .micro files) from desperate users.
To be honest I was desperate also that I try to download it, but after installation and app run, there was an app message stating it'll do just a scan, to fix you have to pay the full licence: uninstalled.
I think this SH's developers policy is a big fraud playing on users scare to get their files lost. I think you can use these infos for your lawsuite against these cheaters!
Captain_Chicken - 6 months ago
Please create a new topic so we can help you
PuReinSAniTY - 6 months ago
Do you know what really makes me sad? Enigma is bitching about the facts, trying to 'act' like a good company, and is actually trying to sue a legit website that actually helps people unlike their useless product. Spyhunter is a joke, along with their company....Got my support Bleeping.
LesCarter - 6 months ago
I donated. Why? Because BC has been such an excellent resource- free with lots and lots of skilled, knowledgeable individuals who are willing and able to help hapless, clueless users like me. I have never detected any commercial bias, though INDIVIDUALS may express preferences regarding software, methods, standards, OS'es, etc. It's legal vulnerability is precisely because BC is not a huge commercial enterprise with lawyers and deep pockets, characteristics that (for most of us) lend credence to its content. As does the different opinions often debated within a given thread.
For these and a variety of other reasons, this lawsuit is frivolous SLAPP BS.
I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir, but SLAPP suits are a real problem. It's hopeful, given the very active community and readership here that BC can successfully fight this, though less hopeful they can fight it without a payoff for the plaintiffs. For smaller outfits and individuals suits such as these can be devastating.
I'll double my contribution to BC if they are aggressive in their defense. No settlement (often all these lawyers are really interested in) &/or going after the scumbags that file these crap suits.
Apparently only about half of states have anti-SLAPP laws of varying strength. I'd bet this was filed in one with no such law.
xXToffeeXx - 6 months ago
Yes, the lawsuit was filed under the state of New York, where Grinler lives, which does not have any anti-SLAPP laws currently (otherwise this case would have almost certainly have been thrown out).
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Hi, for the fun of it, since I 'm from abroad. I thought slap was aslang for somethin. Care to explain to me what slapp is?. Does the state in US need to have certin hole in the law to accept this law suit? Is that actually possible that the US laws does not cover what a state law is able to do. Take the whole issue to the high court then, and even get mony for it, when it becomes a TV-series I'm even more amased. A law suit like this can be rejected in one state, but equally well be accepted in another. som laws over ther need to be changed and now in the favour / direction of the public.
Sintharius - 6 months ago
SLAPP (Strategic Lawsuit Against Public Participation) is a kind of lawsuit designed to silence people or censor something. DecryptedTech has a TLDR description here: http://www.decryptedtech.com/editorials/bleepingcomputer-hit-with-slapp-suit-from-enigma-software-over-comparrion-thread
As far as I know some states like California do have anti-SLAPP laws (SLAPP lawsuits would be thrown out there), but Lawrence lives in New York and they do not have anti-SLAPP laws there yet.
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
As TRAP, Targeted Regulation of Abortion Providers, does same kind of action, maybe worse, AS IT SHUTS DOWN CLINICS, YES THESE laws done by anti-abortion lawmakers. And GOP lawmakers shamelessly say its to protect pregnant women. Just as The Protect Women Act, HR 358 which made it possible for the fetus to kill the host, if a hospital refused doing an abortion, even knowing they'd both die without the abortion.
xXToffeeXx - 6 months ago
There is no overall US law on whether cases like this are allowed to be submitted. In certain states this would have already have been thrown out, due to their state law.
I agree that laws like this one should be changed in all states, as it is often misused by those looking to censor others.
DonnaB - 6 months ago
Judge Judy would have a blast with this one.....
Papakid - 6 months ago
Actually, according to the following site, there are some anti-SLAPP laws in N.Y., just not certain if they apply in this case. The first seems to protect only against government actions, but I haven't read the statutes, and I'm no lawyer so I could be mistaken.

The second law listed, Amendment to Sec. 5304 (Libel Tourism Legislation), might apply since one of the owners of Enigma is in a foreign country, but they are applying from an address in the U.S., so this might have been worked around as well.

And no SLAPP-back law, which is a real shame. These people, and others like them, need to be stopped.

http://www.anti-slapp.org/your-states-free-speech-protection/

The Electronic Frontier Foundation is pushing for a Federal law, which would help tremendously, but their article is from May of last year so I don't know if there is any progress on that front.

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2015/05/federal-anti-slapp-bill-introduced-house
MCGCS - 6 months ago
Looks like they are trying to be like Microsoft who filed a lawsuit aganest to No-IP last year.

I have made a donation and I hope you win. I have been a long time reader of the forums and also using the software you have for removing adawre and virues.

Thank you. Come people they help us now its our turn to help them.

Please donate something a small bit from each of us, can go along way in helping.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Hi, as I noted before. I said I would test the program for "fun" or to see if there are hold in any claim at the moment. I do not regrd the program dubiuos at the moment, neither rogue, but so does not BC. I have sent som inquieries to ESG to have some patrs cleared

Anyway. I let the SW run, it found regkey and files that were suspcionus along with all the cookies in the world :)

On key found: InstallIQ from none existing w3i at the moment. It is tru a pup but this key was empty along with ano program files places. As i regard the program as not rougue, i just did a dir search for file i found info about on internet. Lets say I spen 2 hours on this subject)
then next case: blekko in FF prefs.js Indeend blekko is rougue / pup but what key was this. I opened prefs and I have https_everywhere extenision (https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere)
And what do I see here... Well EFF's ongoing fights agains among others the government and agancies Nex hit, Speed checker PC speed up, here there are more keys, I will have to investigate, same alley as the other pup's but there is no trace on my computer the threat is there ever. Now the worst case. my taskmgr-key is hijacked, a potentianallo virus even with a name. Whel that was my sysinternals processexplorer that has been deliberately set to replace taskmgr (key: ... Image File Execution Options in registry)

So summary: the malware program is not rougue, but it is overly triggerhappy as noted more than one place, and the installation was just a "disaster"

- I got no warnings, althoug I did. I downloaed a hidde exe as a .com
- Warnings were the fact thet this dit not follow the noreaml way of letting me choose what to do, system protection, runtime protection safe mode etc...
- Then the next. I had opened FF, FF developer, Total commander, Notedpad++, Taskmrg, and Palemon and a few others... All were closed down in a slpit of a second, and installation continued. It di not say it would do this, and it did not say I should or even say I cannot install unless I do as I'm told
- Next think. I opened the program and had to dig for info about removing all protections (i cannot fin the scheduled task from the program, but I check manually in services and control panels scheduled tasks )

No I have sometng I regard as a stand alone advicer I regard it as thrusworthy as all it said was true, except the thing about the viruses. If anyone want the report they can be sent, pasted etc.

I just thought I would let som tech-info into this discussion as Elise among others started to discuss. I do say I mixed up the spy-progs in above posts, but now that I ran it again in 2016, I remember I have seen it before, and the program is one of the reasons I never let a program autiomatically remove anything from my computer, or computers I'm in control of. There are far to many shoot from the hip approaches. I spent about 5 hours resaaerch on this them the last two days, in addition to the scans performed that took about 8 hours (overnight)

I just forgot one tiny little issue about the program. I want to buy it.
Click on register...
I get free fixes, customised help product updates, but where on earht are the terms I want to read
Is the SW free for ever, its there other terms. Price is just 35 Eur
The program was translated to my language incase any wonder if there alocalised verions.
Randy9845 - 3 months ago
If I could just add this, I'm really happy about your bad experiences...uh wait a sec, what I mean is, I'm glad I wasn't the only one to have had similar experiences, and before reading of yours, I thought it was my own fault for not paying enough attention to details of bundled stuff that normally I catch and decline, but Spyhunter just sorta appeared, and didn't show up except where a 3rd party had to be used, IOBit's Uninstall to remove it cuz Windows didn't even know it was there. Heck, I didn't until it inadvertently appeared with a message, a dire warning of sorts if I recall correctly.
Oh, and I really wasn't happy with your glitches, but if you know anybody who's an Aspie, then you can understand my initial comment.
There's an interesting test at rdos.net for whether Aspie or swinging more to neurotypical.
AND similarly a political test that'd surprise you. As for Aspies, for example, the first time I heard the phrase as an 8 year old 'She's as tall as a pine tree,' I stopped for a sec, and began asking about the details to do with what kind of pine tree it was, loblolly, seedling, white pine a few years old, etc(I used to love reading Encyclopedia Britannica). Of course, the point was only that she was very tall, and trees almost used just as a colorful description mainly, so, social graces is not many an Aspie's strong point, literal interpretation sometimes is. High IQs can be typical, but also locked away into a kind of tunnel vision focus. FYI, Aspie is akin to autism, obsessive compulsion disorder, and oddly enough, related to Neanderthals remotely, I think. Sorry for the tangent, and thanks for your understanding and feedback about your experience. Score is based ona kind of continuum,where 200 is max Aspie direction, and closer scores to that mean likely Aspie, e.g., mine was 162/200, as for the other direction, neurotypical, as in closer to normal and being non-autistic, 45/200, and both scores compliment each and determine to what degree, I hate to say of the affliction, of the quiz takers. The word autistic can be a loaded word, but from the time when first named and explored, understanding for this syndrome is better understood. It really isn't bad, ADD, or ADHD, or even dyslexics are worse off IMO. Quirky comes to mind, and is apt I suppose. I hope I haven't wasted anyone's time, as I have gone way away from the topic. Thanx for listening. And Lawrence's top of the page note to users, as in 1st timers yet to comment anyway, well, he may have a regret for noticing until now under this topic, I hadn't posted a comment, yet, he may want to change that. :-)
mightynards - 6 months ago
the world would be a better place without the legal system we use due to its process of creating laws to control everything animal,vegatable and mineral its even ruling over some aspects of space how can it claim jurisdiction to places we have never been we need a simplified legal system like with a colt and a box of shells maybe then the people in greed mode wont be so quick to try to take from others so often hopefuly not ever give up your arms and give up your freedom
ScathEnfys - 6 months ago
As my history professor puts it - "Lawsuits are a substitute for violence". Without litigation, it's whoever is the strongest gets what they want. With litigation, it's "Whoever understands the laws best gets what they want".
JohnHT - 6 months ago
The following post was made to my Facebook:

"This website is absolutely the best website in the world for information and tools that enable techs like me, and ordinary people, to combat the growing problem of malicious software. If any of you ever donate to just one cause, make it this one. A company that produces software that has been determined to be ineffective and a hindrance to the performance of a computer is suing BleepingComputer.com because of a negative review of their software. This is a clear violation of Freedom of Speech by a company who's sole intent is to bully a very helpful website into silence. Don't let that happen. Please donate to fend off the lawsuit so that techs like me can continue to help people like you. Thanks."

I posted links back to this site. I hope most of you will do the same.
Pierre (aka Terdef) - 6 months ago
Hi Lawrence,

I read all of this since the 1st day

What is the legal action given to this?
http://assiste.com/Assiste/media/Craptheque/Enigma_Software_SpyHunter_Class_action.png

Pierre
Grinler - 6 months ago
Yes, this lawsuit is a open class action suit against Enigma for what appears to be their billing practices.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Hi Grinler keep up the good work. You have support, even from the ones not fully into the leagal systems of US / New York. Is it possble for a judge to rule this, give the plaintiff / or suer a fine for messing around with the valuable time for other things to do? In that was discouraging "unlawful" suits? I have red the entire paper and have trouble to understand how it is possible, especially when things are copy paste and taken out of context and and also when the things it is reacted agains is not hidden anywhere. I do not know how it was in 2006 though as some parts seems to be from that date. I have also tested the program as you can see above. I gave me some insights to what it detected. I'm traversing som key in my registry, so all it said was tru, but the quality of the advices were scaring and will easilly send unaware users into "problems" maybe not problems, but somtimes missing features.
I was especcially conserned it wanted me to remove som rules from my FF prefs thsee filters come from EFF and are certainly not a threath... Best wishes.
bluesmanuk - 6 months ago
An interesting law suit indeed.

The first question that I would have to ask is with regards to the claim that Beeping receives commission from Malwarebytes just to establish a potential base for the suit.

It's not uncommon for many sites to receive commissions to promote certain vendors software, although it does not automatically mean that any reviews for competing products are discriminatory.

Where Enigma software fail at the first hurdle though is in failing to directly address any concerns voiced by a negative part of a review in order to fully and correctly counter such views with verifiable and factual conclusions, just as happens across all of the scientific community when a hypothesis or theory is tested in order to seek validation.

They have taken a less moral direction in simply issuing a lawsuit that in the US at least will be known to be costly to defend.

Because of the stance that they have taken, I think that it is in the best interests of the community to broadcast as widely as possible what is happening and draw in as much attention from people and the media as possible.

Enigma cannot fail to realise that if there is wide disdain for the direction that they have taken, then this will also make both the company and it's associated products the equivalent of poison for prospective purchasers.

At the same time though, it would also be in the interests of all for those that do host independent review blogs and sites, where any issue of commission does not exist, to actually carry out tests of the software in competition with others in order to garner a more informative stance of it's actual quality and effectiveness.

Id find it ironic though that when I attempt to enter the Enigma site, my WOT (Website of trust) addon throws up immediate warnings.

Whether they are the result of Bleepings review or a more widely held and independent opinion of users contributing towards WOT could be debated but it is a potential avenue to assist in the defence of any action because the reputation of Enigma and it's products has to be established through far more reaching avenues than just Bleeping, which whilst a great and no doubt popular site, it likely to be globally known by far more than those that are aware and use it.

Personally I have tested some of their products in the past and did not wish to pursue their further use based upon my own usage and testing.

But right now, based solely upon their distorted direction of approach towards this potential issue I would not consider purchasing their products.

Voting with my wallet is the most powerful statement that I and others can make when it comes to any product purchase, from any vendor.

Companies cannot survive without sales.
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
Lokk on my test of the product above for info how I ran on my computer. Not a review, but I had to see what it would say. The test is conducted a couple of days agoe and too about 13 hours to execute.
Paul Freed - 6 months ago
Okay, you got my donation a couple of days ago. Don't much care for companies that sue folks because they don't like your opinion. There are plenty of programs out there that my coworkers and I don't recommend based on experience with the product. If you give a 10 minute Google search around the web you can find plenty of derogatory reviews of SpyHunter. There are other reviews that say they cleaned up their act. Still, one wonders why Bleepingcomputer was singled out by Enigma. Guess they thought CNET would really clean their clock in court and decided to go after someone smaller.
NightbirD - 6 months ago
Totally agree. There's something more behind (obviously, i don't know what is it).
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
I kinda like you have to pay for the program to remove the issues. That way I'm perfectly aware of what it finds, and it cannot mess with my precious :)
PrairieTechComputers - 6 months ago
Sent my donation to show my support. BC is my "Technician's Bible", it is an ideal tool, one of many, when working in IT. Take everything with a grain of salt, some people jump up and down over how great a certain antivirus may be, while others think that it is as useful as a knitted condom!
Hell even I advise my customers that have SpyHunter on their systems to remove it. Long before BC did!
Angoid - 6 months ago
Someone referred to Web of Trust, so thought I'd look ESG up there. Here is what I found:
https://www.mywot.com/en/scorecard/enigmasoftware.com
PeterStevens - 6 months ago
Have you guys thought to start a grass-roots SocMed campaign about this? Ala what happened to Specialized when they tried to crush a small town bicycle shop?

http://www.bicycleretailer.com/retail-news/2013/12/09/social-media-explosion-over-specializeds-roubaix-lawsuit

It ended with the CEO having to apologise in person to the shop owner: http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/sinyard-takes-responsibility-and-apologises-to-cafe-roubaix-owner/
z3r010 - 6 months ago
Enigma Software's adwords account, blocked from advertising on any of my sites ;)
plat1098 - 6 months ago
I added a little to the coffer, if only as a small token for some really good free downloads from this site. What goes around, comes around. You'll prevail, I'm confident of that.
Grinler - 6 months ago
Thanks. I truly appreciate it.
googlebot2 - 6 months ago
Good luck. I know what Avast thought of Spyhunter:

https://forum.avast.com/index.php?topic=139227.msg1016528#msg1016528
craiggc - 6 months ago
Not cool.
dorijan22 - 6 months ago
I hope my donation will help..Good luck
NightbirD - 6 months ago
:)
☼▲\o/☼▲\o/☼▲\o/
Grinler - 6 months ago
Thanks... Truly appreciate it.
Sneakydude - 6 months ago
I wanted to say, as a customer of malwarebytes, and spyhunter i am extremely pissed off that Enigma Software has gone to great lengths to sue anyone for using forum posts by mods, or members against the site. Each post that is entered in this case was a correct response. It is a member that has been asked to monitor the website and fix posts by the rest of the members. Nothing more.

I see it a drive to gain more sales, and a drive to get cash flow back out of these lawsuits.

I removed spy hunter because it didn't work very well for me, it also had other issues i wasn't a fan of. I use malware bytes more often but i use bleeping computers to help solve problems with malware and virus's. It is up to the users to test products. I also warn people to be careful of unjustified purchasing practices. If someone in the market offers auto renewals i warn people to be weary of use.

More grain of salt then anything, its an education site used solely for detection and helpful removal instructions.

Here is what i want to say, I made an account today as a spyware, virus, and malware removal tech, and feel very ill by this.

I wondered if we could sue them for all the garbage they sold me? if malwarebytes is the direct target then if that software wasn't working right i would tell people not to use it either.

But it works well and helps me out, do i only use that from bleeping computers Hell no, i have many other topics i refer to and other software removal tools we download. Spyhunter was one, yet to me felt like a rogue years ago, purchase or else.

Superantispyware also detected spyhunter as a rogue years ago, so did many other products such as AVG and trendmicro.

I suggest if your looking to purchase anything these days, to be careful who to buy from because if Enigma Software gets away with this lawsuit, then maybe as customers we should sue them back for taking our money and giving us horrible software.

Spy hunter did not catch anything on the hundreds of towers i scanned with it other then cookies. It brought up all kinds of questions then, and now i see whats happening here. I had and was forced to purchase other software because spyhunter forced me to purchase licenses after it detected false positives.

I still have the receipt for that one, it reminds me never to pay for anything again to remove a virus if it isn't found by other tools.

You can quote me on that Enigma Software, because i was upset then and upset now the bad practices this has done.

I will donate as soon as i can, this is one bleeped up case... good luck wish i could help more. Maybe a letter explaining what i went through???
Sneakydude - 6 months ago
The software i have purchased after coming to bleeping computers.
Trendmicro, eset, malwarebytes, norton, kaspersky, spyhunter, superantispyware, and many more.
Spyhunter was the only one years ago that had false positives and forced me to purchase the licenses after detection. All the software tested including tools such as trendmicro, eset, norton saw spyhunter as a rogue software. This forced me to uninstall it.

I lost a fair bit of money because i thought it was detecting good items nobody else did.

As a customer .... i am shocked a forum gets quoted "as a personal suggestion" and they use it as a company slandering it. Well is my post slander too? when i saw it being hit as a rogue detection years ago, and it forced me to purchase the software. I run from companies like this now.

Its unfair business practices used against customers. It did not detect half of what i had on the computers, and half of it was false positives much like trend micro and avg can do.

I have been doing this since 1997

and have invested hundreds if not thousands of dollars since using beeping computers website for help in software.

so if members tell me to be careful and use my own judgement on software i cant thank them enough.

Keep up the good work, maybe we should lock this site down and have paid memberships? Since people like to quote us or mostly you guys for everything we post good or bad or neutral postings.
malware1 - 6 months ago
A question - why do you promote Trojan Killer while you discourage using SpyHunter?
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/539119/30-off-gridinsoft-trojan-killer-ends-july-3rd-2014/
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/542878/50-discount-off-a-2-years-license-of-trojan-killer-ends-august-10-2014/
I'm just curious.
Grinler - 6 months ago
Ahh... i missed the URLs. I was just passing along a deal at the time. We were not affiliated with them at the time and I do not think we are now.

Are they considered a bad product now? I do not have much experience with them.
malware1 - 6 months ago
I used to consider them a SpyHunter-like product as the scanner generates tons of false positives (intentionally?) and asks you to pay to remove them. They make removal instructions as well, for example http://trojan-killer.net/omniboxes-com-virus-how-to-delete-it/ I'm not sure if any external site promotes it, but it's not much better than SpyHunter, at least for me.
Grinler - 6 months ago
Thanks for letting us know. Will keep that in mind.
Grinler - 6 months ago
I want to thank everyone for their contributions. I am sorry it has taken so long to individually thank everyone for their support.

I also want to say that supporters should not setup monthly contributions. Though it is greatly appreciate that you would want to support us going forward, I have no idea how long this process will take and do not think it is right to take numerous contributions from you.

For those who have setup these types of contributions, I have cancelled them!
vilhavekktesla - 6 months ago
For all the other. I like spyhunter for one thing and one thing only.

I downloaded the SW a few days ago, to test it. As i wrote abowe it found something, in addition to all the cookies, of course. The best thing with the entire program was that it would not erase anything withouth payment.

That is really great. I would actually cry if Spyhunter removed my great https-everywhere addition to Firefox. So, yesterday I removed the program, and same thing as when installing. this is really a great program, not even the taskmanager is faster quitting 20 programs. I Find the Spyhunter a great memory cleaner, for any (un) / wanted process.

I had one FF, One skype, one Notepad++ (not all files saved) Multiple explorer windows and a few other things. No warning what is about to happen during uninstall. A fraction of a second later i regained 2 GB memory, which is quite an amount, but unfortunately i had to restart all the programs again and that took a while. Luckily Notepad++ is smart enough to autosave even none previously saved Windows. I often use Notepad++ as a scratchbook, and have no intesions to save the windows as files, but to expect a program with no warnings to close it, must be regarded as harassment and act of vandalism.
CrazyGaston - 6 months ago
@Vilhavekktesla

The ironic thing is I can see Enigma Software using your post as proof of their software "having positive uses" in court. "See!", they'll say. "Someone found a 'practical' use for our garbage software".
vilhavekktesla - 5 months ago
Well, that would be great, since if it is used in court, without the context, that could be seen as withholding the evicences. The Spysoftware is now utterly deleted on the computer i tested it. Malwarebytes were used afterwards and three of the threats were the same. Those three threats were the empty registry key, I left alone to see if another tool would say the same, and then there were a few other keys found with Malwarebytes, one from Blocksite (extensinon in FF, also disabled long ago, but files were still present, and two pups in two web-cam programs downloaded from CNET, never installed, but was still present in the download folder.
Having such things from CNET is expected, unfortunately, so using it is a last resort when testing, before a better program is found. At the momen Malwarebytes says 0 hits.

Cookies, I do not even care to think about, as they can be erased whenever I like, or i can use services where the cookies are not used for tracking.
LeoNot - 6 months ago
Thought I'd add that I've mentioned this to my readers over at Ask Leo! - hopefully you'll get more support. As I said there, this threatens us all....

-Leo

https://askleo.com/another-reason-dont-negative-reviews/
Grinler - 6 months ago
Thanks Leo. Were your ears ringing? I was literally just sending you a thank you :)

To all BC visitors, let me introduce Leo Notenboom. He runs a terrific site at https://askleo.com/. Excellent site for users of all experience levels.

Thanks again for your support.
NightbirD - 6 months ago
Agree 100%.
momsternator - 6 months ago
Leo is great - his newsletters are the only ones I actually keep.
Years ago I came here while researching solutions for a particularly difficult bit of malware (on a friend's computer), and was able to clear the problem just by reading posts and following threads here.
I, like millions of other ingrates, never stopped to say thank you. Today I do. Thank you for all the support, information, and assistance you have made available (for free!) to people like me.
I provide casual computer support for my family, friends, and relatives. They are always asking me what anti-virus, anti-malware, and (gasp) cleaning tools to use. I have never used or recommended the software involved in the suit, and I can absolutely guarantee I never will now. This is based solely on their action against you.
This is an outrage. This tactic has to be stopped now - before consumers have no say whatsoever about any product or service.
Any company worth their salt would have posted a rebuttal or made a statement of their own instead of using forms of intimidation and posturing - such as this type of lawsuit. I trust the presiding judge will see it for what it is and dismiss it as frivolous and spiteful, and I hope the judge gives you rights to recover any and all costs of defense.
I (and all the people I support) will be watching.
Thanks again and I wish you all well!
momsternator - 6 months ago
And yes - I just donated. ;o)
KPryor - 6 months ago
I will donate soon. Can't give much, but you guys have been a tremendous help to me over the years and I want to give back. Good luck against these jerks.
Sneakydude - 5 months ago
Not going to harp on software, but i am starting to find hitman pro also as false positives. In my case nothing else found 1 entry it claimed.

We really need to revisit all software, even superantispyware the new company i am no longer a retail supplier for (yes first in the world) btw has been only finding cookies and nothing more. I dont know who the team is but so many pieces of software need to be looked at and reevaluated in 2016.

Agree? not just spyhunter but all of them. As a tech they need to be looked at by votes maybe?
Aura - 5 months ago
You can expect a lot of changes and improvements in SurfRight products, since SOPHOS recently acquired it. I'm not worried at all about their products. HMP.A is one good piece of software as well.

SUPERAntiSpyware is no longer recommended for use by many users here, since it's performance only seems to be decreasing in the year. It's only a shadow of it's former-self and cannot compete with other Antimalware products on the market right now.

Also, now would be a good time to include a distinction between Anti-Spyware and Anti-Malware. Cookies are a privacy issue ("spyware", depending on your point of view), but not malicious.
mineseeker - 5 months ago
There are a lot of red flags around Enigma and SpyHunter. I'll not list all that come into my mind, but one, because I don't see anyone mentioning it. I'm talking about this quote:

"I am the Vice President of Technical Support and Research at Enigma Software Group. I read the post above and I would like to let you know that we have an email specifically for complaints. You or anyone can submit a complaint and I can assure you that we will find a suitable solution for any problem that is related to SpyHunter or to our service. If you have any questions or complaints, please send us an email to complaints@enigmasoftware.com. I personally read all emails from that account. At Enigma Software Group, we work hard to maintain the best level of service and make sure that every customer becomes a satisfied customer.

Regards,
Alec Malaspina
Enigma Software Group USA, LLC."

What is my problem with this? They are lying. A vice president does not comment on forums where his company's product is being discussed. Also a vice president does not read all emails coming to a support email address. A vice president has lot more important things to do. Responding to comments & handling support emails is usually the job of a customer service representative, a technician, or anyone less senior than a vice president. This quote reminds me of those email scams which refer to Microsoft, Kaspersky, AT&T or any other well-known company to give credibility to the contents of the scam. I see exactly the same in this quote. But be fair, and let's say I believe this quote is not a lie, and it's really the vice president who answered. In this case I don't want anything from this company. Why? Because if a vice president does not have anything better to do than answering on forums (and reading ALL complaints one by one), then that company is a total failure. Come on, who buys this story?

PS: Although it is my first comment on BC, I visited it many times to seek advice, get free tools, etc. Combofix helped me a lot in the past :)
Sneakydude - 4 months ago
After superantispyware was sold it was no longer a viable solution to removing spyware. It finds cookies more then the rest. I was the original retail store in Canada selling it (the first actually) They never had setup such a thing before, it was great to use. Now i have had to come away from their products due to buying and paying state taxes to them for online subscription numbers. It wasn't worth it.

I am not sure what happened but it went down hill very quickly.
yoyosmuggler - 5 months ago
Just ignore their asses. Those idiots don't have a leg to stand on and you don't need to fork out money for lawyers because if you were to represent yourselves, the only thing you need to do is speak factually. Just 2 2=4 kinda speak. don't elaborate on things too much A judge alone or a jury would in not so many words would say go bleep yourself; you lose.

If you guys haven't already realized it. The society we have created in our country is built on financial greed. Every business from bottom (a hotdog vendor) to top (BIG Pharma) are greedy, throw a fit when some bolts get thrown in the gears of their money machine, and will always seek out someone to lay the blame on so they can refill their accounts with money they TAKE/steal from others.
StoneyCreeker - 5 months ago
I have been helped and have helped dozens of users over the years and BC has been my primary source of virus and malware removal tools and techniques. I am a member and if they need help I will gladly help with a donation. I read the post in question and agree with the opinion in it. I also have tried Enigma's software and did not like it. So sue me too I guess. If they want a better review then they should make a better product. I have watched this industry for 30 years as of this year and it is turning into crap. Lawyers and crybabies attempt to make their point not with facts but with argument. It's bull****. This is a forum! And they don't charge to get help like Windows Secrets and some of the other "computer user help sites" have gone to. I have never been led astray here. If they can keep paying to keep the server up, the domain fees paid, and the lights on with affiliate revenue, then that is good for everybody here! Thats my 2¢.
softeyes - 5 months ago
Grinler,

Thank you for your personal email to thank me for my donation! It's amazing that in the midst of this time consuming law suit, you would take the time to send me a personal thank you! Nothing but a classy gentleman; and a true refection of BleepingComputer.com
Reena - 5 months ago
Have always consulted this website when I needed help and have never been let down. Even reading solutions to others' problems I have found both interesting and, often, invaluable.

I have donated a small sum. Wish it could be more but if everyone contributed "something" it would all help. Free speech is priceless.
vilhavekktesla - 5 months ago
Hehe, you support bitcoins now :) Did not see it until now. At least then we can donate anonymously. Would be interesting to see a trace of the bits... and to use the same tactics agains the malware makers :)
deputy963 - 5 months ago
Donated and shared with my readers - https://davescomputertips.com/a-bleeping-lawsuit-that-you-should-definitely-know-about/.

I've very sorry you find yourself in this position, but know you have the entire internet standing behind you. Glad you you didn't buckle to their demands.
Grinler - 5 months ago
Thanks Dave!
walletcollector - 5 months ago
I honestly, do not see why Spyhunter is trying to sue BC. I also can not find where the negative review is. However, question 1: Does bleeping computer get commission off of the download links as an organization? If not, case is dropped because their is no financial benefit? If it is against quietman7 posts, he did state his opinion of Spyhunter which should be protected under freedom of speech? Another thing, users use their judgement to believe what they want on articles they read online. Not everything on the internet is true and not everything spoken is true. Neither is everything false on the internet and neither is everything spoken false.
Grinler - 5 months ago
I agree with your common sense. If you read the post in question, you can see it is Quietman's opinion is being expressed.

http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/550005/spyhunter-vs-malwarebytes-vs-iobit/

As for the commissions, if we link to sites with affiliate links and someone visits that site and buys something, the site earns a commission. If people download certain programs from BleepingComputer.com and then purchases it, we earn a commission. We never hid this fact.

Any program we offer, though, is free to use and free to scan. We do not offer programs that you need to purchase to get functionality from it.
vilhavekktesla - 5 months ago
And thet is the whole idea. When someone need help and gets it, he / she uses a SW recmmended from someone. Then when you are happy with it and you like extra functionality like monitoring etc. you may decide to buy it. It is of course likely you come back to the very first place recommending the SW...

I have a very high level accepting a SW for what it does and what it claims, If I see no relations between the claims and the functionality, ohh my... It will take a long long long time for the SW to regain its trust, even if it is changed... But If I can see the claim on the SW and it does what it claims and nothing els (phone home, adding adds, etc...I would sure recommend it. And I do. ninite.com is such a place. Give the users the possibility to get valuable SW mostly for free. (the version on ninite is free, but sometimes I can be upgraded, but that is entirely up to the user.

If the site recomending the SW gets commision, and I'm happy then all are happy, but if the recomentdation is driven by the comision part... it is not something I as the user would be happy for, It is as simple as that. (By beeing open about affiliates agreement (skip law / legal talk now), the leed to the user will trust you, but hiding adds, other products, or something you either need to experience or dig for about a product to then get dissapointed does not lead to trust. That is the big difference in this matter...

For me, as of January 2016 Malwarebytes deliver, SH does not)
And even by claiming they are able to remove Tesla, but make it worse is an even bigger than the Tesla in the first place.

If anyone on the BC forum came with such claims we know what to do... you do this... and it makes a mess, we would certainly hear it... And if we did not learn, actions would be take.
This company however seems unwillingly to learn, so it must be stopped.

An expert cannot claim something, and then when it misfires, not be liable for the actions.
If there is any belief something does not work, then simply say so, so the user can make different choices.

If I shake my head more now, it will probably fall of.
Dazza2502 - 5 months ago
Regardless of what anyone says it is a fact that searches for reviews of Spyware Hunter and Enigma Software result in numerous hits of complaints about the software including false positives.

I have used and will continue to use Bleeping computer for reviews regardless of the law suite as it has been a valuable resource to me.

You don't like BC reviews don't read them, facts are on the table all over the net. It is clear by the amount of money they have appropriated from users of spyware hunter that they are not prepared to fix the problems but take out a law suite from the little man.

Stop filling the pockets of lawyer's and fix your product Enigma and stop taking advantage of the vulnerable and already out of pocket.
Leurgy - 5 months ago
Considering the fact that these lawsuits can take years to wind their way through the court system, and considering the fact that New York State has no anti-SLAPP Legislation, perhaps this is the time to lobby your elected officials to consider this law. I for one would like to email the appropriate representative in your state legislature and ask that person to consider such a law, not as a citizen of New York State, but as a citizen of the community that supports this New York based website.
If you could let us know who that person is, I would be happy to bring this matter to their attention, and I am sure that many others would also do the same. If you want, you could even provide a template for that email so that it could be pasted in, expressing our displeasure with this lawsuit and the lack of protection against such extortion. I would suggest that any emails sent in support of your cause are also C.C.'ed to your attention as these can be used in the upcoming court proceedings to show the wide support you have in this matter.
DonnaB - 5 months ago
The following link says they do have an anti SLAPP law, or did I read that wrong?

http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/anti-slapp-law-new-york
Orange Blossom - 5 months ago
"The following link says they do have an anti SLAPP law, or did I read that wrong?

http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/anti-slapp-law-new-york"

It's very limited, and wouldn't cover this particular case. In order to use that law, I quote from the link above,

"To use New York's anti-SLAPP law, you must show two things. First, you must show that the plaintiff suing you is a "public applicant or permittee." Second, you must show that the plantiff's claim against you is an "action involving public petition and participation." "

This case doesn't cover either of those conditions.
Rich W - 5 months ago
I soon shall be wondering what about Freedome of the press and free speech for people who blog and journalists everywhere? So if I have a blog and I have all these Youtube stations then if I review products honestly then they beat you down? What the hell? People are entitled to the empowerment of freedome of information when it comes to protecting their loved ones especially if the issue of a safety concern? What is wrong with this world. I think we all should contact the EFF or Electronic Frontier Foundation because if people do this then basically it sets a legal precendent that every negative review is lible or slander etc... This can not be allowed in the United States or any country that is honest with consumers and believes in Capatalism.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
You're so right Richard. As far i know, 'till now, real democracy is just a high hope... If the people is conditioned in their capacity to "see" & "know", what kind of "freedom" could be practiced? Our planetary reality is more like a "multiple choice" pre-configured schem in which we're all dreaming scripts writed by a very, very few.
plat1098 - 5 months ago
Couldn't resist running my mouth a little, but I think Enigma's "lawsuit" is emotion-driven to some extent, they have a personal grudge because someone affiliated with this site has considerable influence and perhaps hit them where they live-- in the wallet. Don't think this show of righteousness will have me making a mad dash for their software, however.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Agree, is the exact opposite, for example, to CGISecurity. Obviously, i'm not sure at all, but i feel something more behind this capricious "sue".
plat1098 - 5 months ago
Yeah, I believe the "freedom of speech" issue is not the real deal. It seems more and more like a personal grudge, directed at one or more persons and the affiliated firm because they hit a little too hard and too close to home. Therefore, this suit is truly frivolous, Enigma knows this, but what do they expect as the outcome? People flocking to them in droves? Add: I also think it's a stunt for publicity.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
...well, adding to your words i'm gonna say something that could be wrong..., but many data highjackers are being blocked by the art of some security experts from BC, is just a thought, my paranoia perhaps?
plat1098 - 5 months ago
Hmm, interesting. That would suggest this "lawsuit" is a smokescreen or obstruction of some kind, wouldn't it? Kind of like "head 'em off at the pass" before something more unsavory is uncovered, maybe? I mean, these speculations aren't going to make this suit go away, but if you pick at something already rotten, perhaps it falls apart a little faster.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
;)
vilhavekktesla - 5 months ago
Hmm, I can se only on reason for this suit. And that is the suer does not loose anything, if they loos the suit... In many countries you need to pay for all the cost to the party that is sued if you loos, and you might also have to pay a fine if you misuse the court system... If you do not face any consequences for "false" accusations or for sing somneone for things you probably know you will loos, then suing could be considered a low cost trial for publicity, or whatever...

So i agree with many, that says, the law must be changed to disencourage such suits.

Far far up in this article i downloaded and thested the SW, and I'm glad i know what I'm doing, becaus following the advices to the program could pose a great threath to my computer habbits. (stopping my EFF exteension in FF, because a spam word was mentioned in a filter) It was not even able to remove Tesla-threats even if it claimed so. I wrote this in many forums on the publishers site, but noe were published.
So again, if anoyone foreign to US law or this time NY law can write mails to the legislation autority, I will most likely sign it and ask them what they are doing, and who they support.

There are som many ACT's coming from US which are too easily implemented in other regions, so this SLAP-thing must be stopped in its infanity. Still shaking my head...
NightbirD - 5 months ago
You're always looking forward & wiser pal, than me, at least. What else you've found these days?
plat1098 - 5 months ago
Well, you can't deny the reality of this suit and there's nothing anyone can do about it right now, even though Enigma has the option of withdrawing it. So, the question for me is: With all these "slanderous" comments about them all over the place, why'd they single out Bleeping Computer's? It's personal, maybe? Also, even negative publicity stemming from this suit is still publicity--for both sides. Based on what you read about this, it doesn't seem to be much of a case, but Enigma's still pursuing it. How come?
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Understood. I think that you & @vilhavekktesla are in the right path. Also Lawrence's words about a "sue multiplier" launching, if Enigma win this case, should be considered. It's my humble & relative opinion that's somerhing personal behind, yes, but i guess they're tryin' to "take the bus" of something a little bit darker that's running on several politicians heads...; a few corporations ruling EVERYTHING all of us could ever imagine.
plat1098 - 5 months ago
Woo-hoo, very cloak-and-dagger-ish, for sure, lol! Who's to say a white hat by day isn't a black hat by night and vicey versy. Definitely NOT what it appears on the surface, yet they're (Enigma) sticking to their guns and not backing down. Go figure--?
NightbirD - 4 months ago
Understood, yes.
Sneakydude - 4 months ago
Honestly? they seem to be reaching around the world at all companies trying to sue, as they cant get into the market like the big dawgs.... malwarebytes had to step up their game too... I know i have been in this game for 21 years now. You get to know the products what works and what doesn't work. I think these guys are stretching to any one and everyone around software because they are losing profits and its cheaper to sue then it is to higher a ton of top end engineers.

If someone said my products where garbage, i would want to know why right away... however many of these so called promoted products "As seen on TV" will never make it past the "real life industry" so they fail, we see it, we inform others of its bad uses in the market and then we got companies like this suing everyone? ok whatever.
Quartzkyte - 4 months ago
Can't agree more.
I too have been around for quite a long time now and never ever have I been fooled by BleepingComputer's members advice.
MBAM needs some practice if one wants to use all the bells & whistles but this is an excellent product.
Spyhunter needs some practice too but it's very easy to learn: do not download - do not install - do not sponsor.
NightbirD - 4 months ago
hahahhahahahaaaaaa....., lol, you've made me laugh as a lonely crazy dog after being working all nite long...hahahahaaa... "...but it's very easy to learn: do not download - do not install - do not sponsor." Thanks a lot (can't stop, hahahahaaaa). Well, stop.., ok, I'm sorry, i must grow up, i know.

Thx Quartzkyte.
Quartzkyte - 4 months ago
"ok, I'm sorry, i must grow up, i know."
Please don't :)
NightbirD - 4 months ago
....ok..., well, perhaps i've gotta sleep for a while... I've almost finished a 46 tools live multiboot Unix/Linux/D.O.S./Windows environments... I really needed to read you...... (hahahahaaaaa, can't stop dude....hahaha...).
CalusBlade - 5 months ago
Edit": Wrong act, this is the right one Global Online Freedom Act of 2013. Not sure if it went though
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Good input man!
wdorso - 5 months ago
Long time reader, just signed up. I just made a donation. Wish it could be more. I don't know how many times (countless really) Bleeping Computer articles (guides, tutorials, etc.) have pulled our back ends out of the flames when we had our computer in over it's head in trouble. I have for many years relied on information because it is unbiased, factual, and realistic. Thanks for all you do, and best of luck to you.
r0de0 - 5 months ago
I donated. Keep up the good cause guys.
Gmer99 - 5 months ago
Enigma will never win this action , they are just acting like they want , I think they need to be taken out of the market for good for selling poor quality software with many false positives and WOT rate this rogue software as malware ... people"s reviews are honest on this link https://safeweb.norton.com/reviews?url=enigmasoftware.com ....
So those guys are messing with people or this donation thing is made up ... I am skeptical with donations in general ...those donations can be stolen or hijacked :))
Aura - 5 months ago
BleepingComputer have been live for 12 years, and I'm sure Lawrence have been around for way longer. Do you really think that something would happen to the funds? Plus the campaign is on GoFundMe, which is a well-established and trusted platform. All the funds will go directly to BleepingComputer's defence in court. They won't be stolen or hijacked. All the unused ones will be donated directly to the Electronic Frontier Foundation.
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
Received (from Herser, a well-known Microsoft M.V.P.) and re-published for French readers @ http://surgele.free.fr/SpyHunter.exe.htm
Grinler - 5 months ago
Thank you for your support!
Robust - 5 months ago
I read the comments, and one big problem - this is a forum. Users have something called freedom of speech, and forums can be ran by will. Forums do not take responsibility for user posted content. The US was founded upon the laws of free speech, statements made in the first amendment. BC is a US company, afaik, in addition to that.

There's no legal standing in which you can be sued... I don't see what a case is about and how it could cost hundreds of thousands at all. The point can be dismissed immediately, because, like I said: this is a forum, it's called free speech, and an opinion was expressed by an individual user: nothing was silenced, and even if it were, it's called a forum...

This has no legal standing whatsoever in any first world country. This wouldn't even cost a penny to fight in 'court'.
Robust - 5 months ago
By the way, this is like suing every newspaper in the world for anything they write. This claim isn't refutable, at all...

I'm astonished reading that a company would even try to sue anyone over this, but I'm also astounded that you're asking for donations here, because I don't even see this being a legitimate court case, and even if it was, it wouldn't last more than one hearing... It cannot cost "hundreds of thousands of dollars"
Grinler - 5 months ago
I wish you were right, but unfortunately in the USA the way the legal system is setup makes it very very expensive to defend yourself even if you are right. There are certain states in the USA that contain something called anti-slapp laws that make suing someone over frivolous matters not only stupid, but possibly very costly. Unfortunately, where I am located, New York, those laws do not protect the site.
Grinler - 5 months ago
To add a further comment.. your right, this is exactly like suing every newspaper in the world. Anyone can sue a newspaper, but will probably lose. Also as newspapers typically have their own general counsel, the cost to them is not the same as for example a site like BleepingComputer.com. Once again, this lawsuit is created not to win, but to bully us into giving up because they hope we cant afford to fight it or are scared.
Robust - 5 months ago
That's really surprising to me, and really sucks. I'll send a donation your way then, I guess. You guys deserve it for all the hard work you do.

I'm sorry it came to this. I wonder if it'd sound ridiculous to say you should sue them back when you're done, for costs loss in some BS claim and get some money. Throw it to someone like the EFF. It's funny how a company is ridiculously so offended that they're wasting money rather than improving their tech.

You know what, this case is going to stab their company harder than that post and advisory, correction, heavily cited advisory ever can. It's an example of their stupidity. Whoever made this decision is definitely getting a sack, and they probably skipped a few heart beats when they realised you'd rather fight than remove the content. Oh well, their money too, and there goes their reputation, while yours just increased.

I honestly wish you the best of luck, and it sucks that it had to come to this. It's a real damn shame that people have problems with a non profit organisation helping people with their problems... for free... without donations to themselves. Actually, it's pretty disgusting.
Grinler - 5 months ago
To be perfectly clear, we are not a NFP, but still can't afford the costs of this lawsuit.
RobertNotRoberta - 5 months ago
Are these douchebags going to sue Web of Trust next? Everything posted there say Enigma is a scam all the way!!!

https://www.mywot.com/en/scorecard/enigmasoftware.com
Ted Striker - 5 months ago
I'm sorry to hear about this lawsuit. It definitely sounds like a petty, frivolous lawsuit and I bet they're hoping to intimidate you into removing the review.

Have you considered contacting the EFF? They might be interested in taking this case and they won't charge you as much as the average attorney.

Good luck!
Grinler - 5 months ago
Yes, we reached out to EFF to see if they wanted to work with us, but they said this is not something they wished to get involved with as we already have representation.
Lloydlec - 5 months ago
I would not worry about this. You were giving an opinion and it is unlikely that any judge worth anything will find you guilty of anything if it is your opinion or your testers opinion. Ask your lawyers and stop the worry !
kmac88 - 5 months ago
In my opinion Bleeping Computer have only ever given open and honest advice which we the public can choose to accept or not. I agree with everything you have said about Spyhunter from my past experience and have avoided it ever since then. This was nothing to do with any advice you or any other website has said about it. Anyway, I have mad a small contribution and would like to wish you best of luck in defending freedom of speech.
Phreedom - 5 months ago
Refuse to be bullied. I've made a donation.
jonsey - 5 months ago
I am here because Leo of Ask Leo! suggested I take a look. I know and love BC and I'm very sorry that you have to waste time dealing with this ridiculous situation.

Enigma indeed! No mystery there - obviously a pathetically small-minded outfit.

My donation is not only to support you, but also to thank you for all the free information and help over the years. People like BC who offer their time and knowledge online for no monetary gain warm my heart!
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
I've made my donation too.

On the French battlefield, another well-known Microsoft M.V.P. (Georges News) published on Microsoft Answers a thread I could hardly translate as a couple of words are slang, but starts with something like:

Hello everyone.
Some still wonder:
is Enigma Software's "SpyHunter" a crap, together with a scam?
=> The answer is YES, it is a crap to avoid.

and further down relays the message I posted here yesterday.

Georges bets on the excellent reputation of Answers with Googlebots and thinks his message will be very well referenced and soon, maybe tomorrow.

http://answers.microsoft.com/fr-fr/protect/forum/protect_other-protect_scanning/spyhunter-est-il-bien-une-daube/4ba791fd-1fb8-425b-bfcb-1edca5377cc8

All this won't probably really help you from our side of the ocean, but, maybe, will cheer you up a little bit?
Grinler - 5 months ago
Though I appreciate the support, I am asking everyone to please not make negative comments about Enigma or their products just because you think it may help the case. If you have legitimate concerns, opinions, or facts about them, then that is one thing, but do not post negative comments just to make them look bad in the search engine results. That is not something I condone for the site, as a person, and is not something that I would allow to be done here at BC.

Though I appreciate the sentiment behind him creating the topic, it would be better if he removed it.
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
I have no personal relationship with Georges (but have bumped into him many times on newsgroups or forums).

Nevertheless I will try to ask him if, rather than deleting it, he would "defuse the bomb" and stick to his experience and not express an opinion, to stick to what you would condone.

The support will remain anyway :)
Gmer99 - 5 months ago
I will donate only if Combofix will work on Windows 8.1 Pro and 10 both x64 and x86 bit ...
Sintharius - 5 months ago
The author of ComboFix is part of Malwarebytes Corporation, whether he chooses to update CF or not is up to him. I do not think BC has a say in that matter.
Aura - 5 months ago
You think that sUBs works for BleepingComputer or something? sUBs works for Malwarebytes, and I think he have more pressing things to work on than ComboFix compatibility with Windows 8.1 and 10. This being said, ComboFix isn't meant to be used by untrained users, so you shouldn't be worried about this. If anything, people that are part of the malware removal community should, but they all understand that it's not possible at this time.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
heheheheheheeheheeeee..., i've cougt you!, you're joking!, ain't you? I'm not talking about CFix capabilities, but about the conditioning of your donation... :)
OliviaDrinkwine - 5 months ago
i donated not much but it's what i have and i hope bleepingcomputer wins this lawsuit we should be able to speak freely without the threat of getting censored and until i read a malwarebytes unpacked blog about this lawsuit i never even heard of Ignima software or malware hunter not sure if that's what it is called but ya
LuigiV6 - 5 months ago
You may GregoryJJ is one of the plaintiffs ? Someone thought what its possible?

Spyhunter bad experience my pc personal,end point.
Only support moral,good luck .no money : (
LuigiV6 - 5 months ago
Yes!!!!!OliviaDrinkwine,my thinking is the same
strek22ts - 5 months ago
They should be sued just because they stole the logo from LucasArts !!
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
Seems Answers support guys don't like them much either...

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/protect/forum/protect_other-protect_scanning/wth-bleepingcomputer-is-being-sued-by-the-creators/0fd10ffa-b139-43b6-a746-0b49d35d2591
meows - 5 months ago
Guys, while we are disabled and on social non-security, I am sending 500.00 your way, maybe for the one hour of attorney time you need to get the monkey shit off your back and send them to supererogatory.

Do you need additional legal OFFENSE (a counter suit at times like this has ended many suits against us) or Defense team members?
Crazy Cat - 5 months ago
Way too much rhetoric on this, and not enough unbiased objective opinions.

Grinler: May I suggest you register at http://forum.freeadvice.com and post in "Libel / Slander / Defamation." http://forum.freeadvice.com/libel-slander-defamation-88/

Under some circumstances, posting or tell the truth, is not enough to stop defamation. See #4. http://forum.freeadvice.com/libel-slander-defamation-88/can-she-sue-621768.html#post3389977
Papakid - 5 months ago
That case isn't comparable to this one and it's a terrible example to use. It really doesn't support your assertion that "Under some circumstances, posting or tell (sic) the truth, is not enough to stop defamation." The more experienced poster there does say if what was written implies defamation then there could be grounds for a suit, but in his concluding post he elaborates. The contents, exactly what was written, is critical, so he couldn't say with certainty that a suit was warranted in the case, but if so, only "(i)f there are false implications that can be drawn..." So falsity is still the acid test, along with malice, in any defamation suit, whether it be libel or slander (libel in BC's case since the words in question were written instead of spoken). Not to mention that you're referencing an opinion given by one person about what might be possible, not case law that exemplifies a point of law.

And why would Lawrence want to go to a forum for free advice when he has already retained council? Yes, that is rhetorical, but also a valid question.

I do agree with one thing you've said, there is a not a lot of objectivity in the comments here--but that is to be expected. Objectivity is very difficult, especially for those who have no idea what it is. Some say it is impossible to be 100% objective--which is probably true. Plus this is a thread in essence advocating for one side, which is subjective by nature. But I am amazed at the naivete of some of the posters here--a couple in particular who have no concept of or at the least are misinformed about communication law and a realistic assessment of what can be done in the legal system, not only in the US, but other systems in the free world. It's a common misconception that freedom of speech is absolute. There are restrictions--many more than most people think: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_free_speech_exceptions

Defamation is one of those restrictions. (And for a sobering look at how oppressive the U.S. government can be, do some research on sedition laws.) All three of ESG's claims are in essence charging BC with libel, even the first that cites the Lanham Act, which, according to my research, the false advertising claim and others really just boil down to commercial libel where the acid test is still falsehoods and malice. In my opinion, the suit against BC is frivolous because there are virtually no provable facts to support a good faith argument. Is that fair and just that this suit can be brought in the first place? Not in my opinion. As has been mentioned over and over again, the purpose of the suit is not to achieve justice, but to intimidate and censor by threatening or, in this case causing the economic hardship of paying for a defense. That's just the system we have in the United States. Consider these quotes--and sorry if they seem on the cynical side.

"This is a court of law, young man, not a court of justice." ~Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.

"Law is not justice and a trial is not a scientific inquiry into truth. A trial is the resolution of a dispute." ~Edison Haines

"Although the legal and ethical definitions of right are the antithesis of each other, most writers use them as synonyms. They confuse power with goodness, and mistake law for justice." ~Charles T. Sprading, Freedom and its Fundamentals

"It is not a Justice System. It is just a system." ~Bob Enyart

Even so I hold out hope for BC achieving justice. In a perfect world BC would be able to sue ESG for libel based on the claims made in the lawsuit--the large majority of which are false in my opinion. What worries me a bit is how courts decide the issue of malice--from what I hear the concept is (as well as libel itself) much more tricky than what we would think for a just system and may come down to how a judge (or jury if ESG has their way) interprets malice. That is why Lawrence needs excellent lawyers and the money to pay them. So I urge everyone to contribute to help fight for justice--because it is not impossible. There is still hope.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
Martin Luther King, Jr.

On its face, the case should be thrown out, since QM7 clearly stated he was giving his opinion, and opinons are not facts, therefore not provable, and false facts are essential to proving a case of libel.

One last thing: In another thread you have claimed that the suit has nothing to do with Freedom of Speech--as you can see from what I've already written it most certainly is. Later you seemed to back track to state that Free Speech only applies to censorship by the government, although it isn't completely clear if that was your intended meaning. But if so, you are most certainly mistaken there as well. It's true that the first amendment says that "Congress" shall make no law (...), but that was remedied by the 14th amendment. Lawrence's lawyer addresses it much better than I can at the bottom of this post: http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/605606/about-the-engima-lawsuit-my-just-my-02-and-alternative-thinking-to-donating/#entry3936413

Which makes sense when you think about it. It should make no difference which governing body makes a law, NO LAW should be created by anyone that abridges reasonable free speech.
Wolverine 7 - 5 months ago
Blantant oppertunism from a poorly thought of company,with second rate products,will be donating.
Crazy Cat - 5 months ago
[1] That case isn't comparable to this one and it's a terrible example to use. It really doesn't support your assertion that "Under some circumstances, posting or tell (sic) the truth, is not enough to stop defamation." The more experienced poster there does say if what was written implies defamation then there could be grounds for a suit, but in his concluding post he elaborates. The contents, exactly what was written, is critical, so he couldn't say with certainty that a suit was warranted in the case, but if so, only "(i)f there are false implications that can be drawn..." So falsity is still the acid test, along with malice, in any defamation suit, whether it be libel or slander (libel in BC's case since the words in question were written instead of spoken). Not to mention that you're referencing an opinion given by one person about what might be possible, not case law that exemplifies a point of law.

[2] And why would Lawrence want to go to a forum for free advice when he has already retained council? Yes, that is rhetorical, but also a valid question.

[3] I do agree with one thing you've said, there is a not a lot of objectivity in the comments here--but that is to be expected. Objectivity is very difficult, especially for those who have no idea what it is. Some say it is impossible to be 100% objective--which is probably true. Plus this is a thread in essence advocating for one side, which is subjective by nature. But I am amazed at the naivete of some of the posters here--a couple in particular who have no concept of or at the least are misinformed about communication law and a realistic assessment of what can be done in the legal system, not only in the US, but other systems in the free world. It's a common misconception that freedom of speech is absolute. There are restrictions--many more than most people think: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_free_speech_exceptions

[4] Defamation is one of those restrictions. (And for a sobering look at how oppressive the U.S. government can be, do some research on sedition laws.) All three of ESG's claims are in essence charging BC with libel, even the first that cites the Lanham Act, which, according to my research, the false advertising claim and others really just boil down to commercial libel where the acid test is still falsehoods and malice. In my opinion, the suit against BC is frivolous because there are virtually no provable facts to support a good faith argument. Is that fair and just that this suit can be brought in the first place? Not in my opinion. As has been mentioned over and over again, the purpose of the suit is not to achieve justice, but to intimidate and censor by threatening or, in this case causing the economic hardship of paying for a defense. That's just the system we have in the United States. Consider these quotes--and sorry if they seem on the cynical side.

"This is a court of law, young man, not a court of justice." ~Oliver Wendell Holmes, Jr.

"Law is not justice and a trial is not a scientific inquiry into truth. A trial is the resolution of a dispute." ~Edison Haines

"Although the legal and ethical definitions of right are the antithesis of each other, most writers use them as synonyms. They confuse power with goodness, and mistake law for justice." ~Charles T. Sprading, Freedom and its Fundamentals

"It is not a Justice System. It is just a system." ~Bob Enyart

Even so I hold out hope for BC achieving justice. In a perfect world BC would be able to sue ESG for libel based on the claims made in the lawsuit--the large majority of which are false in my opinion. What worries me a bit is how courts decide the issue of malice--from what I hear the concept is (as well as libel itself) much more tricky than what we would think for a just system and may come down to how a judge (or jury if ESG has their way) interprets malice. That is why Lawrence needs excellent lawyers and the money to pay them. So I urge everyone to contribute to help fight for justice--because it is not impossible. There is still hope.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
Martin Luther King, Jr.

[5] On its face, the case should be thrown out, since QM7 clearly stated he was giving his opinion, and opinons are not facts, therefore not provable, and false facts are essential to proving a case of libel.

[6] One last thing: In another thread you have claimed that the suit has nothing to do with Freedom of Speech--as you can see from what I've already written it most certainly is. Later you seemed to back track to state that Free Speech only applies to censorship by the government, although it isn't completely clear if that was your intended meaning. But if so, you are most certainly mistaken there as well. It's true that the first amendment says that "Congress" shall make no law (...), but that was remedied by the 14th amendment. Lawrence's lawyer addresses it much better than I can at the bottom of this post: http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/605606/about-the-engima-lawsuit-my-just-my-02-and-alternative-thinking-to-donating/#entry3936413

Which makes sense when you think about it. It should make no difference which governing body makes a law, NO LAW should be created by anyone that abridges reasonable free speech.
[hr]

[1]Lets see what my 'terrible example' and ESG claims have in common?

FROM http://forum.freeadvice.com/libel-slander-defamation-88/can-she-sue-621768.html#post3389977

Would there be anyway to pull the book off the shelf?
Demonstrate her reputation has been harmed by the publication.
Embarrassment alone cannot support a defamation lawsuit but what is implied about the mother-in-law in the text could.

ESG wants Quietman7 (QM7) remarks to be removed, because the publication (of QM7 remarks on the forum) was damaging their reputation. Is this embarrassment and damaged reputation defamatory, either stemming from the conflict of interests between BC and ESG antimalware products, resulting in predication by BC?

While the full contents, and context, is not published in my example, it is here. Also let's assume the author of the published book has been historically accurate in contents, and context (even publishing her full maiden name), - can she still sue for malicious bias intent to harm her reputation?

[2] Not for Lawrence to seek free advice, but for Lawrence to show the members who have posted here, an objective view by those in the law field.

[3] Agreed, "It's a common misconception that freedom of speech is absolute."

[4] Let me be bold to say this, if BC was some back-water obscure forum with little to no public interest on the internet, then ESG would not be wasting their time with a lawsuit.

[5] "since QM7 clearly stated he was giving his opinion, and opinions are not facts, therefore not provable," QUESTION: are the opinion(s) just opinion(s), or bias opinion(s) stemming from the conflict of interests between BC and ESG antimalware products, resulting in predication by BC?

[6] Show me, and other members, WHERE on the forum BC has been oppressed, or censored, in their opinions or views?

Lawrence's lawyer, Marc Randazza http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marc_Randazza

Interesting read...

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/11/how-copyright-lawyer-marc-randazza-got-famous-lost-friends-and-went-broke/
http://fightcopyrighttrolls.com/2015/07/09/marc-randazza-must-pay-600k-for-clear-and-serious-breaches-of-fiduciary-duty-against-his-former-client/
Papakid - 5 months ago
{[1]Lets see what my 'terrible example' and ESG claims have in common?}

I wish you would because what you have written below this sentence doesn't. The first two lines below the link are nonsense and the rest of it is just an attempt to define and justify a case of libel, but you don't show any way in which the circumstances of the two cases are comparable. I would go through it line by line, but it is all a red herring. There is no refutation of my point that nothing in the linked to thread cites case law or anything else that would prove or even support your assertion that, "Under some circumstances, posting or tell (sic) the truth, is not enough to stop defamation."

{[2] Not for Lawrence to seek free advice, but for Lawrence to show the members who have posted here, an objective view by those in the law field.}

Really? After thinking about it a great deal I kind of see what you're saying--but it is a very strange and inefficient way to go about it. And it presumes Lawrence does not think objectively and that there is a need for him and others to see objective thinking. Your condescension sounds very much to me as if you are biased against Lawrence and his case. If you wanted those who have posted here that are obviously ignorant of what objectivity is to see that forum, you could have just posted such on your own without implying that there was a need for Lawrence to do so.

{[3] Agreed, "It's a common misconception that freedom of speech is absolute."}

'Nuff said.

{[4] Let me be bold to say this, if BC was some back-water obscure forum with little to no public interest on the internet, then ESG would not be wasting their time with a lawsuit.}

That is somewhat true and would be especially so if the primary purpose of ESG's suit was to "achieve justice" by proving libel and recovering actual damages. But it's not, in my opinion; the purpose is to intimidate anyone who publishes anything that might be interpreted as a negative review so that they remove that review and are afraid to post honest criticism in the future. So small sites are affected if ESG is successful. And I think it is not so much the size and popularity of this site as it is that the "review" in question is near the top of the page in a Google search for Spyhunter. Small sites with a good SEO strategy could be the same kind of threat in ESG's eyes. But for the most part, in regard to just forums, you are correct--only forum topics that are extremely helpful in solving a specific issue or that are extremely popular for whatever other reasons are going to have a high page rank to come across their radar. But the big problems I have with your statement is that you seem to think ESG has a viable case, which is counter to my opinion.

{[5] "since QM7 clearly stated he was giving his opinion, and opinions are not facts, therefore not provable," QUESTION: are the opinion(s) just opinion(s), or bias opinion(s) stemming from the conflict of interests between BC and ESG antimalware products, resulting in predication by BC?}

What, are you a shill for ESG? You are mischaracterizing the nature of BC, just as they are and making the concept of an opinion more complex than is needs to be. Please don't obfuscate--or leave out key parts of my comment; that "false facts are essential to proving a case of libel." I don't think my comment could be any more clear, but let's see if I can get through to you. All three of ESG's charges boil down to allegations of libel. To prove libel, ESG's council must prove that their reputation was damaged by the publishing of false facts with malice. Courts have ruled in libel cases that opinions are not facts so are unprovable and ergo cannot be considered false facts. So it doesn't matter if the opinion is based on false facts, biased or even patently ridiculous--you can say that the moon is made of blue cheese and anyone who disagrees is an idiot--as long as it is an opinion it is protected free speech.

{[6] Show me, and other members, WHERE on the forum BC has been oppressed, or censored, in their opinions or views?}

Now you're responding with a non sequiter that begs the question. I've shown you where this suit is a Free Speech issue; you show me, please, where it is not. I linked to the Wikipedia article on how defamation is a restriction on free speech. That is offered as evidence to prove it's a free speech issue, not to negate. All laws that relate to free speech fall under the First Amendment and it is my contention that it goes beyond specific laws abridging free speech, but includes how law is used to muzzle free speech regardless of whether it's the government or a non-government entity using those laws. I will also submit that (humoring your question here) ESG's censorship is a fait accompli just by the existence of this and other SLAPP suits alone. I.E., the idea that one could be sued for expressing a negative opinion has prevented some, not only members of BC, but it could be anyone who wants to publish an honest opinion on the web, from doing so. So, that being the case, how can I show you something that hasn't been posted because of the oppressive weight of this lawsuit? The closest I can come is Leo of Ask Leo posting his view that suits like these are one reason he doesn't write negative reviews.
------------------
As far as Mr. Randazza goes--thanks for the links. The arbiter's decision does raise concerns about his ethical behavior, but I don't think that whole controversy is completely over and ultimately decided, so, to be unbiased like you want me to be, I'll reserve judgment until more serious sanctions follow. I just hope he will treat Lawrence right. But whatever his personal failings, your logical fallacy (implied) of "attacking the person" does not negate his expert knowledge of First Amendment law. And anyone who puts Glenn Beck in his place can't be all bad as far as I'm concerned...
Crazy Cat - 5 months ago
In lieu of your comments and conjecture, mainly these three:

(1) What, are you a shill for ESG?

(2) Your condescension sounds very much to me as if you are biased against Lawrence and his case.

(3) your logical fallacy (implied) of "attacking the person" does not negate his expert

I stated clearly on the 11 February 2016, the following; "For the record, I'm neither friend nor foe of Bleeping Computer or Enigma Software Group. My opinions are without prejudication." http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/550005/spyhunter-vs-malwarebytes-vs-iobit/page-5#entry3932860

Since your claims imply, I'm a ESG agent sympathiser, with bias against Lawrence and his case, attempting to 'poison the well' and have 'an axe to grind' is completely FALSE. I DON'T CARE WHO WINS OR LOSES PERIOD!

Any further debate, or discussion, will possibly cascade into a war-of-words and trolling, resulting in a futile counter-productive debate.

So I have decide forthwith to NOT comment further. Should you feel the need for further debate, or discussion, direct through post-mail ONLY.
Durnwood - 5 months ago
The tactics used by Enigma are simply deplorable. I donated $20 tonight for BC's defense and wish I could give more. I tried to call Enigma tonight to complain about their practices, but had to do a bit of searching before I could find their number. I found it on a Better Business Bureau website, called them up and entered a random extension number in hopes of reaching someone important. The Karma Gods smiled upon me with this:

Natalia Alcantara
Vice President of Online Marketing for Enigma
1-888-360-0646 ext 222

I left her a message demanding a refund for the money I donated to BC and gave her some valuable feedback regarding her company's software and "marketing" practices. I suggest everyone take a minute and do the same. Bleeping Computer should not have to lose time, money, and resources defending themselves against Enigma.
eurobyn - 5 months ago
I have donated 15 dollars to support bleeping computer. i hope it will help to stay alive after all you already did to help others.

eurobyn.
Grinler - 5 months ago
Thanks again to everyone for supporting us!
VinceDDD - 5 months ago
It doesn't matter what the information WAS. It matters what IT IS at the PRESENT MOMENT.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Surely, all we want to know..., but you know, there are laws being treated, & court rules about procedures & the convenience of release data or not. Better ask directly to Lawrence, & patience..., 'cause he's surely busy as never before with this capricious Enigma's mystery..
Grinler - 5 months ago
I am not sure I understand what you mean by that?
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Hi Lawrence. I don't know if you're asking to me or to @VinceDDD. In my reply to Vince i'm telling him that, perhaps, release info about the case's state is not something possible, or convenient. Don't know in which step of the legal situation BC is now, & which is the deffense strategy. For me, from my perspective, no info may be released about. But i could be wrong, obviously, just an opinion.
Grinler - 5 months ago
I was replying to Vince. Not much information to give at this point. Lawyers are working on it. The minute we have something new on my side, I plan on publishing it unless told otherwise.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Thx, Lawrence.
Nashemon - 5 months ago
Hey BC. As someone with absolutely no affiliation with BleepingComputer (I arrived at the website today simply looking into formatting a drive over USB vs SATA, and was greeted by the frivolous lawsuit, which I then promptly researched), but as someone who removes malware from dozens of customer's computers on a daily basis, I completely agree that Spyhunter is a rogue security product. A virus disguised as a helpful program. There's hundreds of them, and they have become easy to spot. It is on my list of software to be removed. This is from personal experience. I do not read reviews to determine these things. I personally witness and test individual software myself before deeming them worthy of this list.

The thought of a company created to scam unsuspecting people that are seeking help with their computer issues is suing because someone is trying to warn them really boils my blood. Not only would be be a dangerous precedent to set in terms of allowing scammers to prevail, it would be an abomination of our right to Freedom of the Press. Hopefully this backfires on Enigma and they get shut down and arrested.

I've donated all I can afford at the moment. Good luck to you, and the future of this country, in getting this case dismissed.
fcwe1113 - 5 months ago
you guys should thank the fact that the internet basically reaches everywhere ;), i'm a student from Hong Kong randomly finding ways to clear BS from my friend's computer and I stumbled upon here and the lawsuit, I really want to help you guys on your money department but it's not as easy as you think of getting a credit card as a student, especially if you are not old enough, also from the comments above I kind of know what is happening, i will send this to a press that will say anything that is right, hope it help you guys on getting more money in defending yourselves :)

good luck to you all here

*also sorry for my bad english
Grinler - 5 months ago
Thank you very much for your words. Comments like this are in many ways just as important as a contribution to the defense fund. What you said means a lot.

Btw, your english is fine :)
jonl370 - 5 months ago
I wanted to post this information, to assist Bleeping Computers lawsuit with Enigma. I have recently been trying to remove some nasty ransomware, that keeps prompting me to call 855-977-9319 fro support. When searching on how to remove this garbage, the only results I find are fake anti-malware removal sites, that suggest installing SpyHuner4. I am unable to find any relevant information on how to remove it, using any search engine. In my opinion, they are the ones making the malware, to sell SpyHunter4! I have also donated some money to help with legal fees. Thanks BC, for the many years of service!
Grinler - 5 months ago
If you post in the forums, I am sure someone can help you remove it for free. If you want you can pm me and I can help you find the resulting file. I would like to write a guide on it anyway.
jonl370 - 5 months ago
Thanks for the offer Grinler, but due to time constraints, I'm just going to do a fresh install. It's one of my managers home computers, so nothing critical. I did eventually find a website that has some good information, but they were even struggling to remove it all.
lostoldman - 5 months ago
A perfect time to help out a site that has helped me a couple times!
Angoid - 5 months ago
For kicks and giggles, just dug this out of Facebook:
https://www.facebook.com/enigmasoftware/posts/1120446987985864
(you don't need to be logged in to FB)
Read the comments!
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Hahahahahaaaaaaaaa...., FCS!!!
I really would like to know who's behind those clowns... Impossible to believe.
Thx for the input, laugh in the morning is the best! (even if one was working all nite long...., i go to bed rfn!).
AKWolffan - 5 months ago
Just a few points

1 I heard about this lawsuit by reading about it on The Register.

2 I have been been a Malwarebytes user for years. It has never let me down.

3 prior to this, I'd heard about Enigma software. I had not heard much that was good.

4 given what I'd heard before, and the company's behavior in the current case, and particularly what certain Enigma partisans have posted here, my opinion of the company is now totally negative. SpyHunter is now on my nuke on sight list, and I will be so advising anyone I encounter who has it on their systems.

5 the people running Enigma have no-one to blame for (4) about but themselves. Congratulations.

6 memo to Enigma: if you boys didn't try to hide your stuff so that it looks like Windows systems stuff, if you boys set up your uninstaller to remove all traces of your software, if you boys didn't try to sue because someone dared to criticize you, if you boys didn't try to astroturf assorted fora, including this one and the forum at El Reg (yes, I saw at least one of your boys there, too...) then I might, just might, think that maybe you were the party who was being wronged. However, you did try to make your stuff look like Windows files; that's deliberate deception. You did not build your uninstaller so that it removed all files you installed; at best that's careless, at worst that's hostile action, and I don't use Norton or McAfee precisely because their uninstallers don't clean up behind them, either. And you sued because you didn't like a comment on a forum; that's petty, and stupid. All taken together, I'd rather not do business with you. Even if your software really did find spyware, I'd not use it. Do enjoy the rest of your worthless lives, now.
Quartzkyte - 5 months ago
Very good news that The Register published the info!
I'm going to a local trade show in March, and I'll relay the info again.

The only real worry comes from Oliver Wendell Holmes's sentence quoted above by Papakid:
"This is a court of law, young man, not a court of justice."
So true, unfortunately.
dls62 - 5 months ago
I've just made a donation to this vital cause. Hopefully this vexatious litigation can be batted off in quick order so that the good people at BC can get back to concentrating on doing what they do best - helping others.

Let us not forget that many who visit the BC site, from around the world, do so for advice and guidance from the BC community. They need to be able to read objective and unbiased opinions on anti-malware software so that they can select a product that will provide protection not leave their computers at risk. Vendors cannot be allowed to suppress unfavourable comment about their products. If this happens the internet will become a less safe place to be.
efarayenkay - 5 months ago
I can't afford to donate right now, but I have attempted to bring your case to the attention of the folks at PopeHat, maybe they can get the signal out for some pro-bono first amendment help, like they did when FunnyJunk tried to sue The Oatmeal.
andy_hg - 5 months ago
came via The Register too - have used your site several times in the past - belated thanks - I've sent you some money for your fight - Good Luck !
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Thx Andy, this is what i call a responsible & gratefull behavior. Sadly, our contemporary culture is mostly compound by a "to receive" behaviour, not to share, even less "to give". :)
☼▲\o/☼▲\o/☼▲\o/
Rosenberg - 5 months ago
I've made a donation; it's a pittance, but it's all that I can afford at the moment. BC helped me out in the past and is a valuable resource to me. Will donate more when I have it.
Fight the good fight, and may righteousness prevail.
NightbirD - 5 months ago
Your attitude is laudable, & i think never could be called as a "pittance". In the name of the members of this house i say that your donation is much appreciated, i'm absolutely sure about it. :)
Grinler - 5 months ago
Thank you very much!
PatL - 5 months ago
This is just appalling. I cannot donate as of yet, but once I get some money I will try and help out. What are the outcomes from this lawsuit exactly? Like if they win will it close down BC? Or is it just a 'they have to be nice about our product' kind of result? Overall it's sad that this is happening and that they decided to resort to such measures in regards to a negative review. Heck there are YouTube reviews of their product that show it as being terrible. Again sorry to hear about this and I will donate when I can. Thanks for all the help you all have provided over the years. You guys are awesome!
Grinler - 5 months ago
BC is not going anywhere, but if they do win, and we have to take the content down it will just cause a problem for everyone who has ever posted a negative opinion about them. It will also embolden other companies like them to come out of the wood works and sue everyone who posts a negative opinion.

This can't be allowed!
mvi - 5 months ago
I just registered and donated 5$. I used this website for years to help me clean infected computers.
Keep up the good work guys! This is at least I can do for you!
Thank you!
Dragongirl - 5 months ago
I wish I could donate to help, but alas I have no means to do so, BC forums are my first stop for help when all the local computer chopshops {smalltown not bigbox shops} are closed. I always come to BC Forums before going to a guy to talk face to face about a problem.

I think what this company does not understand is the simply fact that EVERYNE HAS AN OPNION ABOUT A PRODUCT, some like it, some dont, those that dont can vent how they like because it didn't work for them or something. Those that like it, feel free to praise it, but DONT GET YOUR UNDIES IN A KNOT BECAUSE SOMEONE GAVE THEIR OPNION

There, ym two cents over with, I truly hope that BC can get this to go their way. Just like I am backing Apple to keep a phone locked down, BC can get through this, and soon!
Nickh90 - 5 months ago
I have had to manually Remove this sh*tfest of a software From multiple machines I've cleaned in the past Including my Own when another Software has Hidden check boxes upon install.
I hope that all of their Malicious/Deceiving products die out and never return.
I have used this web site multiple times for support and wish to continue to see it live on.
Cheers to winning that suit BC.
titan1 - 5 months ago
There are two ways to come in the spotlight. One is by doing a good job, and the other is by trying to harass people who are already well known for doing good job. Poor Enigma software has chosen to try the other way, most probably because they don't have the the guts to do the first one. Pity on you enigma, companies like you will come and go but sites like bleeping computer and the volunteers here will always be remembered for their good works.
benJephunneh - 5 months ago
To the owners of BC, you need to understand your rights, and I'm not talking about the right of free speech, etc. If you had to come up with thousands of dollars every time somebody came to you with a made-up lawsuit (i.e. claiming a made-up damage) then you could very easily find yourself in debtors' prison. Could just any Joe off the street sue you for breaking his fence because the tree fell and crushed it? It would sure have to be your tree that did the damage, no? If you don't even live next to the guy, this is even simpler. The point being, somebody suing you for damages has to FIRST quantify those damages AND convince somebody important that you CAN be held legally responsible for those damages.

So, do they have cause? It doesn't sound like it, from what little I know. Have they quantified the damages and shown that you can be held legally responsible? I doubt they could convince anybody of that. You'll have to go over the documents, etc., but don't waste your time and money with a case just because somebody feels like bothering you. They must have cause.

Don't rely only on your lawyer, either, even if he sounds like he wants to help. Get yourself a Black's Law Dictionary and start searching the records for similar cases. American law is based heavily on precedent. And understand that a case can't be dismissed unless you ask for it to be. Judges often won't simply tell you that. They'll continue with the case only because you never bothered to ask for it to be dismissed (citing precedent, etc.).
benJephunneh - 5 months ago
I should also say, if you don't represent yourself (if it comes to that), then you are at the mercy of your lawyer. By hiring representation, you yield your rights! The fact is right there in the term, "representation," where the lawyer IS you for the purpose of the case. If he's losing your case, you need to get rid of him.

So you might want to hire council, instead; somebody who can advise you and help you get your documentation together.

Search for "sui juris." There are many knowledgeable people out there that have a lot of experience with self-representation.
Angoid - 5 months ago
It's interesting to see what they have to say on the "other side" of this .... going by the comments, some pro-Spyhunter folk appear to have become disillusioned with ESG's behaviour ....
https://www.techpowerup.com/220304/enigma-software-sues-bleepingcomputer-over-negative-review.html?cp=1#comments

Same content, but in forum format:
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/enigma-software-sues-bleepingcomputer-over-negative-review.220304/

Until I found this, I was not familiar at all with TechPowerup
ScottAustin - 4 months ago
We are TIGHT on donating but I can try once I start my new job. POSTED TO FACEBOOK asking friends to spread like the VIRUS Spyhunter is!!! Love you guys and the site Stand TALL
vilhavekktesla - 4 months ago
Hi, well, maybe you were... Like me, I know about
TechPowerUp GPU-Z but I do not know about TPU or TechPowerUp

I often find sw on SW-sites, but i always try to find the source-site too and when I visted the site, it was familiar to me, even though I have never heard about it. :)
Unfortunately the users over ther are just as disillusioned as us. We can't really believe a company that sue someone can get away with it, the company does know this, and I believe that is one of the rerasons they chose to sue in New York.

If the company knew they would have to pay the sued part incase they lost, they would be more careful, but since it appears they can get away with this practise it is all users responsibility to let anyone misusing their trust / power to pay.

Ways to do this is to let as many as possible know about this case, and it seems that many sites now tell about this case, which is actually good, this shows me a few things. There are luckily not to many cases like this, so the ones popping up are discovered and told about, the other is, tha the suer cannot simply claim one site tells lieas about them or uses hidden agendas to win or hidden practise to get customers...

When the commuity or many communities start spreading the word, any company that base their business strategy on threaten to silence will eventually loose. I have tried to write accurate and true info on an esg-forum / article, but I can still not see it published. It does not say much about the products, but it does say something about advices given in the article, and my objections and clarifications. I had to register, that was ok, but I could not see my comment was monitored and it appears also it was censored...

By not showing my comments esg prevents a desperate user informations about something that could help them, and where their product cannot. Instead esg could have contacted me if they wanted more information and wanted to play alon rather than play against.

For me, this action alone game me distrust in their product. I aslo downloaded it and tested it on my systems, and it was not rougue, but it was certainly not a product I would reomend.
The program was erased after 4 days of testing...
NightbirD - 4 months ago
A valuable testimony.
chrisupi007 - 4 months ago
This is madness, it's obvious Enigma Software just want to bully us and shut us down but they will fail, WE are legion.
vilhavekktesla - 4 months ago
I checked the ESG site today, as I try to find info about this case, well there is not much to find. Now with the extension web of trust installed on Firefox I'm adviced from entering the site.
Although I agree to what wot tries to prevent me from doing, the site itself is not malicious, questionable yes but malicious no. How it was in 2006 since some of the examples in the suit show, I cannot tell. Anyway, I wanted to look up the info ESG has on Tesla, and up to .vvv I think ESG withold information preventing ther customers/potential customers access to a solution, which is quite unfortunate. ESG has however updated ther info on 3.0.1 and newer and claims it is impossible to crack, and the support is Cisco Talos. Some of the claims against BC is that BC is or has been witholding information to the public, I can hardly see ESG is better, since they certainly read what we write here on BC in articles, forurms and comments to such.

So again ESG as many have invited you to, try to find a solution to this case, instead of suing someone for not obeying your "orders" try to work together fighting the malware creators and distributors, instead of all that do. You are running a company that uses scare tactic to persuade your customers to pay for your product, instead of invitiing them to pay for it.
In some cases your product does not even help, even it claims to do so, making a grave situation for a user even more severe. You cannot possible want this.
Now a defence to myself, I have tried to write some comments and articles on your site when I was evaluating your sw. I cannot find this evaluation, so the comments were probably moderated. I find this hard to understand. My evaluation did not link elsewhere, it did say / claim alternatives exist and it did correct misinformation in the articles, but it should not have been moderated. I also invited ESG to comment to better help all the desperate users you may have.
Think of it like a shop selling clothes. You do not want to send your customers to your competitor, but if you do not have what the customers whant, you certainly not want to trick the user to buy something they do not want from you. You simply tell them alternatives exist and hope the users/customers treat you properly. For instance you could have a note/review back from the customer, they did not have what I asked for, but I got some valuable advices, so I'm happy. I highly recomend this entity. Now back to the case, in the anti malware sw there were to many flaws in it to advice anyone to use it, so the only users you can have are the uneducated ones, meaning the users that have a problem, search internet, find your programs, install it, pay for removal, and hope it works.
You cannot possible want a situation like that? Or the fact that WOT which you know how works put the flags: Scam, Malware or viruses, Misleading claims or unethical, Suspicious, Poor customer experience. Of course not all flags are correct, but this is how your site is regarded by everyday users.
The best action is certainly not to attack WOT, but to try to solv all issues. No customers write bad review just for the sake of it. You probably always get more bad reviews than positive since a user that simply get what was expected don't bother telling. A happy user will maybe tell about it, but an unhappy user will certainly advice about it.
So please stop this suit, and work together making it a safer experience for all users.
jcanker - 4 months ago
All anyone needs to know to settle their own mind is located here:
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/spyhunter-voted-best-antivirus-anti-153400129.html
This is a blatant press release disguised as a news article (And shame on Yahoo for being so desperate for content!). My favorite part is the headline "Spyhunter: Voted As Best Antivirus And Anti Malware That Offers Complete Protection Offering Spyhunter Download and Free Scan" yet nowhere in the article does it actually mention this "vote." That right there, my friends, is what we call "deceptive advertising practices." Go to bed, Enigma. You're drunk and have been at least since the 2014 date on this deceptive advertise-- *ahem* news article.
NightbirD - 4 months ago
hahahaaahahaaa..., awesome & hilarious, really. Look, social experiments everywhere, always, but in the last 3 decades this lab became extremely, cinicly RUDE. & i'm not paranoid; if reality is a concrete circumstance, people has choosen to dream (sweetly, or nightmares ), not balanced at all. "I saw it in TV", almost everyone say, now is more as "i saw it in the net". I'm astonished about that. If you have the resources you can hammer any idea in the masses brains, pure reality becomes just as a weird, vague, & vanished memory.
Jman005 - 4 months ago
"Download free scanner" and "Source: Engima Software" (and only Engima)

Yep, that draws the line.
plat1098 - 4 months ago
This is disgusting. They're probably in each others' pockets, maybe Yahoo shuffles bewildered readers infected with malware/adware from their site to Enigma's, in exchange for whatever.

Now if you'll excuse me, I must consult my attorney, I may have stepped over the line here.
NightbirD - 4 months ago
....hahahahahaaaaaa...... lol
Mackspower - 4 months ago
Hi - this site has helped me few times over the years, so I am donating to help the cause.

But I wanted to add that while the claim by Enigma may well be 'frivolous' my own experience on this site is that completely legitimate applications are frequently condemned and referred to as 'spyware' and 'PUP' when they are in fact nothing of the kind.

Maybe the site owners should use this experience with Enigma to reset their compass a bit and not be so critical of completely legitimate software. Just my two cents. Peace.
Grinler - 4 months ago
Can you provide some examples of this so I can look into what you are referring to? If I have made comments about legitimate programs that are untrue, I would want to know about that. Since I am the only employee of the site, any other comments would have had to come from members, like yourself, in the forums.

Also its important to note that nothing in Quietman's post states that SpyHunter is malware, a PUP, or spyware. In fact, his post states the complete opposite.
Mackspower - 4 months ago
Sure: here is a classic example. Your 'Global Moderator' (Bleepin' Janitor) completely trashing and impinging the reputation of a legitimate product. There are many such examples of this.

This post: http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/539865/is-systweaks-advanced-system-optimizer-3-safe/

Links to this post: http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/forums/t/517402/which-antivirus-and-malware-programs-should-i-use-together/page-2#entry3413359

Like I said - time to reset your compass based the current experience with Enigma. Peace.
Orange Blossom - 4 months ago
Both those links actually go to the same post, one by a remove. That said, there are reasons for what he says there. True, the program is legitimate, but that doesn't mean running it is good for the computer. I myself have borked several programs by running registry cleaners/optimizers, of which that program is but one. Others have actually turned their computers into bricks and have had to reinstall the operating system. Yes, there are times when removing certain registry keys is important and does help the computer, but you have to know what you're doing, just as you have to know what you're doing when you treat yourself with herbal remedies.

Also, things that are flagged as "PUPS". Many security programs do that. PUP means Potentially Unwanted Program. That doesn't mean the program is bad or malicious. Some folks have actually deliberately installed them and want them. However, those programs also often come along as uninvited guests when installing something else. That is why it's a "potentially" unwanted program. If the user didn't deliberately install it, then it's unwanted, just as the puppy that follows a kid home from school may be unwanted by the kid's parents. "Mommy may I keep him?" Maybe she says yes the first time, but how about the 2nd, or even the 10th? There comes a point where you have to draw the line. Toolbars are a fine example of PUPs. I've seen some browsers so cluttered with toolbars, there was practically no space left to see the content of the webpages. That's what PUPs can do. That doesn't mean that they're bad, it just means that maybe the user doesn't really want them there, especially if the user didn't invite the program in to begin with.
Elise - 4 months ago
"Like I said - time to reset your compass based the current experience with Enigma. Peace."

But that is the whole problem here. If I or another individual express an opinion or experience with a program, we should have the freedom to do so, even if not everyone on the internet agrees. BC should not be sued for refusing to take down a post that ESG doesn't like.

Instead, if ESG really was interested in getting a better reputation, why did they not enter a dialogue? There are actual examples of developers who did this and used the feedback they received to make a better product
Grinler - 4 months ago
Your two examples lead to the same comment. So that's really one example. Furthermore, the comment does not call them a PUP or Spyware.

It is a common opinion, including mine, that registry cleaners provide very little, if any, benefit. In fact, there have been cases that registry cleaners actually hurt the computer.

It's not just my opinion:

http://www.howtogeek.com/171633/why-using-a-registry-cleaner-wont-speed-up-your-pc-or-fix-crashes/
http://www.thewindowsclub.com/microsoft-support-registry-cleaners-windows
http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/registry-cleaner-difference/

Hell even Microsoft, who probably knows better than anyone, doesn't recommend the use of Registry Cleaners: https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/2563254

Examples of problems caused by Registry Cleaners:

http://forum.piriform.com/?showtopic=29526
http://www.wilderssecurity.com/threads/registry-mechanic-broken-pc-any-hope.119970/

So I think our compass is working fine and pointing north like it's supposed to.
AKWolffan - 4 months ago
"completely legitimate applications are frequently condemned and referred to as 'spyware' and 'PUP' when they are in fact nothing of the kind."

Interesting.

Name three examples, preferably with a pointer to where this happened.
Mackspower - 4 months ago
See my reply above . . . there are many such examples: calling legitimate products "borderline scams", "a marketing ploy intended to goad users into using an unnecessary and potential dangerous product", "I would not trust any results the program detects as problematic" . . . you get the idea. Peace.
NightbirD - 4 months ago
@quietman7 is not alone at all about most of us thinks of that "legitimate product". A product could be, or not, legitimate, but this do not turns it a good product, or a bad one. You can come here & say what you want to say, but you'll not improve the performance of a not efficient product that has an agressive behavior . You can start topics about products, or give your opinions about a specific software/hardware, that's what @quietman7 did, just that, & nobody goes to sue you. Enigma's behavior is reflected in their production, & they feel very backed & strong like a punch, not as software's engineers provided with a solid foundation of knowledge and professional ethics. Until the dictatorship you want to not give the coup, the people have rights that must be respected. Your opinion is just one more, do not get your hopes to impose rules, this is not the place nor the time.
AKWolffan - 4 months ago
err.. I quoted you exactly because I don't recall seeing any 'legitimate applications ' referred to as ''spyware' and 'PUP' when they are in fact nothing of the kind."' The pointer you gave does not mention either spyware or PUP. Those terms have rather specific meanings. A product, which might or might not be 'legitimate' (I know _my_ opinion of the entire class of 'system optimizers' and 'registry cleaners'. Hint: Microsoft has a few things to say about them, and indeed there is a pointer to Microsoft's opinion in the very pointer you reference) but they're not being called either 'spyware' or 'PUPs' in the pointer referenced.

I again request that you give three examples of "completely legitimate applications are frequently condemned and referred to as 'spyware' and 'PUP' when they are in fact nothing of the kind.". You have yet to produce even one.
vilhavekktesla - 4 months ago
GWX is a virus, a pup, a hoax, a legitimate program, a product, a helper and so on. GWX comes from Microsoft, and if BC made a thorrough article about it, I'm not sure where it would be put.

Now, my experience is this. GWX is fantastic, it gave one user I know help to install W10 for "free". great help. Here is another example, I have one W7 computer nagging to install W10, I cannot eassily shut it off. Here another one, W7 home with auto windows update, got to the stage, thanks for your choice to install W10, please restart computer. Well, it was not the user who decided to do this, is it a pup or a virus now? I consider this behaviour completely out of order.
Now at work, we have a system relying on W7, W64 and Sql 2008, an autoupdate put W10 on that machine, no one at work says they did this... so Would MS do?
Anyway, computer is broken, reinstall W7, udating with all updates etc minus W10 "virus".
time to fix 2 days.... So my claim GWX is a "virus", or pup or malware or... stands.
No one can sue anyone for claiming this, althoug MS should have been sued for this practise ... Think of ESG or Java with ask in this context. Not my two cents, more like 200 USD as this is the minimum these few incidents have costed me / us in extra work.
I really dislike SW doing things it is not allowed to do or told to do, and especially dislike, when I'm not even able to stop it from doing such things.

For the record, I have some ideas stopping GWX. Internet is flooded with info about this issue, and that is the key here, the same goes for ESG. BC just happend to be one place where discussions and claims aganst ESG are posted. Legitimate claims that none would have posted unless the experience with the SW was the way it was. I have for the sake of it tested the SW in 2016, and 2015 to get an idea how it acts. I had forgot I had used the SW many years ago, and I remembered during the installation process of the program, and then all the false positives inside it. It wanted me to turn off my https-protections in FF for instance.
I know many users would follow the advices and also buy the product, not making ESG much better than the one making crypto malware. There are many sublte ways doing extortion, so either it is GWX or ESG doing business in a way the users do not like, this has to be discussed somwhere and under discussions there are posts going too much in to any directions. The point is, who decides what to keep or delete. BC are fully able to monitor their own site and make sure all users follow BC policy. And most do anyway. ESG would still benefit working together then against, and they will eventually realise this. Wheter MS will, that is another story.
NightbirD - 4 months ago
Better said ever.
The answer for the x of the equation this time is; MARKET RULES, forget about humans, the human race is extinct, was replaced by the manipulable consumerkind.
Captain_Chicken - 4 months ago
Can we keep this on topic please?
NightbirD - 4 months ago
You're right, i'm sorry, my mistake. However, i think this "topic" could turn to THE TOPIC in not too much time more, i mean, we'll not be free to speak about anything.
BitcoinMonkey - 4 months ago
Just donated a dollar, mother fuckers are going down.
Grinler - 4 months ago
Every dollar counts! Appreciate the support!
David241 - 4 months ago
Just donated $25 Good Luck Bleeping Computer has helped me and a lot of others.
I do not want to live in a world without Bleeping Computer.
Would have given more but Social Security does not pay well.
NightbirD - 4 months ago
Your effort is a very valuable one, no one could doubt about it!
James Austin - 4 months ago
ONCE YOU'VE WON THE LAWSUIT, which you will

countersue for stress and legal expenses
Necklemancer - 4 months ago
I have been a user of this site for years, but I have never posted or registered until today. After reading this my family donated for the cause. They have done so much for me, and it's my turn to do something for them. Anyone who uses this site should donate without hesitation. I'm sure it has saved all of us a lot of grief. So step up people and help them out now. And I hope when Bleeping Computers wins, they counter sue for expenses and damages. Time to set the example for the losers that file these usless lawsuits.
JGamez - 4 months ago
Just an idea you should do a one cause.com donation for the cause. It may be 1 penny per search but if we all pitch in it can make a big difference!
MelissaPleases - 4 months ago
I can't afford a lot, but I've donated to the defense fund. This is fucking ridiculous (you should pardon my unladylike language...)
NightbirD - 4 months ago
You're absolutely f******g right! (about the nonsense sue...) :) Thx 4 stand there & help this unique site.
majneeds2chill - 4 months ago
Can someone please explain?

So this company KNOWN for making scam products receives a bad review. It then violates the CONSTITUTIONAL right to freedom of the press and speech by suing the site.

Why does bleepingcomputer need donations? Enigma has absolutely no leg to stand on. There sue goes against the constitution, not to mention the abundant proof of the company being illegitimate in the first place.

I honestly thought this was a joke. Bleepingcomputer doesn't need any money! They already won the case that shouldn't even be legal in the first place!

Obviously, I am missing something. What is it?
NightbirD - 4 months ago
Of course that i'm just another member, & @Grinler could explain it better & absolutely authorized; as far i know, you're right about the principies exposed in your words, but real world just know about justice & well applyed laws in a weirdly way, contradictory in every possible way. Your words expose the better results possible in a non common chain of circumstances in a court affair, justice far all usually does not happens, is part of an ancient deception, sadly. If you, knowin' it or not, go against the stableshment (or a part of it), even having enough evidences, you'll have to face (at least) some nightmares of entangling & endless furious paper twists, &, of course, afford all the costs. Without our help the thing could be much worst than currently is. & agree with @Quartzkyte words.
Quartzkyte - 4 months ago
Just the obvious: you do not need to be right to sue.
Fighting a sizeable opponent that can bury you under paper is not like going to Small Claims Court... and can be very costly.
vilhavekktesla - 4 months ago
All wondering on lawsuit, pretty much of topic now, but still.
An inventor came up with the graphic card and had a patent. Some high profiled companies stole this patent and sued the invetor for infringing. The inventor fought for a decade (at least) and finally won, but got depressed. Annother big company or many companies then stole again, and this time the inventor lost. This inventor is also behind the AIS systems for ships, and Amadeus for plane tracking. Not alone of course but never the less. I leave the rest open and add no links for now. So, yes you can pretty much loose anything iv the opponent is big enough... I hope this is not the case this time, and by giving BC the ability to stand up for it's cause I hope it is less interesting suing instead of working out solutions. If I before had forgotten the suiers company name or products that won't happen again. If the someday learn and act together instead ow agaings, my mind might changed, depending of the caused damage. Since it is not ours decision we should be glad Lawrence chose to take this and I truly hpoe the court if it goes that far will understand the underlying causes. There should not even be neccesare to use any of the amendments, if you really need to use the constitution and not any other laws ni a country for such a thing, then maybe the entire lawbook should be reviewed... I'm starting adding hmm's again. And my eyes are flashing...
NightbirD - 4 months ago
:)
DrDOS - 3 months ago
Hello,

In a nursing home but wish BC the best. Have relied on them for years.
THEBDC - 3 months ago
Sadly...I am guilty of trolling thru some of this lengthy conversation...but I most certainly support BC...as an IT Professional, they have been very helpful to me over the years. Furthermore...I wanted to make mention that I attempted to download the AV software "Combofix" about an hour ago using the link provided by the BC website...I found it very interesting that the link on your site redirected me to the Spyhunter.exe! Explain that one Ed-Nigma?
NightbirD - 3 months ago
Hi, i've just checked one second ago..., for me the download link works fine.
Grinler - 3 months ago
I am unsure what you mean? You clicked on the download link at BC and it brought you to enigma's site or downloaded their software?
Quartzkyte - 3 months ago
Works fine for me too...
Lawprof2681 - 3 months ago
Unfortunately, FREEDOM OF SPEECH is not free. Sometimes it costs lives and sometimes it costs money; however, there is an underlying cost. Due to Marbury V Madison, only the United States Supreme Court can determine the meaning of the Constitution. Worse still, the meaning can change as the old Justices are replaced with new ones. Worst of all, there is no justice in America...merely ju$tice...the richer you are, the more sway you have in the courtroom.
As it stands now, "false or defamatory statements made with malicious intent" are not protected by the Free Speech clause to the Constitution. Therefore, if BC made statements about Enigma Software that were not true and/or were intended to defame Engima Software, they can be held civilly liable for the money Enigma loses. The crux of the issue is this: What did BC say about SpyHunter, and why did they say it?
AKWolffan - 3 months ago
So far as I can see, 'Bleeping Computer' made no statements about Spyhunter. Someone posting on BC did. BC merely declines to remove those comments. Also, said comments appear to be quite accurate. Enigma Software has launched a SLAPP suit precisely because those comments are quite accurate. As a direct result of their SLAPP suit, I, and quite a few others, who would not otherwise have given a damn one way or another about Spyhunter now care deeply... and we don't like Enigma Software Group. If they'd just shut up, or if they'd worked to fix their problems, I would not care about them or their software, which exhibits behavior which in my opinion at least borders on being malware-like. (Yo! Enigma Software! Please note the words 'opinion' and 'malware-like'! And bite me.) BC is hardly the only place where Enigma Software Group's stuff has been criticized. See, for example the Better Business Bureau:: http://www.bbb.org/west-florida/business-reviews/computers-hardware-software-and-services/enigma-software-group-usa-in-clearwater-fl-90083408/complaints

Memo to Enigma Software Group: you boys ever heard of the Streisand Effect? look it up... I'll even help you https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect Congrats, boys, you attempt to remove some negative publicity has resulted in vastly more negative publicity than you could have imagined. And worse for you, a lot of us have placed Spyhunter, and anything else Enigma Software ever creates, onto our kill on sight list and will tell our clients why. And, oh, when (not if) you boys change your name to try to protect the guilty, some of us will go out of our way to look up the new name and and all software created under that name to our kill on sight lists. And will tell our clients why. And should you somehow manage to get BC to pull the comments which started this, we will point to sites like the BBB. (One more time, that URL: http://www.bbb.org/west-florida/business-reviews/computers-hardware-software-and-services/enigma-software-group-usa-in-clearwater-fl-90083408/complaints ) and to Ripoff Report http://www.ripoffreport.com/r/enigma-software-group-inc/stamford-connecticut-06902/enigma-software-group-inc-spyhunter-is-a-ripoff-stamford-connecticut-258347

How come y'all haven't dropped SLAPP suits on the BBB and Ripoff Report? Could it be that they have sufficiently deep pockets that y'all know that you'd lose and that the attempt would generate lots and lots and lots of negative publicity? Could it be that y'all aimed for BC 'cause you thought that this was an easier target? Ooh. bad idea. Have fun, now, y'hear. I know that I will.
plat1098 - 3 months ago
I agree with this. If it's the publicity angle, it doesn't seem to be an effective strategy. Can anyone come up with any information about whether this lawsuit-thing has affected Enigma's business favorably? After reading this and many other comments, it seems to me Enigma's "real" motive is to drain the wallet of the ones who pissed them off the most--in the form of a frivolous yet unavoidable and costly lawsuit. When's the initial hearing, anyway?
tn.l4dy - 3 months ago
They say everyone has one. Guess that one is ours
vilhavekktesla - 3 months ago
Just wanted to notice, if we all slept during the latest hours. the donation goal is now reached in 2 months. now, we sit and wait for the next step in this peculiar case.

Maybe that law should be changed so that it cannot be misused like this, that is the big battle here, not fighting one company, that hired lawyers that are paid to find holes in the laws.
PaBlppg123 - 3 months ago
Hello, new member here. I have used BC many times as a pass by reader and have always appreciated the help.
However the discussion of donations for support of BC defense troubles me. Without going into all the emotional issues this raises, I have questions about why BC needs such funding.
And who are the funds really going to? Individuals? Or the corporate entities that now run BC website as a completely commercial and bloated ad income producing destination?
BC now is unrecognizable from just last year or so. Only the forums remain semi regular.

I question this because BC.com is NOT non profit and appears to be generating very good and constant income. I am posting BC's own FTC disclosure below and people can make their own judgements. Again, I have benefited from BC's expertise in the past and have always respected BC mantra and the forums which are great.

I'm just a little uncomfortable with the lack of transparency in this lawsuit matter. I am not affiliated with BC, or the other company in any way. Even great companies can do questionable ethics. I hope that isn't happening here. Thank you for reading.
But please read the disclosure, as this is true corporate advertising income structure and I feel this is not what the original BC people had in mind, and may be out of their hands now.

The FTC disclosure:

FTC Disclosure

The Federal Trade Commission requires that we disclose any relationship we have between a product manufacturer or advertiser when we write about a product, service, or recommend a product. This is a good policy that allows you, the reader, to understand the relationships between a site and the various companies and products they promote.

We have outlined our product review standards and the various ways we use affiliate link or earn commissions:

Affiliate Links

BleepingComputer may use links that generate a commission for the site if you use them to purchase a product. In the forums, we use SkimLinks to automatically transform posted links into affiliate links. If you do not wish to view inserted links you can opt out of this process by going to this url: http://optout.skimlinks.com/?tested=1.

We also provide affiliate links for various products within our Virus Removal Guides, Download section, and Tutorials.

Virus Removal Guides

In our Virus Removal section we offer guides on how to remove various computer infections. These guides may use programs and utilities that generate commissions for the site when you purchase them. We will never, though, promote a product for the sole purpose of generating a commission. We will only suggest a product that can actually help you remove the computer infection for free and we will only receive a commission if you decide to purchase it after. If it is required that you purchase a product before you can remove an infection, and we receive a commission for it, we will specifically state this in the guide. The products that we routinely use in our guides and that we receive affiliate commissions from are MalwareBytes, Emsisoft, and HitmanPro.

Download Section

All of the programs in our Download section are fully functional and free to use. If you use the product and decide to purchase it, then the site will generate a commission for the sale of the software.

Tutorial Section

Some tutorials may discuss or require specific hardware or software that contain Amazon affiliate links that will generate a commission for the site if you purchase them.

StackCommerce and the BleepingComputer.com Deals Store

BleepingComputer.com has partnered with StackCommerce to offer our readers deals on a variety of products. If a user chooses to purchase a product through this store, BleepingComputer.com will earn a commission on the sale.
Papakid - 3 months ago
I call BS that you are unaffiliated with either site--looks to me like a typical Enigma astroturfer--pretending to be someone who likes or at one time liked the site and feigning ignorance as to the nature of the site. Who owns the site and that it is not a non-profit entity has never been a secret. Your feigning ignorance about this and other questions you have are disingenuous since all the questions and concerns that "trouble" you can be answered with just a little reading of what is posted at BC--including the disclosure you posted.

If I've misjudged you I apologize, but you fit the bill of Enigma in that they want to miscast BC as a huge commercial software company with a considerable income. Frankly, I don't know how much Lawrence makes on BC, but I doubt it is near as much as some want you to believe--and just because this is a commercial site does not mean he's rolling in the dough. But whatever he makes he's earned it thru hard work and integrity.

I could answer one by one all of your questions, but anyone who is truly neutral can see the answers if they just take the time to look for them. All I will say is this: lawyers are expensive, Enigma knows this, and that is why they file the SLAPP suit--by definition. I have no qualms at all helping Lawrence raise money to fight these/you people. Because this case affects way more than just BC.
PaBlppg123 - 3 months ago
"I call BS that you are unaffiliated with either site--looks to me like a typical Enigma astroturfer--pretending to be someone who likes or at one time liked the site and feigning ignorance as to the nature of the site."

Did you bother to read the disclaimer? People don't seem to realize there's more than just the regular people that started BC. It's now a complete commercial site and is actually a pain to navigate because of the ads and such. It appears to be a separate entity from the forum help group.

And your knee jerk witless retort is not appreciated as you have certainly missed the mark. Do you have access to any updated information of a lawsuit? Do you know who BC lawyers are? Is any of this available to the public. Should any of this be available to the public? I believe all of it if the public is paying into it. I'm certainly not ignorant how a website is operated.

As far as that other company, they are crap and lawsuit trolls. Always have been. It's not just BC that has been attacked by them, nor spoke out about their lousy software and ethics.

Personal forum attacks are committed by people with tunnel vision who won't bother or are too lazy to look at a bigger more educated picture. There's no constructive contribution or respect gained with that attitude. Apology accepted.
PaBlppg123 - 3 months ago
When one thinks about how frivolous this slapp suit really is based on just a few simple points.
One, if a forum member is responsible for posting the comments, BC does not take personal information except emails, so if enigma is looking to subpoena BC for real names, even with a FOIA request, BC has no names to give them. If BC can prove that it was a member, then BC has most likely no liability for a unknown alias member and enigma has no case and should be thrown out like it deserves. It's not a freedom of speech issue because BC is a private forum site with internal rules.
enigma imo has no case in the first place.
Grinler - 3 months ago
PaBlppg123, let me try and answer some of your questions. As stated throughout the comments and in many many other places on the site, BC is a commercial site and has never claimed to be a NFP. I do derive income from the site and this has never been denied or stated otherwise.

There are no investors in the site and the site is owned and operated by myself. This is the same as it has been since it opened in 2004. Everyone else who helps on the site is a volunteer. Revenue is generated from advertisements and affiliate sales. All the content and support on the site remain 100% free.

In October I did a facelift of the site and did not touch the forums. This does not mean, though, that someone bought the site or that it is under control by anyone else. I just didn't like the way it looked and wanted to make it more professional looking.

As for the ads, I am sorry that you feel its a "bloated ad income producing destination", but we have actually toned down the ads compared to what they used to be. In fact, we have always had the feature that anyone can register a free account on the site and when logged in see absolutely no ads on the site at all. I think that this is a great compromise. Do not want to see ads? Simply create a free account and login. This information is clearly displayed to any member not logged in when they visit the forums.

As for the legal contributions, all of this money has gone into a legal fund and is only used to pay for legal bills related to this lawsuit. I have already spent my own money fighting this suit and legal fees will almost certainly exceed what I have raised. With that said, I expect to have to pay more out of pocket.

I am represented by Greg Herbert of Greenberg Traurig and Marc Randazza of The Randazza Legal Group. If any contributions are left over they will be donated to a freedom of speech charity when this matter is resolved. To see how the money is being spent, all of the site's filing are public and are available via Pacer. You can see a summary of it here: https://www.pacermonitor.com/public/case/10274484/Enigma_Software_Group_USA,_LLC_v_Bleeping_Computer_LLC_et_al.

Unfortunately with the United States Legal System, defendants have to spend a great deal of money to defend themselves even when they have done nothing wrong. That is the purpose of a SLAPP suit. To make the defendant pay exorbitant amounts of money so that they just give up or settle. I wish it was as easy as you say, but unfortunately it is not.
PaBlppg123 - 3 months ago
Thank you for that information. Interestingly, that pacermonitor is a 3rd party service not associated with pacer in any way as far as I can see and charges a high price for data I can get for free as I have a free pacer account which is allows up to 10 dollars a month in service before charging anything.
I believe people in the cases get the same info for free as well.
You may want to save some money and dump that pay service if all it is is a convenience.

Good luck in your lawsuit. And enigma will do exactly as you say. They will file motion to motion and file for delays as much as possible.
Elise - 3 months ago
"And enigma will do exactly as you say. They will file motion to motion and file for delays as much as possible. "

I appreciate your concern, but there really isn't much reason to be worried about this to be honest. ESG has done a lot of damage to their public image by filing the lawsuit in the first place, but instead of stopping there after seeing all negative publicity (by regular press, I'm not referring to reactions here at BC which were naturally negative), they decided they don't care.

It saddens me that in all the past months not once they have even tried to look into reasons why people (individuals, not websites) had issues with their product. That would have been constructive. Just throwing around lawsuits whenever something negative appears about their product is not.

Think about it like this: sure, defending against a lawsuit is very costly and time consuming. But in the long run the damage will be for ESG, not for BC, for the simple reason that BC is considered useful, liked and supported by a large online community (as shown also by the huge amount of money donated, which honestly I'd never have expected).

ESG right now is not gaining any popularity, because (potential) customers much prefer to see product improvement over bullying. No amount of delaying and filing extra motions will change anything about it (if you'd ask me it'll only make things worse, but I am also not a legal expert so I may be wrong there).
DJ_Omnimaga - 3 months ago
As someone mentioned on another forum, I wonder if the EFF ( https://www.eff.org/ ) would be able to help? In 2009, Texas Instruments sent a DMCA takedown notice against hobbyists for publishing the private TI-83 Plus RSA keys, even though it was legal to do so. The TI-83 Plus community got the EFF involved, DMCA counter-notices were sent and then the community won (or at least invalidated the DMCA takedown notices and made TI stop sending new ones).
vilhavekktesla - 2 months ago
Hi, EFF has already been contacted by BC and "declined" to help, no not declined, but stated for BC reason why they won't get involved here. BC als staded any money after the suit could be sent to EFF as donations, so no hard feeling. Eff gave BC a valid reason, which is accepted.
And for me. I'm still wonder in 220 countries in the world, even rougue countries (whoever they may be) In homw many countries would this lawsuit be accepted by the court and not what slap should meen. You get a slap for even thinking a case like this, both on your fingers and then in your face... It is simply (put in anything you like) to see this is even possible. The laws should definitely be changed after BC gets through this. Rest my case... for a few seconds at least...
DeepThought62 - 2 months ago
In the course of researching this topic (in the interests of fairness and objectivity) I came across the following website. http://www.2-spyware.com/news/post6642.html#comments

In the light of the conflicting "OPINIONS" offered here and in other places I looked a little deeper and guess what I found?

I know some of you already have the answer to that question, but for the less diligent here is the content of the comment I (tried) to post (still waiting for moderator clearance).

"I was sufficiently aroused by this article to Google for positive reviews of Spyhunter and the Bleeping Computer controversy. I am disappointed to see that one Help site should be badmouthing another for allowing honest comment about a product/company that should provide the highest level of ethical standards and behaviour in an unsafe world.

I have a question for you - how many affiliate commissions or product recommendations does YOUR site receive payment for? That's OK, no need to answer, I see from your own website that the truth is out there. To quote your own disclosure page :

"2-spyware.com is the affiliate of several anti-malware and anti-spyware programs. The company works in the affiliation with these companies: Enigma Software, Malwarebytes, iS3, SUPERAntiSpyware, SurfRight B.V., Webroot, BullGuard, ParetoLogic. These companies pay special commissions after users purchase their products thru the site. The main program, which is recommended on the project, is SpyHunter by Enigma Software." - http://www.2-spyware.com/news/disclosure

It should be noted that I had never heard of either of your sites until today nor did I know of Spyhunter. Needless to say, I will not be adding you to my bookmarks or asking you for unbiased and trustworthy advice.

I wonder how long it will be before this post is removed. 2 Hours?"

I am currently unwaged and almost penniless but I will look at the possibility of making a donation to your cause. As a psychotherapist I like to think I am a good judge of character and I have seen nothing on this website that suggests malicious intent or motivated self-interest. On the contrary, I have taken note of the high moral and ethical standards that you adopt. I cannot say the same about your opposition, but one good thing occurs to me about this situation. If nothing else it shows that you should not take at face value the first thing you read on the Net. Check, double-check and re-check.
Grinler - 2 months ago
Thank you for your note. Though I truly appreciate your offer, I ask that noone should contribute if it would cause any hardship, conflict of interests, or any sense of misgiving.

The fact that you posted this note is support enough. Thank you!
Elise - 2 months ago
Thank you for taking the time to research this and offer your opinion. No worries, we do not remove any posts, except in case they violate BCs terms of use (and contain for example offensive language or intentional spam that has nothing to do with the subject at hand).
DeepThought62 - 2 months ago
Sorry Elise if I gave the impression that I expected my post to be removed. That comment was not aimed at you, it was part of my submission to 2-spyware.com. As of yet they have not allowed my post. Quelle surprise..
Elise - 2 months ago
I saw only after replying that it was part of your quote, which is why I edited my original reply, my apologies for the confusion!
Elise - 2 months ago
Thank you for taking the time to research this and offer your opinion, much appreciated!
DeepThought62 - 2 months ago
I would add that the above website was not the only one I visited searching for clarification.

Others included

http://www.comparedandreviewed.com/

http://windowssecrets.com/forums/showthread.php/163160-SpyHunter-4-Good-or-bad

http://www.wehatemalware.com/us/

Sadly not all sites are as forthcoming about the nature or identities of companies that they have links with or derive income from so it's hard to judge the impartiality of their advice/recommendations.

Spyhunter4 seemed to garner a few positive comments but Windows Secrets at least tried for some balance.

Whilst I have no experience of this software (and don't intend to gain any) so cannot pass judgement on it's efficacy or reliability I have a basic objection to sites that lure you in with promises of help but demand payment beforehand. It would be like me telling a client with serious mental or emotional problems that he had to pay me before I would help him/her.
What basis of trust is that? Furthermore, any company or individual that treats honest comment as a cause for litigation and threat has no business being in operation. Don't we have enough terrorism on this planet already?
vilhavekktesla - 2 months ago
Hi, no need for you to test it. I forgot what SH was and tried it this windter, and after a few second I remembered. Im not sure wher my post is, but on one of the comments very early on this page:
http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/announcement/frivolous-lawsuits/
And then on of the articles, I posted my experience. Not scientific, but I let SH run for 3 days I think to get an idea what it did not like on my "clean" computer, and what it did to fix it. Luckily I had not paid for it so SH did not commit its changes. Otherwise I would probably sue them... Anyway, much of what SH said was true, but the severeness of it, I disagree, and findin 400 dangerous cookies... who cares... You get tha in just a few days... What I do with them is to disallow 3rd party tracing with lots of addons in my FF, and one thing SH did was to close doen my FF where I had just downloaded SH, with no notice at all, and the same happened wit uninstall. Not Eset, Malwarbytes etc did such things... Jut their mentality we wknow what w are doing you do not, let me fix it, trust me... is not very comforting... Then another issue her on BC. One user had Ransomware Tesla. SH removed the registry key so the Tesla lost track, so after restart the rest of the files were encrypted with another key... The user would then have to pay the ransom twice... SH did not remove the dangerous encryptor though, only the Registry key and stated the comuter is clean... Now valid SW does this... They will of course remove all dangerous cod and not simply the Windo to see the process running...

It did not even show what was removed so a skilled user could agree... now I'm safe...
This is what this company does. It is not a Bad company, simply not a competent comapany, but it acts as it is... There are more examples and I did not have any bad feeling when I wrote this the first time. I even posted some info at ESG in the beginning to let the correct some info, about Tesla, since their advice was use shadowexplorer, and not that a mthod exist fixing some versions... That post (actually thre posts ) were not accepted. I even made a login name and stated som info about me so they could validate... The only thing I have to say. That company or anyone affiliated with them cannot be trusted what so ever... not becaus they are rogue... but since they dont do the job properly but still claims they do. Any uninformed user will believe this, since all around looks professional...
pikachuking - 2 months ago
i read quite a bit and its late and im too lazy to read this long forum im in favor of saying who really cares whether bleeping computer ask for money they give us free advice and help us when we dont know jack about computers even the pc nerds use bleeping computer i bet no one person can have all the answers so if bleeping ask for money give or dont give its that 1 persons right but as for me im broke :/ otherwise i would donate im not a rocket scientist but im very eletronic savy myself to a degree and hwta i dont know i look up and 9 out of 10 times its from bleeping computer we are suppposed to have freedom of speech yet with all these morons stipling our rights its kinda hard to beleieve we are better then dictator countries nowadays we are the land of the free but we dont feel like it lets do something about this by helping bleeping computer if i had the money id give any extra money i could spare for those who oppose greedy crappy companies or big buissness the fact that bleeping computer has been around for over 10 years helping all of us for free should be enough to give our respect most people would be evil and turn thier backs and the big coporations win against small companies so even if they were to be rich or poor help them out for they helped us for so long if we went anywhere else they charge out the but for help on stuff we have a good idea of but need that 1 bit of info we need to be sure ex: geek squad to fix an old computer cost me over 150 bucks to repair the computer wasnt even worth 1/4 that much yet if i asked someone on bleeping computer they would help for free so in the end i say help this site out for they have been there for us and we need to be there for them

sorry for the long comment kinda new to forums and go a bit over bored

GIVE US LIBERTY OR GIVE US DEATH USA USA USA
TaterHawk - 2 months ago
Well I for one appreciate Bleepingcomputer. They helped me recover 5 years worth of files that were sensitive in nature. Even if they were not being sued I would do what I can to support this forum. Everyone and I mean everyone abandoned all hope of us recovering our files except the good people of this site. So suite, no suite money, no money it makes no difference.
alexmorano - 2 months ago
Hi everyone. I just wanted to say thank you to the people at BleepingComputer. I came here a few times with problems of my own without any idea how to fix it. This is the only site I have been to that has any real solution to the problems a lot of computer users face each day. When I came here for help the first time, I was not very smart when it came to computers. Now, I am in my last 2 months of school. I went through the Cisco Networking Academy and I'm finishing up with getting my Microsoft certifications through the MSSA (Microsoft Security Systems Analyst)Program. I give credit for that to BleepingComputer! I probably would not have went to school for this if I did not find your site. When I was able to fix my own computer, with your help of course, It felt great and It was fun. Bottom line is, I would do anything for BleepingComputer. If my donating money is going to help you I have no problem doing it. May not be much with school loans and all but I will do what I can. You have helped me in so many ways and I never paid you a dime. Thank you so much.

P.s Sorry this post was so long. I just thought it would be an appropriate time to give my testimonial with all the haters visiting the site. :)
Grinler - 2 months ago
Thanks Alex! I truly appreciate your words and it means a lot to me.

Please save the money and put it towards your student loans. I know from my own experience how hard it was paying those off.

Your words are enough support!

Thanks again.
Booh-kitty - 2 months ago
Hm.....I thought I posted a response here.
If I didn't forget to add my comment, maybe it was removed? I was mainly bashing the comments flaming Lawrence, Grinler and BC. Under the circumstances, I can see that might be necessary. :)

I won't go into that again, but I do want to express my extreme appreciation to Lawrence, Grinler and the BC community. They have saved me huge amounts of money! I don't usually need to come back often because the things I've learned here and easy access to the tutorials have given me enough know-how to fix most of my problems on my own. I've also been able to help many of my friends with problems as well. That's even more money saved that can be attributed directly to this forum.

I know that at least some of the members on this forum have their own PC businesses or work for one. I have never been charged a single penny for anything at all by these people who have created a fantastic compilation of information for the everyday person and are more than willing to help me understand should I need further assistance.

So to everyone on this forum, here's to you! A great big, heart felt thank you for giving your time to help me and so many others!

Thank you!

Furthermore, several years ago, I asked this forum how I to make a financial donation to help support this site. I was told that BC was doing okay at the moment and told me to use my money to help some other worthy cause.
Grinler - 2 months ago
Your previous comment is further up the page :) I would post a link to it, but that seems to be broken :( Gotta look into that.

Thank you for your words. They mean a lot.
DonnaB - 2 months ago
Yes, Booh-kitty, your words certainly do mean a lot. I'm not here for monetary rewards . There is nothing more rewarding to me than helping others to learn how to help themselves. I guess you could call me a philanthropist. I may not have the monetary wealth to share so my way of giving back is through the heart, my spare time and a wealth of skills that was so graciously given to me and those who shared with me this wealth of knowledge asked only one thing of me. To pay it forward. What better gift could one person give to the world other than knowledge and friendship.

It is grateful people like you that turn my world right side up and keeps me coming back to give more. Thank you for sharing your words of appreciation.
nelsonhoover - 2 months ago
Love the site. It wasn't much, but I donated a bit towards the fund as a way of saying thanks for the great site. I've often found it quite helpful. Hope it all works out well for you.
Sophtbot - 2 months ago
First of all you are the greatest and let's hope not more people are getting sued for their own personal opinions ever again.
I have lurked your forums for years never ever felt the need to say anything, but come on how the f*** can anyone sue you.
I have not read all the forum posts related to this case nor will i, but from what i have read it seems like people have shared their own personal opinions regarding a certain software and now the site is getting sued for it.
Even though these people were or are moderators of this site, that still does not seem right to sue them for sharing their own opinions.
BC have saved me and many others over a lot of years and the thanks i owe you guys i feel is more than can be quantified in a certain amount of $ donations.
I have a better and safer internet experience thanks you, the amounts of gratitude i feel towards this community is more than i know how to express.

I hope there is a future for this site and community because the internet would be at a loss without it, i know at least i would.

Thank you for all your efforts through the years and i hope something as frivolous as this lawsuit can't stop what you have created.

Again thank you.
Metaspoilt - 2 months ago
First off,point 7 of the summary from the ammended complaint:"To further that interest Bleeping has intentionally desparaged ESG and it's products while simultaneously recommending that it's "novice" forum members use Malwarebytes products for which it admittedly is paid a commision."....so everytime someone uses(runs a scan?) with malwarebytes wether it's the free edition or runninmg the trial for the pro version means Grinler gets paid......lmao....absolutly clueless and rather entertaining,next thing we know they are going to try arguing water isn't wet,or accuse Bleeping of orchestrating the Kennedy assassination or the dissapearance of Jimmy Hoffa.....any judge with the power of logical reasoning and a bit of humor is hopefully going to laugh this right out of his/her courtroom.

On a more serious note,i donated $10 to the cause because unlike ESG, Grinler and everybody at Bleeping has my admiration and respect.

Highest Regards Metaspoilt
Krill - 2 months ago
I would like to help, please make a video (hide your face if you want), say in your own words what parts of Spyhunter you find people should be warned about, demonstrate it if possible. Then ask for help for the legal battlem.

Upload your video to youTube but as a hidden video, (only visible to those with the URL, then PM me the URL, I will then do my magic and publish 50 copies of each video, I will also put them on social media and encourage others to share.

Anyone who has used the product and found practices to be deceptive I recommend you leave a review on RIPOFFREPORT, they have been on receiving end of threats like this and the site owner has won time and time again.

What are you waiting for, go make that video!
Grinler - 2 months ago
Thank you Krill for your offer of support, but this behavior is not something I would do or condone others to do. Regardless of how I feel about Enigma and their products, I have never said anything bad about them and therefore I see no reason to hide anything.
Nzyme - 2 months ago
SpyHunter is no way a rogue program. It must have been in the past, but definitely not today with the current version. Instead of spending so much time writing all these comments, install a virtual machine and test it yourself. I did and this program found some nasty toolbars that other popular AV and spyware programs could not.I am not supporting anyone but just after what is the truth. One should first test the current version and then if found malicious, rate with negative feedback. In this case i don't thing Bleeping computer did a thorough test of the program and just rated negatively based on past experiences (maybe years back). If so then BC deserves it.
Metaspoilt - 2 months ago
Not trying to be a know-it-all but,from quietman7's post:"SpyHunter is not classified as malware or rogue security software."....e.g your missing the point almost entirely,i advise you to carefully read quietman7's entire response,fwiw i have tested SpyBlunder in a VM against serious malware(poweliks etc.)...it's nearly completely useless,at this point i could ADVISE you to run 2 very well known and probably more effective tools available on this website for free if you are having trouble with "nasty" toolbars and/or browser plugins/hijacks,but that would probably serve as more insentive for ESG so....... :)

Highest regards Metaspoilt
Krill - 2 months ago
I think the post is entirely reasonable, I do not like people who use Lawyers to BULLY.

I also do not like it when any supplier hides that they are not make a one off charge but a subscription.

Most AV vendors charge for a year, this one is every six months.

So six months later WHAM you suddenly find an unexpected charge on your card.

They can sue me for my opinion too if they want.

It is totally reasonable that people are able to review products, express their opinion on the product, how it compares to other products on the market, including the purchase methods.

We expect these "in my opinion" devious sales practices from some countries but when it is happening in the US we have to warn people.

There is no slander if there are no lies, there is no defamation here either, just an honest review.

If Enigma Software Group are so scared of an honest review and opinion then they should change their "in my opinion" rather dubious sales practices.

I am going to ask some of the Major magazines to include the product in their roundup reviews.

I am also going to ask my social network to discuss the disgusting bullying of this fantastic site that helps thousands of people for no cost and I am going to ask them to let Enigma Software Group know what they think, via social media.

This is a LOSE LOSE situation for Enigma Software Group, if you win you come across as bullies and the market will spread the word forever. If you lose you confirm everything in the review.

The best solution for Enigma Software Group is a simple "right to respond" where you address all of the things you do not like or think are unfair in the review, and Bleeping Computer have a simple page where the review is shown along with your response.

Be man enough to admit you got it WRONG Enigma and SETTLE.
NoVirusJoe - 1 month ago
I for one have nothing but good things to say about Bleeping Computer. I have found many solutions to various computer problems over the years in the BC forums, and recently enlisted their help isolating and fixing a particularly gnarly problem I was having. The BC staff are highly professional, helpful, and informative, and do not charge a dime for their services. I offered to make a donation to help run the site, and was directed here. I am happy to make a contribution to whatever cause BC needs help with. The web needs more resources like BC!!
Heleios - 2 weeks ago
It is sad that its a loose loose situation for enigma, But it appears to be a situation of their own making. Ill be giving BC a donation. Of course everyone has to make a living but why should BC have to loose theirs because they chose to tell us their honest opinion. My opinion is that keyboard mercenarys must be very cheap. May be a bit stuck don't want to fix it so try to change people focus and hope all will forget. Seems common these days. :)
DonnaB - 2 weeks ago
Caveat emptor, quia ignorare non debuit quod jus alienum emit

("Let a purchaser beware, for he ought not to be ignorant of the nature of the property which he is buying from another party.")

The assumption is that buyers should be able to inspect and otherwise ensure that they are confident with the integrity of the product before completing a transaction. This does not, however, give sellers the green light to actively engage in fraudulent transactions.
benJephunneh - 2 weeks ago
I'll say it again, since it's worth repeating. You do not have to defend yourself (thus pay money) simply because someone wants to sue you. Otherwise, I could mail you a letter tomorrow saying I'm suing you for something and just keep taking you to court for no reason until you're bankrupt. Think about it.

The person doing the suing must show that there are damages, first. THEN, somebody will say that the suit has merit and may proceed. To not have specific, quantified damages is to have SPECULATIVE damages, and courts have upheld that parties may not sue based on speculative damages (i.e. "I bet we lost thousands of dollars because of BC's review."). The person doing the suing must show that the damages are real. Without these things, this kind of case is called COERCION. Look it up.

Such a case is also called a frivolous lawsuit, and you may file your own suit against the other party even now, because of it. Look it up.

If your lawyer isn't telling you these things or hasn't pursued them with vigor, FIRE HIM. There are lawyers in this world who will lose on purpose if there's a greater gain for them, a threat, etc., and even judges are sometimes guilty of doing the threatening.
Krill - 2 weeks ago
What is REALLY sad is the sheer number of people that cannot spell a simple four letter word!

So let me explain

If you are on a diet you hope to LOSE weight, if you LOSE enough weight your shirt collar might start to get LOOSE.

If you need a way to remember, if it is about LOSS then it is LOSE, otherwise it it LOOSE.

We are all born ignorant but once you have been told, you have no excuse.

Go forth and educate!

"It is sad that its a loose loose situation for enigma, But it appears to be a situation of their own making. Ill be giving BC a donation. Of course everyone has to make a living but why should BC have to loose theirs because they chose to tell us their honest opinion. "
deskvor - 1 week ago
Those fucks, hope you win.